Carmack talks PS3 vs. 360, id's three-game pipeline

QUAKECON 2009: Technical Guru says studio is aiming for a triple-team structure; no Doom 4 news until next year; new Rage trailer inside.

GRAPEVINE, TEXAS--QuakeCon 2009 kicked off today at the Gaylord Texan hotel, where thousands of fans of id Software's various shooters gathered. After the start of registration for the convention's myriad tournaments, including a $25,000 Quake Live contest, the main keynote address began with id's top luminaries taking a ballroom stage. It would be the first time they had addressed a QuakeCon audience since id was bought by ZeniMax Media in a $105 million-plus deal in June.

Following a fusillade of techno beats, now-id-president Todd Hollenshead bounded onto the stage to talk up id's new corporate sibling, Bethesda Softworks, which is displaying Wet and Brink at QuakeCon. After mentioning that the iPhone game Doom Resurrection will be only $2.99 until Sunday, he announced that the browser-based Quake Live will be available for Macs and Linux machines starting next Tuesday.

Hollenshead then quickly deflated many attendees' hopes by saying new Doom 4 details would be revealed at next year's gathering. As a consolation prize, he introduced the new trailer for Rage, id's all-new open-world driving/action role-playing hybrid, shown below.

When the lights came up, id chief technical officer John Carmack took the stage. He began by echoing sentiments he had aired in a June interview with GameSpot. "Really, what we do on the game development side of things, that's not changing at all [post-buyout]," he told the crowd.

In fact, things will change somewhat, given the extra resources id now has at its disposal. "We will eventually be producing three [simultaneous] triple-A titles," the CTO said, up from id's current two-game workload. "The bottom floor of our building is for the Doom team, with the Rage team up top," he continued, not dropping any hints about any potential third projects. He did say, though, that three AAA games would be the most id would ever work on at the same time.

Then, the oft-awarded technical guru talked about the many ups and downs of exploring Web gaming with Quake Live, particularly bandwidth constraints. On the upside, about half of the people who have registered for the Quake Live beta remain active competitors. On the downside, it will take about 12 more months to see if Quake Live will be a success or not.

"In order for Quake Live to succeed, we're putting up a team that eats, breathes, and sleeps network gaming," he said.

Carmack went on to focus on Rage's development process. "You don't want to design by committee," he explained. "You need some kind of guiding vision to make a great game." He said developers were currently working on getting the details right, with the design team fine-tuning such things as the barrel climb of guns. Carmack is a strong believer in late-development polish, which he says is the "difference between a good game and a classic."

Then, Carmack talked about developing for consoles for the first time with Rage. He feels that the PS3 has more processing power but that the 360 is easier to program for. "I know Sony fans might get mad, but all the consoles are so much better than they once were, and are closer together now," he explained diplomatically. As a sop, he said that the 360's space constraints caused a lot of extra work having to go back and streamline textures for the platform.

The technical guru then praised Nintendo for going off the beaten path, particularly with its motion-sensing controls. "It's a shame we're not on the Wii. ... Motion-sensing technology will open incredible artistic possibilities in the future."

However, he does feel there are better motion-sensing solutions out there, calling out the Sixth Sense technology from the MIT Media Lab as an example. (See demo below.) "It is what the Wii wishes it were. I mean, it is the lightsaber," Carmack declared.

Coming back to id's signature high-end visuals, Carmack said he hasn't "really explored any kind of graphical research in the past year or so." Indeed, since the ZeniMax buyout, he said he feels compelled to produce and deliver, rather than working on fun extracurricular projects like Armadillo Aerospace. That said, his rocket company does have a Labor Day launch coming up and turned a "small profit" last year, said Carmack.

Getting more technical, the CTO believes that "the next step in technology is the virtualization of geometry, in the way megatextures have done with textures. Game art these days is built with millions of polygons, then reduced to a low-resolution map. Someday, we won't need that second step, but I guess I'm pretty conservative when it comes to conceptualizing how good new tech will make graphics look."

Speaking about Rage, Carmack believes precomputed lighting has helped its development, though performance is still sometimes a battle between engineers and artists.

"Everyone knows that future high-performance gaming is about parallelism," he explained, referring to multiple core processors like those in the PS3, 360, and higher-end PCs. "The real work is taking advantage of these parallel resources, not how polygons are drawn, but how they're economically rendered."

He called people who advocated using more processing threads "naive," since savvy programmers understand the many roadblocks. "Rendering causes latency to pile up; textures, vertical syncing...and if you want to accelerate in another thread, you have another frame."

Carmack also touted his PC gaming cred, saying, "The mouse and keyboard is still the best and most precise control scheme for first-person shooters." He also said that the continuing work of hardware manufacturers such as ATI and Nvidia means that PC graphics will continue to lead. "It'll be a whole new ball game for next-gen [consoles]," he declared.

337 Comments

  • green_dominator

    Posted Oct 20, 2009 7:37 pm PT

    Rage is going to be amazing no matter what system it's on......
    Sure the PC has the best control of all time but PS3 eith Blue Ray's storage capacity.....this is going to be the first game that exorcises that to the extreme.....
    then there is 360, it might not have the storage capacity but it delivers on graphics......
    Since I don't have the money for a gaming rig I'll be grabbing either the 360 or PS3 version of the game....

  • necorid

    Posted Sep 13, 2009 1:17 pm PT

    Bring back Romero. Bring back Prince. Bring back Donna, Bring back Id

  • kiblespoop

    Posted Sep 8, 2009 1:15 pm PT

    imjustjames, PCs don't require genius to create. All it takes is about 5 hours of research into what parts you want, and if you really don't want to assemble it, take it to a DataDoctors. High end PCs cost around 1k, will last you for about 5 years if maintained properly, and can also be.........a computer. You spend about 350 dollars on a console. take that 350 and add it to the 400 dollar computer that most average people have and you have a "lower" high end computer. Enjoy.

  • imjustjames

    Posted Sep 3, 2009 1:32 am PT

    Why is it when I read every single comment board, there's always at least a few dozen clowns that have to start something about platform wars. Games are games no matter what platform you play it on. For those arrogant, diehard PC fans, someone of us can't spend, nor have the talent, nor have the time to buy and build the gaming PC of their dreams. The 360's hardware infrastructure is fine, not perfect, but still fine, I mean, they must be doing something right if more developers are flocking to them opposed to the PS3 right? On the other hand, Sony was smart to go with Blu-Ray because they knew it would sell systems (like how they went with DVD for the PS2), it was the main selling point for me when I finally bought one used, recently. PC's are always gonna have the upper hand on a technical standpoint because there are no limits but all PC gamers know that not everyone has the know-how to build themselves a gaming platform that they're comfortable with, nor are they comfortable with viruses (denying the existence of viruses is just plain ignorance, please quit creating excuses). Point is, every platform has their strengths and weaknesses, we could go on forever about the petty differences between each platform, so why bother? Some people would rather actually talk about games, not pass arrogant insults regarding one's financial or job status just because they can't accept that someone else might have different tastes. Crazy concept, huh?

  • Jmilicich

    Posted Aug 31, 2009 3:46 pm PT

    It's called jobs. Work hard and save up for a PC. It's blood and sweat that goes into saving for a great PC. Not the next welfare check you get in the mail while you sit on your ass and game game game.

  • needfood

    Posted Aug 18, 2009 5:00 pm PT

    @ Baramos6
    Yes a good PC costs some money, also I have a PS3, and I have more control on a PC. I also have to say a PC is far more useful than a console.

  • BigBangWiscite

    Posted Aug 18, 2009 4:30 pm PT

    This is so easy. PS3 runs Puppy Linux kernel and Xbox 360 runs weird firmware. PS3 is no longer more expensive than Xbox 360, and it has stability updates and Xbox 360 doesn't. All true. Microsoft has got to wise up and put Linux + DX9 onto their system to equal the brilliance of PS3. My 2 cents

    Maybe I'm living in barn, but who games on Linux except PS3 these days! I mean complex commeircal games, not those KDE games.

  • grootelaar

    Posted Aug 18, 2009 7:12 am PT

    but it will cost alot of money

  • grootelaar

    Posted Aug 18, 2009 7:10 am PT

    this is actully very good for peapole always on the go

  • athenian29

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 2:29 pm PT

    "The mouse and keyboard is still the best and most precise control scheme for first-person shooters."

    True that, but doesn't he say that every single year?

  • RonTorque

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 2:07 pm PT

    Respect for the PC.

  • ja010764

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 12:34 pm PT

    If anyone cares the sale on id games (for the iphone) has been extended until the end of MONDAY

  • TheoleDominion

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 10:13 am PT

    Carmack also touted his PC gaming cred, saying, "The mouse and keyboard is still the best and most precise control scheme for first-person shooters." Unfortunately, the vast majority of consumers wether gamers or not don't think of a PC as a gaming platform at least not to the extent of gaming consoles are viewed. PC's are superior in just about every way, EXCEPT when it comes to practicality. Most people do not hook their PC's up to their TV's, the whole concept behind consoles IS "living-room entertainment." Being able to sit side by side with a friend or family member in a room playing a game is something that PC's are NOT naturally set up for. And this concept alone is why most devs flock to the console market. However, for you "hi-tech" geeks, who want the highest quality in everything there's plenty of games that comes to the PC too. So though the PC is superior in technology, it is inferior to the average family who want to enjoy games together in their homes. The technology in consoles are just fine the way it is, while playing, wether or not the game is better than the PC version NEVER crosses their minds. And that's something even a keyboard and mouse cant outperform.

  • awheaten

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 9:11 am PT

    @PixelAddict

    You know why, because gamespot post these threads. When they do. This happens. Anytime you have in a post, "so and so talks PS3 vs. 360" your going to have these fanboy debates.

  • PixelAddict

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 8:07 am PT

    Why does every thread turn into a console war led by fanboys who had 3 scoops of hatred in their coffee this morning?

  • AlphaCommando

    Posted Aug 17, 2009 1:08 am PT

    Yes, the PC can be built to be the superior console, but it's no use if they don't have such great exclusives as Ratchet & Clank and LittleBigPlanet.

  • grimm201

    Posted Aug 16, 2009 11:21 pm PT

    To Linkman0714:

    There's a camera on the guy's chest that projects the information onto surfaces.

  • godzillavskong

    Posted Aug 16, 2009 5:55 pm PT

    Well put VengfulOne. I've never been into the whole mouse and keyboard type of gaming, but I won't knock someone who does play on a PC. I grew up on console gaming with a controller, so that's what I am used to and prefer, and I'm satisfied with the way games look today on consoles, meaning I could care less of the graphics got any better.

  • Linkman0714

    Posted Aug 16, 2009 5:21 pm PT

    the MIT demo looks interesting...but where is all that info coming from??

  • VengfulOne

    Posted Aug 16, 2009 5:04 pm PT

    Baramos6 said: "these machines can pretty much play any PC game. (with lower graphics but honestly are you PC gamers so shallow you care about that? Your not real gamers if you think that way)" So caring about better graphics makes you shallow and means you are not a real gamer? That is a very ignorant thing to say. PC gamers tend to take pride in building their own machines. We want the best graphics AND gameplay. Upgrading every few years(generally not 5-6 months as you claim) is part of the fun for most PC gamers. It is more expensive, but what we do with our money is our business. Its the nature of the beast. I also enjoy my PS3.

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