CONFIRMED: Bungie leaving Microsoft

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2007/oct07/10-05BungieEvolvesPR.mspx

Microsoft Corp. today announced a plan for Bungie Studios, the developers of the "Halo" franchise, to embark on a path to become an independent company. Microsoft will retain an equity interest in Bungie, at the same time continuing its long-standing publishing agreement between Microsoft Game Studios and Bungie for the Microsoft-owned "Halo" intellectual property as well as other future properties developed by Bungie.

The critically acclaimed Xbox 360-exclusive "Halo 3" achieved $300 million in global sales in its first week. Released on Tuesday, Sept. 25, "Halo 3" is the fastest-selling video game ever and already one of the most successful entertainment properties in history.

"Our collaboration with Bungie has resulted in 'Halo' becoming an enduring mainstream hit," said Shane Kim, corporate vice president of Microsoft Game Studios. "While we are supporting Bungie's desire to return to its independent roots, we will continue to invest in our 'Halo' entertainment property with Bungie and other partners, such as Peter Jackson, on a new interactive series set in the 'Halo' universe. We look forward to great success with Bungie as our long-term relationship continues to evolve through 'Halo'-related titles and new IP created by Bungie."

"This exciting evolution of our relationship with Microsoft will enable us to expand both creatively and organizationally in our mission to create world-****games," said Harold Ryan, studio head for Bungie. "We will continue to develop with our primary focus on Microsoft platforms; we greatly value our mutually prosperous relationship with our publisher, Microsoft Game Studios; and we look forward to continuing that affiliation through 'Halo' and beyond."

Bungie Studios will remain in its current location in Kirkland, Wash.

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http://www.comnetslash.com/2007/10/02/bungie-leaving-microsoft-this-week/

http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/digitaljoystick/archives/122799.asp

http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/14693/Rumor-Bungie-Is-Leaving-Microsoft/

http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200710/N07.1002.1438.22348.htm

A friend of mine who has someone close that works at Bungie has just been dying to tell me a secret about their future. Since the NDA officially expire today the sent me and email with the details. I have full faith in this contact.

The email is as follows :

"So heres my big secret. You should google Bungie + Microsoft + separation this week.
You know that big ol BILLION dollar franchise Bungie has created for Microsoft, to show their appreciate Microsoft is letting Bungie leave. Of course Microsoft gets to keep all rights to the Halo franchise, but as today Bungie no longer part of Microsoft. Ask anyone who works there to search the global address book, they're no longer in there. Microsoft was supposed to release the press release today but if they wait till the 10/6 the impact wont effect the quarterly results. However today is the actual official date and the day the NDAs expire, however you still didn't hear this from me."

"Apparently MS just wants Bungie to make Halo for the rest of their natural days, and Bungie doesn't like how MS is constantly trying to "handle" everything they do; the way they market their games, the way they interact with their fans (basically the fact that they do appreciate their fans), and how stingie they are with the profits (comparable to the rest of the industry). So as of today they are their own independent entity. They'll probably make Halo 4 for Microsoft, however hey are also free to create new intellectual properties for whatever system they want. (Even though they prefer the xbox platform)"

Edit: My own words to comment on this... well, could it be true? It's hard to say really. I mean, I wouldn't be suprised if Microsoft treated Bungie the way this article suggests. They are a big company, and usually big companies do lean on their smaller assets.

The main reason that I felt this rumor has potential, is the mention of the quarterly report. Being a professional myself, I am aware that the quarter ended today for most companies. Hense, in my eyes, I know that the author of this email is either a really clever liar, or actually has a legitimate source.

Microsoft still gets rights to Halo. So what, that's like saying someone moves out of his parents house, but the parents still get to keep all of his belongings. stevendiep_100

Its very common in the industry for the publisher to get the rights to the game's name and world as part of a publishing deal.

Microsoft still gets rights to Halo. So what, that's like saying someone moves out of his parents house, but the parents still get to keep all of his belongings. stevendiep_100

I would very surprised if Halo mantained its quality if Bungie stopped developing it.

I doubt this rumour is true though. mIt be aswesome if Bungie developed a Wii FPS though.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=195218&page=17

I'm following this debacle over at NeoGAF, and the odd thing is that Major Nelson has posted in the thread a few times without denying anything, and a lot of people are saying the source of the rumor is fairly credible. Also MS made a "No announcements have been made..." type of response to this, which is always shady IMO. I'm keeping a close eye on NeoGAF, as that will probably be the first place that this either gets confirmed or debunked.

MS would be extremely stupid to let Bungie go, so I doubt it's true. Bungie IS Halo, if MS lets Bungie go then Halo is basically fubared because Bungie is their most talented developer by a LONG shot. I'm still puzzled as to why MS let Activision grab Bizarre.EvilTaru

It feels like it is April 1st. October 1st is the new April Fools Day Confirmed?

This is totally insane, but I could see it as a possibility. But, there goes the neighborhood in terms of Halo if Bungie is released from Microsoft.

I'm going to have to do some research on this and keep my eyes peeled for any new things on the matter, because if this happens, or has already happened....it's going to make for one big news day in the gaming industry.

It makes sense...MS just want Bungie to make Halo none stop, and for the past 10 years thats all they have made, if I were Bungie I would just say "fine take the franchise, but let us leave and make our own games."

I just don't know if its true though...interesting though around this time back 02 or 03 was when these kind of rumors came out about Rare leaving Nintendo and everyone thought that was impossible, so in the game industry and sources confirming this around the internet, nothing is impossible.

Hmmm, it's not impossible (see: David Jaffe forms indie studio), but it's highly unlikely. For starters, what would Bungie be seeking that they don't already have? They have one of the most popular franchises in the world that releases on two platforms. Would the threat of a developer mutiny be enough to get MS to just let the company go, even if the creative talent left? No. Regardless of quality, the next game from Bungie (even if it is a hollowed out shell due to a dev exodus) will be one of the most highly anticipated games of the decade. It would be worth it to Microsoft to keep the name association and let the entire team pull a Seropian if they wanted.

There are too many reasons why this won't happen than why it will or might. I call bogus.

Erm...what? This would be a completely unprecedented event, Microsoft could sell Bungie, but let them go (whatever that means)? No, Bungie is Microsoft's biggest asset as far as gaming is concerned. Unless all the employees actually up and leave (all 200+ of them - another unprecedented event), this isn't going to happen - it can't happen.

The highly likely scenario that I could see triggering something like this is:

1) Bungie pitches some new IP they want to create.
2) Microsoft says: "... Well that was certainly creative. Add Master Chief, change the genre to FPS, and call it Halo 4 and consider it green-lit."
3) Bungie comes to the realisation that they either: Make Halo forever, make Halo until gamers lose interest/quality gets bad, buy back the company, or reform the company down the street.

Not to mention that announcing something like this so close to Halo 3's launch (assuming it were true) would make no sense at all, as it would have an effect on Bungie's own pocketbooks. It could cause people to buy fewer 360's (seeing as some might wait to hear Bungie's plans, be they multiplatform or what have you), which in turn would make it so fewer copies of the game sold.

I don't know very many egos that are so large that they let it affect their own pocketbooks. Bungie would wait it out until Halo (which has extremely long legs as evidenced by previous versions of the game) sales start to peter off, work on some DLC in the meantime, and then make their move while their pockets are even fatter.

It makes zero sense to make this type of a move when the fruit of three and some odd years of labor has just come to bear.

Actually, Bungie enjoys a lot of freedom. Microsoft actually set them up with their own building away from Microsoft's camp. I've also heard the Bungie guys themselves talk about how the suits were having a very hard time comprehending that Halo 3 won't be ready for the 360's launch, but they convinced them that it's for the best and they went with it. Even Bill Gates corrected his blunder by saying that Halo 3 will be done when Bungie says so, not Microsoft. Obviously, Microsoft has a lot of faith in Bungie, so why wouldn't they be receptive to a new IP? They were with Rare which doesn't have nearly the same reputation as Bungie.

Besides, Bungie is a huge studio - it wouldn't kill them if they did two projects at the same time.

This is weird.

Nice sig taru.

Microsoft letting Bungie go is like Nintendo getting rid of the Pokemon Company.

Both, arguably kept their systems alive during the time when they needed it the most. I think Pokemon kept Nintendo alive during N64~Gamecube era. When everything else flopped, it was Pokemon that continued to sell-out Gameboys/GBAs and remained the best selling games of all-time. Also, similarly, it is Halo and Bungie that kept the XBOX alive last-gen. I heard many times from people and game magazines that say if it wasn't for Halo, the XBOX would've died last generation and Microsoft would've given up on the console business. I kind of believe this statement.

Of course, the 360 has much more support and a stronger library than just one big franchise to carry their system. But still, without Bungie making Halo, it will be like Nintendo making Mario and Zelda games without Miyamoto and his team...or like making Metroid Prime without Retro, in which NST did with Prime Hunters, and although good, it wasn't spectacular as Retro. Drawing the parallels here? Halo won't be Halo without Bungie, just like Metroid Prime wasn't Metroid Prime without Retro.

So I highly doubt Microsoft will let Bungie go. Halo 3 just came out, why would they talk about leaving or letting go? Makes no sense to me...

...could it be because Microsoft is giving Peter Jackson too much creative freedom with the Halo franchise and maybe Bungie doesn't want to take it anymore? This last one was a joke...but could be true. :P

When I first heard of this I was kind of sceptical. Then again, we don't know how microsoft studios and bungie relate. If MS studios wants to have too much influence on the halo's, and forced bungie to make several decisions and to have bungie make halo games, I can understand bungie putting pressure back. After all, bungie did all they could now to make the ultimate halo. I can't think of any additions that would make a next halo worth the while except for the money. Now that's exactly where it stops at bungie I think. Where MS wants to get costumers and make money, the bungie guys seem to be more proud of their product, and they'll want to make more awesome things than the same shooter over and over again.

Now think about it, if bungie says they don't feel like making another halo, they're out of ideas, and they'd just serve out their time and leave together if they'd have to make another halo. Here the suit may think, bungie and halo are one and the same, which would make bungie kinda useless. After all, members of the dev team have been leaving earlier already. Here bungie can take their chance and buy themselves out. Who knows this is true, and bungie is going to get the old team together. I'm sure they wouldn't have any difficulty finding a publisher who gives them some freedom with a track record like bungie's and their fanbase.

It would be very stupid of MS to let bungie go though. In the worst scenario (for them) they should just give bungie the freedom to call the shots and let the developing talent do its work. Bungie is not a studios to just let go.

Edit: just saw the gamespot article on it, and lets just say that it's not likely to happen. There's been more stupid rumours than this.

I have to say that I'm surprised you guys are actually thinking this might be possible. It's not. Bungie is a fully owned Microsoft subsidiary - Bungie can't split with Microsoft, they can't leave, they can't buy themselves out. When was the last time that a game company went from being fully owned by a first or third-party publisher to...being indie again? It's impossible and has never, ever happened before. Again, what this guy is suggesting is impossible.

i dont understand the clout that bungie gets as far as their developer prowess. yes halo is a quality series. but IMO they have not proven themselves as anything other than a one trick pony so far. an extremely successful one trick pony, but still. its not like this is rockstar, or bethedsa, or something along those lines.

in any case im not saying MS should let them walk. just find int strange is all.

This would be like Retro leaving Nintendo -- nearly impossible since Nintendo owns Retro and is happy with it. Microsoft owns Bungie -- it has for many years now. Unless there is some caveat to this story that would help it all make sense, Bungie isn't going to up and go away from Microsoft.

There could be a brain drain if some Bungie employees decided to leave to work on other things, but that's not quite the same as Bungie itself moving out of Microsoft.

A guy named MappyMousePD on another list said it best, I think: Of course it's not true. I don't even know why anyone would pay any attention to it. It was started by some random guy posting on a blog under a news site. And although the blog clearly states "P-I Reader Blogs are not written or edited by the P-I. They are written by readers, for readers," some people still think it's more credible than, say, a message board post.

This would be like Retro leaving Nintendo -- nearly impossible since Nintendo owns Retro and is happy with it. Microsoft owns Bungie -- it has for many years now. Unless there is some caveat to this story that would help it all make sense, Bungie isn't going to up and go away from Microsoft.

There could be a brain drain if some Bungie employees decided to leave to work on other things, but that's not quite the same as Bungie itself moving out of Microsoft.

A guy named MappyMousePD on another list said it best, I think: Of course it's not true. I don't even know why anyone would pay any attention to it. It was started by some random guy posting on a blog under a news site. And although the blog clearly states "P-I Reader Blogs are not written or edited by the P-I. They are written by readers, for readers," some people still think it's more credible than, say, a message board post.

m0zart

This sounds like pretty major news if it has any truth to it. First Bizarre and now Bungie? You just don't "sell off" companies of that calibur if you have intent to advance in the industry. It's just incredibly stupid, these are companies that could be put to use on handheld titles, where the biggest money is made. Selling Bizarre and investing in companies like Rare and Silicon Knights is simply laughable.

well i dont think anyone outsideof the parties involvedknowsthe trueterms of the "ownership" of bungie. there may be clauses that allow for outs. im not trying to say this story is credible but i find it strange the way alot of people on forums become lawyers when talking about this stuff :

well i dont think anyone outsideof the parties involvedknowsthe trueterms of the "ownership" of bungie. there may be clauses that allow for outs. im not trying to say this story is credible but i find it strange the way alot of people on forums become lawyers when talking about this stuff :

OneWingedAngeI

Not true. Microsoft is a publically traded company. Their ownership terms are generally a matter of public record. When a company is purchased outright or just taken over through a 51+%stock purchase, it is announced. It can't actually be held a secret.

If this has any truth to it at all, it might be due to some admissions Microsoft has made lately about ownership of a well-known development company. They could be afraid of brain drain (i.e. owning Bungie doesn't mean they own any of the human resources of Bungie). They could prefer to want to move to exclusive deals in exchange for a buy-back. Things like that could happen. But for Bungie itself, as a company, to leave Microsoft would require something like that -- not just Bungie's desire to leave but Microsoft's willingness to let them go.

[QUOTE="OneWingedAngeI"]

well i dont think anyone outsideof the parties involvedknowsthe trueterms of the "ownership" of bungie. there may be clauses that allow for outs. im not trying to say this story is credible but i find it strange the way alot of people on forums become lawyers when talking about this stuff :

m0zart

Not true. Microsoft is a publically traded company. Their ownership terms are generally a matter of public record. When a company is purchased outright or just taken over through a 51+%stock purchase, it is announced. It can't actually be held a secret.

If this has any truth to it at all, it might be due to some admissions Microsoft has made lately about ownership of a well-known development company. They could be afraid of brain drain (i.e. owning Bungie doesn't mean they own any of the human resources of Bungie). They could prefer to want to move to exclusive deals in exchange for a buy-back. Things like that could happen. But for Bungie itself, as a company, to leave Microsoft would require something like that -- not just Bungie's desire to leave but Microsoft's willingness to let them go.

so then show me these terms and then ill be quiet. no one is saying it isnt announced, but seriously you think all the details of the contract are known to the general public? as rabid as halo fans are, this information would have been found by now in such case.

edit: also please realize, i am just playing devil's advocate here. i dont give much credit to these rumors either, but people act like they know the specific terms of everything anytime something like this comes up.

This sounds like pretty major news if it has any truth to it. First Bizarre and now Bungie? You just don't "sell off" companies of that calibur if you have intent to advance in the industry. It's just incredibly stupid, these are companies that could be put to use on handheld titles, where the biggest money is made. Selling Bizarre and investing in companies like Rare and Silicon Knights is simply laughable.trifecta_basic

Bizarre Creations wasn't owned by Microsoft, until Activision acquired it, it was an indie developer. Microsoft just owns Project Gotham Racing.

well i dont think anyone outsideof the parties involvedknowsthe trueterms of the "ownership" of bungie. there may be clauses that allow for outs. im not trying to say this story is credible but i find it strange the way alot of people on forums become lawyers when talking about this stuff :OneWingedAngeI

You don't need to be a lawyer to understand basic concepts such as ownership. Microsoft went in and bought the company (if I remember correctly, part of it was owned by Take-Two at the time), why would there be any clauses? It doesn't make any sense. This would be like saying that Blizzard is leaving Vivendi - it just can't happen.

so then show me these terms and then ill be quiet. no one is saying it isnt announced, but seriously you think all the details of the contract are known to the general public? as rabid as halo fans are, this information would have been found by now in such case.

OneWingedAngeI

I am not asking you to be quiet. I was simply telling you that it is common knowledge that Bungie is Microsoft property since 2000, bought even before Rare was purchased by Microsoft in 2003. Before that Bungie was a Macintosh studio, and Halo was a Mac exclusive. It isn't just a contract. A contract would imply a mutually beneficial business arrangment, the details of which could be kept quiet because it would be a provider/customer relationship that had less impact on investors. This is a purchase at the corporate level. It isn't a business arrangement, it is ownership.

I don't mean to sound rude here in any way, but all you had to do was Google to know that the purchase took place. It is impossible for a public company to keep an acquisition quiet.

http://archives.cnn.com/2000/TECH/computing/06/22/ms.bungie.idg/index.html

http://www.starport.com/battlestations/bungie_microsoft_000619.html

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2000/06/19/microsoft_buys_myth_maker_bungie/

http://ps2.ign.com/articles/081/081051p1.html

http://www.news.com/2100-1040-242066.html

http://www.macuser.co.uk/macuser/news/23864/microsoft-buys-bungie.html

edit: also please realize, i am just playing devil's advocate here. i dont give much credit to these rumors either, but people act like they know the specific terms of everything anytime something like this comes up.OneWingedAngeI

Somebody else already made this point, so this might be redundant at this point. Ownership doesn't require much special knowledge. It isn't just a case of playing devil's advocate or doubting the story -- in this case, one company owns the other. Bungie doesn't really have to consent anymore to go in Microsoft's stated direction. They have as much freedom as Microsoft is willing to give them, and no special contracts are needed for any of it. That's what ownership is like. Customer relationships have contracts -- ownership has bills of sale or stock.

i dont understand the clout that bungie gets as far as their developer prowess. yes halo is a quality series. but IMO they have not proven themselves as anything other than a one trick pony so far. an extremely successful one trick pony, but still. its not like this is rockstar, or bethedsa, or something along those lines.

in any case im not saying MS should let them walk. just find int strange is all.

OneWingedAngeI

That's like saying iD is a one trick pony. Marathon had just as much influence on the beginnings of the FPS genre as Doom or Wolfenstein. That however, is almost immaterial to the larger picture: creating now 3 of the biggest selling games of all time. When you develop 2 games in a row that set 24-hour records for any entertainment product in history, I think you've gone well beyond "proving yourself." Even more, this was done on two consoles with relatively small installed bases. You might want to think about the Cachet that the Halo name holds and the cash it brings in before lumping them in with any other developer. They have done things that Rockstar or Bethseda never will.

Also, there is no question that MS has ownership of Bungie. When the deal happened in 2000, Bungie made one last multi-platform title, Oni, before shutting down all of their operations and moving to Redmond. They do all their business from the MS campus - they are effectively part of MS. The only way that would change is if the MS shareholders decided to sell back the requisite amount of shares for Bungie to become independent again.

I'm following this debacle over at NeoGAF, and the odd thing is that Major Nelson has posted in the thread a few times without denying anything, and a lot of people are saying the source of the rumor is fairly credible. Also MS made a "No announcements have been made..." type of response to this, which is always shady IMO. I'm keeping a close eye on NeoGAF, as that will probably be the first place that this either gets confirmed or debunked.

rragnaar

That thread is just a mess.:lol:

Why is it that most GAF threads end up being theforum equivalent of the movie theatre scene out of Gremlins? There are some very bright minds on that forum, but they always get drowned in the sludge. Still, the place breaks news like a day or two before it lands on other forums. Kinda hard to fault that.

I agree, the lack of any concrete statement from either side means something is up.

[QUOTE="rragnaar"]

I'm following this debacle over at NeoGAF, and the odd thing is that Major Nelson has posted in the thread a few times without denying anything, and a lot of people are saying the source of the rumor is fairly credible. Also MS made a "No announcements have been made..." type of response to this, which is always shady IMO. I'm keeping a close eye on NeoGAF, as that will probably be the first place that this either gets confirmed or debunked.

Shame-usBlackley

That thread is just a mess.:lol:

Why is it that most GAF threads end up being theforum equivalent of the movie theatre scene out of Gremlins? There are some very bright minds on that forum, but they always get drowned in the sludge. Still, the place breaks news like a day or two before it lands on other forums. Kinda hard to fault that.

I agree, the lack of any concrete statement from either side means something is up.

I can't believe that at one point I used to think that place was a superior community to this one... that thread proves just how far off the mark I was.... I'm almost surprised no one has busted out the cat pictures yet. That said, I think the original rumor is wrong, but that something is up... like maybe some people are leaving bungie, and the rest are getting folded into Microsoft Game Studios, or something.... that is 100% speculation on my part, but it has gone on too long without a solid denial for it to be complete BS.

well i never claimed to be a big bungie afficianado, which is why i said to show me the terms. i didnt know anything about the specifics but i just figured if it was a question, there might be some kind of deal in place. a sale is not simply a sale. it really depends on of it is a mutual sale or a hostile takeover. sometimes there are things in place. i guess that is not the case here, but thats why i presented the idea.

but you also have to realize that bungie is not a group of people. what i mean is, bungie is the company. people are free to come and go. Maybe people agreed to stay at bungie under certain terms. or maybe microsoft is just letting them go, but that makes no sense. personally i think its all just a rumor.

That's like saying iD is a one trick pony.Uncle_Tbag

I seriously doubt anyone would argue with that one. :wink:

They do all their business from the MS campus.Uncle_Tbag

I just wanted to point out that that is no longer the case, Microsoft set Bungie up with their own building away from the Redmond camp.

I agree, the lack of any concrete statement from either side means something is up.Shame-usBlackley

Microsoft has never commented on rumors and speculation - just ask GameSpot's Rumor Control. :wink: A multi-billion corporation responding to everyone's blog entries would get them nowhere fast - especially one as silly as this one.

Oh wow. This is looking more and more likely. Game Informer is now reporting something awfully similar to what the blogger wrote, except that in this case, they say Bungie has bought back the rights to the company. Here's the link.

According to this, Microsoft had been pushing and pushing Bungie to become a Halo farm, and that's not what Bungie wanted. This not only sounds like Microsoft (who has slapped Halo on everything but Rubbermaid trash cans), but I could totally see it being a problem since Bungie hadn't originally even intended for Halo 3 to happen, but did so due to Halo 2 not being able to wrap things up.

If true, this is a huge, huge disaster for Microsoft, the likes of which haven't been seen since Sony announced the PS3's price tag. It's a PR disaster, a financial disaster, and a mindshare disaster. It's going to hurt the system in ways previously unseen. According to this, Bungie regains their name andautonomy, but Microsoft has first dibs on titles they produce, which is better than nothing, but they've now lost arguably the most powerful development name in the west, and that studio will be making games on competing platforms. IF this is true, of course. But let's face it folks -- the story has grown legs and isgetting to the point where one side or the other would've shot it down by now.

This might drastically alter what happens in comingyears on the console front.In a way, I feel sorry for Microsoft, because it seems like developer relations haven't been up to par (first Bizarre, now this) and it would've been much easier (and less expensive) to fire the dolt (or dolts) who has been pissing these companies off and get someone in there who wants to keep them happy and productive.

Again, this isn't confirmed until the fat lady sings, but she'sdefinitely warming up.