Why is nintendo so obsessed with this dual screen gimmick

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torenojohn7

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#1  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

I love Gamboy&GBA's design its versatile and it appeals to everyone,however the dual screen isn't! it was kinda of cool back in the 2007's something when touch screen was a novelty but now 2014 it just feels like a gimmick overstaying its due.

After owning a psp&tablet for more than 5 years i think its safe to conclude that dual screen is simply unnecessary for portable gaming! what exactly makes it so damn important that we need the whole console designed around it? this is the real reason why people say that nintendo is just showing the middle finger to hardcore gamers! we need dual analog sticks NOT dual screens!

What are the exclusive perks of the dual screen exactly? If i want to see the map screen,i would pause my game and go the map,i don't want to stare at the map all the time! the only games that seem to fully utilize dual screens are the games that are specifically designed around that and even very hard to find most of the ds games don't fully utilize it so WTF? its nothing more than a waste of LCD backlight... and the most baffling thing is that they're pushing this nonsense into WIIU controller as if its cutting edge tech tch.... c'mon its 2014 dammit!

don't get me wrong i know nintendo used to be gimmicky since the NES days but they were only for accessories but now their every new game console seems to have a gimmick fetish..

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CodingGenius

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#2 CodingGenius
Member since 2004 • 8118 Posts

While I agree that not all portable gaming needs 2 screens, some games have really made good use of it. It also prevents the HUD from getting cluttered by menus for games like Animal Crossing.

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torenojohn7

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#3  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@CodingGenius: i haven't had a single moment in PSP when i felt like "Damn there's so much hud,only if there was a completely unnecessary screen to show it"

And i don't know about you but that games i want to immiedialy play on 3ds&ds are the games that don't really need dual screen at all! New super mario,Metroid,zelda,Kirby,Castlevania and some niche RPG's and they all don't need dual screens at all! so to me its just annoying gimmick that i have to waste my batteries on which is just unacceptable.. why should i waste batteries just because nintendo doesn't know how to design consoles?

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Sgt_Crow

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#4  Edited By Sgt_Crow
Member since 2004 • 6099 Posts

Giant battles in Mario & Luigi Dream Team Bros. came to mind when I read this.
Those made dual screens worth it by itself imo. Lots of other good examples out there.

It basically gives developers the possibility to create something truly unique and creative. Sony's handhelds are stale and boring in comparison. The backside touch screen was a nice addition but you don't hear anyone about it because almost no developer utilizes it.

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torenojohn7

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#5  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@Sgt_Crow said:

Giant battles in Mario & Luigi Dream Team Bros. came to mind when I read this.

Those made dual screens worth it by itself imo. Lots of other good examples out there.

It basically gives developers the possibility to create something truly unique and creative. Sony's handhelds are stale and boring in comparison. The backside touch screen was a nice addition but you don't hear anyone about it because almost no developer utilizes it.

The whole game of mario as far as i know is a 2d platformer which doesn't need a dual screen AT ALL.. majority of the time you're just looking at one screen and i could do without fancy boss fights.

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#6  Edited By Sgt_Crow
Member since 2004 • 6099 Posts

@torenojohn7 said:

@Sgt_Crow said:

Giant battles in Mario & Luigi Dream Team Bros. came to mind when I read this.

Those made dual screens worth it by itself imo. Lots of other good examples out there.

It basically gives developers the possibility to create something truly unique and creative. Sony's handhelds are stale and boring in comparison. The backside touch screen was a nice addition but you don't hear anyone about it because almost no developer utilizes it.

The whole game of mario as far as i know is a 2d platformer which doesn't need a dual screen AT ALL.. majority of the time you're just looking at one screen and i could do without fancy boss fights.

I suggest you play the game before talking about it...

TIP: It's not a platformer, nor only 2D, and uses the second screen a lot.
Actually, I'm gonna assume you've never even owned a 3DS if you think the second screen is only used as a map.

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torenojohn7

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#7 torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@Sgt_Crow: I'm talking about New super mario bros&Yoshi's island ds!

I don't care about the bazillions of mario spin-offs.. i just want to play a decent mario sidescroller on the go and i don't need a dual screen for that!

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#8 trugs26
Member since 2004 • 7537 Posts

It's got to the point where it's distinctively Nintendo. So simply from an aesthetic point of view, you can easily see what is Nintendo, and what isn't.

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Sgt_Crow

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#9 Sgt_Crow
Member since 2004 • 6099 Posts

@torenojohn7: So what's your point again...? First you're saying the dual screens are bad because they're only used for to show maps even thought there are countless games that use it in a creative way and essential to the gameplay of said games. And now you make it a personal irk because you want to play a certain type of game that doesn't need two screens. O.o

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torenojohn7

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#10 torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@Sgt_Crow: Yes exactly the games i want to play don't require dual screens at all,they're just shoehorned into those games needlessly just because NDS is designed that way.

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#11  Edited By ANIMEguy10034
Member since 2008 • 4955 Posts

For most DS/3DS games, the touchscreen is there to make your life easier. It's not incredibly necessary, but it's an appreciated addition and using it is second nature for most handheld owners. It's useful for RPGs, which DS and 3DS excels at. Yes, there are games that barely make use for it, especially ports, but I have not come across a game where I felt like it was worse off because of the second screen.

The Wii U's gamepad screen does feel unnecessary for most games, but it's freaking incredible for off-screen play. Off-screen play makes the Wii U a fantastic secondary console for those who have several consoles sharing the same TV.

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#12 PikachuDude860
Member since 2014 • 1810 Posts

@torenojohn7: I don't think their necessarily "obsessed" with it. When used in the right way, stuff like that can open up a whole new world of gameplay. Gameplay that wouldn't be possible without it. When used properly that is.

Look at Wind Waker HD. Try playing it with a pro controller (Or the Gamecube version) then try playing it with the Gamepad. With the pro controller, you'd have to press start and open up the menu everytime you'd want to look at the map or manage your inventory. You'd have to pause the game which would interupt the gameplay. On the other hand, with the Gamepad you wouldn't have to pause the game. Just look at the screen and select what you want. No pausing. It's a lot faster and more conveint. Kinda like your looking down at a map in real life.

I'm sure there are some DS and 3DS games that take advantage of both screens.

I don't think there is anything wrong with the whole touch screen thing. Developers just need to make games that use it in a unique fun way.

Without the screens, Gamepad etc, it would just be the same as everything else. Same thing we've seen for years.

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torenojohn7

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#14  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@pikachudude860:Actually i've played so many PS2 games that it has become my secondary nature to pause the game to see the map. its kinda like how console gamers are simply used to triggers&analog sticks instead of keyboard&mouse,its just something we'd have to re-wire our brains for.

And don't get me wrong i love touch screen! but the dual screen design for a portable console is just redundant and quite frankly is not worth all the money... yes i agree it does allow for a "little bit" more creativity but that's still taxing much of hardware and the 3dsXL quite frankly looks like a goddamn notebook laptop!

and please don't confuse overglorified gimmicks for actual innovation,WiiU's controller is far from being one its a gimmick which would've worked in the original launch of Wii not in 2012 when oculus rift was released... i'm also having a feeling of deja vu that wiiU is going to go through the same shovelware&inferior console port syndrome as wii.

@ANIMEguy10034: I mean it takes battery power and a good chunk of hardware just to provide you with subsidiary features that is not really that necessary..

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KBFloYd

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#15  Edited By KBFloYd
Member since 2009 • 22036 Posts

sounds like you want an snes or gameboy rehashed year after year after year with nothing but updated graphics.

maybe if the DS didnt sell more than the ps2 then you would have your wish. but it did.

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#16 superbuuman
Member since 2010 • 6400 Posts

Don't think they are obsessed with it..just it works with DS so they kept it..don't change what's not broken. Wii U is simply just a copy of DS in large scale..however it didn't work out. I doubt we will be seeing another tablet controller in their next console. :P

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#17 Master_Of_Fools
Member since 2009 • 1651 Posts

Cause it's different. We don't want the same junk as Microsoft and Sony. 2 Screens is better then 1.

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outworld222

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#18 outworld222
Member since 2004 • 3063 Posts

Clearly a misguided thread. The DS craze was sensational for its time.

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#19  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@KBFloYd: Err.. isn't WiiU kinda like a blatant rehash of Wii? i don't don't want rehash.. i just expect a lot from people who used to make the finest gaming consoles&handhelds which appealed to everyone.. nowadays its just pathetically pandering to soccer moms and their little kids and the sad thing is. nintendo's strategy actually works,it sold more than PS3&360.. but at what cost?

@Master_Of_Fools: IMHO a controller is supposed to be a controller not a freaking Ipad masquerading as a controller..remember the old saying? if ain't broke DON'T FIX IT!

@outworld222: I clearly mentioned that the for the original it was really something fresh but now in 2014 we don't need that anymore.

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#20  Edited By Master_Of_Fools
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@torenojohn7 said:

@KBFloYd: Err.. isn't WiiU kinda like a blatant rehash of Wii? i don't don't want rehash.. i just expect a lot from people who used to make the finest gaming consoles&handhelds which appealed to everyone.. nowadays its just pathetically pandering to soccer moms and their little kids and the sad thing is. nintendo's strategy actually works,it sold more than PS3&360.. but at what cost?

@Master_Of_Fools: IMHO a controller is supposed to be a controller not a freaking Ipad masquerading as a controller..remember the old saying? if ain't broke DON'T FIX IT!

@outworld222: I clearly mentioned that the for the original it was really something fresh but now in 2014 we don't need that anymore.

It's not an Ipad. A touch screen isnt automatically an Ipad, was the DS or 3DS ever called an Ipad? NOPE. Just cause of it's size, people say that. Back when I was a kid we were all saying I bet in the future there will be a screen on the controller!!! Well now it's here and frankly I love it, and never want to go back to normal controllers. Either accept change, or get left behind in the dust.

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#21  Edited By -ParaNormaN-
Member since 2013 • 1551 Posts

I personally think that the dual screens were genius for handheld gaming. For home gaming like the Wii U though? Not so much. I would love for Nintendo to keep the dual screens for future handhelds but would really love to see the Wii U be the last to have dual screen play and motion controls.

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#22  Edited By Sgt_Crow
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@torenojohn7: If the Wii U is a rehash of the Wii, then what is the PS4 compared to the PS3? There is nothing new there except the same "gimmicks" that they took from Nintendo in the first place.
The Wii U is by far the most fresh next-gen console experience this gen because of the gamepad. If you want to know the value of the gamepad, I suggest you try Pikmin 3. Just because you want to keep releasing the same thing over and over again without trying new and creative ways to keep gaming fresh and fun doesn't mean others do as well. I think you're best of with a Sony console and handheld.

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torenojohn7

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#23  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@Sgt_Crow: Well PS4 is the successor of PS3... WIIU is just like Wii2.0 with better graphics but the same motion control gimmicks and the same type of casual gamer focused marketing..

And if you're talking about innovative gamepads check out Steam's controller. it blows WiiU's ipad out of the water.

lol and if i wanted nintendo to keep releasing the same thing over and over i wouldn't be complaining about the dual screen in 3ds&WiiU(its actually the original game&watch design btw nothing new)

@Master_Of_Fools: Well i'm clearly not willing to be nintendo's guinea pig,i stick with controllers that give me what i want instead of what nintendo thinks i want.

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hydralisk86

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#24  Edited By hydralisk86
Member since 2006 • 8835 Posts
@torenojohn7 said:

@Sgt_Crow: Well PS4 is the successor of PS3... WIIU is just like Wii2.0 with better graphics but the same motion control gimmicks and the same type of casual gamer focused marketing..

And if you're talking about innovative gamepads check out Steam's controller. it blows WiiU's ipad out of the water.

lol and if i wanted nintendo to keep releasing the same thing over and over i wouldn't be complaining about the dual screen in 3ds&WiiU(its actually the original game&watch design btw nothing new)

@Master_Of_Fools: Well i'm clearly not willing to be nintendo's guinea pig,i stick with controllers that give me what i want instead of what nintendo thinks i want.

From what little i know, you saying Nintendo releases the same stuff over and over again doesn't really cover how other games, like CoD could also be said to, "released the same stuff over and over again."

And if the PS4 is the successor of the PS3, shouldn't that make the WiiU also a successor to the Wii?

I think the screens work, why is that such a problem with you?

EDIT: I see that you were saying about the maps thing. I played the ds games, the use of the stylus on the screen was pretty interesting, though some people here would disagree.

I know little about handhelds, but if the Nintendo handheld didn't have a second screen, what difference would that make with the Ps Vita? (i know they would probably have features different from each other, but still)

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YearoftheSnake5

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#25 YearoftheSnake5
Member since 2005 • 9164 Posts

The dual screen concept worked well for their handheld, so they attempted to apply it to their home console. Unfortunately for them, that didn't work as well as they'd like. I wouldn't say that they're obsessed with it - just that they're trying to expand on the idea by bringing it to home consoles. Not everyone is going to like is, as you obviously don't. I like the idea, though. Going back to having health bars, maps, and other statistical information on the main display bothers me and makes the screen seem crowded. After playing Mass Effect 3, Deus Ex, Assassin's Creed, and others on Wii U, where the HUD can be relegated to the Gamepad, the screen seems crowded in older games, like Xenoblade. Then, there's dual screen multiplayer which is great for games like CoD.

I don't always use the Gamepad, though. If a game doesn't make good use out of it, like Injustice, Donkey Kong: TF, or Mario Kart, I tend to use the Pro controller.

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#26  Edited By torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@YearoftheSnake5: Agree pro controller is so much better than Xbox one's controller.. i for the LOVE of GOd cannot understand why they make their analog sticks asymmetrical not everyone in the world is an FPS player.. >_>

@hydralisk86 said:

From what little i know, you saying Nintendo releases the same stuff over and over again doesn't really cover how other games, like CoD could also be said to, "released the same stuff over and over again."

And if the PS4 is the successor of the PS3, shouldn't that make the WiiU also a successor to the Wii?

I think the screens work, why is that such a problem with you?

EDIT: I see that you were saying about the maps thing. I played the ds games, the use of the stylus on the screen was pretty interesting, though some people here would disagree.

I know little about handhelds, but if the Nintendo handheld didn't have a second screen, what difference would that make with the Ps Vita? (i know they would probably have features different from each other, but still)

I was just refuting the claim that Nintendo is "Fresh&innovative" and other game console devs are pragmatic,uncreative people rehashing their tech when its far from true.

Well yes it is but the way its trying to attach itself to Wii shows how it lacks a creative vision behind it and no i don't think a fancy controller can hide that fact.

The screens bother me because :-

A) They cost batteries B) They are mostly unnecessary(If it was detachable then it would be cool) and yes you're right Nintendo has to come up with a "Difference" A.K.A actual innovation... rather then using the same gimmicks that worked in circa 2004.

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YearoftheSnake5

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#27 YearoftheSnake5
Member since 2005 • 9164 Posts
@torenojohn7 said:

Agree pro controller is so much better than Xbox one's controller.. i for the LOVE of GOd cannot understand why they make their analog sticks asymmetrical not everyone in the world is an FPS player.. >_>

I like it a lot, even for shooters, though I prefer the wiimote and nunchuck for those. I'll get a shooter for Wii U instead of my PC if it has pointer control, just because I like that method of input best. Back to the Pro controller, I like how Nintendo spaced everything. I was skeptical about putting the buttons below the analog, but it works. The only thing I don't like are the triggers. I wish those were analog.

Oh, and dat battery life...I rarely have to recharge it.

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#28 GH05T-666
Member since 2010 • 1067 Posts

I would love to see Nintendo return to one screen and remove the 3D feature on the next handheld.

I want a new generation Gameboy!

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#29 torenojohn7
Member since 2012 • 551 Posts

@GH05T-666 said:

I would love to see Nintendo return to one screen and remove the 3D feature on the next handheld.

I want a new generation Gameboy!

3d feature doesn't bother me because it can be easily turned off.. Nintendo seems to be lacking the creativity in this gen TBH

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#30  Edited By hydralisk86
Member since 2006 • 8835 Posts

The DS was a handheld i really enjoyed, it had lots of good games. Though tbh, i didn't finish a lot of them.

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#31 yixingtpot
Member since 2005 • 1484 Posts

it might be cool if they used the the gamepad or Sony used the Vita with PS4 etc, in more creative ways... but as is now, 3DS, Wii U, it's just a waste of time. I have high hopes for the Fatal Frame game utilizing it in an obvious camera obscrua set up, but who knows how well that might work out. I never owned a DS or 3DS and that's just completely stupid... hey here a tiny screen and what's this right above/below it? another stupid little screen lol. So stupid, just pointless and retarded... useless. For that matter, while I love Apple and have always used Apple computers I actually hate iOS interface for gaming. Touch based gaming is simply and absolutely wretched. Gaming has been dumbed down more via iOS and Android popularity more than any other reason except DS/3DS stupidity. DS convoluted the controls and just added 'quirky' slop gameplay which was further dumbed down by iOS and Android slop gaming.

Controller offer the best interface for realtime input, all this sloppy stylus, touch based mess has just added yet another degree of frustration to our desired gratification. Now when you get pissed it not just controller or HDTV input lag, you've got some sloppy stylus touch based poop to deal with. You might as well just take the DS and violently smash it against the wall for more fun, same goes for the iOS and Android based slop.

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#32  Edited By hydralisk86
Member since 2006 • 8835 Posts

@yixingtpot said:

it might be cool if they used the the gamepad or Sony used the Vita with PS4 etc, in more creative ways... but as is now, 3DS, Wii U, it's just a waste of time. I have high hopes for the Fatal Frame game utilizing it in an obvious camera obscrua set up, but who knows how well that might work out. I never owned a DS or 3DS and that's just completely stupid... hey here a tiny screen and what's this right above/below it? another stupid little screen lol. So stupid, just pointless and retarded... useless. For that matter, while I love Apple and have always used Apple computers I actually hate iOS interface for gaming. Touch based gaming is simply and absolutely wretched. Gaming has been dumbed down more via iOS and Android popularity more than any other reason except DS/3DS stupidity. DS convoluted the controls and just added 'quirky' slop gameplay which was further dumbed down by iOS and Android slop gaming.

Controller offer the best interface for realtime input, all this sloppy stylus, touch based mess has just added yet another degree of frustration to our desired gratification. Now when you get pissed it not just controller or HDTV input lag, you've got some sloppy stylus touch based poop to deal with. You might as well just take the DS and violently smash it against the wall for more fun, same goes for the iOS and Android based slop.

I think many people would disagree with you. The DS has sold many units (i don't know how much of it is due to people buying upgrades of the same handheld, but even though). The DS had many good games, do you even own a DS or a 3DS?

EDIT: I read more of the post, are you trolling?

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#33 Zeedware
Member since 2010 • 27 Posts

Sounds like you only play mainline mario on DS.

Believe me, dual screen is one of the best Idea that nintendo ever had. If you a fan of turn-based rpg and adventure games you'll know what I mean. Ever played Ace attorney? Prof Layton? Hotel dusk? The world ends with you? Devil survivor? Yu gi oh? those are the games that utilize the dual-screen amazingly well.

You'll probably say "so what I can play those games without dual screen and it still good", yes in the same way I can play GTAV in GTAIII graphics and not complaining at all.

Anyway DS is good in my opinion. But for 3DS, Dual screen almost didn't work at all. Since the quality of the screen is very different. The games tend to use the upper screen much more heavily instead of using both screen. 3DS dual screen actually can work IF they use capacitive touch screen. So the lower screen could become a 'interactive' button, but unfortunately, they are resistive, and it doesn't work very well with bare hands.

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#34  Edited By deactivated-58bd60b980002
Member since 2004 • 2016 Posts

@torenojohn7: sorry bro but the PS2-3-4 are reharsh of the PSOne ... Sony finally updated their Dualshock after 4 gen ... it was a bout time !!! Don't kid yourself Sony only update graphics, the rest is still the same old Sony stuff. I like it but still it is the same at least Nintendo try different stuff and they always did try unique different stuff.

I think you never played with a DS, 3DS or WiiU to call them reharsh, many games took advanteges of the dual screen for DS and 3DS. Not so much for the WiiU but there is still games that used it like Wind Waker, Pikmin and Shovel Knight which is super useful and fun.

As for 2d platformer Mario games, I have the New Super Mario 2 for 3DS and the second screen gives you an idea of how close to the flag you are, how many special koins you have found in the level, your second powerups that you can use by the touch of the screen ... the primaly screen is small and all that stuff has its place on the second screen and they are so close that it isn't hard to look at it.

It is also very useful for Pokémon games, you touch instead of menu surfing.

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#35  Edited By raugutcon
Member since 2014 • 5509 Posts

@GH05T-666 said:

I would love to see Nintendo return to one screen and remove the 3D feature on the next handheld.

I want a new generation Gameboy!

You can turn off the 3D ya know.

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#36  Edited By trugs26
Member since 2004 • 7537 Posts

EDIT:

Just realised this is an old thread. I've noticed lately a lot of people digging up old threads in the Nintendo boards.. Stop it.

Original post:

Just for the mere fact of menu navigation, touch screen is way better (hence the popularity to have touch screens on phones).

I love navigating the Wii U OS, eShop, Miiverse, etc. using a touch screen.

On top of that, a lot of games do benefit from the 2 screens. It's not like it will detract from the experience anyway.

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Bravo632

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#37  Edited By Bravo632
Member since 2015 • 207 Posts

One thing concerns me is later when you'd want to replay these games on an emulator or if Nintendo plans to re-release them on higher definition ports, where future consoles won't support dual screens & porting such game controls to new systems would be a pain. They would end up scrapping their plans in the end.

I think it just adds potential issues porting good games to future consoles.

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garywood69

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#38 garywood69
Member since 2013 • 518 Posts

It's pretty great for games where you have an inventory. Ocarina 3D being the prime example. Made the water temple so much more enjoyable.

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Kenny789

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#39 Kenny789
Member since 2006 • 10434 Posts

They're obsessed maybe because it....oh I don't know.....works?

I'm sure we've all gone through the Gameboys and probably PSP and/or Vita and we're ok playing games with one screen but having two screens undeniably makes things a little better. At times, it can make things a LOT better. Games that make use of the second screen as a map may not be the best use of the system but it's definitely a welcome addition. Games that make use of the second screen as an inventory? Makes life a lot easier when you want to change gear or use an item.

Then you have games like Elite Beat Agents on the DS which requires the use of the touch screen and Mario and Luigi: Dream Team which had dual screen boss battles. The Wii U's use of the gamepad isn't spectacular at the moment and while I may agree that it can be unnecessary at times, having the map on the gamepad can be nifty on games like Assassin's Creed and Batman.

Now you're probably going to answer back "But I only care for mainline Mario games which can be played on a single screen" as well as "Wii U gamepad functionality is still crap" to which my reply would be "Sure buddy but that's your opinion and you're pushing it very strongly but you simply can't brush aside the use of the second screen on the DS. 3DS, and Wii U simply because you don't care for them". This whole thread has a lot of great input from different users and I think it's only fair to point out that everyone here has a good point.

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Shadowchronicle

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#40 Shadowchronicle
Member since 2008 • 26969 Posts

Unlike 3D the dual screens has actual utility and people do like the feature so Nintendo tends to favor its implementation.

I mean its not a bad invention, it really helps with touchscreen games.