UK Judge rules that Nintendo infringed on 2 Philips patents

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#1 Edited by Speak_Low (746 posts) -

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/nintendo-loses-uk-motion-control-patent-ruling-to-electronics-giant-philips/1100-6420634/

A United Kingdom court today ruled in favor of electronics giant Philips in its ongoing case against Nintendo, stating that the company infringed on two Philips patents related to motion controls. Nintendo did not violate a third patent related to "modeling a body in a virtual environment," UK High Court Judge Colin Birss said in court today, as reported by Bloomberg.

It's not immediately clear what penalty Nintendo faces as a result, but Birss said he would provide an update on the damages to be paid to Philips sometime in July. Whatever the case, a Nintendo representative said the company plans to appeal the decision.

"Nintendo has a long history of developing innovative products while respecting the intellectual property rights of others," the company said. "Nintendo is committed to ensuring that this judgment does not affect continued sales of its highly acclaimed line of video game hardware, software, and accessories and will actively pursue all such legitimate steps as are necessary to avoid any interruptions to its business."

Philips is also suing Nintendo in the United States, claiming that Nintendo copied two of its technology patents. The first is related to real-life actions inside a game and the second revolves around an input system featuring a pointing device. In this case, Philips is asking for a block on all sales of the Wii U, as well as damages.

This is the second major patent lawsuit Nintendo has lost in as many years. Last year, a jury ruled that Nintendo's 3DS violated patents held by former Sony inventor Seijiro Tomita. He was initially awarded $30.2 million in damages, but this figure was later halved.

LOL at everyone calling Philips "patent trolls" or not having anything to stand on. Judge says Philips is right on this one.

And everyone laughed at this picture from Philips. Who's laughing now?

Remember it's not about the graphics, but the gravity of the lawsuit. Philips wins

#2 Posted by AmazonAngry (675 posts) -

This is the end of Nintendo

#3 Edited by ConanTheStoner (4463 posts) -

Nintendoomed for sure this time. No chance of recovery.

Philips will rise from the ashes and take their rightful place in this industry. Philips BDI incoming, just wait.

#4 Posted by PsychoLemons (1919 posts) -

A case of lawful stupid.

#5 Posted by Capitan_Kid (6509 posts) -

Looks like Ninty does more stealing than innovating

#6 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (8611 posts) -

I'm still shocked that Nintendo lossed ! Phillips has never once given me the impression that they were after those hot sweaty Nintendo Features.

#7 Edited by Speak_Low (746 posts) -

Am I the only one surprised that this specific part hasn't been mentioned more prominently in articles? If Nintendo fails to appeal, Philips could have sales of the Wii U consoles BLOCKED:

Philips is also suing Nintendo in the United States, claiming that Nintendo copied two of its technology patents. The first is related to real-life actions inside a game and the second revolves around an input system featuring a pointing device. In this case, Philips is asking for a block on all sales of the Wii U, as well as damages.

Looks like Philips did have a legal leg to stand on. This is for all those who laughed at Philips like they were an annoying gnat "chasing a case" and annoying Nintendo. Just because you don't hear a company's name often doesn't mean Philip's legal case doesn't deserve examination under the proper light of justice.

It's not the size of the company that counts, but the size of the patent. Some of you are so shallow.

#8 Posted by Bigboi500 (28804 posts) -

This isn't System Wars material. Lock please.

#9 Posted by ConanTheStoner (4463 posts) -

Am I the only one surprised this part hasn't been mentioned more prominently in articles. If Nintendo fails to appeal, they could have sales of the Wii U consoles BLOCKED:

You're probably the only one surprised because we've seen this stuff over and over and over and over and over again with Sony, MS and Nintendo.

This isn't even close to the first time we've seen that a platforms sales could potentially be blocked over a patent. And it always blows over every single time. Maybe this time will be different? Who knows.

But these patent wars are a constant in this industry. Companies settle and move on and that's about all there is to it.

#10 Edited by super600 (29963 posts) -

From what I read this patent is so vague that it can also apply to sony's ps move controller and microsoft kinect. Nintendo will deal with this case in another court and try to get another ruling on this case or get this ruling reversed. And philips does not know how the wiiu or wii work according to that patent.

#11 Edited by Speak_Low (746 posts) -

@Bigboi500 said:

This isn't System Wars material. Lock please.

Nintendo Wii U consoles could have their sales BLOCKED. Hello? How is this not worthy of mention? One part of the current Three-Console War could be wiped out (this is probably unlikely, but then, they all laughed at Philips before and now they aren't).

This is huge video gaming news that could affect sales of the Wii U. Don't people post NPD sales and Amazon charts all the time here?

It may not be pleasant news for some, but then you should probably log on to Safety Wars or Softy Wars instead of this site. This is video game news, brought to you by Philips.

#12 Edited by Kaze_no_Mirai (10893 posts) -

Will appeal. Nintendo will win.

#13 Edited by super600 (29963 posts) -

@speak_low said:

@Bigboi500 said:

This isn't System Wars material. Lock please.

Nintendo Wii U consoles could have their sales BLOCKED. Hello? How is this not worthy of mention? One part of the current Three-Console War could be wiped out (this is probably unlikely, but then, they all laughed at Philips before and now they aren't).

This is huge video gaming news that could effect sales of the Wii U. Don't people post NPD sales and Amazon charts all the time here?

It may not be pleasant news for some, but then you should probably log on to Safety Wars or Softy Wars instead of this site. This is video game news, brought to you by Philips.

The likelihood chance of the WiiU sales being blocked is near 0% like that other case which attempted to block the sale of the xbox 360 which failed to block the selling of that console in any of the markets it is in.This patent mostly applies to the Wii anyway.

#14 Posted by sandbox3d (5105 posts) -

So it's LG vs. Sony all over again except that Philips has even less of a leg to stand on.

Who cares?

#15 Posted by farrell2k (5186 posts) -

Gamers win! Now we'll see the long awaited Philips CDI-2!!!

#16 Edited by ConanTheStoner (4463 posts) -

lol

OP losing his shit over run of the mill patent wars.

Still, it's better than the article wars and twitter wars topics, I'll give him that.

#17 Posted by superbuuman (2527 posts) -

@Bigboi500 said:

This isn't System Wars material. Lock please.

Nintendo Wii U consoles could have their sales BLOCKED. Hello? How is this not worthy of mention? One part of the current Three-Console War could be wiped out (this is probably unlikely, but then, they all laughed at Philips before and now they aren't).

This is huge video gaming news that could effect sales of the Wii U. Don't people post NPD sales and Amazon charts all the time here?

It may not be pleasant news for some, but then you should probably log on to Safety Wars or Softy Wars instead of this site. This is video game news, brought to you by Philips.

lol..you're probably the only one who actually believe 100% that it will get block...even though you should know well enough, it *very* rarely happens..if not at all. I'd take you more seriously if you're not such an anti Nintendo nut. :P

#18 Edited by Speak_Low (746 posts) -

Even if we see these patent lawsuits all the time (actually, I think that's a little exaggerated - it's not that frequent if we look through the years), I think this recent ruling should show that we can't always accurately judge the validity of any patent lawsuit since many dismissed this Philips one as a joke.

Yes, maybe Nintendo will successfully appeal and all of this is swept away and forgotten. But the other scenario could happen. Things could go back to normal for Nintendo, or we could start seeing a frightening escalation of legal and punitive measures forced upon them and their Wii U console. We can't completely rule out the latter now.

This is what happens when you laugh at drawings.

And if patent stuff happened to Sony and MS of course people would post news about it here. If it could potentially affect sales of a console, or affect their finances then it's fair game. Sony and MS's financial difficulties have been posted here all the time (with Sony's fiscal troubles posted all over here not more than a couple months ago).

#19 Posted by ActicEdge (24327 posts) -

They'll appeal it. Nothing more to this news than that.

#20 Posted by Blabadon (25218 posts) -

Fucking Phillip, getting me banned and now this shit?

#21 Posted by Shinobishyguy (22316 posts) -
#22 Edited by bbkkristian (14759 posts) -

TC really wants Nintendo to die.

What a douche.

#23 Posted by ActicEdge (24327 posts) -

@ActicEdge: shhh don't crush speak_low's dreams

He's not wrong. Still, it'll get appealed and we'll see what happens from there. Until the court matter is finally settled I don't see a point in getting into it, every company sues every company about everything these days. Apple fucking patented the swiping motion on a touch screen. It's not news until the thing is settled.

#24 Posted by drummerdave9099 (603 posts) -

Can't wait to play Hyrule Warriors, Bayonetta 2, and Smash this year on my WiiU, and X and Zelda U on it next year.

#25 Posted by Life-is-a-Game (546 posts) -

Such a Nintendo hater, Speak_Low is :s

#26 Edited by Speak_Low (746 posts) -

@bbkkristian said:

TC really wants Nintendo to die.

What a douche.

Actually I want presumptuous arrogance to die. In the old Philips lawsuit thread posted here on SW, everyone was laughing at Philips for being a patent troll, calling them irrelevant and their products garbage; and they were overall satisfied with their swift "professional" assessment of the entire case.

So basically, Philips had no rightful voice because they are smaller, seldom-mentioned, don't make products related to fun (they are not liked our beloved Nintendo), and have illustrators with a very dubious handling of anatomy and perspective. Guilty all over.

Thank goodness a judge doesn't approach a new case the way video game message board users do here on a forum. They have to transcend bias, personal history with a company, and other extraneous features of a lawsuit and focus rigorously on facts and evidence. The coolness of judicial reason has prevailed (and already proven some wrong).

You see, in Law, judges are only interested in nurturing Truth and seeing it blossom in the end. Fanboys nurture feelings of favoritism, first and foremost, and arrive at finality that way. Ew. Like, yuck. That is why fanboys are wrong a lot and why the "b-b-bu-but" has become a thing here.

If we're going to laugh at lousy pictures, lets talk about the lousy Nintendo picture I've seen people dream up one year ago about where Nintendo would be today (described far better than where they actually are now), or how the first round of this Philips case was never going to go anywhere. I'm seeing way too many contradictory pictures which is making me question the skill of the one wielding the instrument.

#27 Posted by AK_the_Twilight (285 posts) -

Didn't a judge just recently shoot down another patent troll case from Philips against Nintendo?

#28 Edited by nintendoboy16 (25826 posts) -

@bbkkristian said:

TC really wants Nintendo to die.

What a douche.

Actually I want presumptuous arrogance to die.

Of course you do. :roll:

Dude, I've seen you post about Nintendo and I've argued with you before. You're not fooling anyone. That's the only reason you brought up these suits (and this loss, but who knows if it'll last that long as Ninty has pulled out of these before) because you want to see Nintendo DEAD!

#29 Posted by GunSmith1_basic (9721 posts) -

I doubt anything comes of these suits. Just because one judge bought into their argument doesn't mean that it is the end. The appeal will come. I don't like when companies steal but these patents seem incredibly vague to me. The one curious idea I see there is the "code" about vitual representation. If Nintendo lifted the exact game code that Phillips developed then that would be bad, but somehow I bet that is vague as well.

#30 Posted by Bigboi500 (28804 posts) -

@Bigboi500 said:

This isn't System Wars material. Lock please.

Nintendo Wii U consoles could have their sales BLOCKED. Hello? How is this not worthy of mention? One part of the current Three-Console War could be wiped out (this is probably unlikely, but then, they all laughed at Philips before and now they aren't).

This is huge video gaming news that could affect sales of the Wii U. Don't people post NPD sales and Amazon charts all the time here?

It may not be pleasant news for some, but then you should probably log on to Safety Wars or Softy Wars instead of this site. This is video game news, brought to you by Philips.

If anything, this belongs on the Nintendo board. It really has nothing to do with System Wars.

#31 Posted by charizard1605 (54469 posts) -

Technology companies fighting each other over patents and IP rights. More at eleven.

#32 Posted by lglz1337 (3022 posts) -

this is fucked leave nintendo alone you fucking philips!

#33 Posted by Suppaman100 (3596 posts) -

Sheep: "Bu..bu..bu.. Ninty doesn't steallll!!!"

Lol, they're all the same in that regard.

#34 Edited by MirkoS77 (6866 posts) -

Wii U sales blocked? Yea.......no. Nintendo would do everything in its power before letting that happen, that's simply Phillips blowing hot air and pounding its chest. I'm sure Phillips and Nintendo would come to a nice settlement before that possibility would even be entertained by either side.

#35 Edited by lamprey263 (22444 posts) -

The judge is an idiot, you can clearly look at the patents Philips says Nintendo infringed to see that what Nintendo designed uses none of Philips patented technology. Philips was patent trolling. Problem with patent law is if you lose in one court you can travel the globe in hopes a technologically illiterate court rules in your favor. I hope Nintendo's appeal falls on sane ears.

First off, the HCI interface in Philips patent takes photos of the display to process where the cursor is, Nintendo's controller doesn't capture the display images for processing, rather the controller emits IR signals that the consoles stereoscopic sensor peripheral captures; totally different.

Secondly, that's also the entirety of their motion control patent, that the system involves the use of cameras that capture the motion of the body and does image processing of the user to to determine motion from a stored bank of movements and gestures. The Nintendo patent doesn't do that, there's some basic gyro sensors in the controller, and activity checks stored movements in its banks.

Even if one were to say that the purpose of the technology is the same in the end, that's not enough for a patent claim. The heart of a patent is how that aim is achieved. That's why often companies reverse engineer technology. Sure they do the same thing, how they do it though is a different thing entirely. After all, if this wasn't the case, Xerox could probably sue Philips for violating their HCI patents from the mouse.

Anyhow, only one way to add more validity to my point with you people... boobs:

#36 Posted by tormentos (16510 posts) -

Sony got its revenge when the PS1 and PS2 destroyed Nintendos N64 and GC and now Philips gets its revenge by patent won,Look like in the end all those who Nintendo screw up when they wanted to make their CD console got their revenge..

#37 Edited by Micropixel (816 posts) -

Well first...

1) There's no ruling for compensation yet. And I don't believe it's going to be as bad as some are thinking (look at the 3DS lawsuit and what they were orignally asking for, versus what they actually got).

2) The decision is being appealed. I believe the appeal is definitely going to stick.

3) They are NOT going to block Wii U sales regardless of the court decision in the US. It's not happening. Even if there's infringement, Phillips has to have an existing device (MEANING a recent protype ready, or with the intent, to come to market and compete) in order to block anything. They'll get financial compensation out of Nintendo if there is infringement, but a block? Very doubtful.

So put your hard-on away, speaklow. ;)

#38 Posted by YearoftheSnake5 (6867 posts) -

@super600 said:

From what I read this patent is so vague that it can also apply to sony's ps move controller and microsoft kinect. Nintendo will deal with this case in another court and try to get another ruling on this case or get this ruling reversed. And philips does not know how the wiiu or wii work according to that patent.

Agreed. It's incredibly vague. Classic patent trolling.

#40 Posted by Desmonic (12694 posts) -
#41 Posted by KungfuKitten (20670 posts) -

Wiki:

What relation with Sisvel?
Sisvel (which enforces mp3 patents) has been described as "Philips’ licensing arm".[5] A July 2008 ruling of a Dutch court mentioned that:
Philips and others granted a licence under the patents to Audio MPEG Inc. with the authority to grant a (sub-) licence to Sisvel, which authority has been used. Philips and others also granted an irrevocable power of attorney to Sisvel to act for and on their behalf in court on account of the patents[6]
Sisvel's website's About us page says they're (now) separate.[7]

Looks like Philips learned a little from their ex-patent troll partners in crime.

#42 Edited by KungfuKitten (20670 posts) -

I bet we can think of 10 other products that use motion sensors that are not paying Philips.
Six Axis for instance.

#43 Posted by Jankarcop (8827 posts) -

Nintendon't

#45 Posted by Micropixel (816 posts) -

I bet we can think of 10 other products that use motion sensors that are not paying Philips.

Six Axis for instance.

That is a very good point.

#46 Edited by foxhound_fox (86938 posts) -

Got to love patent trolling.

#47 Edited by Jag85 (4265 posts) -

Nintendo acquired the Wii's underlying motion control technology from an American company called Gyration in 2001, two years before Philips' patent application in 2003. Philips had nothing to do with the Wii.

#48 Edited by aroxx_ab (9142 posts) -

Consider you can patent like anything in US it is no wonder companies break them all the time

#49 Posted by nini200 (9383 posts) -

Phillips CDi HD coming in 2015!!!

#50 Posted by Kjranu (770 posts) -

They'll appeal it. Nothing more to this news than that.

Erm, appealing a decision doesn't mean the sued will get a ruling automatically changed in their favor . People on death row appeal their ruling all the time and 99.9% of the time they get rejected.