Feature Article

We Should Talk About How Bra Sizes Work

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The Definitive Bra Size Guide For Gamers™

As any number of women's magazines will tell you, 80% of women are wearing the wrong bra size. That's probably because bra shopping is hell on earth and basically impossible unless you invite a total stranger into the fitting room to help measure you properly, but it might also be a result of our society's complete misunderstanding of what bra sizes even are. If the video game discourse is any indication, most people seem to think bra sizes stop at DD and that anything smaller than "huge badonkers" is in the A-to-B range.

I'm talking, of course, about Tifa Lockhart, who has been accused of having B-cup breasts--as her character model in the Final Fantasy 7 Remake looks different from her extra-busty appearance in the PS1 era--as well as the entire female cast of Mortal Kombat 11, for that matter. Now, these are fictional women who have top-of-the-line physics engines supporting them, so it's not like they really need the extra support from an $80 Lululemon sports bra. But if we're going to use bra sizes as shorthand to talk about fake women's bodies, we're going to do it right, goddammit.

No Caption Provided

Lucky for you, I know a thing or two about this. Bra sizes have two main components: the cup size and the band size. The cup size is denoted by letters, like B or DD, and refers to the actual breast part of the bra. The band size is a number based on the size of the person's ribcage area (right under the actual breasts), and it's secretly the more important size.

While most people tend to focus on the cup letter, it's band size that determines cup size. So if you have two people whose actual breasts are exactly the same size, but whose band sizes are different, they'll wear different cup sizes. A 36DD, for example, is the same as a 34DDD--those two people have the same size breasts, but one has a smaller ribcage, so the cup size scales up a bit. Why does Big Lingerie do this? Because the cup size represents the difference between your band measurement and your breast measurement, with one inch difference being an A, two being a B, and so on. The bigger the difference, the bigger the cup size.

Anyway, back to Tifa. Tifa is a Woman of Small Ribcage, so I'm going to guess and say she's a 28 band size. If you look at her for even two seconds, you can see that her chest is a lot bigger around than her ribcage. I'd say it's at least a six- or seven-inch difference, which puts her in the F or G range. Did you know bra sizes go up that far? They sure do!

On top of that, there's also been some discussion around Remake Tifa's bra--specifically that she's wearing a sports bra. Sports bras are generally a bit more constricting in terms of fit, and while some retailers do offer traditional bra sizing options, you'll often see sports bras sold in dress sizes (2, 4, 6, 8, etc.) or in the small-medium-large metric. Because of the design and further size confusion, sports bras often make chests look "flatter" than they are. In Tifa's case, however, it looks like she's wearing a $100-plus designer sports bra that imitates the look of a regular bra. I'd argue the type of bra she's allegedly wearing has little to no effect on the perceived size of her chest... or how hard she punches the hell out of things.

So while it may be true that Tifa's chest looks smaller than it used to be (or perhaps how you imagined it), it's by no means a small chest. Even if you did think she wears a B-cup bra, though, you can still look at her and see that it is not a small chest. Now that you know how bra sizes work, you can go back to the cast of MK 11, too, and observe that they have different bodies and thus fit a variety of bra sizes. And finally, consider that there's nothing at all wrong with small boobs to begin with.

In conclusion, if you think that video games are being censored because suddenly "every" female character has A- or B-cup boobs, you're just plain wrong. And if you must complain, you should maybe consider complaining about ribcage size instead.

[Image Credit: CestyMour]

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kallie

Kallie Plagge

Kallie Plagge was GameSpot's reviews editor from August 2018 to March 2021. She loves Pokemon, inventory management, and Grunt Birthday Party.

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burn6

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this is why game developer needs to hire more women because all these video game characters who have huge chests are laughable and terribly designed. The back pains must a F*ng nightmare, let alone they are going to run, dodge, attack, it is physiologically improbable.

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Tony56723

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@burn6: But there are skinny women with naturally large breasts in the world.

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mogan

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Edited By mogan  Moderator

@tony56723: And there's at least one in the FF7 remake too. Her name's Tifa.

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Tony56723

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@Mogan: And according to an Ethics Committee her original design had to be censored. Like what exactly is unethical about large breasts on a character? Especially when the game already features more modest characters like Aerith and Yuffie. It’s not like everyone in FF7 was rocking what Tifa was.

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mogan

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Edited By mogan  Moderator

@tony56723: I'll be surprised if most anybody in FF7's remake is rocking what Tifa is either.

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Tony56723

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@Mogan: you’re dodging my question; what is unethical about large breasts on a character? Why is this something that needs to changed/censored?

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mogan

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mogan  Moderator

@tony56723: I don't care about that question, and what I posted never had anything to do with it. As far as I'm concerned, the 'Tifa was censored!' controversy is about the least important thing on the internet.

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Tony56723

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@Mogan: the “Tifa is censored” controversy is quite literally just part of a greater debate. But you’ve already stated that you have no interest in anything that isn’t posted on Gamespot so I guess it doesn’t really surprise me that you have no interest in it. It’s not like most of the major outlets are actually open to discussing matters such as the rise in rampant censorship.

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mogan

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Edited By mogan  Moderator

@tony56723: *looks at Cindy in all the FF15 marketing*

Censorship. Riiight.

The fact most major game news outlets aren't taking the Tifa's Titties Outrage seriously should probably be a sign it's not a serious issue.

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Tony56723

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@Mogan: @Mogan: That game also launched 3 years ago. People also demanded she be censored or removed from the game due to the way she looked. The media also heavily lambasted Square for having four playable male protagonists with out a female team member and there were cries of sexism left and right. Honestly even though the game wasn’t great I’m glad they stuck by their product.

I’m not surprised they’re not taking it seriously, it’s become obvious that the major media outlets will side with whatever view is being deemed the most “correct” at the time. While I don't necessarily blame them as I do understand it’s a stance based around profits that doesn’t mean it going to approach things the same way. I’m not arguing against censorship to make money, I do it because I truly believe a creator should be free to create what they want and not have to bend to the whims of people who never had an interest in their art to begin with.

Additionally I find it disheartening you're referring to this as the “Tifa’s Titties Outrage” when, as I already stated before, it’s quite literally just part of a larger discussion going on with the gaming circle. You’ve made it quite clear you don’t care which is fine, but what I don’t understand is what you’re getting out of belittling those that do.

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mogan

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mogan  Moderator

@tony56723: I respect you staying calm over me not caring way more than I respect any outrage over this particular case of censorship. We're not going to agree, I'm always going to think the outrage over Tifa's new character model is dumb, but I can respect that you feel strongly about it and aren't just trying to justify wanting more anime tiddies.

So, I'm sorry I was flippant about this thing you care about, and lets just agree to disagree.

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CybaCowboy

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@burn6: And what about the unrealistic proportions of say, Barret? The guy is built like a mountain which in Real Life, only completely unrealistic - particularly if Barret is going to run, dodge and attack with any sort of speed...

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Veeh

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@burn6:Uhm bayonetta is designed by a woman. You do realize that also greek statues showing unrealistic human perfection is just an art style and doesn't emulate reality.

You don't complain when a 60kg woman can punch a 120 kg muscular guy because its fantasy, so why would you complain here? If it looks cool then its good.

How ever i find it laughable that they have an "ethics" department going around judging fictional breast size

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CodyHall

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@veeh: key freaking word fictional fake not real imaginary made up fantasy make believe....but it better be realistic as far as boob size lmao

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TacticaI

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@veeh: So if you actually read an article before concerning this completely stupid controversy you’d know they’re there to make sure the games are in line with the respective countries ratings guidelines, because you know, they want to actually sell their games. Don’t ask me why.

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zamorian79

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@TacticaI: And this is precisely the problem. Final Fantasy VII is the vision of a creator. That creator SHOULDN'T have to adapt his/her vision to the countries guidelines. So now what? Tifa should be latino for México and Colombia? A blonde for the US? It is a japanese product, that is how it was envisioned, not your cup of tea? move on!

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James_xeno

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@TacticaI:

Ah what?! Bullshit. This had nothing to do with rating systems and everything to do with PR nitwits.

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CybaCowboy

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@TacticaI:

*Newsflash*

Women sometimes have unusually large breasts - even skinny women... If a country has issues with realistic depictions of women, then there is an even larger issue with the country in question, rather than the game.

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TEOL222

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@veeh: if they really do have an ethics department that focuses on that its only because social media shamers who have nothing better to do in their lives than to constantly look for non objective thinkers (newsflash there exists none objective thinkers) has forced them into having to have one for the sake of appearances. Sorry for the longass sentence

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Tony56723

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@TEOL222: sadly from what we’ve been able to gather Square does indeed have an ethics department. What an odd job when you really think about it.

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Blowfish82

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Hey author:

What are your thoughts of Captain Marvel Blu Rays already going on clearance because nobody is buying them?

Must really suck to feel slighted by this, while most of us get to feel happy that agenda crap is going down, and fast!

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CybaCowboy

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@blowfish82: I agree 100% that they've turned Captain Marvel into a movie specifically for the Social Justice Warriors - but unless I am mistaken, my understanding is that the film is doing rather well?

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Blowfish82

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Edited By Blowfish82

@CybaCowboy: It "did well" sure, cant say it did well though.

The day this dropped on torrent sites, there were 3 separate public trackers, each serving ~60k each, so 180000 concurrent downloads.

No movie ever has even had half of that, maybe not even a 3rd because 60k is ridiclous alone. I have never seen anything close to those numbers.

Reason I bring this up is because I firmly believe that the movie didn't do as well as its led on, and the torrents were put up by official sources to help "spread" it around.

Remember, IT IS about the agenda\message with the movie, so this actually is plausible.

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zamorian79

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@CybaCowboy: It did really well, but make no mistake, everything was a PR stunt. The movie was released weeks before Avengers Endgame, the biggest event in the MCU, so the Marvel hype was on fire and people were driven to watch that film a few weeks before Endgame. Also there is evidence of theaters completely sold that were half empty. They also censored bad press, comments from the fans, banned YouTube videos, etc. Captain Marvel is the most protected movie on history.

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ZmanBarzel

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@blowfish82: Clearance?

Amazon: $20/DVD; $25/Blu-ray; $30/4K
https://www.amazon.com/CAPTAIN-MARVEL-Blu-ray-Brie-Larson/dp/B07QLB785M

Walmart: same pricing
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Captain-Marvel-4K-Ultra-HD-Blu-ray-Digital/280684893

Best Buy: the same
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/captain-marvel-includes-digital-copy-blu-ray-2019/6332722.p?skuId=6332722

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Blowfish82

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@zmanbarzel: Yeah. Its called waiting. Tomorrow you will start to see them in stores. Literally nobody is buying the movie not a single retailer is moving stock.

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ZmanBarzel

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@blowfish82: "The 21st film in the blockbuster Marvel Cinematic Universe debuted at No. 1 on the NPD VideoScan First Alert chart, which tracks combined DVD and Blu-ray Disc unit sales, and the dedicated Blu-ray Disc sales chart by a wide margin, outselling the next 44 titles combined."

https://www.mediaplaynews.com/captain-marvel-powers-up-on-disc-sales-charts/

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Blowfish82

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Edited By Blowfish82

@zmanbarzel: It is sad AF that you would actually even begin to believe that. If it isnt obvious that the movie did nowhere near what is stated, I dont know how it could be anymore clear.

Walmart, Meijer, Target... I was shopping and stopped at all 3 (just got back). All three kiosk displays right at the entrance were not only fully stocked, they werent even being looked at.

*and for kicks, simply search Youtube for "captain marvel blu ray" there are videos in the first results. Want me to take some too?

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ZmanBarzel

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@blowfish82: If you would, that would be great. It's not that I don't believe you. It's just...no, wait, it IS that I don't believe you.

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Blowfish82

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@zmanbarzel: Oh thats okay. Dont worry.

You can just go to youtube, right now, and type search (no quotes needed) "captain marvel blu ray" and the results are right there, dont even need to load another page.

Its right there, so it shouldn't be a problem. I really dont know what else to tell you outside of mouse moves the cursor on screen, keyboard types...

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ZmanBarzel

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Edited By ZmanBarzel

@blowfish82: I actually did, and the one video on that topic making its claim was so flimsily supported by logic/evidence that it's laughable. Full kiosk facings of "Captain Marvel"? It's almost as if he never heard of "restocking." As copies are bought from the kiosk up front, which thanks to the death of physical media is the closest most Best Buy customers get to Blu-rays in the store, replacements are moved from the dying media section and/or the back rooms.

Oh, and then he uses the near sell-out of "Us" -- a Blu-ray that has been out mere days that hasn't had the chance to have more copies shipped to the store -- as some point of evidence.

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Sharon

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@XBgyManX(and others): First, the stuff about women judging men by penis size is not really a thing, at least among any women I've ever talked to (and I am an old gamer mom). Second, the movie industry thinks guys like The Rock are what teenage boys want in a movie, not girls. Consider, is Arnold the love interest in Terminator? Of course not, it's the cute, kind of scruffy normal-looking guy. When movie makers want to attract boys and young men, they put in guys that look like The Rock. When they want to attract women, they put in guys that look like Ryan Gosling or Tom Hiddleston. (Or, back in my day, Pierce Brosnan.) When most women see a really bulked-up guy their first thought is not "sexy" but "into himself". In my experience, what most women are looking for in a guy is someone who is reliable, cute in some way (super subjective), and has good personal hygiene (clean hair, shaves or keeps his beard tidy, clothes that look like they were washed not long ago, a living space not full of food trash and moldy dishes) and not too self-absorbed. Some women like big muscles, or super skinny guys, or other extremes, but most women I've been acquainted with in the past 50+ years are mostly attracted to normal healthy regular guys who happen to have some spark with them. In my case, my husband also liking video games was a big plus. :-)

3 • 
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Blowfish82

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@Sharon: No use explaining the exact evidence. Its ignored by the few against it. Dont waste your breath becuase they wont have many more to take.

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James_xeno

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@Sharon:

lol Imagine actually buying into and believing these kinds of nonsensical, usually after the fact, super convenient explanations and hand-waves for everything/anything that doesn't fit the narrative.. *rollseyes*

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CodyHall

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@Sharon: opinion for facts thanks lol

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Veeh

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@Sharon: women judge men by height how ever. Also women judge men by character more so. Thats why most super heroes are inteligent, charismatic, brave good leaders etc.

Meanwhile men judge women mostly by looks, this is why you can have a female super hero with rotten character and men will still like her.

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Blowfish82

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Edited By Blowfish82

@veeh: Nah. I personally have been eyeballed as: "how should I dress him?" from a girl that likes me, a girl im about to ask out, or my girlfriend herself. *MULTIPLE times id like to add.

You women are EQUALLY as bad, you just do it at different times. Go ahead and argue.

Again: women are just as superficial about looks as men, everyone operates on attraction being the basic (first) attractor.

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CybaCowboy

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@veeh: It's almost like men and women find different things appealing... Amazing!

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James_xeno

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@CybaCowboy:

To certain people and groups today. More like... Heresy!

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Sharon

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@veeh: Good points. I'd forgotten about height but yes, probably more women care about height than muscles. And yes, character is hugely important.

Back to the original topic, cartoony Tifa's bosom didn't bother me in PS1 FFVII, but a modern-graphics Tifa now with those proportions would strike me (and not just me) as rather skeevy (and unbalanced). She still seems pretty busty to me, which is fine, and at least it looks like she's getting decent bra support! :-D

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Tony56723

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Edited By Tony56723

@Sharon: but what the women in real life that look like Tifa (and yes they do exist)? Are you implying that they would be skeevy and unbalanced too? I’m just curious what your thoughts on that are.

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Blowfish82

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@Sharon: Dont worry. Like Resident Evil 2 there will be full nude mods that adjust for the breast size. Pretty realistic looking too!

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Blowfish82

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Edited By Blowfish82

@veeh: Thats why they chose Brie Larsom. They knew nobody would like her and she is an ugly person.

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Cashmoney007

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Edited By Cashmoney007

Let’s get to the real issues here:

1. I think many people are very concerned about SE having an ethics department.

2. Certain people on this article already know exactly what Kallie stands for. This is the woman that brought us the Pokémon review on IGN a few years. Remember, the game had a lot of water.

3. People that get offended and feel the company needs to change something because it doesn’t make sense in their mind are ridiculous. The funny part is these people that get offended have no desire to make their own game. They just want to force other people to see their way of thinking. How does that help anyone?

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GunEye

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Edited By GunEye

Am I the only one who think her breasts don't look that small at all - rather they look just right?

In fact - if compared to the polygon PS1 Tifa shown above (not some fan-base art): Her new Remake breasts actually appear BIGGER.

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James_xeno

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@GunEye:

No, you're not.. But that's completely beside the point. Which is that the creators didn't think they are perfect like this.. just the PR ghouls.

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GunEye

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Edited By GunEye

@James_xeno: Also I'm more concerned the n game is Episodic. I think it's gonna take very long, SE gonna drag and potentially milk the game franchise, and it won't be good...

At least release the first freaking chapter this summer or something. There aren't any PS4 games left (or any for 2019...)

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James_xeno

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@GunEye:

Yeah. That has always been an issue with the remake. Wasn't a fan of the idea from the beginning.

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GunEye

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@James_xeno: graphics change. There's no way something like her breasts or even face is going to look the same as an ancient CGI scene or a PS1 game with limited resources and early attempt at 3d.

I'm not sure it was truly changed at all or on purpose.

No one is complaining Cloud hair isn't super long and spiky either.

The only thing that I can address is the shape of the (they are not round this time) has changed.

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James_xeno

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Edited By James_xeno

@GunEye:

Yeah and also note how nobody is reeeeing over lack of realism in cloud running around with a weapon that would be heavier than the rest of the team combined.. Or the talking cat.. or the stuffed animal, or magic, or tifa being able to lift monsters the size of three story buildings over her head and then jumping with them in order to slam them down. and so on and so on.. That's kind of the point. It's this and ONLY this that needs to be changed.. for "realism"..

What I was talking about is partly summed up in this image:

https://i.imgtc.com/f8xQN7f.png

Plus the devs have said that they were told to change it so her breast didn't move around/bounce/etc. By their "ethics department" (i.e. PR people) so as not to upset outside ideologues and others who whined about it, yet never had any intentions of playing it to begin with in 95% of the cases. Their only interest in gaming being to complain about things they don't like/agree with. That is.. Conformity with their ideological/political dogmas.

For most, this has very little to do with her actual breast size (i personally like it better as a non fan of big huge ones) and more to do with the implications of these changes, and for whom/why they were made! You should also take note of her now covered legs (only drastic change to an old design so far) and the fact that she has shorts on under her ugly new skirt. So she has two tops on, two bottoms on, leggings covering her legs almost completely up and on top of all that, she has a rigid butt guard now too!

It may seem like (and be intentionally distorted as being) nitpicking, but you have to point this stuff out because it's part of a trend which is almost phantom-like in it's very nature. Very tiny groups of ultra loud outsiders screeching about stuff they don't like, being backed and supported by the so-called gaming "press".. that is given a soapbox and blanket defense against any and all push back completely. Pressuring devs and pubs to censor or self-censor and then claiming they were merely "pointing out problematic content" and have nothing at all to do with the artist's/dev's "choice" to censor. Usually forcefully attacking or mocking anyone who claims otherwise. (see the DOAX3 case.. even once the company outright stated they feared backlash from whiners, the narrative still to this day is that it was all because of business reasons.. i.e. it wouldn't sell enough over here. despite the fact that the western releases of the first two games outsold the eastern versions. Or the current sony censorship that they have fully officially announced and admitted to.. but which is still denied all over the fandom.. People will literally get into arguments and insult over the supposed ridiculousness of the idea, or just hand-wave it away as nothing to worry or be tolerable to allow to be talked about.. "silly".) All censorship is censorship full stop! There is no "inconsequential" amount. Once you hand-wave it away, because it's "small" in amount or stuff you don't care about, you open the door for censorship of anything! What happens when it comes for something you do care about?! After all, we are starting to see.. commentary of an anti-fictional-violence nature once again too.. in many cases from the same people whining about too big of boobs and too much skin..

I can't believe there is any doubt about the state of things within gaming when you have stuff like sony censoring adult fictional female characters in bathing suits on beaches!

https://www.oneangrygamer.net/2018/10/sonys-ps4-censorship-policy-forces-japanese-devs-to-censor-games-in-japan/71032/

(^ Japanese games IN japan now censored because of fear of western SJ zealots seeing it on the net and whining a/o causing problems.)

https://www.oneangrygamer.net/2018/11/nora-to-oujo-to-noraneko-heart-hd-ps4-patch-heavily-censors-cg-images-switch-version-is-safe/72096/

https://www.oneangrygamer.net/sony-ps4-censorship-policy-censored-games/

(Note: That list hasn't been updated in a while.)

When something like this:

(Switch version)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1954/45497077362_f968908b8d_z.jpg

(Switch version)

vs.

(PS4 version)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1948/44821969904_13a85a1daa_z.jpg

(PS4 version)

....is allowed to happen and go by almost without comment, you know something went terribly, disastrously wrong!

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CybaCowboy

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@GunEye: And what if you compare her breasts to that shown in other "official" media, such as the Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children movie?

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GunEye

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@CybaCowboy: they still look bigger, rounder and more bulging out than her Advent Children counterparts

Just compared her chruch fight scene with

https://youtu.be/Uecx4l7HdbA

0:02 and other scenes like 1:43

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CybaCowboy

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@GunEye: I remember them being considerably bigger in Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children... But I don't care enough to go digging through our DVDs/Blu-Ray Discs and look for my copy, to compare it to the YouTube video (we all know that films are occasionally edited in subsequent releases - for better or worse).

I think I've made my point, as have others... But sadly, this news article seems to have brought out all of the "trolls", on BOTH sides of the fence.

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GunEye

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@CybaCowboy: watched some scenes on YT and you are right. She has bigger chest in Advent Children, but somehow she still looks great and doesn't look abnormal.

Her face now in the Remake is much improved.

I wonder if they will make some CGI prerenderd scenes as well.

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GunEye

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@CybaCowboy: Perhaps, just pointed out my observation. I believe you. I hope you don't allude that I was trolling because it definitely wasn't my intention.

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CybaCowboy

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@GunEye: No, I was referring to others... But sides of the argument have some valid points - but as I said, this news article seems to have brought out *all* the trolls from both sides of the fence.

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monkyby87

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While I don’t doubt many of the users here could use an education, this article is is a prime example of how poor these websites have become.

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Tony56723

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@monkyby87: hei I is smurt!

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yeknomdab

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???

Figures...Squenix is finally releasing their sketchy episodic remix of FFVII and somehow the new Tifa's human-sized boobs are the only thing we talk about.

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streamline

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I take it literally that the PS1 model can poke an eye out with those low polygon count textures.

Female friends long ago told me that band size mattered less than cup size. I don’t know who to believe but I am old enough to not care any more when it comes to real women since the personality matters so much more. Video game women, however, I don’t know.

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PETERAKO

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This is why traditional media is quickly falling to irrelevance.

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AranShiizaa

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I been with women who have had many different size boobies. Guess what? I would still be madly in love with Tifa even if she was flat chested really. And trust me she DOES have big boobs, sure they may look smaller now but we also have to consider that bigger boobs were a thing back in the mid to late 90's because they helped stand out better than normal size ones since we didnt have the technology back then like we do now.

There is nothing wrong with Tifa. In the end of the day its her personality that matters and shes still gorgeous as hell. As long as her personality rocks, it doesnt matter.

But real talk the fact we got people whining for bigger tits that are unrealistic, please go watch some hentai or echhi anime ffs.

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Tony56723

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Edited By Tony56723

@AranShiizaa: you do realize there are girls that look just like Tifa in real life right? Like there are real girls out in the world who are slim with naturally large breasts, I’m really not sure how me going off to watch hentai is going to change that.

That’s also sidestepping what people are really arguing against here; censorship.

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dunpeal83

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Pff, everyone knows DFC is the way to go.

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