Super Mario 64 sequel?

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#51 Posted by KBFloYd (18436 posts) -

I hate the linearity of the Galaxy games. Wish they'd go back to the Mario 64 format. 

soundcellx

 i agree...open world to an extent like mario 64.... but i dont want a remake.... i want it based in the castle but i want everything else to be new...

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#52 Posted by guitarist4292 (503 posts) -

[QUOTE="soundcellx"]

I hate the linearity of the Galaxy games. Wish they'd go back to the Mario 64 format. 

KBFloYd

 i agree...open world to an extent like mario 64.... but i dont want a remake.... i want it based in the castle but i want everything else to be new...

I'll take any hub, as long as its an interactive hub that you can explore and that keeps revealing areas and making new secrets available to discover as you progress. Damn I want another game like Mario 64...
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#53 Posted by ssj_neo (162 posts) -

I don't think they will ever be able to top mario 64 so I don't mind a remake as long as they add some new stuff to it. I think exploring the castle with another player would be really cool.  Perhaps in galaxy 3 they can have a mix of galaxy and more open world levels.

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#54 Posted by FFCYAN (4964 posts) -

[QUOTE="Chozofication"]

Super Mario 64 is now dated.  Each 3d Mario game vastly improves on its predecessor, so they won't look back at an old formula and make a new game based off that.

Although the next 3d mario won't be improving nearly as much since Galaxy 2 is already so close to perfection.  Mostly I think the biggest difference will be in visuals, esp. since Nintendo is just now transitioning into HD development, they have to put so much work into that anyways.

Even though Super Mario 64 is dated, it's a classic and I can play it now just as I could when I was a kid.  Super Mario Sunshine is my second favorite game in the series, Galaxy 2 is my favorite and the best obviously.

Toxic-Seahorse

I disagree. Galaxy didn't improve on Sunshine all that much. As a matter of fact, I believe it took away more than it added. The linear levels were such a disappointment after how awesome the open levels in SM64 and Sunshine were.

You have to realize though that Mario games and platforms games in general were built on linear designs. The platforming genre, by nature, are linear due to designed obstacles one must overcome to reach the intended objectives. Although games like Super Mario 64 and Sunshine were able to create a fully explorable 3-D world to platform in, there are aspects to platfoeming that are lost when you throw exploration into a genre that thrives on deftly reaching goals in a fluid, precisely controlled manner. That is why I have prefered the Galaxies and older SMB and SMB 3 to the slower 3-D Mario games.

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#55 Posted by guitarist4292 (503 posts) -

[QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"][QUOTE="Chozofication"]

Super Mario 64 is now dated.  Each 3d Mario game vastly improves on its predecessor, so they won't look back at an old formula and make a new game based off that.

Although the next 3d mario won't be improving nearly as much since Galaxy 2 is already so close to perfection.  Mostly I think the biggest difference will be in visuals, esp. since Nintendo is just now transitioning into HD development, they have to put so much work into that anyways.

Even though Super Mario 64 is dated, it's a classic and I can play it now just as I could when I was a kid.  Super Mario Sunshine is my second favorite game in the series, Galaxy 2 is my favorite and the best obviously.

FFCYAN

I disagree. Galaxy didn't improve on Sunshine all that much. As a matter of fact, I believe it took away more than it added. The linear levels were such a disappointment after how awesome the open levels in SM64 and Sunshine were.

You have to realize though that Mario games and platforms games in general were built on linear designs. The platforming genre, by nature, are linear due to designed obstacles one must overcome to reach the intended objectives. Although games like Super Mario 64 and Sunshine were able to create a fully explorable 3-D world to platform in, there are aspects to platfoeming that are lost when you throw exploration into a genre that thrives on deftly reaching goals in a fluid, precisely controlled manner. That is why I have prefered the Galaxies and older SMB and SMB 3 to the slower 3-D Mario games.

In the sense of pure platforming, yes the Galaxies are far better games... but for me and many others the exploration factor MORE than made up for those aspects of platforming that are lost and ultimately results in a more enjoyable experience. It's definitely subjective. Do you want more precise linear platforming or do you want sandbox exploration? It just comes down to personal preference.
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#56 Posted by meetroid8 (21152 posts) -
No, Nintendo has been moving towards streamlined, linear design in all of their big franchises, Mario in particular, and they've been very successful with it.
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#57 Posted by FFCYAN (4964 posts) -

[QUOTE="FFCYAN"]The platforming genre, by nature, are linear due to designed obstacles one must overcome to reach the intended objectives. Although games like Super Mario 64 and Sunshine were able to create a fully explorable 3-D world to platform in, there are aspects to platfoeming that are lost when you throw exploration into a genre that thrives on deftly reaching goals in a fluid, precisely controlled manner. That is why I have prefered the Galaxies and older SMB and SMB 3 to the slower 3-D Mario games.

guitarist4292

In the sense of pure platforming, yes the Galaxies are far better games... but for me and many others the exploration factor MORE than made up for those aspects of platforming that are lost and ultimately results in a more enjoyable experience. It's definitely subjective. Do you want more precise linear platforming or do you want sandbox exploration? It just comes down to personal preference.

Absolutely. However, if you look at both the commercial and gaming critic successes of the NSMB series and especially SMG and SMG2, it wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to move away from what people seem to enjoy the most when it comes to the current/future direction for Mario. Look at the Donkey Kong Country Series, after Donkey Kong 64 did the obligatory move to three dimensions, everyone just wanted a platformer that worked and DK had a revival with the 2-D DKC Returns. Not to say that these games shouldn't be 3-D in nature, I feel that they are just harder for the majority to get in to, and Nintendo knows this.

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#58 Posted by GunSmith1_basic (10532 posts) -
I wished that Galaxy 2 would have at least one giant planet in it. A planet so huge that you could get lost on it, but it would still wrap around. The curve of the planet would not be so noticeable and there could be a moon orbiting it that you could launch yourself to as well. The Galaxy games never had any areas that matched the complexity of the average Banjo Kazooie level. Time to take it to the next level.
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#59 Posted by bonesawisready5 (4971 posts) -
Honestly 2016 is our best chance at another remake or a sequel Nintendo could make a 20th anniversary Mario 64 remake for Wii U, which I would prefer since it would be the biggest possible graphics leap but its also possible they would make a Mario 64 remake (again) for their next-gen handheld which could release in 2016. It would be five years after 3DS after all.
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#60 Posted by guitarist4292 (503 posts) -

[QUOTE="guitarist4292"][QUOTE="FFCYAN"]The platforming genre, by nature, are linear due to designed obstacles one must overcome to reach the intended objectives. Although games like Super Mario 64 and Sunshine were able to create a fully explorable 3-D world to platform in, there are aspects to platfoeming that are lost when you throw exploration into a genre that thrives on deftly reaching goals in a fluid, precisely controlled manner. That is why I have prefered the Galaxies and older SMB and SMB 3 to the slower 3-D Mario games.

FFCYAN

In the sense of pure platforming, yes the Galaxies are far better games... but for me and many others the exploration factor MORE than made up for those aspects of platforming that are lost and ultimately results in a more enjoyable experience. It's definitely subjective. Do you want more precise linear platforming or do you want sandbox exploration? It just comes down to personal preference.

Absolutely. However, if you look at both the commercial and gaming critic successes of the NSMB series and especially SMG and SMG2, it wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to move away from what people seem to enjoy the most when it comes to the current/future direction for Mario. Look at the Donkey Kong Country Series, after Donkey Kong 64 did the obligatory move to three dimensions, everyone just wanted a platformer that worked and DK had a revival with the 2-D DKC Returns. Not to say that these games shouldn't be 3-D in nature, I feel that they are just harder for the majority to get in to, and Nintendo knows this.

Oh yeah, it wouldn't make any sense to go back to the 64/sunshine style. Besides commercial and critical success, more linear, focused design is definitely the dominant trend in today's gameplay philosophies. I don't think a 64-style game is gonna happen, it's just that I'd like it. For that matter I'd also like another DK game like DK64.
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#61 Posted by mark552495786 (69 posts) -

I think Mario Sunshine was the sequel. 

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#62 Posted by FFCYAN (4964 posts) -

Oh yeah, it wouldn't make any sense to go back to the 64/sunshine style. Besides commercial and critical success, more linear, focused design is definitely the dominant trend in today's gameplay philosophies. I don't think a 64-style game is gonna happen, it's just that I'd like it. For that matter I'd also like another DK game like DK64.guitarist4292
I honestly wouldn't mind a Sunshine remake or a sequel, but those STUUUUUPID blue coin challenges left a bad aftertaste for open environment 3-D Marios. Dumb game design choices tend to have a huge impact on me when it comes to later games. That's why I never played Spirit Tracks for DS, because Phantom Hourglass had the worst dungeon in Zelda history that you had to painfully play over and over again like some kind of sick joke. I'd just rather have the awesome level and design creativity with games like SMB 3 and Super Mario Galaxy for Mario. It's what nearly everyone would agree upon.:)

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#63 Posted by gronik1 (25 posts) -

[QUOTE="guitarist4292"]Oh yeah, it wouldn't make any sense to go back to the 64/sunshine style. Besides commercial and critical success, more linear, focused design is definitely the dominant trend in today's gameplay philosophies. I don't think a 64-style game is gonna happen, it's just that I'd like it. For that matter I'd also like another DK game like DK64.FFCYAN

I honestly wouldn't mind a Sunshine remake or a sequel, but those STUUUUUPID blue coin challenges left a bad aftertaste for open environment 3-D Marios. Dumb game design choices tend to have a huge impact on me when it comes to later games. That's why I never played Spirit Tracks for DS, because Phantom Hourglass had the worst dungeon in Zelda history that you had to painfully play over and over again like some kind of sick joke. I'd just rather have the awesome level and design creativity with games like SMB 3 and Super Mario Galaxy for Mario. It's what nearly everyone would agree upon.:)

To be honest, I don't really see how every thinks Super Mario Galaxy is that linear... Some of the levels have some many planets in them, with secret levels to unlock and secret planets to unlock within those levels. Once you get the flying mushroom exploration is ready set go! However I really don't think we will see this in the next big 3D mario game. Galaxy had to be presented in the way it was to give the feeling of traveling around a huge galaxy; but as Miyamoto has stated before he is more interested in making new experiences. This is why Mario 64 was in 3D, why Sunshine had a gadget, why Galaxy was in space & why the next Mario game will be something new. That being said, a few things can probably be assumed from what we might expect in the next game; *Shared experience; Galaxy already laid the foundation for this with wii mote helpers as asymmetrical multiplayer. This is one of the Wii U's cornerstones so expect something utilizing this feature. *Connected experience; The Wii U has been built to expand the online capabilities of their software. Mii Verse is assured. What if we could see Mario silhouettes everywhere on the gamepads screen, selecting one would show us another Marios world to watch him playing a level. *The name: Wii U, of course it could be called Mario U, but this is quite unlikely. What is more likely is the name of "Mario Universe" which would help translate some of those prior game play mechanics stated above. This would also help be move from the Galaxy name, as Universe is a major step up in the scale of size, and would allow for many new interesting levels to exist whilst also being able to pull in levels from prior games such as Sunshine, Galaxy, 64 & super Mario World!
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#64 Posted by guitarist4292 (503 posts) -

[QUOTE="guitarist4292"]Oh yeah, it wouldn't make any sense to go back to the 64/sunshine style. Besides commercial and critical success, more linear, focused design is definitely the dominant trend in today's gameplay philosophies. I don't think a 64-style game is gonna happen, it's just that I'd like it. For that matter I'd also like another DK game like DK64.FFCYAN

I honestly wouldn't mind a Sunshine remake or a sequel, but those STUUUUUPID blue coin challenges left a bad aftertaste for open environment 3-D Marios. Dumb game design choices tend to have a huge impact on me when it comes to later games. That's why I never played Spirit Tracks for DS, because Phantom Hourglass had the worst dungeon in Zelda history that you had to painfully play over and over again like some kind of sick joke. I'd just rather have the awesome level and design creativity with games like SMB 3 and Super Mario Galaxy for Mario. It's what nearly everyone would agree upon.:)

The difference between open vs. linear doesn't have to mean superior or inferior level design. I think 64 had superb level design. Sunshine did for that matter too, it just lacked a little in the meaningful content department and padded the Shine count with blue coins. I don't think that has anything to do with level design though... Additionally, with the exception of the gravity mechanic which is a truly awesome hook, there's not much outstandingly clever about Galaxy's level design. If anything, it repeats the same handful of clever gravity tricks over and over, and when those tricks aren't used the levels fall a bit flat. Also, saying that "nearly everyone" would agree on ANY one thing is pretty bold hahaha, but especially when it comes to the 3D Mario discussion. I feel like it's pretty split down the middle.
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#65 Posted by FFCYAN (4964 posts) -

The difference between open vs. linear doesn't have to mean superior or inferior level design. I think 64 had superb level design. Sunshine did for that matter too, it just lacked a little in the meaningful content department and padded the Shine count with blue coins. I don't think that has anything to do with level design though... Additionally, with the exception of the gravity mechanic which is a truly awesome hook, there's not much outstandingly clever about Galaxy's level design. If anything, it repeats the same handful of clever gravity tricks over and over, and when those tricks aren't used the levels fall a bit flat. Also, saying that "nearly everyone" would agree on ANY one thing is pretty bold hahaha, but especially when it comes to the 3D Mario discussion. I feel like it's pretty split down the middle.guitarist4292
What?! Level design in Super Mario Galaxy were fantastic. It's the very first thing mentioned in the SMG Gamspot review in the "Good" section! Super Mario Galaxy 2 has levels mention first in "The Good" section yet again. Granted, it's all subjective, but when nearly every gaming critic and gamer says practically the same, you are pretty much against the grain with your opinion.

A few things mentioning about the linear Marion games:

1: They are always easier to pick up and play. Games like SM 64 and Sunshine had the hubs and rooms that took more time to navigate to get to a level, then the levels themselves took longer to complete as exploring spaces tends to do that. SMG had hubs as well, but far more confined then the castle and island resort of old.

2: They encourage more players to share the game. Even the first SMB had a two player option. SMG and SMG 2 were fairly limited in two player co-op, relegating the second person to collecting Star Bits, but SM 64 and Sunshine were pure one player only. This isn't necessarily a deal breaker or anything, but it's worth mentioning.

3: I feel the biggest asset to the linear Mario games thus far are the possibilities it brings. It would have been nearly impossible to take Galaxy's spherical worlds and upside down navigation with a SM64 point of view. It would be nauseating and confusing. There are just things that can't be done without having a direct point of reference to platform in, hence, the linearity creates structure for ideas and levels can could not otherwise be navigated easily.

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#66 Posted by PokeCrysis (40 posts) -
Well it depends on what you regard as a sequel; If you mean a game that follows a similar "feel" then Mario Galaxy Has already been released. If you are talking about a game with the title "Super Mario 64 2" then I seriously doubt it.
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#67 Posted by guitarist4292 (503 posts) -

[QUOTE="guitarist4292"]The difference between open vs. linear doesn't have to mean superior or inferior level design. I think 64 had superb level design. Sunshine did for that matter too, it just lacked a little in the meaningful content department and padded the Shine count with blue coins. I don't think that has anything to do with level design though... Additionally, with the exception of the gravity mechanic which is a truly awesome hook, there's not much outstandingly clever about Galaxy's level design. If anything, it repeats the same handful of clever gravity tricks over and over, and when those tricks aren't used the levels fall a bit flat. Also, saying that "nearly everyone" would agree on ANY one thing is pretty bold hahaha, but especially when it comes to the 3D Mario discussion. I feel like it's pretty split down the middle.FFCYAN

What?! Level design in Super Mario Galaxy were fantastic. It's the very first thing mentioned in the SMG Gamspot review in the "Good" section! Super Mario Galaxy 2 has levels mention first in "The Good" section yet again. Granted, it's all subjective, but when nearly every gaming critic and gamer says practically the same, you are pretty much against the grain with your opinion.

A few things mentioning about the linear Marion games:

1: They are always easier to pick up and play. Games like SM 64 and Sunshine had the hubs and rooms that took more time to navigate to get to a level, then the levels themselves took longer to complete as exploring spaces tends to do that. SMG had hubs as well, but far more confined then the castle and island resort of old.

2: They encourage more players to share the game. Even the first SMB had a two player option. SMG and SMG 2 were fairly limited in two player co-op, relegating the second person to collecting Star Bits, but SM 64 and Sunshine were pure one player only. This isn't necessarily a deal breaker or anything, but it's worth mentioning.

3: I feel the biggest asset to the linear Mario games thus far are the possibilities it brings. It would have been nearly impossible to take Galaxy's spherical worlds and upside down navigation with a SM64 point of view. It would be nauseating and confusing. There are just things that can't be done without having a direct point of reference to platform in, hence, the linearity creates structure for ideas and levels can could not otherwise be navigated easily.

I should clarify, I'm not intending to say anything truly negative about the Galaxy games... I loved them both a ton. I don't think they had bad level design... that would just be incorrect, I'm just less of a fan of that type of level design. Neither do I think that the gravity mechanic of Galaxy should have been paired with the openness of 64. I'm just saying, if I had things my way, the NEXT 3D Mario would be like 64/Sunshine in terms of level design, and I know I'm not alone in feeling that way. That's just the era of game design I grew up in, and personally what I find most fun. There are obvious advantages to linearity, as I said in an earlier post in this thread, but the sandbox nature of 64 is more entertaining for me and a lot of others, just like the precision of linearity is clearly something you enjoy more. The entirety of my point is that it comes down to taste, and as much as I'd like to see a 64/Sunshine style 3D Mario game, I don't think it's going to happen. I was simply adding my two cents to the others in this thread who expressed a love for the 3D Mario style of old.
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#68 Posted by LionHeart897 (25 posts) -

Super Mario Sunshine was actually the prequel to Luigi's Mansion. Theres no connection (story wise) between SM64 and Sunshine.

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#69 Posted by ZHONGTIAN (25 posts) -
thing shouts poverty, stupidity, poor decision making skills, and just overall trashiness quite like smoking a cigarette
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#70 Posted by calway55 (361 posts) -

I really liked Mario 64 and Sunshine. When Galaxy came out it was great graphics but not as much enjoyment as I got from Mario 64 and Sunshine. When Galaxy 2 was announced all I could think of was "Oh, they had too much material in the first Galaxy that had to be cut so that's where that new game came from." It reminds me of The Yoshi yarn game that is coming up. Will this be the same case? Game play that didn't fit into Kirby's Epic Yarn? If it is an improvement on the game then that would be good. After reading about new Wii U games in the making, I've noticed that the team making the new Mario game is called the galaxy team or team galaxy :( I never cared for the space theme or the music. I'd like something completely new, but with the whimsy and exploring that Mario64 and Sunshine offered.

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#71 Posted by Truewolf2008 (25 posts) -

A la Super Mario 128? Not going to happen. 64 on DS is as close as we get to a sequel. That said, I would love Super Mario All-Stars 2 with full HD remakes of Mario 64, Sunshine and both Galaxy games (or at least the first one) on Wii U, using the engine Nintendo will use for 3D Mario.bonesawisready5

 

Sir, if I knew where you are, I would high-five you.

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#72 Posted by braycuster8 (25 posts) -
It was my favorite Mario game.
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#73 Posted by sonic_spark (5524 posts) -

[QUOTE="bonesawisready5"]A la Super Mario 128? Not going to happen. 64 on DS is as close as we get to a sequel. That said, I would love Super Mario All-Stars 2 with full HD remakes of Mario 64, Sunshine and both Galaxy games (or at least the first one) on Wii U, using the engine Nintendo will use for 3D Mario.Truewolf2008

 

Sir, if I knew where you are, I would high-five you.

Agreed.

That said, what I want to see are the vast levels and exploration of Super Mario 64 in the WiiU Mario Title.  However, I also enjoyed the obstacle course stages from Sunshine/Galaxy.  I would further like to see some Galaxy levels thrown in the mix.  

I expect nothing short of a mind blowing outing for Mario on the Wii U.  Galaxy and Mario 64 were wow.  I expect to be wow'ed again, but x2.

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#74 Posted by Guovssohas (330 posts) -
I would love a new Mario game in the style of Mario 64. :)