could these visuals or better be done on DSi?

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darth-pyschosis

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#1 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

Perfect Dark Picture

as you all know, perfect dark on the N64 used the expansion pak, making it need to run off in most cases, 8MB RAM.

i'm wondering is this do-able on the DSi? can something even better be done? i know N64 did 320x240 but i'm wondering if the 256x192 DSi can pull it off (it sure passes all the technical specs)

and for sake of comparison lets compare PD to Moon

Perfect Dark Picture

and here is moon

Moon Screenshot

so i'm wondering PD on N64 needed a 94Mhz CPU, and 8MB RAM to look that way

so the DSi has 133Mhz CPU for 3D, and 16MB RAM. couldn't the DSi surpass these graphics?

(the DS lite can't its CPU speed and RAM is less than the amount the N64 needed for PD originally so thats out of the question i think)

would you like to see the DSi enhanced game card games to sport visuals like these in 3D games? thoughts?

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Jaysonguy

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#2 Jaysonguy
Member since 2006 • 39454 Posts

The DSi is not more powerful then the DSLite so no, it can't

What you and others keep thinking is that the extra power the DSi has is used for games. That's false.

It's for keeping an operating system going at the same time while you're doing everything on the DSi.

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#3 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

The DSi is not more powerful then the DSLite so no, it can't

What you and others keep thinking is that the extra power the DSi has is used for games. That's false.

It's for keeping an operating system going at the same time while you're doing everything on the DSi.

Jaysonguy

do you have proof of how much said OS uses at all times?

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darth-pyschosis

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#4 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

well since Jaysonguy can't give me confirmed links or proof saying the DSi can in no way use its extra power for games, (plz if you find some i sincerely want it) AND if no one else can prove it

i think its safe too assume the DSi doesn't need 66Mhz CPU and 12MB RAM at all times to run that simple little menu with a few icons. So, that should say something of the DSi's better hardware can be used for grahpics

so, can you guys see PD like visuals? do you want to see better graphics? (in 3d games)

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darth-pyschosis

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#5 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

well, fellow DSi owners do you want these visuals?

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Nomoreblasphemy

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#6 Nomoreblasphemy
Member since 2008 • 198 Posts

well, fellow DSi owners do you want these visuals?

darth-pyschosis

Well, looking at Moon, haven't these visuals already been achieved/surpassed(with the exception of the texture filter)?

I have to go with jasonguy and say that the processor is only used for multitasking, which is what people upgrade when they want to improve their ability to multitask.Graphical improvementsI believe would require another componentto be upgraded, it's name I know not.Nintendo said the graphics wouldn't change, andwhat's more, jasonguy said it. :P

Considering what Nintendo said they'll be doing with the DSi, multitasking is EXACTLY what the beefed up processor is for.

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louiscky2

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#7 louiscky2
Member since 2005 • 267 Posts

all this talk of the processor being used SOLELY for multitasking, but wats all this extra power doing when your actually playing a game ? to me it seems a bit pointless to have it doing nothing which is why i and ALOT of other people belive that in the future DSi exclusives will come out and will use the extra processor power....

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#8 flippin_flames
Member since 2008 • 348 Posts

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

well, fellow DSi owners do you want these visuals?

Nomoreblasphemy

Well, looking at Moon, haven't these visuals already been achieved/surpassed(with the exception of the texture filter)?

I have to go with jasonguy and say that the processor is only used for multitasking, which is what people upgrade when they want to improve their ability to multitask.Graphical improvementsI believe would require another componentto be upgraded, it's name I know not.Nintendo said the graphics wouldn't change, andwhat's more, jasonguy said it. :P

Considering what Nintendo said they'll be doing with the DSi, multitasking is EXACTLY what the beefed up processor is for.

When?

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Willy_Ham

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#9 Willy_Ham
Member since 2009 • 25 Posts
I don't know alot about computers/computer software but will the extra RAM help games like "the settlers" and others that run slow or lag run faster? Or is the RAM for multi-tasking also...
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dsownge

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#10 dsownge
Member since 2005 • 2393 Posts

I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite with camera and some minor stuff.

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darth-pyschosis

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#11 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

well, fellow DSi owners do you want these visuals?

Nomoreblasphemy

Well, looking at Moon, haven't these visuals already been achieved/surpassed(with the exception of the texture filter)?

I have to go with jasonguy and say that the processor is only used for multitasking, which is what people upgrade when they want to improve their ability to multitask.Graphical improvementsI believe would require another componentto be upgraded, it's name I know not.Nintendo said the graphics wouldn't change, andwhat's more, jasonguy said it. :P

Considering what Nintendo said they'll be doing with the DSi, multitasking is EXACTLY what the beefed up processor is for.

1. so you're saying it can't multitask by using better lighting, more things on screen, better AI? thats multitasking

2. so you propose all DSi games will leave 66mhz and 12MB RAM un-used? just because they are there for multitasking? what are they multitasking while playing a game?

3. Moon doesn't nearly look as good as PD, and PD could look better on DSi from a technical level

4. nintendo hasn't said (to my knowledge) that the graphics wouldnt change, they said the hardware didn't change, which is true and untrue. yes they are the same types of CPU, and RAM as lite. but they added more to them. They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade

5. jasyonguy said it was the OS, and he has already told me he has no proof (infacti asked him 3 or 4 times before he finally answered)whatsoever that the Operating System will need 66Mhz and 12MB RAM, we have no idea what the OS needs, if you think 66mhz and 12MB RAM is needed for that scrolling menu, thats fine. i don't. doesn't seem logical it would need 2 to 3 times the power of Phantom Hourglass.

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#12 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite with camera and some minor stuff.

dsownge

no one said that. to say "i also think that" it implies someone previously stated the same thing you said.

thats disruptive posting, we're discussing the graphical possibilities of the DSi's hardware increase, and no one can give me a direct answer on why the full CPU and RAM wouldn't be open for use.

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#13 meiaman
Member since 2006 • 3300 Posts

[QUOTE="dsownge"]

I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite with camera and some minor stuff.

darth-pyschosis

no one said that. to say "i also think that" it implies someone previously stated the same thing you said.

thats disruptive posting, we're discussing the graphical possibilities of the DSi's hardware increase, and no one can give me a direct answer on why the full CPU and RAM wouldn't be open for use.

Calm down Darth, you need to relax a bit. Well, its no use trying to convince people about the truth of the DSi now, since the DSi development and stuff is still on his initial stage, as we know, Ninty can just launch a expansion pack for the DSi to give it higly upgraded graphics or abandon the project like they did with Snes cd.
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#14 Nintendo_Ownes7
Member since 2005 • 30973 Posts

I think it is possible the DSi is powerful enough. Developers just have to use it to their advantage.

The only developers that could make the N64 look its best wereNintendo, Factor 5, and Rareware.

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riariases

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#15 riariases
Member since 2007 • 2335 Posts
[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"]

The DSi is not more powerful then the DSLite so no, it can't

What you and others keep thinking is that the extra power the DSi has is used for games. That's false.

It's for keeping an operating system going at the same time while you're doing everything on the DSi.

Okay, lets look at facts, not stupid things made up by people who don't know what they are talking about. The DS Lite has a 4mb ram and 64MHz processor, and the DSi has a 16mb ram and 133MHz processor, am I right? Of course I am. Now heres the deal. That extra power was added so It was powerful enough to use things like the DSi Shop, Camera and so on because fact: 4mb ram and 64Mhz processor couldn't handle it all at full speed. But those specs were enough to run the games. Now the DSi only uses 4mb and 64MHz processor to run DS games because thats all it needs. Think of it as your PC you're on right now. Click CTRL, ALT, Delete and the task manager should come up. Click on that Performance tab at the top. On the left hand of the task manager window, it will show a CPU and PF Usage. CPU refers to the processor and PF refers to the ram. The DS Lite and DSi are like this as well because they are also both using this same technology. Now if it showed a DSi's chartings while playing MarioKart for instance. The CPU Usage would be %50 while the PF Usage would be a 1/4th of the bar and would say 4mb. You understand now? Do me a favour and make sure you know what you're saying so that you don't make a fool of yourself next time and I don't have to explain how computers work.
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#16 canadianloonie
Member since 2004 • 384 Posts

I would think so. DS/DSi's video ram is also better than N64's (656kb to 16kb). So, DSi can technically do it.

But, the real question is whether developers will actually push the system and do it. Sadly, the answer is no. The demand for a realistic 3D "hardcore" game on the DS/DSi is simply too low to justify the high cost in making one.

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#17 dsownge
Member since 2005 • 2393 Posts

[QUOTE="dsownge"]

I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite with camera and some minor stuff.

darth-pyschosis

no one said that. to say "i also think that" it implies someone previously stated the same thing you said.

thats disruptive posting, we're discussing the graphical possibilities of the DSi's hardware increase, and no one can give me a direct answer on why the full CPU and RAM wouldn't be open for use.

jaysonguy said "The DSi is not more powerful then the DSLite so no"

So thats why i said "I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite". Now if you can prove to me that it is more powerful than the DS lite then i will believe.

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riariases

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#18 riariases
Member since 2007 • 2335 Posts
[QUOTE="dsownge"]

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

[QUOTE="dsownge"]

I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite with camera and some minor stuff.

no one said that. to say "i also think that" it implies someone previously stated the same thing you said.

thats disruptive posting, we're discussing the graphical possibilities of the DSi's hardware increase, and no one can give me a direct answer on why the full CPU and RAM wouldn't be open for use.

jaysonguy said "The DSi is not more powerful then the DSLite so no"

So thats why i said "I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite". Now if you can prove to me that it is more powerful than the DS lite then i will believe.

Okay so 4mb ram compared to 16mb ram? 64MHz processor compared to 133MHz processor? Thats not even first grade math. I'm very unimpressed.
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#19 FILIPINOMAZTER
Member since 2008 • 1627 Posts

I think it is possible the DSi is powerful enough. Developers just have to use it to their advantage.

The only developers that could make the N64 look its best wereNintendo, Factor 5, and Rareware.

Nintendo_Ownes7
but rareware doesnt work for nintendo anymore :(
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darth-pyschosis

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#20 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

[QUOTE="dsownge"]

I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite with camera and some minor stuff.

dsownge

no one said that. to say "i also think that" it implies someone previously stated the same thing you said.

thats disruptive posting, we're discussing the graphical possibilities of the DSi's hardware increase, and no one can give me a direct answer on why the full CPU and RAM wouldn't be open for use.

jaysonguy said "The DSi is not more powerful then the DSLite so no"

So thats why i said "I also think that the DSi is just a DS lite". Now if you can prove to me that it is more powerful than the DS lite then i will believe.

i think my bro ria already took care of this. and in addition to this, ppl say the resolution being the same will present a prob

it will for 2d games, 3d games can visually benefit

and the GCN and Wii have the same resolution, and certain Wii games clearly look better than anything on GCN

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Nomoreblasphemy

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#23 Nomoreblasphemy
Member since 2008 • 198 Posts

[QUOTE="Nomoreblasphemy"]

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

well, fellow DSi owners do you want these visuals?

darth-pyschosis

Well, looking at Moon, haven't these visuals already been achieved/surpassed(with the exception of the texture filter)?

I have to go with jasonguy and say that the processor is only used for multitasking, which is what people upgrade when they want to improve their ability to multitask.Graphical improvementsI believe would require another componentto be upgraded, it's name I know not.Nintendo said the graphics wouldn't change, andwhat's more, jasonguy said it. :P

Considering what Nintendo said they'll be doing with the DSi, multitasking is EXACTLY what the beefed up processor is for.

1. so you're saying it can't multitask by using better lighting, more things on screen, better AI? thats multitasking

I'm saying that it's multitasking by constantlyrunning more processes

2. so you propose all DSi games will leave 66mhz and 12MB RAM un-used? just because they are there for multitasking? what are they multitasking while playing a game? Other processes are running in the background

3. Moon doesn't nearly look as good as PD, and PD could look better on DSi from a technical level

PD looks a mess compared to Moon IMO. Plus, the DSI still can't use a tex filter.

4. nintendo hasn't said (to my knowledge) that the graphics wouldnt change, they said the hardware didn't change, which is true and untrue. yes they are the same types of CPU, and RAM as lite. but they added more to them. They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade.

Iwata clearly said "things like graphical capabilities wouldn't change, so we needed to present a sense of newness to users," or something like that.

5. jasyonguy said it was the OS, and he has already told me he has no proof (infacti asked him 3 or 4 times before he finally answered)whatsoever that the Operating System will need 66Mhz and 12MB RAM, we have no idea what the OS needs, if you think 66mhz and 12MB RAM is needed for that scrolling menu, thats fine. i don't. doesn't seem logical it would need 2 to 3 times the power of Phantom Hourglass.

Of course it doesn't need 66MHz and 12MB of ram. That extra power is probably being used elsewhere or is being capped. Especially in the DSi's case, using ~100% of the processor power is very inefficient.

Since all you have are theories, I'll present mine: DS games aren't very CPU intensive, so they need more vram to see an improvement. Nintendo hasn't revealed the amount vram the systems have, BUTthey said that graphical capabilities wouldn't change, which makes it safe to assume that it was left the same.

DS games don't run much differently because they don't have access to much more of the power- some being occupied by the OS, and the rest being capped. I've come to the conclusion that the DSi's processor speedis capped because It has a smaller battery and a much more powerful processor, yet the battery life doesn't take toomuch of a hit. The only way to reduce the amount of power a processor uses is to reduce its clock speed. That extra power is needed for the camera so it can run during a game, and in such case, the processor clocks up to 133MHz again. Better processors means that more processes- or more straining processes-can be running at any given time.

More proof as to why the processor would be capped: If you overclock a computer, it consumes more power even if CPU usage is at 1%. Having the DSi's processor at full speed all the times would kill the battery very quickly, so it would need to be capped to reduce it'senergy consumption. Look at the PSP- It's processor is by default capped to ~266MHz, but when necessary, it clocks up to 333MHz and consumes more power (games since update 3.5 do this).

The PSP clocks up when playing games made after update 3.5 that need the extra power. The DSi, having no use for the extra power aside from handling the new OS and using the camera, would only need to clock upwhen the camera is used.

It's a little unorganized and I have a little more to say, but I'm kinda tired and don't feel like typing it all or fixing this what I have already typed.

P.S. VRAM is used to process images and convert them before they are sent to the display. Without more VRAM, the DSi would not be able to render a larger image to be sent to the display.

P.S.(again)They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade.

You have no info proving this. (they never said the hardware didn't change, just the graphics). The small amount of info available actually disagrees with this. You cannot assume that they are lying, or really anything that wasn't suggested by their statements.

P.S.(...again) You are doing neither yourself nor anyone else any good by presenting this info. Given the very large chance that you're info is untrue, you are doing more harm than good.

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riariases

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#24 riariases
Member since 2007 • 2335 Posts
[QUOTE="Nomoreblasphemy"]

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

[QUOTE="Nomoreblasphemy"]

Well, looking at Moon, haven't these visuals already been achieved/surpassed(with the exception of the texture filter)?

I have to go with jasonguy and say that the processor is only used for multitasking, which is what people upgrade when they want to improve their ability to multitask.Graphical improvementsI believe would require another componentto be upgraded, it's name I know not.Nintendo said the graphics wouldn't change, andwhat's more, jasonguy said it. :P

Considering what Nintendo said they'll be doing with the DSi, multitasking is EXACTLY what the beefed up processor is for.

1. so you're saying it can't multitask by using better lighting, more things on screen, better AI? thats multitasking

I'm saying that it's multitasking by constantlyrunning more processes

2. so you propose all DSi games will leave 66mhz and 12MB RAM un-used? just because they are there for multitasking? what are they multitasking while playing a game? Other processes are running in the background

3. Moon doesn't nearly look as good as PD, and PD could look better on DSi from a technical level

PD looks a mess compared to Moon IMO. Plus, the DSI still can't use a tex filter.

4. nintendo hasn't said (to my knowledge) that the graphics wouldnt change, they said the hardware didn't change, which is true and untrue. yes they are the same types of CPU, and RAM as lite. but they added more to them. They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade.

Iwata clearly said "things like graphical capabilities wouldn't change, so we needed to present a sense of newness to users," or something like that.

5. jasyonguy said it was the OS, and he has already told me he has no proof (infacti asked him 3 or 4 times before he finally answered)whatsoever that the Operating System will need 66Mhz and 12MB RAM, we have no idea what the OS needs, if you think 66mhz and 12MB RAM is needed for that scrolling menu, thats fine. i don't. doesn't seem logical it would need 2 to 3 times the power of Phantom Hourglass.

Of course it doesn't need 66MHz and 12MB of ram. That extra power is probably being used elsewhere or is being capped. Especially in the DSi's case, using ~100% of the processor power is very inefficient.

Since all you have are theories, I'll present mine: DS games aren't very CPU intensive, so they need more vram to see an improvement. Nintendo hasn't revealed the amount vram the systems have, BUTthey said that graphical capabilities wouldn't change, which makes it safe to assume that it was left the same.

DS games don't run much differently because they don't have access to much more of the power- some being occupied by the OS, and the rest being capped. I've come to the conclusion that the DSi's processor speedis capped because It has a smaller battery and a much more powerful processor, yet the battery life doesn't take toomuch of a hit. The only way to reduce the amount of power a processor uses is to reduce its clock speed. That extra power is needed for the camera so it can run during a game, and in such case, the processor clocks up to 133MHz again. Better processors means that more processes- or more straining processes-can be running at any given time.

More proof as to why the processor would be capped: If you overclock a computer, it consumes more power even if CPU usage is at 1%. Having the DSi's processor at full speed all the times would kill the battery very quickly, so it would need to be capped to reduce it'senergy consumption. Look at the PSP- It's processor is by default capped to ~266MHz, but when necessary, it clocks up to 333MHz and consumes more power (games since update 3.5 do this).

The PSP clocks up when playing games made after update 3.5 that need the extra power. The DSi, having no use for the extra power aside from handling the new OS and using the camera, would only need to clock upwhen the camera is used.

It's a little unorganized and I have a little more to say, but I'm kinda tired and don't feel like typing it all or fixing this what I have already typed.

P.S. VRAM is used to process images and convert them before they are sent to the display. Without more VRAM, the DSi would not be able to render a larger image to be sent to the display.

P.S.(again)They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade.

You have no info proving this. (they never said the hardware didn't change, just the graphics). The small amount of info available actually disagrees with this. You cannot assume that they are lying, or really anything that wasn't suggested by their statements.

P.S.(...again) You are doing neither yourself nor anyone else any good by presenting this info. Given the very large chance that you're info is untrue, you are doing more harm than good.

Look, no one has hard facts here. We're gonna be argueing about this forever until someone cracks a DSi open and checks the VRAM or when exclusive DSi games come out and some game developer decides not to be lazy and make their game look good instead of taking the easier 2D path.
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darth-pyschosis

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#25 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

[QUOTE="Nomoreblasphemy"]

Well, looking at Moon, haven't these visuals already been achieved/surpassed(with the exception of the texture filter)?

I have to go with jasonguy and say that the processor is only used for multitasking, which is what people upgrade when they want to improve their ability to multitask.Graphical improvementsI believe would require another componentto be upgraded, it's name I know not.Nintendo said the graphics wouldn't change, andwhat's more, jasonguy said it. :P

Considering what Nintendo said they'll be doing with the DSi, multitasking is EXACTLY what the beefed up processor is for.

Nomoreblasphemy

1. so you're saying it can't multitask by using better lighting, more things on screen, better AI? thats multitasking

I'm saying that it's multitasking by constantlyrunning more processes

2. so you propose all DSi games will leave 66mhz and 12MB RAM un-used? just because they are there for multitasking? what are they multitasking while playing a game? Other processes are running in the background

3. Moon doesn't nearly look as good as PD, and PD could look better on DSi from a technical level

PD looks a mess compared to Moon IMO. Plus, the DSI still can't use a tex filter.

4. nintendo hasn't said (to my knowledge) that the graphics wouldnt change, they said the hardware didn't change, which is true and untrue. yes they are the same types of CPU, and RAM as lite. but they added more to them. They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade.

Iwata clearly said "things like graphical capabilities wouldn't change, so we needed to present a sense of newness to users," or something like that.

5. jasyonguy said it was the OS, and he has already told me he has no proof (infacti asked him 3 or 4 times before he finally answered)whatsoever that the Operating System will need 66Mhz and 12MB RAM, we have no idea what the OS needs, if you think 66mhz and 12MB RAM is needed for that scrolling menu, thats fine. i don't. doesn't seem logical it would need 2 to 3 times the power of Phantom Hourglass.

Of course it doesn't need 66MHz and 12MB of ram. That extra power is probably being used elsewhere or is being capped. Especially in the DSi's case, using ~100% of the processor power is very inefficient.

Since all you have are theories, I'll present mine: DS games aren't very CPU intensive, so they need more vram to see an improvement. Nintendo hasn't revealed the amount vram the systems have, BUTthey said that graphical capabilities wouldn't change, which makes it safe to assume that it was left the same.

DS games don't run much differently because they don't have access to much more of the power- some being occupied by the OS, and the rest being capped. I've come to the conclusion that the DSi's processor speedis capped because It has a smaller battery and a much more powerful processor, yet the battery life doesn't take toomuch of a hit. The only way to reduce the amount of power a processor uses is to reduce its clock speed. That extra power is needed for the camera so it can run during a game, and in such case, the processor clocks up to 133MHz again. Better processors means that more processes- or more straining processes-can be running at any given time.

More proof as to why the processor would be capped: If you overclock a computer, it consumes more power even if CPU usage is at 1%. Having the DSi's processor at full speed all the times would kill the battery very quickly, so it would need to be capped to reduce it'senergy consumption. Look at the PSP- It's processor is by default capped to ~266MHz, but when necessary, it clocks up to 333MHz and consumes more power (games since update 3.5 do this).

The PSP clocks up when playing games made after update 3.5 that need the extra power. The DSi, having no use for the extra power aside from handling the new OS and using the camera, would only need to clock upwhen the camera is used.

It's a little unorganized and I have a little more to say, but I'm kinda tired and don't feel like typing it all or fixing this what I have already typed.

P.S. VRAM is used to process images and convert them before they are sent to the display. Without more VRAM, the DSi would not be able to render a larger image to be sent to the display.

P.S.(again)They say it hasn't changed, but clearly to do anything with the camera, online, DSiware, they needed to beef up the CPU and RAM. so they are just BSing you. they are playing it safe with DS owners who won't immediately upgrade.

You have no info proving this. (they never said the hardware didn't change, just the graphics). The small amount of info available actually disagrees with this. You cannot assume that they are lying, or really anything that wasn't suggested by their statements.

P.S.(...again) You are doing neither yourself nor anyone else any good by presenting this info. Given the very large chance that you're info is untrue, you are doing more harm than good.

i'm a gamer who's excited about the possibilities of his new platform, so i'm trying to do good by gather information, from people who could be more knowledgable on the subject than me, to come to a conclusion of my new platform, the DSi

and i already told you it ria's thread, i meant to say they said they didn't change the graphics when i said Nintendo said they didn't change the hardware. and ria has already, in his thread, given a good example of the DS doing ray tracing in DQM:J, a thing you've said the DS can't do. so if you know an explantion for this, or if the DS is really doing it, then plz fill me in. i sincerely want to know. i'm not trying to upset anyone dude, i'm just speculating and hoping nintendo ditches its old platform and embraces its newest platform. why shouldn't i? i own one afterall.

another thing, so if the DSi has 656kb of VRAM, no more than lite, will the 16MB RAM and 133Mhz CPU speed, if somehow used in a DSi only game, it will show no difference? or will it show some difference? could objects be smoother? i guess there won't be objects on screen at a time, but couldn't gameplay be sped up? if Link is the only thing on screen, in a game that doesn't have a lot on screen at a time, couldn't the CPU and RAM show some difference over a normal DS game with 3D models despite the same amount of VRAM? i mean that kinda of increase seemslike it would help games which uses 3D models but only need 1 or 2 things on screen at a time. but i'm no expert, and you're acting like one, so plz fill me in