Why you shouldn't be excited. TB weighs in on the hype

#1 Edited by MlauTheDaft (3778 posts) -

I expect this video exists since TB was sort of dragged into the debacle about Zoe Quinn so I'd thought I'd share. No Phil Fish Twitter Meltdowns here, just good points.

There's even a shoutout to good old GS ;)

Not SW material? As much as the aforementioned Meltdown was.

#2 Posted by CrownKingArthur (4804 posts) -

i like these kind of totalbiscuit vids. he's usually pretty insightful. cheers.

#3 Posted by parkurtommo (27087 posts) -

Praise lord Gaben and TotalBiscuit Christ.

#4 Edited by MlauTheDaft (3778 posts) -

@parkurtommo said:

Praise lord Gaben and TotalBiscuit Christ.

xD

I had a point but it somehow eluded me within seconds.

#5 Posted by uninspiredcup (8669 posts) -

Very good review.

#6 Posted by SolidTy (43357 posts) -

This year sucked for me as far as gaming.

#7 Edited by PapaTrop (1239 posts) -

I know people with next gen consoles (Wii U, PS4, and Xbox Ones), and most of them haven't turned on the systems in months.

The new systems are really really bad. I don't think I've seen a generation of consoles this lackluster which only makes it more sad just how hyped some of the systems are, and how successful they are.

#8 Posted by hiphops_savior (7914 posts) -

@papatrop: PS4 isn't too bad for streaming MLB games. Wii U has full BC support if you sold your Wii last gen.

#9 Posted by UnbiasedPoster (834 posts) -

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

#10 Posted by PapaTrop (1239 posts) -

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

What's wrong with DRM? Every developer has the right to protect their IPs.

I'm against the extreme extent to which some devs take DRM, but the only way to avoid DRM is to buy from GOG.com, and that's it.

If you buy consoles, or use Steam then you're supporting DRM.

#11 Posted by parkurtommo (27087 posts) -

@SolidTy said:

This year sucked for me as far as gaming.

Apart from a few gems here and there I haven't really enjoyed gaming that much since around 2012.

I haven't really played a game that blew my mind since Journey came out on PS3. I honestly cannot remember anything else that I have enjoyed to that extent in recent times. Maybe Metro Last Light was the closest thing.

DOTA 2 probably spoiled me. Coincidentally I started playing DOTA 2 in 2012. And only stopped a few months ago.

#12 Edited by lamprey263 (23958 posts) -

Well, gaming press has a reason to make games excited, after all people want to be excited, it brings in readers. There's a degree where gaming journalists can do this. After all nobody wants gaming critics to bring down their hopes regarding games coming out, it's going to alienate their audience. Though, there is a degree where this can go overboard, I've seen lots of shit developer interviews talking about games with them, watching gameplay videos, and the games look awful, and in the end they're like "can't wait to play it when it releases"... and that bugs me, because at some point yes, they're in a perfect position to go "hey, there's a lot of things wrong with this game" straight to their face and maybe force needed change to actually make a better game.

It's true though, we as a community of gamers will often get us psyched, even over teasers, without any real idea of substance. And they can really keep this up gathering hype until the game releases, at which point it either confirms our expectation or squashes them.

#13 Edited by BldgIrsh (2594 posts) -

So.... we shouldn't be hyping this???????? I mean look at how realistic the bug is! This game will be graphics king. /s

#14 Posted by lamprey263 (23958 posts) -

Okay, since his piece is basically on how hype in gaming is ruining peoples expectations and the players involved and who does their part... there's basically one aspect I strongly felt is left out, and that's the retail end of hype and it's contribution of ruining gaming.

Let's take a trip back to the end of PS2 and Xbox days. Game retailers like GameStop, EB Games, Best Buy, and such, when it came to the games they carried, they often carried just about EVERYTHING that was available on the systems, mostly. With the age of the Xbox 360 and PS3 and Wii things took a turn for the worst. In part it was the explosion of the used game industry, but the hype had a part in their pattern. That came with pre-orders.

Well, what do pre-orders do? It used to be pre-orders were a way to guarantee yourself a game on release. It's not that anymore. Though there are incentives for pre-ordering, special DLC content, swag, whatever, but pre-ordering isn't about getting a copy on release day anymore. It's about the game retailers gauging which games will be the biggest sellers and ordering supply of their titles based on pre-order numbers. What this means is games that don't get hype early on will not be highly available in the long run, and likely once they're gone then they're gone for good from the retail shelf. The retailer has no reason to order more, and thus rare games can only be found used much the time.

Now, this is a lot different than the gaming I knew years earlier. It didn't matter if games released years prior in the gen, if it was the current gen and they carried games for that system then they most likely carried a robust and near complete selection of games. Go to any Best Buy for instance 10 years ago and about every game made for a system will be on the shelf. There'll be plenty of GREATEST HITS for $20, many games sometimes going for less, brand new, without those yukky used game stickers, not missing their game inserts (manuals, registration codes), not missing their original case or cover art, not looking like the game cases were jacked off onto and encrusted in semen. It didn't matter that the hype a game got or its pre-orders, if they were a gaming retailer then they carried it.

Now, what hype does is dictate the games retailers carry. It does not allow for underdog titles to slowly gain a vocal cult following and other gamers to spread word of mouth, allowing them to go to their game store and acquire those games down the line. It only guarantees success to publishers and developers whose games can dominate at launch and anything less is a ticket to a defunct studio and a failed IP. Hence why even good game studios disappear. So, it's not entirely used games at fault, I'd say the hype train is just as culpable in the way that game retailer has evolved over the years to give consumers less options in their exposure to the diversity of games.

#15 Posted by MlauTheDaft (3778 posts) -

@bldgirsh said:

So.... we shouldn't be hyping this???????? I mean look at how realistic the bug is! This game will be graphics king. /s

No we should not. This is actually a good example of building expectations without any basis.

Well, ND has a great track record of course.

#16 Posted by bezza2011 (2529 posts) -

@papatrop said:

I know people with next gen consoles (Wii U, PS4, and Xbox Ones), and most of them haven't turned on the systems in months.

The new systems are really really bad. I don't think I've seen a generation of consoles this lackluster which only makes it more sad just how hyped some of the systems are, and how successful they are.

Lackluster??? was you not there for the PS3??? Plus any third party game which makes up pretty much more than half the games we was playing more of on the PS3/360 were all third parties and just so it happens are coming out for the new consoles, yes there is a drought at the minute for games, but that's how it normally is just after launch, next year is full to the brim of great exclusives for both and great third party games,

But sales prove one thing and that's people were ready and wanting next gen so badly, so my argument to you is there not really really bad, because in a year or 2 from now it will be a whole new ball game, just like it was with the 360/PS3 they both didn't get into there strides for at least a year or 2, PS3 more than anything, but 360 had 1 maybe 2 games which were decent the first year, the rest were cut down versions of last gen games, take Fifa for Example the first Fifa on 360 was the biggest cut down from what you could do on the PS2 and many games followed, it's just the same every transition onto a new console, I'll agree both companies haven't put both feet firmly into next gen which was strange but i guess this is such a cut throat market at the moment and how well both systems were doing before this gen, that they felt it best to put one foot forward and keep the other just behind long enough to transition.

#17 Posted by The_Last_Ride (71828 posts) -

TotalBiscuit is overrated imho. You can be excited about a game...

#18 Edited by Roler42 (752 posts) -

@The_Last_Ride: There's getting excited and then there's memorable gems like "Believe the hype!" and "why you should be excited for X game!" only to end up getting dissapointed

#19 Posted by The_Last_Ride (71828 posts) -

@roler42 said:

@The_Last_Ride: There's getting excited and then there's memorable gems like "Believe the hype!" and "why you should be excited for X game!" only to end up getting dissapointed

i support him about sites making articles that hype games, but you can use your own brain aswell and check it out for yourself. If you take the word of journalists without having seen the game, then you're stupid. It's as simple as that

#20 Edited by GhoX (5011 posts) -

@The_Last_Ride said:

TotalBiscuit is overrated imho. You can be excited about a game...

You didn't watch the video or hear what he had to say then.

It's fine to be excited for the right reasons, but it's not fine when you are simply misled by games media into false hype. One of the examples in the video was the Dungeons 1/2 games, which were hyped as spiritual successors to Dungeon Keeper games, even though the original devs didn't promote it as such and the gameplay are vastly different.

#21 Posted by inb4uall (5728 posts) -

ITT: butthurt cows who only have CGI to be excited about.

#22 Posted by ReadingRainbow4 (14098 posts) -

@SolidTy said:

This year sucked for me as far as gaming.

Same here, 2014 was pretty damn lame.

#23 Posted by clyde46 (46294 posts) -

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

You play on consoles. Hypocrite much.

#24 Posted by MBirdy88 (8240 posts) -

@lamprey263 said:

Okay, since his piece is basically on how hype in gaming is ruining peoples expectations and the players involved and who does their part... there's basically one aspect I strongly felt is left out, and that's the retail end of hype and it's contribution of ruining gaming.

Let's take a trip back to the end of PS2 and Xbox days. Game retailers like GameStop, EB Games, Best Buy, and such, when it came to the games they carried, they often carried just about EVERYTHING that was available on the systems, mostly. With the age of the Xbox 360 and PS3 and Wii things took a turn for the worst. In part it was the explosion of the used game industry, but the hype had a part in their pattern. That came with pre-orders.

Well, what do pre-orders do? It used to be pre-orders were a way to guarantee yourself a game on release. It's not that anymore. Though there are incentives for pre-ordering, special DLC content, swag, whatever, but pre-ordering isn't about getting a copy on release day anymore. It's about the game retailers gauging which games will be the biggest sellers and ordering supply of their titles based on pre-order numbers. What this means is games that don't get hype early on will not be highly available in the long run, and likely once they're gone then they're gone for good from the retail shelf. The retailer has no reason to order more, and thus rare games can only be found used much the time.

Now, this is a lot different than the gaming I knew years earlier. It didn't matter if games released years prior in the gen, if it was the current gen and they carried games for that system then they most likely carried a robust and near complete selection of games. Go to any Best Buy for instance 10 years ago and about every game made for a system will be on the shelf. There'll be plenty of GREATEST HITS for $20, many games sometimes going for less, brand new, without those yukky used game stickers, not missing their game inserts (manuals, registration codes), not missing their original case or cover art, not looking like the game cases were jacked off onto and encrusted in semen. It didn't matter that the hype a game got or its pre-orders, if they were a gaming retailer then they carried it.

Now, what hype does is dictate the games retailers carry. It does not allow for underdog titles to slowly gain a vocal cult following and other gamers to spread word of mouth, allowing them to go to their game store and acquire those games down the line. It only guarantees success to publishers and developers whose games can dominate at launch and anything less is a ticket to a defunct studio and a failed IP. Hence why even good game studios disappear. So, it's not entirely used games at fault, I'd say the hype train is just as culpable in the way that game retailer has evolved over the years to give consumers less options in their exposure to the diversity of games.

I see your point, but you are putting too much reliance on brick and mortar stores here..... I think that speaks more about the fact that there isn't one centralised place to get your games anymore.... online orders, and digital distribution have caused that.... not hyped titles and the way you say it is. They have fierce competition in multiple directions from multiple publishers now. people can see all the games and deals right on their couch. or at least gaurentee cheaper online ordering.... every aspect of retail is facing this problem.... music/games/films even moreso.

The real issue is the focus on these big blockbuster titles.... their costs increased so you see less AA level productions .... and more multiplatform AAA productions that are in the hands of non-gamer publishers/marketers/managers .... all this money in graphics and marketing.... for watered down cinematic experiences. I feel the consoles fall victim to this.... and yet consolites around here BRAG about big budget shallow 10 hour shooter games with no substance... and then complain they have nothing unique to play a week later.

These big games have to appeal to the lowest common denominator to sell enough... so we don't get that same enthusiasm as veteran gamers than we use to. I have to turn to indies, to start up PC developers to get fresh games. or companies like Valve, Nintendo and the likes that still "GET" that fantastic games are aimed at a TARGET AUDIENCE and focus on gameplay.... not replicating films with abit of gameplay inbetween. Hell I even give credit to CoD.... as people love that for its gameplay, even if it IS pretty casual in its genre.... it still has a defined place and the lastibility factor.

I look at most of the games at E3 ..... nothing put me to sleep quite like The Order.... I really don't see its purpose.... its not the only game, but E3 showed the same reptitive big budget games with nice graphics.... not many interesting ideas, and not much focus on gameplay.

I feel that Nintendo won E3 as a gamer.... and I believe PC-Centric games like Star Citizen, Elite Dangerous, The Witcher 3 ect won GDC.

and no, not because I'm a hermit..... but because.... they were actually impressive, they have a target niche, they know their audiences demand a certain quality, a certain challenge, a certain level of gameplay.

Meanwhile.... Sony/Microsoft E3 was basically "Look we got more super graphics, more gun games! look at our power....." .... so shallow. so boring.

#25 Posted by UnbiasedPoster (834 posts) -

@clyde46 said:

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

You play on consoles. Hypocrite much.

Explain.

#26 Edited by Gue1 (10013 posts) -

@UnbiasedPoster said:

@clyde46 said:

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

You play on consoles. Hypocrite much.

Explain.

I wanna hear an explanation too because I can play all my games offline, even the digital ones I used to have before my PSN account was stolen. The only one that had actual always online DRM was Capcom's Final Fight Double Impact. I bought it without even knowing it was like that because they kept it a secret till it was too late to avoid the purchase.

Most my games I bought them on disc and none of them require any online DRM bullshit. After the PS3 is phased out I'll still be able to play all my games.

#27 Posted by UnbiasedPoster (834 posts) -

@Gue1 said:

@UnbiasedPoster said:

@clyde46 said:

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

You play on consoles. Hypocrite much.

Explain.

I wanna hear an explanation too because I can play all my games offline, even the digital ones I used to have before my PSN account was stolen. The only one that had actual always online DRM was Capcom's Final Fight Double Impact. I bought it without even knowing it was like that because they kept it a secret till it was too late to avoid the purchase.

Most my games I bought them on disc and none of them require any online DRM bullshit. After the PS3 is phased out I'll still be able to play all my games.

He won't be back. He has no argument.

At best, he could provide a couple of isolated examples.

#28 Posted by CrownKingArthur (4804 posts) -

haha

#29 Posted by Gue1 (10013 posts) -

@papatrop said:

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

What's wrong with DRM? Every developer has the right to protect their IPs.

I'm against the extreme extent to which some devs take DRM, but the only way to avoid DRM is to buy from GOG.com, and that's it.

If you buy consoles, or use Steam then you're supporting DRM.

what's wrong is that you're paying to buy something when you're actually just renting it. All those PS3 games with always online DRM like Final Fight Double Impact will be unplayable once Sony shut-down the servers of the console. DRM is not and never will be good for the consumer.

And how am I supporting DRM if I buy consoles? lol

#30 Posted by CrownKingArthur (4804 posts) -

george hotz' hacking gave rise to circumvention of DRM in ps3 games. "SCEA claimed could be used to circumvent the security system in the console and allow the playing of pirated videogames" http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/04/11/settlement-in-george-hotz-case/

john carmack is on the record complaining about xbox 360's on disc drm because it took up so much space. here's an article from when they changed the type of drm so it took up a bit less space. http://www.tomsguide.com/us/google-android-open-software-honeycomb,news-10695.html

so, there is drm on consoles, and if one spent a dollar on consoles they supported drm.

#31 Posted by funsohng (27931 posts) -

When journalists hype and doesn't side with their readers, then they are no longer journalists. There is a reason why gaming journalism is seen with skepticism. Most people in gaming journalism just aren't journalists.

I may not always agree with TB, but I think he's at least professional. Or knows that he has to try to be professional. Vast majority of gaming outlets don't even get this I think.

#32 Posted by PapaTrop (1239 posts) -

@Gue1 said:

@papatrop said:

@UnbiasedPoster said:

He supports DRM, have not clicked his vids since.

What's wrong with DRM? Every developer has the right to protect their IPs.

I'm against the extreme extent to which some devs take DRM, but the only way to avoid DRM is to buy from GOG.com, and that's it.

If you buy consoles, or use Steam then you're supporting DRM.

what's wrong is that you're paying to buy something when you're actually just renting it. All those PS3 games with always online DRM like Final Fight Double Impact will be unplayable once Sony shut-down the servers of the console. DRM is not and never will be good for the consumer.

And how am I supporting DRM if I buy consoles? lol

How are you supporting DRM?

Well, try this out. Try burning a copy of your favorite console game, and playing it.

If it doesn't work, well, that's because of DRM.

#33 Edited by Maroxad (8270 posts) -

@lamprey263 said:

Okay, since his piece is basically on how hype in gaming is ruining peoples expectations and the players involved and who does their part... there's basically one aspect I strongly felt is left out, and that's the retail end of hype and it's contribution of ruining gaming.

Let's take a trip back to the end of PS2 and Xbox days. Game retailers like GameStop, EB Games, Best Buy, and such, when it came to the games they carried, they often carried just about EVERYTHING that was available on the systems, mostly. With the age of the Xbox 360 and PS3 and Wii things took a turn for the worst. In part it was the explosion of the used game industry, but the hype had a part in their pattern. That came with pre-orders.

Well, what do pre-orders do? It used to be pre-orders were a way to guarantee yourself a game on release. It's not that anymore. Though there are incentives for pre-ordering, special DLC content, swag, whatever, but pre-ordering isn't about getting a copy on release day anymore. It's about the game retailers gauging which games will be the biggest sellers and ordering supply of their titles based on pre-order numbers. What this means is games that don't get hype early on will not be highly available in the long run, and likely once they're gone then they're gone for good from the retail shelf. The retailer has no reason to order more, and thus rare games can only be found used much the time.

Now, this is a lot different than the gaming I knew years earlier. It didn't matter if games released years prior in the gen, if it was the current gen and they carried games for that system then they most likely carried a robust and near complete selection of games. Go to any Best Buy for instance 10 years ago and about every game made for a system will be on the shelf. There'll be plenty of GREATEST HITS for $20, many games sometimes going for less, brand new, without those yukky used game stickers, not missing their game inserts (manuals, registration codes), not missing their original case or cover art, not looking like the game cases were jacked off onto and encrusted in semen. It didn't matter that the hype a game got or its pre-orders, if they were a gaming retailer then they carried it.

Now, what hype does is dictate the games retailers carry. It does not allow for underdog titles to slowly gain a vocal cult following and other gamers to spread word of mouth, allowing them to go to their game store and acquire those games down the line. It only guarantees success to publishers and developers whose games can dominate at launch and anything less is a ticket to a defunct studio and a failed IP. Hence why even good game studios disappear. So, it's not entirely used games at fault, I'd say the hype train is just as culpable in the way that game retailer has evolved over the years to give consumers less options in their exposure to the diversity of games.

This is a good point you are making.

Most games these days are too heavily leaning towards pre-orders and the first 2 week sales. And the best way to do so is make a game that will sell fast, not sell well in the long run. Games that live and die by their hype and marketing, and will be forgotten after the month they are released. These games drop to 10 dollars shortly after their time in the spotlight is gone. And this didnt always be the case from what I remember. I see PlayStation 2 games cost more than PS4 games do after a few months. And sadly this is the state of the industry, games that are designed to sell fast due to marketing and hype, not games that sell in the long run through superior quality. Perhaps this is why I find so few memorable games of the last gen, that I honestly would recommend someone to go check out, especially on the PS3 and 360.

People accuse Nintendo of not lowering the prices of their games, but the truth of the matter is, their prices do lower. But unlike many of their AAA competitors, Nintendo's games tend to sell really well in the long run. Supply and demand rules, and as long as there is as steady demand, there is no need to lower the price. As an example of a Nintendo game dropping in price fast, look at how cheap Metroid Other M is now, I dunno how it is in the states, but here in Sweden, you can get that for less than 100kr, Metroid Prime 3 goes for more than double that price. And for a more extreme example of prices of games actually increasing after launch, a good example would be the fire emblem series that isnt awakening, nowadays those games cost well over 1000kr (a new PC game going by the cheapest retailers tend to cost roughly 400kr).

Thankfully these word of mouth dependent games can still do well, The Witcher 1 was a game that had no marketing here, but it was still popular because people spread the good word, Divinity: Original Sin was the best selling game on steam for nearly a month, and games like DayZ and Minecraft got huge from it. I accidently introduced my (then 10 year old) brother to minecraft, the next day all his friends were playing it, and after a month or so, it had spread to his entire school (and a lot of their families too). There is still a place for these word of mouth games, despite of this pre-order buy because of hype culture we are currently in.

#34 Posted by parkurtommo (27087 posts) -

@Maroxad said:

Thankfully these word of mouth dependent games can still do well, The Witcher 1 was a game that had no marketing here, but it was still popular because people spread the good word, Divinity: Original Sin was the best selling game on steam for nearly a month, and games like DayZ and Minecraft got huge from it. I accidently introduced my (then 10 year old) brother to minecraft, the next day all his friends were playing it, and after a month or so, it had spread to his entire school (and a lot of their families too). There is still a place for these word of mouth games, despite of this pre-order buy because of hype culture we are currently in.

Another reason why PC>PS4/XBone. I'll keep saying it until it happens; they're both running towards a cliff, eventually both brands will mean absolutely nothing.