Red Dead Redemption 2 - The Game

It's kind of impossible to find a place to actually have a conversation about this game so I decided to open a thread outside SW and give it a try.

So my early impressions are... The game is gorgeous. Not saying that everything looks amazing but as a whole I'll say that this is the most impressive game I've played this gen (or ever). The only negative so far is the mission failure status, and this seems like an huge overlook in QA which should have pointed out thid. But in all honesty once you understand the rule that once you are on a mission you can't deviate from it it stops being so bad. But the should definitely have implemented a better warning system before you fail a mission.

Having played RDR very recently I do feel gameplay was improved. Still some issues but once you tweak settings you're set.

Love the general slow pacing. But some players might displeased by it. But again... I LOVE it.

Exploration is extremely rewarding. And this is where the game truly shines. The emerging situations are unmatched and definitely a step above everyone else. I just wißh they had implemented a elemental system like BotW, that would amazing.

Still just at around 10h so plenty of stuff to see and do. But so far this game is totally my kind of game. They nailed it.

Great! I'm just waiting on my RDR2 PS4 bundle to arrive and then I can join the fun. Then my dilemma will be to spend most of my time on Witcher 3 or RDR2!

i'm only just near the start of chapter 2 so still early days but so far -

chapter 1 felt faster paced and more action packed than the opening of rdr1, which is a good thing as doing odd jobs around the mcfarlane ranch wasn't a great way to open the game imo. but it's largely on rails which may be a little frustrating for those who want to quickly dive in and start exploring.

the presentation and production values are absolutely top notch with typical r* attention to detail but the base ps4 struggles occasionally during busy scenes. i'd love to play it on the one x.

there's a lot of dialogue, but it's well written and voiced, and interspersed well between gameplay sections so it doesn't drag. the game does a great job of quickly establishing the setting and characters and painting an authentic and atmospheric world.

controls seem a little fiddly and the shooting / cover system don't seem much different than it was in gta v but i'm hoping they get fleshed out as the game progresses.

but all in all a highly encouraging and engrossing start and i can't wait to play more this weekend

@phbz: Probably won't play it because the first Read Dead Redemption didn't strike me as a game as good as fans claimed it to be. And reading-

The game is gorgeous. Not saying that everything looks amazing but as a whole I'll say that this is the most impressive game I've played this gen (or ever)

after its been public for so little time. . I can only assume is zeitgeist mentality from Gamers that get easily sucked into presentation and forget a lot of the rest. It's The Last of Us/ Uncharted 4/ God of War IV/ Spiderman all over again_

I've recently played SCORN: Part 1, which itself is a looker, however I didn't leave viewing it as the best game in existence because its visuals. What I'm getting at is, from my experience Rockstar fans tend to blindly praise the positives and ignore everything else, almost like this developer gets a free pass_

Having played RDR very recently I do feel gameplay was improved. Still some issues but once you tweak settings you're set.

That's cool, but from what I've read you have to do a lot of annoying pace-killing things in the sequel, almost like The Sims features. Which I know many can overlook but seems stupid to me, like cooking and weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. Are these optional in RDR2 or needed for progression? I suppose all that can be overlooked if the shooting's really good, which does look pretty good in RDR2, and switching to FP mode seems better than GTAV.

Well despite my stance I'm glad it's living up to fans expectations. Even if they do seem exaggerated.

I'm really not liking Arthur Morgan as the main character. I find him to have zero charisma, ugly to look at and ugly voice to listen to. Whenever I hear John Marston talk it brings back good memories and makes me want him to be the main character again. Not sure why they didn't just go with the proven dude this time. Game is pretty but very slow so far (end of ch. 1) and everything just seems to be unnecessarily complicated. I'm hoping things improve.

@s0ldier69: To be honest yesterday I had the same opinion but now not really, now I'm getting more and more into the character.

Terrible combat/sluggish controls. Lots of fetch quests and riding around on your horse. Another overrated Rockstar game.

@RSM-HQ: Although a very different game than BotW they have in common some stuff that can be off putting to many. I really love the micro tasking, what you see as pace killing is exactly what sets the right pace for me. I can honestly understand why this can be a big no for many, this is as far from what is expected from a mainstream game as a mainstream game can be.

@phbz: Mainstream is a business term for mass market appeal. Which is not really those kind of mini games at all.

And while Rockstar have countlessly shown they deliver to a mass market; I don't think it's because of the various odd mini games, otherwise the stress system in MGSIV would have been a selling point and huge hit for Metal Gear Solid (spoiler: it wasn't, most hated it)

I would bet RDR2 will be successful and eye catching because of the style of open-world and mature themes R* deliver. The mini games are more likely to make people pull away quicker, or at least wait for the online. . on that note_

Goes without question GTAV would not be one of the most successful games of all time without the online modes.

Battle Royale is mainstream, loot and level progressions are mainstream, Death Match and Raids are mainstream, showering and shaving pace breakers?. . . Not really. But open-worlds are, and that's what'll sell a Rockstar game, because they've proven to be the best at it time-and-time-again 'for many'. Adding some of those online and progression editions adds to an even wider mass market.

@Damedius: Just curious, which version are you playing.....base console or Pro/X?

@sealionact: Base. I have a PC as well so I won't upgrade till next gen drops.

I adore the multi-tasking as well. I was surprised to see this game getting very initial bad first impressions in ResetERA's OT due to pacing issues. While I can understand the criticism, I believe part of the problem and what is leading to these feelings is that because this game is simulation-esque in many of its mechanics and have so many to introduce from the get go, the game could not have just thrown the player into the deep end allowing for such freedom without overwhelming them beyond hope given the intricacies and depth of its gameplay systems. The pacing has picked up significantly after the snow prologue, and I'm loving (and have loved) every single second of it.

Seriously, I'm in awe and lost in this world. It's remarkable and breathtaking in the detail of its immersion and scope, and I so far from what I've played, consider this R*'s magnum opus. This is going to take me hundreds of hours to absorb. I'm playing in 1st person mode (only off horse) which not only rectifies some of the shooting issues, but makes the game far more engrossing and personal. If this were given VR support (which I believe it will be when it hits PC), it would be VR's vindication against the doubters.

As an aside, thanks OP for this thread to get away from the System Wars nonsense.

This far I'd say the game will be like GTAIV.

GTAIV was loved by critics, but hated by many gamers who could not see past the issues and failings. And it still is. Loved and hated in equal measure.

For me, the failings in RDR2 are pretty apparent, and in many cases, glaring, but I'm beginning to see that there might be a golden game there, behind all that. Just like in GTAIV, a game that I simply love.

Having said that, its pretty obvious the game does need updating the same way every new game does these days. This is bit surprising, given that Rockstar is known for never launching games unfinished.

So, to avoid fanboy or hater jargon, I'd say the game is a mixed bag in both the good and the bad. And the ugly.

i was trying to stay reserved and not wax lyrical about rdr2 just yet, as i still have a long, long way to go, but after sinking several more hours into it, f*ck it. ^what mirko said.

i'm similarly blown away with the world rockstar have created. the lighting effects and the day / night / weather cycles are outrageously good. and the draw distance... wow, what sorcery is this? open world games on console often struggle to portray distance with things on the horizon rendered distorted or muddy, and it's often an immersion breaker for me if aspects of the landscape fail to look convincing.

but rockstar have somehow managed to get the background scenery, even things that are huge distances away, to be vivid and detailed enough to look realistic. it's almost like an oil painting saturation effect, and it results in some stunningly vast and epic backdrops. it's often immersion overload. and coupled with the sound which is just... nature in all its glory, and the occasional unobtrusive musical accompaniment, it has me regularly stopping to just look around and soak it all in.

have to admit, after seeing all the micromanagement tooltips pop up throughout the first chapter i was skeptical over whether they'd be a worthwhile complement to the gameplay, but so far the simulation aspect is great and further compounds the game's authenticity. combine all this with a brilliantly realised fps mode (for everything none horse or melee fighting based, in my case) and you have a highly absorbing game in which it's easy to lose hours in at a time.

i've been quietly miffed that rockstar took a five year hiatus from sp games this gen but maybe that's a necessary evil we have to live with to allow them to create something of this kind of scale and quality. rdr1 lost momentum for me around the half way mark. i'm really hoping rdr2 doesn't follow the same path. now excuse me i have a horse to go bath and brush

@Macutchi: yea, this is a western fan's wet-dream.

I'm especially digging the hunting, and've just discovered that you have to study animals first through the binoculars to be able to identify pelt quality (which I need the highest to have Pearson craft satchel upgrades), then hunt them properly to attain it. Thank God that sniper shots to the dome retain pelt quality. Currently I'm just on horseback trying to study everything I see, but it's hard as wildlife can be fairly elusive at times. Plus the fact that I can't find a way to identify on the map which species are where WITH bounties on me and this can be a pain (also can't reach a fence to sell my stolen goods as they're waiting for me there).

Do you know? There has to be a map or something that shows where each animal is, because I don't want to play the whole game with having no upgrades but I have to know where to find each respective species. There's general icons on the map but they give no indication of specificity.

@MirkoS77: no i haven't come across one yet but if i do i'll let you know!

Even after playing other open world Rockstar games, this one is a bit overwhelming in terms of what to do, how to do it, etc..,

Still at the first camp, not had a lot of time to play it but so far i am loving it . missing the mouse and keyboard so might switch over to the Xbox one X

Anyways in your opinion do you consider the first essential to have played before this or ?

I wrote a little blog about it.

Title: "Red Dead Redemption 2’s aiming feels horrible"

I love all the little details Rockstar put in Red Dead Redemption 2’s world. My most satisfying moment so far has been chasing a small herd of deer up a hill on horseback. I turned with it, aimed my bow a little ahead and put it down with one clean shot. It stumbled, got up, tried to run again and then dropped. I got off my horse and watched it cry out until it died, admiring the disturbing attention to detail. {I would post the video of that here, but I expect the fanboys would down-vote it because of the rest of this post.} The world is beautiful.

I wish I could enjoy the action. No matter what I do with the settings, the aiming feels horrible. Don’t know how anyone could say this feels good, unless they’re among the majority playing with Soft Lock (auto-aim), which is lame anyway. I know I’m at a big disadvantage with a controller, but the problem goes beyond that. It feels like I’m pulling the character instead of controlling them. I don’t know why Rockstar thinks making a game feel authentic requires making the character as unresponsive as possible. I also don’t like that the default movement during gunplay isn’t a slow run. I have to hold or tap (depending on what I’ve chosen in the settings) the Cross button on my PS4 controller every time. I mostly crouch behind cover now so that I have time to clumsily pick my targets. What I may do is sell this game when/if it’s on PC. At least then I’ll be able to aim.

Outdated hardware, these controllers. Aiming with your thumb makes no sense. You’re always dragging the camera instead of directly sliding it like with a mouse because the analog stick has so little range. The devs put shooting mechanics into all the games, but the console makers and players cling to this inadequate design. Fine for most games that aren’t about aiming. Almost all of them are, though.

Hunting in this game is pretty hard. I shot a moose two times on the neck and it's still walking. So, the third time I shot it in the butthole... How many shots can a moose take?

I prefer fishing.

I know it's not really a valid excuse for the feeling of Arthur, but I'd advise trying to play in first person mode only when off your horse. The controls are far more responsive and quicker, the shooting sections far more enjoyable, with no loss of detail in the game world.......the only downside being unable to see Arthur's person (if that's really important to you). These are at least the default setting I have, but can go third person when desired.

Also try turning up to sensitivity in controls. It helps somewhat.

I must admit, this game seems to make consistent jabs at Santa Monica Studios.

"There a good boooooooy."

"That's my boooooooy, heh heh heh."

"Whoah, take it easy booooooooooy."

I don't know if this dialogue was recorded before GOW hit or after, but there's enough boooooooooooy in this to seriously question such a coincidence. Every time I hear Arthur comfort his steed I have to laugh.

Had a busy weekend so haven't played as much as I wanted but 5 hours in and it's what I expected. Looks beautiful even on the S imagine it's incredible on the X plays like a typical rockstar game which is fine by me.

@Jacanuk: You don't need to play the first at all. It just adds when you meet some characters but it's just a little extra.

Ok, cool thanks

Btw guys, broomstick gaming released a video talking about gameplay settings. For those struggling it's worth it. I had my settings tweaked almost the same as his and can say it does improve considerably the original hyper dumb settings.

I watched a video that had a lot of good things to say about it.

there was one part of the video that really struck me, that was the ability to flip thru a catalog to buy a weapon. Very well done how that is put together.....however.....it also sparked the question 'why is it in so many of these games, weapons is the only thing I can buy?' why is it shooting a gun really the only feature of living in the wild west?

so I am not compelled to play a game that is limited in that respect.

Umm.....because it's not? You can buy clothing, outfits, various forms of provisions for health, stamina, and dead-eye management, and horse supplies. You can also rest and get baths at hotels, see a doctor, and watch a show. You can head out into the wilderness to hunt, take a bath, rest in hotels, hang out in the saloon, eat, drink, play poker, dominoes, blackjack, and groom your horse.

Weapons are a significant part (as would be with anyone seeking an authentic depiction of the wild west) but they're not the only thing.

ah I did not know that because I dont have the game and am not that interested in it so all I can tell is from the video.

Having said that outfits isnt not what I am talking about. Can I buy farm equipment and start a farm? can I buy construction tools and build a home? or a fence?

I would agree it is progress on their part, they are moving in the right direction but they have a long way to go still (graphics aside speaking just game play)

@phbz: I am about5 days into this game and I done so much! Belted some annoying bastard in valentine, robbed a stage coach,shot some bastard who tried to rob me. And the list goes on and on. I also had encounters with unfriendliness and friendliness all together. I know the game with playing anything can happen . One of the best games I ever played.

@watercrack445: I am just guessing but I have the feeling that rockstar borrowed the fishing idea from Ubisoft . Correct me if I am wrong. But far cry 5 fishing and red dead redemption 2 fishing is not the same.but we all love fishing and I am glad rockstar invented the fishing idea into red dead redemption 2.

Well, RDR2 isn't a farming or housing simulator so it's a bit ridiculous to expect as much.

That said, you are able to upgrade the camp in which your gang resides, including housing, horse stables, food, provisions, etc. It's not a farm, but is much more in depth than simply purchasing guns. I find that given what R* is striving to accomplish here, they have outdone themselves.

Just noticed that the game has a solid fire simulation going on. Was getting ready to attack a bandid camp and remember that I had Molotovs that I never used, the fire spread pretty realistic making small explosions as it got to explosive stuff ( I imagine drinks and ammo) and the bodies got by the fire as well as materials all appeared burnt. Impressive stuff. Of course I had little loot left but it was worth it.

so going back to my orginal comment on this to paraphrase I understand that this is a shooting game. I get that, the question is, why does so many games have to only focus on this. that does not mean it cant have shooting, only that its not the only thing in the wild west that is appealing as game play, that is not to say shooting is not, but it doesnt HAVE to be that way, there is no hard and fast rule that says no AAA game that seeks adventure and excitment can not also contain other features other than that which falls into the shooting category which has been overdone for a decade already.

I am trying to fill all the holes so you can at least be able to understand my point, in understanding my point you are in no way obgiated to enjoy farming, nor am I suggesting that it should be a requirement for all players to do that specific activity, but rather that there are choices and no given this is a AAA company and indies do this its not realistic to suggest they (the AAA company) can not pull this off, and yes I do think there is a market for such features that also contain combat, I know there are people who enjoy both and yes enjoy both in the same game.

i hope that gets all your possible upcoming reasons why it can not or should not happen as well as any choice of words I might have used that are hyper accurate but you did in good faith understand what I am saying.

ok?

But the thing is, I wouldn't really consider this a "shooting" game at all. It's certainly as aspect of it, but I wouldn't say it's the main focus. Immersion and world building are. Sure, there are times where firefights happen, but I've been on missions that do nothing more than have me going to a saloon to get **** faced, go out fishing on a lake to keep company and bond with other gang members, to deal in moonshine, or go on bounties that don't even involve shooting if you approach them right. There's been gang parties, I've been spending time rounding up horses to sell to a horse fence, etc. One of the things that's impressed me about this is that R* has (so far) attempted to keep each mission somewhat novel.

I do hear what you're saying, but RDR 2 doesn't really fit into the mold you're claiming it does, based on the videos you've seen. It does more to break it from this actiony shooting trope many open-world games adhere to so heavily, and aside from people taking issue with the controls, this is the reason I'm seeing as to why this game is so incredibly divisive. It's precisely because it's "boring" or not action-packed or gamey enough to fulfill the expectations of the very thing you're accusing it of being, and for that I believe it deserves to be commended.

You should give it a shot, I suspect from your post you may like it.

I've noticed some people complaining about the controls and aiming which I haven't noticed myself. I'm Just enjoying going through the game and experiencing everything in the game world which has so much going on. Spent 2-3 hours just hunting. Exceptional game so far a 9.5 for me.

@robert_sparkes: The default controls are terrible, they're just dumb down to an incredible degree but once you turn off auto aim and some other stuff they are great. As for hunting I think it's my favourite activity.

I love the gunfire reports. They're deafening (especially with headphones) and convey beautifully the power firearms have, and make combat and hunting so much more tangible and authentic due to it. Especially notable are the flawless reloading and chambering effects respective to each weapon. The attention to detail in this just goes to show what money combined with proper technology and extreme talent can achieve.

I dunno how I totally feel about the game - i'm barely a 1/3 through. I guess my early thoughts:

-It's a stunning game visually. The real attention to detail, especially with the lighting is something else. Each zone feels really different. Strawberry as a town is visually stunning...

-I guess on the downside, the game feels pretty deliberate. It's not like GTA where you can make progress or find sidequests wandering around - it kind of drives you through the storyline it feels - and it makes me nervous i'm missing out on stuff and I don't like that feeling. I find myself killing time just to delay the progress of the game. Sure, you'll find stuff, but it doesn't feel like you have a lot of choice in passing it up because I lways have this sense i'm going to lose it.

-Lemoyne was an interesting decision. I thought it lost its sense of 'western' and went more into the realm of 'southern reconstruction simulator'. I love the zone, the graphics, the missions, all of it - it just feels a little out of place. Almost feels like its own game within the game.

-The controls aren't great. There, I said it. They're just not tight at all.

It's obviously a really good game, and i'm really enjoying it so far, but it's not a game changer the way GTA III was. I dunno if i'm just suffering from a skewed perception, but that's the landmark achievement for Rockstar because it was so shockingly beyond anything I had played at the time - from the concept of the open world, the writing, all of it. To me it's almost the BC of games because there was what came before it and what came after it. That's the benchmark for me. I thought RDR came close in at their second best effort. This is probably right around Vice City. Clearly a technical improvement and thematically everything from the previous game multiplied, but yeah. Doesn't have to be that shock to the system - but I don't think it's like... historically good. Doesn't have to be, but I feel the redundancy.

my position is still stands, sorry i tried to account for every possible come back so that you can at least understand what I am saying, I give up, but my position is unchanged.

I think there should be more options other than shooting in more video games and there is not a scarred trust in any genre that demands it be shooting only just because

peroid, I dont know how else or how many ways I can say it, I am not changing my mind because of some random rule you make up in your head about what certian games should or should not be

@Towney007: I feel sorry for you having the good will of actually trying to have a conversation with this user.

Things I love about about RDR2 and things I hate.

Love

• Landscape
• Graphics
• Animations.
• Characters
• Story
• Attention to detail
• Gun battles

Hate

• No way really to fast travel back to your camp gets very tedious after awhile
• Having a Bounty on you and having to pay for it
• Controls aiming is frustrating at times and pulling out items sometimes just doesn't seem to register
• Game never tells you when it's saving unless I'm not seeing it?

Bad controls kind of contradicts loving gun battles. Unless gun battles are more fun from a spectacle perspective and less so from a mechanical one?

Either way solid gameplay for me is the most important aspects of a gaming experience, and while it seems Rockstar have only improved upon the original in terms of variety and openworld aspects, it's not the kind of game I can enjoy. Much like the first.

Weird tasks and poor controls only reinforce that my choice keeping clear was for the best. Though I see many who still just want more Rockstar goodness are having fun, and that's awesome even if the game doesn't cater towards my taste.

Thanks for the honest pros and cons.

@MirkoS77: Just pay your bounties off that’s the only way you can do it.

I think they might of took off the option for pardon letters which is pretty ridiculous.

You can not be free to hunt with bounties on your tail all the time. I always use a bandana over my face whenever I rob someone in the game. It just hides your identity so police can’t report you and give you a bounty. I really think if you want to avoid the bounties elimination of the witnesses might be an option.

Another point I want to make out is you are talking about controls in accuracy .

I had a lot of issues with accuracy in this game. It took me ages to master those controls with accuracy. I had 3 bandits to kill and one left as I shot the other 2 but Just that last bandit trying to kill the guy was a pain because the accuracy and trying to shoot him was terrible. I see what you mean complaining about the controls .

My gun would wave all over the place trying to take this guy out and I lose dead eye very quick so it forces me to use my tonics. I have a habit of always well sometimes stuffing up in the game and having to restart a mission because I died or I stuffed up. This guy was right in front of me and I fired a shot and I could not even hit the guy because of the waving of my gun because he moved all over the place.There are actually customisation for this problem.

Found out how to use the dead eye 2 or 1 day(s) ago. They don't really do a good job explaining the dead eye system.

For me, third person feels so much better than the first person mode during the gun battles. But when I in the store or house buying\searching I use first person mode. Also, when Arthur is driving the carriage it's easier in first person mode because the big wagon blocks your eye of sight. Also, it's better so you know where your going since there is no reversing in the game. I got stuck and a horse was in the way. The only thing I can do was move forward so I had to kill the horse by running over it.

dude, you are saying that you want the game to be about more than just shooting, and Mirko is saying, correctly, that it is about more than just shooting.

shooting only comprises a small part of the experience. its more of a cowboy/wild west simulator in a general sense, with you role playing as gang member who sometimes gets into firefights, but more often is roaming around on horseback, hunting, fishing, helping out around camp, pretty much experiencing every aspect of that life. Its ultimately a story driven game, and it wouldn't really make sense in the context of the story for the main character to just start a farm.

I would not describe RDR2 as a "shooter." hell, I wouuldn't even describe it as a action game.

I don't expect this to change your mind because Mirko was pretty damn clear in saying the same thing, but at this point your position is kinda nonsensical

Christ, I swear.

Remove your ego from this, this is a video game we're discussing in good faith and I honestly couldn't care less as to change your mind. I've already stated to you I understand where you're coming from but also believe RDR2 has taken strides to break free from what traditionally has dictated the open world experience so far, what more do you want? Would I agree that shooting is the main mechanic underpinning the game for which all others revolve around? It's undeniably predominantly vestigial, yes, but nevertheless, there's been absolutely an obvious concerted effort from R* to move away from that tired and true past to grant something to players unprecedented in open world design thus far in terms of depth and variance of mechanics. I've never seen such an evolution in open world design as I have here. It's remarkable.

So when you come out and claim something about a game that (by your own admittance) you've yet to play and've only seen through videos while I've put about 20 hours into so far, I'm going to confront you on your assertions which are, in fact, inaccurate. That's not me attempting to change your mind or slighting your ego based on some "random rule I've made up in my head" (whatever that means), it's me confronting you with reality so you can change it yourself. You can't account for every single comeback when you are utterly ignorant of which you speak from a lack of first hand experience. That's not my fault, nor is it to my blame. Play the game.

@with_teeth26: exactly, thanks.

seriously dude you are just trying to convince yourself at this point.

not sure why you take it so personal that someone might feel that violence and shooting in video games ,although fun, is over done and many games could include more activities in addition to shooting.

dont like it?...go cry somewhere else, these genres arent some immutable text from god to follow a specific guideline and never deviate from it.

give it up..nobody is going to die if they add farming in RDR2 as an option for **** sake