Worst gaming engine for XB1 gets boost thanks to DX12

PES 2016 Jumps From 720p to 1080p Thanks to Xbox One DirectX 12 SDK, MGSV May See Similar Results

More than four weeks ago gaming website Gamekyo posted information regarding their discussion with Konami's Julien Merceron, a technology director who has spent a great deal of time working on the Fox Engine. Among the details shared was something that seemed almost too good to be true at the time. Merceron stated that due to Microsoft's release of a new Xbox One SDK, Konami development members were able to improve the presentation of this year's Metal Gear Solid and Pro Evolution Soccer releases, jumping from their prior 720p resolution to a staggering 1080p.

Many took this as an non-credible rumor, with NeoGAF's EuropeOG posting that it was "confirmed bull****". Well, it turns out that it was true all along.

PES European product manager Adam Bhatti has confirmed on Twitter that PES 2016 will run at 1080p and 60FPS. His post states the following:

We got there thankfully, Xbox One #PES2016 will be 1080p

This lines up with what was claimed by Gamekyo meaning that Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain should follow suit. But this evolution means much more than just a potentially great visual experience on the Xbox One version of this year's Metal Gear Solid. If the SDK is truly impactful enough to nearly double the rendered pixels for these two games, then future Xbox One titles are sure to see similar bumps in visual fidelity.

Since the Xbox One's launch it has struggled to compete with its rival PS4 in resolution. While Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes was a particularly extreme example (720p vs 1080p), most multiplatform titles run at a higher resolution on PS4. For example, the recent Batman: Arkham Knight ran at 900p on Xbox One versus the 1080p of PS4.

Microsoft has said a lot about how it's using software to increase the ceiling of potential for the Xbox One, especially when it comes to the introduction of its touted DirectX 12 software. As a matter of fact, DirectX 12's potential has been talked up so much that many are skeptical as to how much impact it will have on future games, particularly when it comes to the Xbox One. If Konami's games are any indication, it could be a game changer.

http://www.gamerevolution.com/news/pes-2016-jumps-from-720p-to-1080p-thanks-to-xbox-one-directx-12-sdk-mgsv-may-see-similar-results-33987

Both PES and MGSV already confirmed to be running at 1080p/60fps

Gameyko says it was able to get a hands on test run with both games recently and has confirmed they are both running at this very high quality. The website also went and got confirmation from Julien Merceron, Technical Director on Konami’s Fox Engine. Xbox One has recently put out a new SDK that Konami is crediting with making it easier to hit the 1080p/60FPS mark. “The great info is that both games on Xbox One will be in 1080p/60fps. We heard that by Julien Merceron, involved in the development of Konami’s Fox Engine.
http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-solid-5-and-pes-2016-reported-to-run-at-1080p60fps-on-xbox-one#7w94H7Hcqo6FIygM.99

So we will soon have our first glimpse of what DX12 can actually offer the Xbone. I'd say thats a pretty good start considering the fact that it's highly unlikely that either of these games were built for Dx12 from the ground up. If this is what the Bone gets I can't wait to see what it will do for PC, hopefully it will extend the life of my 280.

AwesomeSauce DX12 man now at GC when we see how StormCloud works with Crackdown 3 should seal the deal.

O.O even i don't believe this, being a lemming... slap me...

I thought frostbite was the worst engine for consoles

Great real world results. DX12 for Xbox One is for real.

Inb4 cows "bu bu but mah GDDR 5".

Neither game is DX12 though.

Wuh woh!

Go figure DX12 makes that much of a difference. Welp here comes the Xbox Update (le sigh)

Won't be long until this thread becomes pretty much everyone versus tormentos.

Quote chains ahoy!

let me begin..

TormyKinect you mean. :P

Lol you would be the one to make me rethink my title.....frickin smartass. I forgot how much Frostbite sucks on consoles.

I don't believe it was all DX12. I'm sure they did some major improvements on their code. Maybe I'm missing it, but none of the sources state that they achieved that performance thanks to DX12. It's just implied..

Cool...Im looking forward to seeing Fable, apparently that game is one of the first ones to use DX12 heavily.

There's already a thread on this I think

It doesn't say its directly related to Directx 12, but what it does show is how far behind it was and actually how close in the real world games will be. I've said all along games will end up 900p (while 1080p on PS4) at roughly same fps and the only people that will care will be on fanboy forums like this one.

All good for Xbox One.

Sad day lems.

I already pointed that out in the OP, but if this is the optimization that you get on non DX12 games what do you think it will be like for full Dx12 games?

I don't see how it's a sad day for lems seeing as how both games are already running at 1080p/60 fps. Are you saying Xb1 getting 1080p/60 fps on these two games is a bad thing?

That is what I was thinking. If this is true a first party dev like 343 should have no issue running something like Halo 5 a solid 1080p at 60fps but their last E3 showing proved that weren't hitting that yet.

Maybe by E3 but if Directx12 was such a factor in helping xb1 I'd think a 1st party developer would be the ones to reap the benefits of these performance increases before a 3rd party not the other way around.

In any case it's good it's good news developers are finding ways to get better performance out of xbox 1 in some of these titles. I look forward to what Digital Foundry has to say on them.

Welcome to 1 day 18 hours ago folks.

Or maybe it's just the usual optimisations consoles get two years down the line and DX12 has nothing to do with this. Shit, the fact lems are crowing about the Bone finally getting to what's been the PS4 standard for the Fox engine since launch shows just how desperate you are for some magic wand to be waved and bail out the Xbone's crap hardware.

Yup DX12 and teh cloud will save the X1!!!!!

no not really desperate just wanted to share the news. Not interested in PES since I get FIFA free, and Metal Gear just feels more at home on PS for me so I'll probably get it for PS4. Also not surprised with Fox engine performing better on PS4, PS4 launched with everything available to devs from Day 1. XB1 launched early with hardware being 100%, but lacking in the software department.

What do you guys think of my Zelda avatar

It sucks.

No wonder the game looks like this. Thank you Xbone and your magnificent DX12...

Actually no, Frostbite 3 used on the current Battlefield games is quite good. The engine maximizes cpu/gpu usage based on the API the system has. BF4 was one of the first multiplat games to use async shaders on the PS4. And use Mantle on PC, Problem is that they push the consoles and with DX12 will fix X1's inefficient current API.

Xbox One's DX12 includes new APIs for managing it's 32MB ESRAM, unlocks GPU's full Async features and removes CPU bottlenecks with deferred context threads being serialized into immediate context thread. Improved Async compute enables improved TMU usage for ROPS workaround.

Both TMU and ROPS can read and write to memory. Async compute's TMU output can write to memory while Sync compute's ROPS output can write to memory concurrently, hence improving ROPS workaround.

The removal of CPU bottlenecks with deferred context threads being serialized into immediate context thread enables concurrent DDR3 and ESRAM ROPS/TMU write usage via multiple immediate context type threads.

With better Async and multi-threading model, it enables extra usage for unused shaders resources during CPU side frame build.

Ok but where does the developer say that they used any of that? All I read is that they were finally able to optimize the game to reach it. That could of meant that they actually made an effort to fix their engine as opposed to just porting it and forgetting about it.

The 3D engine runs on top of Direct3D. Direct3D can impose structural bottlenecks.

The split render targets was from GDC 2015 and TMU workaround was from GDC 2014 but keep in mind DX11.X's multithreading model limitations.

The split render targets combines 32MB ESRAM and DDR3 memory pools for frame buffer rendering.

The split render targets enables XBO to replicate FirePro W5000 like results instead of being another 7770 like results and both GCN SKUs has similar CU TFLOPS.

Async compute maximises shader resource usage during CPU side frame build.

Have to agree. Will it do much for my Witcher 3?(PC) Look dude, I am not a big PC or tech savvy guy so I am honestly asking.

In the SW fun terms, LMAO that this will do NOTHING for X1. It really isn't MUCH because resolution means very little to me on my consoles, but I love starting bullshit arguments. LOL

So I'm not asking you to explain DX12 to me. I'm asking where did the developers credit DX12 and its features to the bump in performance?

http://www.icxm.net/x/pes-2016-1080p-xbox-confirmed.html

Konami’s technology director, Julien Merceron, about the resolution and frame rate for PES 2016 and Metal Gear Solid V on Xbox One. Merceron stated that because of the new Xbox One SDK, the developers were able to bump up both games to 1080p 60 FPS

Anyway, http://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-ones-rise-of-the-tomb-raider-demo-reaches-108/1100-6429149/

Xbox One's Rise of the Tomb Raider Demo Reaches 1080p

@slimdogmilionar: Already a thread.

This is an article based on the sketchy foreigh french clickbait source from two days ago.

Thank you. And this new SDK is the DX12 one? Is there confirmation of that?

bu..but innovating at weird resolutions 792p was the only thing Xbone was good at

Notice the journey towards 1080p for Xbox One.

It's another dupe thread w/old PR news.

We'll see when the true native performance is measured in the final product releases on my Xbone.

Rise of the Tomb Raider is releasing on Xbox 360, hardware released in 2005, so the Xbone version will have an easier time due to last gen assets and builds designed for both 360 and Xbone. Similar to last gen remastered ports we see on Xbone.

The Multiplatform 360/Xbone (and future PC/PS4/PS3[?] versions) of Rise of the Tomb Raider hitting 1080p on Xbone is not an impressive feat, rather is should have been expected due to the last gen geometry/assets/engine in the game.

The power of Dx12? Good for the Xbox one. It would have been nice if both Xbox One and PS4 had most games in 1080p 60fps.

I'm not surprised, they said this new SDK would bring about big changes for the system.

the new SDK jam packed with new tools and fixes over previous API's

And this stuff isn't even factoring in DirectX 12 itself yet, these are just the improvements and tools they have made leading up to and for it, which obviously are already having a big impact for developers.

The other Tomb Raider game was 1080p to so is not like DX12 increased resolution over the previous one it just was 30 lock while the PS4 was unlock.

Here is what DX12 can't do.

1-Increase resolution.

DX12 is a CPU bottleneck API the xbox one GPU still is weaker and will not gain power to match the PS4 in most games.

2-Do anything significant.

DX12 is an API which biggest features are console like optimization something that already exist on the xbox one since day 1 because it was a console.

If the target is 1080p 30FPS on PS4 the xbox one will always trail the PS4 unless the game is gimp on PS4 same with 60FPS and 1080p.

I am sure that has shit to do with DX12 and more to do with better understanding of the hardware,DX12 is a CPU over head API not a GPU over head on so you will not increase 100% pixels with it because of DX12,no matter how many times you repeat it that it is not true at all in fact MGS5 and PES should have never been 720p to begin with on xbox one,and more close to 900p or 1080p after all Foxengine is a cross gen cross platform engine and on xbox 360 it was almost 720p 30FPS MGS5.

Give it a rest B4X.

Well that makes sense. I'm still waiting for a developer to say what helped and where. SDK improvements aren't DX12. Everyone expects SDK's to improve over time.

Definitely. Improvements are going to happen across all the systems overtime.

You don't know what DirectX 12 can or cannot do, you're parroting speculation and conjecture from the Internet as if it's an informed point of view.

Silence, we don't care what you have to say because you don't know anything of worth.

P.S. Get mad.

@tormentos: It's clear you didn't read my post nor you don't have the capacity to understand them. Before spewing further BS, please attend a computer science related degree.

DX12's multithreading model impacts on how Async and TMU's ROPS workaround is used.

DX12's multithreading model impacts on how split rendering is used i.e. writing on both DDR3 and ESRAM frame buffer at the same time THAT reduce ping-pong access patterns with ESRAM. Every ping-pong access consumes clock cycles which increases rendering times.

These are the workaround examples for NOT having at least 1GB of GDDR5 for frame buffer workloads AND having 16 ROPS i.e. use compute's TMUs to write results to memory.

That says new SDK. Nothing about DX12 there, which IIRC is not yet available to third party developers.

DX12 is available to selected developers. "New SDK" can cover a range of areas.

Known DX12 titles

Eidos Montreal/Square Enix's Deus Ex: Mankind Divided.

Lionhead Studios' Fable Legends (Unreal Engine 4).

Black Tusk Studios' Gears of War Ultimate Edition (Unreal Engine ?).

Snail Games' King of Wushu (CryEngine 3)

http://www.starwarshq.com/articles.html/star-wars-battlefront/star-wars-battlefront-could-make-use-of-directx-12-good-sign-for-stable-multiplayer-r199/

Microsoft said to expect the first DX12 games to be made available around “holiday 2015″, when “50% of all new PC games will be DX12 compatible.

PS; If PES 2016 wasn't shader bound, it's render resolution would be increased i.e. there are other factors that limits rendering resolution outside of shader resource issues.

Async compute enables shader resources to be used during CPU side frame render setup.

There's only very few games that uses Async compute. From AMD's list, not one is XBO game.

DirectX 12 Early Access Program https://onedrive.live.com/survey?resid=A4B88088C01D9E9A!107&authkey=!AFgbVA2sYbeoepQ