Contemplating buying both Pokemon Sword & Shield?

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#1  Edited By Speeny
Member since 2018 • 2258 Posts

@RSM-HQ might be able to help me with this.

Sure, I could have googled this. But I feel like I'll get a more straightforward answer here.

I know at least from long-term fans point of views there seems to be problems with Sword & Shield. But, for someone like me who hasn't played a recent mainline Pokemon game since X/Y, it may not be seen as an issue. The expansion passes have got me interested again at least. I've started to miss Pokemon anyway.

So, onto the question: should I buy the two versions? Only because, if I'd like to catch everything available, I've read that Pokemon Home will allow me to trade without having to have a second Switch handy? This is only something I'm contemplating on though. Not sure if I want to spend $100+ on virtually the same game. There's always the option to trade online too for version exclusive Pokemon? Plus, if Pokemon Home can't do what I want it to, I'll just buy the one version. I've always found trading with myself with a second console to be tedious when I've done it previously.

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#2  Edited By RSM-HQ
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@speeny:

To answer your trading question, if you want all the Pokémon? you might have to purchase both versions. Considering no one really knows how Home will work I will just explain the trading in Sw/Sh.

Warning that local connection is a bother in the new game(s) it uses a tab/ sticker feature that sometimes doesn't register. When I tried to trade and battle my friend next to me it took us both roughly an hour to find each others stickers, I've been told this is still an issue. .

And seeing as the latest game did away with GTS, which was an online trading feature to request any/every Pokémon in exchange for a Pokémon you bank. Usually banking any starter would make any find swift and easy to collect Pokémon. I don't know if this is returning like many lost features, yet we'll have to wait and see. It all depends if you are willing to first wait and see what exactly these expansions are bringing back.

If anything the announcement of expansions could change my view on the game heavily, considering this is a first for the mainline entries.

Based on the trailer, seems to be addressing many the complaints of the base-game(s).

I'm personally going to wait and see what people think of it; and not the "buy it now" answers some seem to spam here in the forums. I will need a legitimate answer of is it now a competent RPG, and has the features I at least expect, and if they fixed the online and local connectivity suppose.

Basically if what it brought is enough to address Sword/ Shield.

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#3 Speeny
Member since 2018 • 2258 Posts

@RSM-HQ: Doing away with the GTS is a big problem indeed. Might just end up picking Shield at this stage. Prefer the version exclusive Pokemon. Thanks. :)

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#4 RSM-HQ
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@speeny: No problem.

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#5 Ovirew
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There is never a reason to buy both versions. Differences are always minor, and come down to preference. This includes the variant gyms you encounter.

Trading does suck more, but if you catch a bunch of extra pokemon you can do mystery trades and potentially get really great trades. Most of them I got were foreign and I kinda don't plan on keeping them, but I got many late-game monsters this way.

I feel less and less like "catching them all" matters. Sword and Shield fling an ungodly number of pokemon at you from the start, with many monsters appearing as exclamation points and not being visible on the overworld, and pokemon in the wild area changing depending on the weather and time of day. Not to mention the random pokemon that appear in raid battles.

And pokemon level up and grow so quickly in these newer games, it simply doesn't matter to try getting acquainted with every single one. You'll send different types of pokemon away on "jobs" and they'll return and be higher-level and have new attacks. Any move can be relearned at any poke center, and you can fly anywhere pretty much instantaneously by opening your town map and clicking on it.

Sw/Sh is fun for what it is, but I couldn't see myself ever wanting to replay it. You'll get your fill from one version.

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#6 RSM-HQ
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@Ovirew: A lot of the improved features you mentioned already had been mainstreamed in previous games, as such either returning/ or taken an even more simplified method.

I agree that it presents the basics of what makes Pokémon appealing. However, it's short-lived (shortest game(s) in the series), extremely shallow, and has no end-game content worth bring up for interesting debate. Multiplayer is also frankly broken!

The expansions may fix a lot of that but high in large Sw/Sh are the worst mainline Pokémon game in well over a decade.

One would have to have a mighty need for a Switch Pokémon game for me to recommend these games. Otherwise I highly recommend taking out a 3DS/DS and playing far better games in the series (any of them).

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#7 Speeny
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@Ovirew said:

There is never a reason to buy both versions. Differences are always minor, and come down to preference. This includes the variant gyms you encounter.

Trading does suck more, but if you catch a bunch of extra pokemon you can do mystery trades and potentially get really great trades. Most of them I got were foreign and I kinda don't plan on keeping them, but I got many late-game monsters this way.

I feel less and less like "catching them all" matters. Sword and Shield fling an ungodly number of pokemon at you from the start, with many monsters appearing as exclamation points and not being visible on the overworld, and pokemon in the wild area changing depending on the weather and time of day. Not to mention the random pokemon that appear in raid battles.

And pokemon level up and grow so quickly in these newer games, it simply doesn't matter to try getting acquainted with every single one. You'll send different types of pokemon away on "jobs" and they'll return and be higher-level and have new attacks. Any move can be relearned at any poke center, and you can fly anywhere pretty much instantaneously by opening your town map and clicking on it.

Sw/Sh is fun for what it is, but I couldn't see myself ever wanting to replay it. You'll get your fill from one version.

Yeah I thought that as well. Especially with weather conditions affecting appearances it would take up far too much time. Pokemon for me has always been about building a team, and beating the game. That can get tedious after a while though. :P Not familiar with the newer titles at all as the only 3D mainline Pokemon game I played was X all those years ago. So I've just picked up Shield for the moment.

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#9 Speeny
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@RSM-HQ said:

@Ovirew: A lot of the improved features you mentioned already had been mainstreamed in previous games, as such either returning/ or taken an even more simplified method.

I agree that it presents the basics of what makes Pokémon appealing. However, it's short-lived (shortest game(s) in the series), extremely shallow, and has no end-game content worth bring up for interesting debate. Multiplayer is also frankly broken!

The expansions may fix a lot of that but high in large Sw/Sh are the worst mainline Pokémon game in well over a decade.

One would have to have a mighty need for a Switch Pokémon game for me to recommend these games. Otherwise I highly recommend taking out a 3DS/DS and playing far better games in the series (any of them).

Yeah, if I don't end up liking the game I've got a month to return it. Which judging by what you've said about beating the story at 10 hours, no problem. :P (If I get that far.)

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#10 Ovirew
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@RSM-HQ: Yeah I agree with you. I mean, I put quite a bit of playtime into Shield the first two weeks or so I had it, but the novelty wears off so fast. I still haven't completed the game, and that's simply because I was bored with the rinse-and-repeat of it all.

From at least X and Y on, Pokemon has gradually streamlined everything, and crammed far too many monsters for its own good into each game. It now leans heavily on gimmicks like Dynamax and Gigantamax, and the battle system is not better for it.

If they made a new Pokemon game and went back to gen 1-4 basics, made 150-200 new monsters and nothing else, and focused on crafting another great solo adventure then it would beat the pants off of every pokemon game from this past decade. But it's all style (?) and little substance now.

I actually enjoyed the Mystery Dungeon DX demo more than Shield lately. That should tell you how far the main series games have fallen.

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#11 Speeny
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@Ovirew:

@Ovirew said:

If they made a new Pokemon game and went back to gen 1-4 basics, made 150-200 new monsters and nothing else, and focused on crafting another great solo adventure then it would beat the pants off of every pokemon game from this past decade. But it's all style (?) and little substance now.

This is what I want as well at the end of the day.

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#12 Speeny
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@Ovirew said:

From at least X and Y on, Pokemon has gradually streamlined everything, and crammed far too many monsters for its own good into each game. It now leans heavily on gimmicks like Dynamax and Gigantamax, and the battle system is not better for it.

To add, I agree. I remember playing X and then just missing out on the other 3DS titles. Because, I think at the end of the day the game just didn't impress me much at all...I kind of prefer 2D Pokemon too...

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#13 Ovirew
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@speeny: I guess I still liked X and Y because it was impressive seeing them in 3D at first, and I think the starters and legendaries that gen were great. And maybe at the time there was a novelty to having all 600-or-however-many pokemon obtainable over the global trade. And heck, at least mega evolutions were kind of neat and had more of a point than 'max.

But yeah, they definitely started losing me in the transition to 3DS Pokemon games. I'll say that what I played of Black and White was still decent, but Diamond and Pearl had the most content and felt like the peak of the series in a way. Pokemon was definitely better in the DS years.

I wonder if they'll ever make something as good at that again lol.

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#14 Speeny
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@Ovirew said:

@speeny: I guess I still liked X and Y because it was impressive seeing them in 3D at first, and I think the starters and legendaries that gen were great. And maybe at the time there was a novelty to having all 600-or-however-many pokemon obtainable over the global trade. And heck, at least mega evolutions were kind of neat and had more of a point than 'max.

But yeah, they definitely started losing me in the transition to 3DS Pokemon games. I'll say that what I played of Black and White was still decent, but Diamond and Pearl had the most content and felt like the peak of the series in a way. Pokemon was definitely better in the DS years.

I wonder if they'll ever make something as good at that again lol.

Very true. I'd say out of the games I had played on the DS...Diamond, Pearl & Platinum were my favourite. Those games just felt so much more developed, which they were. Heart Gold/Soul Silver would be next on my list. I could be totally wrong because I've been out of the loop with the series for a little bit, but judging by the Let's Go games as well as maybe Sword & Shield it feels as if the games are becoming more "beginner" friendly. Which is fine, but maybe they're stripping back too much for the hardcore players as well. Anyway, once I play Shield I'll have more of an opinion.

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#15 RSM-HQ
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@Ovirew: I was a fan of Sun/ Moon myself. Multiplayer and EV training was a bit pretentious but otherwise was a fun RPG with a lot of hidden secrets to explore and a dense end-game. And while one could port all the Pokémon into the game, it was high in large trying to do its own thing with a heavy theme of the Hawaiian islands. As such I liked a lot of the new roster. Then again I enjoyed a lot of the new Pokémon in Sw/Sh, Falinks being a personal favorite, yet they're few and far between in the latest.

X/Y usually gets a lot more hatred than it probably deserves. First in a full 3D engine so it lacking is at least understandable. Sw/Sh lacked because was developed alongside Let's Go back to back, with no real focus on quality but pumping out four games in two years. And that led to mediocre products.

Maybe the expansions will fix that but I'm not holding out anymore. Nintendo need to whip The Pokémon Company and Game Freak into shape. Because games like that are only giving people a bitter taste.

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#16 Ovirew
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@RSM-HQ: I actually did not get to play much of Sun and Moon. I think the roster did create some pretty interesting new pokemon, and I even liked the ultra beasts - I know a lot of people didn't. Also thought it was cool how the main legendaries came to be.

I think just my early impressions of the game were a little weak. And I also have been more critical of Pokemon sequels on the same system - after being disappointed with the Ruby and Sapphire remakes using the X/Y systems, I was a little wary of Sun/Moon since I didn't get into Black and White as much as I did Diamond and Pearl. I also had this whole situation where I bought the game for me and this girl I was seeing, and the girl broke up with me after that, so I kind of associated that situation with the game a little.

I think you hit the nail on the head about why I kind of give X and Y a free pass, the development going towards the 3D models and whatnot. But yeah, it's pretty inexcusable how rushed the games have gotten in recent years.

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#17  Edited By Speeny
Member since 2018 • 2258 Posts

@Ovirew@RSM-HQ

I've played roughly 3 hours and a half of the game so far. I've reached the first big city but haven't battled the gym yet as I've just been wandering around familiarising myself and catching Pokemon.

So far...I've found it to be very boring. One thing that I don't like especially is the wild area. Feels like I'm playing the Pokemon Let's Go game or just Pokemon Go. I think one of you may have mentioned something along these lines before but the game feels very gimmicky. Like, not a complete mainline game, just something they put out for a cash grab kind of thing.

I guess I'll try and at least beat the first gym, but yeah. Disappointing. Whether I've just grown out of Pokemon or there really is something off, not sure. :(

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#18 Speeny
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@Ovirew@RSM-HQ

Scratch that, actually enjoying it a lot now. One thing that makes it for me is the ability to play with your Pokemon and cook for them. Not sure if that was a part of X/Y from memory?

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#19 RSM-HQ
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@speeny: Well because you are a fan of the cooking. If you are successful linking up with a friend in the wild area and set-up a tent, your friend can join you. This brings one of 2P pokémon party into the camp area; along with allows your friend to help cook the curry with you.

X/Y and S/M had mini games for dishes as well, though not in the same way Sw/Sh does it.

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#20 Ovirew
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@speeny: I remember X/Y had Pokemon Aime' or something like that it was called. It let you interact with your Pokemon, pet it and stuff I think.

I think both of your posts describe the mixed feelings the overall game produces. You'll like some things about it, but find other things really disappointing.

Like you mentioned the wild area, I thought it was alright but I thought those raid battles were so stupid and gimmicky. If the entire world map was a wild area with cities in between, that would have been more amazing than the tiny places you do visit in the world. But then idk, again the wild area is just kind of static and not really that massive or full of exploration. It feels like a big zoo where the animals roam free. And it's based on this idea that the game is better for shoving a couple of hundred pokemon into it - it isn't, in fact that just helps justify the streamlined systems and mediocre development effort.

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#21 Speeny
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@Ovirew said:

@speeny: I remember X/Y had Pokemon Aime' or something like that it was called. It let you interact with your Pokemon, pet it and stuff I think.

I think both of your posts describe the mixed feelings the overall game produces. You'll like some things about it, but find other things really disappointing.

Like you mentioned the wild area, I thought it was alright but I thought those raid battles were so stupid and gimmicky. If the entire world map was a wild area with cities in between, that would have been more amazing than the tiny places you do visit in the world. But then idk, again the wild area is just kind of static and not really that massive or full of exploration. It feels like a big zoo where the animals roam free. And it's based on this idea that the game is better for shoving a couple of hundred pokemon into it - it isn't, in fact that just helps justify the streamlined systems and mediocre development effort.

Not familiar with raid battles. Another thing that I don't like about the wild area is that you run into Pokemon that're at higher levels and your team generally gets destroyed earlier on. Not a fan of that concept at all. Sure, it may be realistic, but yeah. The way you described it as a zoo is absolutely perfect. Lol.

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#22  Edited By Ovirew
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@speeny: By raid battles, I mean the Dynamax battles that take place at the holes in the wild area where bright lights shoot out of into the sky. To begin with the online co-op seldom worked and it's usually easier to go it alone with NPC partners the game pairs you up with. The game lets you select any pokemon you have to battle the monster with. And it comes down to basically using whatever generic elemental move is strong against your opponent. The Gigantimax temporary event pokemon never showed up for me when I bothered doing the raid battles either. But I came across some rare pokemon really early in the game that way.

I didn't mind the level thing too much, since it's kind of there to tell you where you can and can't go. But it doesn't make much sense because you'll have low level monsters right next to some high level ones, in a spot you might not be aware of until later on. I think it's more stupid that you can't catch a higher level pokemon until you have the next badge, and it's usually impossible to catch something unless you have a pokemon of its level or higher in your party.

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#23 Speeny
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@Ovirew said:

I think it's more stupid that you can't catch a higher level pokemon until you have the next badge, and it's usually impossible to catch something unless you have a pokemon of its level or higher in your party.

This is a big problem for me as well. It means that I have to be "aware" if I can catch something or not...and plan it out. Which in my opinion, is a huge time waster. Thanks for your info on the raid battles. I haven't tried any of the Dynamax/raid styled battles yet except for when I go for it at the gyms. Probably won't bother either as I find it pointless.

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#24 Speeny
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@Ovirew said:

There is never a reason to buy both versions. Differences are always minor, and come down to preference. This includes the variant gyms you encounter.

Trading does suck more, but if you catch a bunch of extra pokemon you can do mystery trades and potentially get really great trades. Most of them I got were foreign and I kinda don't plan on keeping them, but I got many late-game monsters this way.

I feel less and less like "catching them all" matters. Sword and Shield fling an ungodly number of pokemon at you from the start, with many monsters appearing as exclamation points and not being visible on the overworld, and pokemon in the wild area changing depending on the weather and time of day. Not to mention the random pokemon that appear in raid battles.

And pokemon level up and grow so quickly in these newer games, it simply doesn't matter to try getting acquainted with every single one. You'll send different types of pokemon away on "jobs" and they'll return and be higher-level and have new attacks. Any move can be relearned at any poke center, and you can fly anywhere pretty much instantaneously by opening your town map and clicking on it.

Sw/Sh is fun for what it is, but I couldn't see myself ever wanting to replay it. You'll get your fill from one version.

I re-read this post and a lot of what you've said has resonated with me. What I'm going to say is from a personal point of view only, because I'd just like to get it off my chest, just a vent post. Some of these things I've already mentioned above but I think I'm pretty set on my conclusion after spending 16 hours playing I believe.

So, I'm pretty sure I've been playing the game for close to a week now. I have enjoyed it for what it is but the reality is, there's just far too many Pokemon. That's one thing that discourages me to be honest. I've noticed why I enjoy Pokemon having played Shield is something pretty conflicting. Again, mentioned it above but will go into greater detail.

I enjoy the hunt for Pokemon. Trying to catch them all. That's the goal. That's what I consider to be fun. As an adult now, that is. Building a team up, beating the game & catching the legendary and whatever else along the way just doesn't do it for me anymore. The thought of having put in all of those hours, for what I may consider to be a waste of time. Completing the Pokedex in Yellow wasn't very satisfying. So, I'm basing my opinion on that. Especially, with 400 Pokemon in these games when Yellow only had the 150. (151 if you count Mew?)

What I take away from this is, if I'm not interested in "beating" the game/main story normally. Then the games just simply aren't for me anymore. Being on and off with them throughout the years has probably changed my tastes but with what yourself and @RSM-HQ have said & just from my own experience, it's become a franchise that at it's core, doesn't really offer me anything anymore.

Also what you said about not seeing a need to replay it is very true. I don't think I've ever replayed a Pokemon game and beat it multiple times. Only started and didn't get very far kind of thing. So if it doesn't hold any sentimental value in my eyes, why keep it? Lol. I could see myself selling off the games once I've transferred all the Pokemon from version to version to future games anyway.