The Real Power of the X1

Who cares about which system has better graphics just get whatever one has the games you like. Im getting a ps4 just for games like wwe 2k14 because their not on pc. If you want graphics build you're own pc, gameplay and software is what counts.

Wii U is better than ps4 and x1

@tormentos said:

@TitanExtremer said:

I Have been an intense gamer for over twenty years, building my own rigs since i was ten. If there is one valuable lesson i have learned from these many years of being obsessive about graphics and hardware specs it is that software matters. Often software even matters more then the hardware itself.

Looking past the fact that there is nothing, absolutely no facts about what GPU the xbox one is using and that rumors and speculations circulate that Playstation 4 has got the better hardware then it, Lets for a moment take a look at the software.

Xbox one uses DirectX 11.2 (Microsoft created Direct X FYI.)

Playstation 4 uses their own opengl version of "Direct X"

Look it up, opengl lost the API wars for a very good reason.

Ask yourself this, if you have a huge gaming rig running on windows 97. How much game are you really going to get?

Same applies with the Playstation, it may or may not have the better hardware but if the software is not there to support it, it wouldn't really matter at all.

These performance claims are the same story for every generation, check out this article: http://reviews.cnet.com/1990-10109_7-6224258-1.html

My coins are on Xbox one.

Not only do you get next gen, you get all the other features to boot.

So Mantle can have 9X draw calls than Direct3D,and openGL actually has similar improvements..

OpenGL is better.

By the way there is a sudden surge in old account that never posted i wonder..mmm

Neither consoles will be using the brand new Mantle tech.

How is OpenGL better, please do enlighten me.

As for the age of my account and my number of posts, i must say i often don´t waste time going into these boards. But i find this topic rather interesting and so here i am debating. #EndofConspiracyTheory.

PS. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vk__hyOM2M

According to nearby staff, Ryse is a native 1080p game and the underlying tech is dubbed the "new CryEngine".

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-hands-on-with-xbox-one

http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Crytek-Downgrades-Ryse-Graphics-Xbox-One-59460.html

Polygon downgrade.

Coming from you this is really silly considering all the bullsh** theories you pull to try to make see like both consoles are on par.

@TitanExtremer

Neither consoles will be using the brand new Mantle tech.

How is OpenGL better, please do enlighten me.

As for the age of my account and my number of posts, i must say i often don´t waste time going into these boards. But i find this topic rather interesting and so here i am debating. #EndofConspiracyTheory.

I am not saying they will did you actually read that tweet from Carmack.? It was done a few days ago,and he talk about how mantle has 9X draw calls as Direct3D,and then stated that OpenGL has similar improvements as mantle..

So yeah OpenGL has what almost 9 times the draw calls of Direct3D.?

That is one of the things AMD complained about PC API like direct3D a fear years ago.

Yeah from what i read several account were allowed back in...no mystery.

@Tighaman: for starters dont say things u have no clue about

next show me where cerny himself says to use the 14+4 configuration...

third the xbone only has 12 cu's not 16...12....

They live on a parallel universe where sony use 14 CU for graphics and the other 4CU serve for nothing at all.

1. It was an Nvidia extention to opengl, not Radeon.

2.I was never not allowed in :-)

1-OpenGL is OpenGL... Nice try.

2-Maybe your other you now isn't allowed in now..hahaha

@FoxbatAlpha said:

Have some candy.

and the game is only using 27% of the Xbox One's current pool of cloud resources. imagine what the future hold for gaming.

@KarateeeChop:

I have a open mind for the X1. This level is just the beginning with Ryse. I don't think 3rd party devs have used Tiled Resources yet so they are only going to get better as well.

@tormentos stop spewing out every damn link and twisted thought you can pull out of your A$$. This is the future, Sony doesn't have it. I don't care what link from some dead site you show that claims other but TR is not on the PS4. Doesn't need a more powerful machine to have better graphics. This is light years ahead of the PS4 and your thinking.

I already miss mid gen, where consolites moan about "elitists" instead of being experts.

I'm going to call it right now:

Mantle won't be all that secret sauce either. Don't expect AMD to suddenly rule the industry.

@tormentos said:

@FoxbatAlpha said:

@KarateeeChop:

I have a open mind for the X1. This level is just the beginning with Ryse. I don't think 3rd party devs have used Tiled Resources yet so they are only going to get better as well.

@tormentos stop spewing out every damn link and twisted thought you can pull out of your A$$. This is the future, Sony doesn't have it. I don't care what link from some dead site you show that claims other but TR is not on the PS4. Doesn't need a more powerful machine to have better graphics. This is light years ahead of the PS4 and your thinking.

Cool brah. Props for the Grease 2 pic or whatever it is.

Come on why is it so hard for you to understand that MS screwed up.?

They had a vision of you with Kinect always on,with no used games,cable box and 24 hour check ups for DRM,sadly the industry did not want that.

Since the spec hasn't change at least no hardware wise,what you will get is a weak console that is over priced big deal is not the end of the world,you still have Halo at least.

Wow MisterX dropping dem truthfacts

Actually the are people silly enough that believe Mister X even that he was mad when MS confirmed the final specs,the dude still trying to find out the dual GPU..hahaha

You mean to tell me MisterX is wrong? Dude, say it ain't so :(

By that logic Ryse had better graphics on E3 than the last build? Correct?

You don't honestly believe Nvidia will give any of their opengl extensions to Amd, their number one competition on the market do you? I think not.

Besides Amd has already made Mantle why would they try to buy Nvidia tech, to improve ps4 graphics? Just makes no sense to me.

On a side note in a year when the oculus rift vr set is coming out its going to be a whole other dimention playing with kinect.

Ps. Sorry for the delayed post time, since I am a forum noob am apparently not able to post more then five times a day. - Lame. :)

hahaha...

You do know sony has physx support on PS4 right.? Which is from Nvidia.

But why would sony need Nvidia Opengl extensions.?

You apparently don't get it OpenGL is open source,and even so the PS4 has its own API to code to metal and they work even better than OpenGL,since they are design specific for the PS4.

@tormentos: it's not hard. Sony screwed up even bigger. I don't think you want to admit anything that relates to this.

Like Penello said"let the graphics speak for themselves". So far Ryse is proving this.

The amount of fog in KZ and Second Son is a major Red Flag of the PS4 weakness.

LOL no. KZSF utterly demolishes that sub-1080p mess.

@I_can_haz: nope. 1080p doesn't mean that the graphics are better. You could run Wonderbook at 1080p and it would still look like garbage.

Don't let the fanboy in you blind you from facts.

Pretty ironic coming from a shill Astroturfer like you.

@I_can_haz: sometimes we have moments of clarity.

Yeah last gen they did this one,no they have not..

The made a more powerful console that the xbox one while keeping it $100 cheaper and for that they are getting more pre-orders than the xbox one is even on US.,.

Ryse is and enclosed game that impress only silly lemming like you, the same who flamed Uncharted this gen for not been open world,now hype a game which is way more enclosed than Uncharted ever was..hahaha

And still Killzone SF look better while been 1080p and having 60FPS in multiplayer,something Ryse can't achieve.

Killzone SF has moving fog,so it may even dissipate,can you say that about Ryse fog.?

Now this is Ryse of Fog...hahahaha Look at how only the main character is good looking the rest un impressive crap.

Nice Fog.

Yeah the problem is that it look better,has better animation and particle effect and is 1080p while been incredibly more open.

Ryse is just a sad trick by Crytek to try to full people into thinking the xbox one is as powerful as the PS4,extremely enclosed,corridor like gameplay this game is build like fighting game only the main character looks good.

Just some news for you. KZ isn't open world either. The path opens up in sections but is far from open world.

As with Ryse, the path opens up too in sections. Both are linear and both look good but one looks better.................Ryse.

@tormentos said:

@FoxbatAlpha said:

@tormentos: it's not hard. Sony screwed up even bigger. I don't think you want to admit anything that relates to this.

Like Penello said"let the graphics speak for themselves". So far Ryse is proving this.

The amount of fog in KZ and Second Son is a major Red Flag of the PS4 weakness.

Yeah last gen they did this one,no they have not..

The made a more powerful console that the xbox one while keeping it $100 cheaper and for that they are getting more pre-orders than the xbox one is even on US.,.

Ryse is and enclosed game that impress only silly lemming like you, the same who flamed Uncharted this gen for not been open world,now hype a game which is way more enclosed than Uncharted ever was..hahaha

And still Killzone SF look better while been 1080p and having 60FPS in multiplayer,something Ryse can't achieve.

Killzone SF has moving fog,so it may even dissipate,can you say that about Ryse fog.?

Now this is Ryse of Fog...hahahaha Look at how only the main character is good looking the rest un impressive crap.

Nice Fog.

NIce pre alpha build shot you have there. That draw distance is bigger than anything in KZ. Don't use the KZ shot from the reveal, over the city too. If PS cant run anything on retail hardware now then don't pull footage of things being run on a PC in Feb. Nice try though.

The fog is almost in your face in this shot. Ryse is way up on a cliff and is a old build.

@SinjinSmythe: Let the cows believe what they want, it obvious what's going on. Let them live in their world of a 60 percent more powerful console. Get some of that power and fix that stylized rain in KZ. Yikes

Is way more open that Ryse quite easy to see from the videos,Ryse is basically corridor shooter like,but without been inside a building,extremely narrow pathways show this game is all main character and the rest is meh.

All games are linear,you most fallow a line on all,no matter how many options you have to accomplish your missing,if you don't fallow the line you don't advance.

Ryse is not even close play blind if you want the videos on the net show it.

@FoxbatAlpha: A lot of PS4 games look like that, I wonder why? Oh that's right , it's "stylized".

#awaitingreatness

In typical Tormentos fashion you twist everything to support yourself. "All games are linear" GTFO. I know what you are trying to say but the "game type" being linear or open world is what was said.

@FoxbatAlpha said:

The fog is almost in your face in this shot. Ryse is way up on a cliff and is a old build.

Actually the fog is close to the wall apparently you have problems with your vision.

Look how much more alive that screen is than Ryse..hahahaa 1080p 60 FPS,..

@FoxbatAlpha: The cows bash DR3, however the poly's being pushed with no cookie cutter building or zombies is really outstanding, I would dare say that Infamous SS would look better on the X1. Hmmm

No there is no twist Ryse is as enclosed and restrictive as it can be,reason why what you mostly see posted are bullshots from cut scenes..hahaha...

Linearity has nothing to do with openness dude,again all games are a line,regardless of how open they are,what you people call linear all the time, like uncharted is taken to the extreme in Ryse,on uncharted you have more open areas and you can even clime,on Ryse you are set on a narrow path always,all the videos showing gameplay show narrow pathways all of them.

Hahahaa....Sure it will on 520p...hahahaha

@tormentos: You don't know what going on do you? Have fun.

MS has won the gen it seems.

I am having fun...hahahahaa

@tormentos: I'm happy for you.

Complete irony. How can you bash KZ for using techniques to hide"flaws" then hype Ryse that is running at 900p/30fps in enclosed small environments with few characters on screen at once? You need your eyes checked, you've been wearing those Xbox fanboy goggles for too long lol.

The you phrased it incorrectly. If you were going to be 40% more than 60mph you'd be at 84mph (x= 60mph + .4(60mph)). It's all about which figure you're getting the 40% from; the larger or smaller.

@stereointegrity: Folks you get your facts straight just because you cant think it doesnt mean isnt true and i know what the hell i hear and read and you can go back and read the back threads yourself its a thread right now on DF and they have the link by CERNEY HIMSELF AFTER THE RUMOR AND HE SAID its not a rumor more of a suggestion to BALANCE the system he SUGGESTED TO DEV to uses 14 for graphical and 4 for compute and sound thats what he said not my words dont be mad at me. AND YALL MF STUPID IF YOU DONT THINK MS HAD A HAND IN MANTLE! Its the same low level API thats in the X1 Thats called PARTNERSHIP now the real question what did ms get in return? I swear you all just read the negative of the X1 and see 1.3 tfs gpu but dont understand that they havent even used 20% of that 1.3tfs gpu and dont even have to use it at all

@tormentos: I will admit i dident see it coming, Nvidia lending physx tools to develop on Amd hardware, but it does seem you are right. However i am still having a hard time believeing that any Nvidida creations will go uncritically to AMD. Created on open source or not.

Does anyone have a detailed plan of torementos sleeping patterns so I can enjoy system wars without his meltdowns.

Not quite.

If you combined PS3's 72 bit XDR and 128 bit GDDR3 you get a PCB with 200 bit wide memory bus. What Sony has done with PS4 is to design a modern Xbox 360 like box with PS3's PCB profile.

@tormentos

In other word like always you reply with something completely irrelevant i already showed that the xbox one doesn't have a 7850 prototype and you don't have a single proof but your opinion,i have a quote from MS and several sited including DF the GPU is a 7790 with 2 CU off and lower clock speed with a 10% GPU reservation.

Regardless of memory the xbox one has less usable power than the 7770..

And once again like i told you 660GFlop is more than half of the xbox one total power,so yeah excuse me if i don't believe your out of this world theories..hahaha

The irrelevancy is your post. Your have NOT addressed the computation performance in relation to CU count and memory bandwidth. There's no limits to your ignorance.

Your simpleton mind is limited to some marketing codenames or model numbers.

X1 doesn't have 7790's 96 GB/s memory bandwidth i.e. X1's memory bandwidth has a theoretical 68 GB/s (four 64bit controllers) and 204 GB/s ESRAM (four 256bit controllers with full duplex).

You have NOT addressed my points on why 7790 has issues with faster memory.

I have shown you 7790 > 7850 on pure CU bound workloads, hence it has the same potential as any other GCN but within the limits of it's CU count.

The prototype 7850 has 12 WORKING CUs and theoretical 153.6 GB/s memory bandwidth. Disabled CUs plays no part with computation performance.

X1's GCN is not gimped by 7770's 1 billion triangles per second and 72 GB/s memory bandwidth bottlenecks.

@tormentos

1-OpenGL is OpenGL... Nice try

It depends on what level of kit-bashing OpenGL with vendor specific extensions.

From http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2008/10/22/nvidia-gpus-support-dx10-1-features-in-far-cry-2/1

NVIDIA has bastardized "DX10" standard with their own DX10.X. This is nothing new from NVIDIA.

It's about time AMD plays the same API kit-bashing games as NVIDIA or Intel (e.g. Instant Acces/Pixel Sync). Standards can goto hell when Intel or NVIDIA undermines the standards.

@tormentos said:

@TitanExtremer said:

I Have been an intense gamer for over twenty years, building my own rigs since i was ten. If there is one valuable lesson i have learned from these many years of being obsessive about graphics and hardware specs it is that software matters. Often software even matters more then the hardware itself.

Looking past the fact that there is nothing, absolutely no facts about what GPU the xbox one is using and that rumors and speculations circulate that Playstation 4 has got the better hardware then it, Lets for a moment take a look at the software.

Xbox one uses DirectX 11.2 (Microsoft created Direct X FYI.)

Playstation 4 uses their own opengl version of "Direct X"

Look it up, opengl lost the API wars for a very good reason.

Ask yourself this, if you have a huge gaming rig running on windows 97. How much game are you really going to get?

Same applies with the Playstation, it may or may not have the better hardware but if the software is not there to support it, it wouldn't really matter at all.

These performance claims are the same story for every generation, check out this article: http://reviews.cnet.com/1990-10109_7-6224258-1.html

My coins are on Xbox one.

Not only do you get next gen, you get all the other features to boot.

So Mantle can have 9X draw calls than Direct3D,and openGL actually has similar improvements..

OpenGL is better.

By the way there is a sudden surge in old account that never posted i wonder..mmm

NVIDIA Kepler hardware doesn't support 64 UAV with all shader types that is required for DirectX 11.1 Level 11.1 and having OpenGL doesn't fix this issue.

OpenGL with NVIDIA's new vendor specific extensions doesn't help PS4.

AMD plans to have it's own OpenGL with vendor specific GCN/Mantle extensions.

AMD Mantle is just a "console like APIs" (with MS HLSL support) for the GCN equipped PC that leverages console's GCN optimisations.

From http://vr-zone.com/articles/john-carmack-mantle-became-interesting-dual-console-wins/61108.html

Of course the only one on stage with in-depth knowledge of Mantle was DICE’s Andersson, as Battlefield 4 is set to be a Mantle launch title. But while Andersson has substantial insight into Mantle, and could likely provide a few rebuttals to what the other panelists said on stage, his lips are sealed until AMD’s APU Developer Summit in San Jose.

“We’ll have a lot more info come mid-November,” he said.

AMD/EA DICE haven't shown anything specifics with Mantle API e.g. AMD could copy PS4's APIs or X1's APIs and call it a day.

I will admit i dident see it coming, Nvidia lending physx tools to develop on Amd hardware, but it does seem you are right. However if we presume the same is correct for Nvidias non-opensource extensions to opengl, why would it only serve to boost the PS4 and not both consoles?

Atm, NVIDIA PhysX runs on X86 hardware. Please provide information that shows PhysX running on AMD GCN.