RUMOR! Xbox 720 CPU Is "RIDICULOUSLY POWERFUL" 16 Cores!

oh these people on sw need 720 and ps4 to be powerful , because they are scared that if their not the wii u will just run all over them which i believe it will anyway because lets face the reality , , in times of hardship with little jobs , people aint gonna wanna spend 400-500 dollars on a console when they can get a cheaper one that has enough power and a cool new controller to boot and must have exclusives which caugh at the end of the day is what matters to me

mariokart64fan

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"] I like how you know 720's hardware. Please gtfo, you are extremyly annoying with your amd spamfr3ddiemercury

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2405922,00.asp

Notice "64 ALU" on the main GPU. It doesn't indicate the CU scaling.

Radeon HD 66x0 doesn't support the latest DX11.1 Level 11.1 hardware. Radeon HD 66x0 uses the same GPU design as in Radeon HD 7570M (closest to Wii U's GPU with 64bit VRAM)

Even if it is a crappy rumor, more cores does not mean more power, it just means more cores. Considering the majority of the work is done on the GPU, 16 cores on the CPU would be just waste, especially if they are going to keep a PowerPC processor as their main CPU.

Logically a 4-8 core CPU would make more sense (4 cores for gaming, 4 for Kinect 2). Pair that with a modern GPU and like 2-4 gigs of RAM and the console could produce some very nice looking games.

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"][QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2405922,00.asp

Notice "64 ALU" on the main GPU. It doesn't indicate the CU scaling.

Radeon HD 66x0 doesn't support the latest DX11.1 Level 11.1 hardware. Radeon HD 66x0 uses the same GPU design as in Radeon HD 7570M (closest to Wii U's GPU with 64bit VRAM)

ronvalencia

WTF?! Proved my point againfr3ddiemercury

Are you blind that you didn't see AMD Radeon 6600?

My post reduces candiate GPUs.

Even if it is a crappy rumor, more cores does not mean more power, it just means more cores. Considering the majority of the work is done on the GPU, 16 cores on the CPU would be just waste, especially if they are going to keep a PowerPC processor as their main CPU.

Logically a 4-8 core CPU would make more sense (4 cores for gaming, 4 for Kinect 2). Pair that with a modern GPU and like 2-4 gigs of RAM and the console could produce some very nice looking games.

Wasdie

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"][QUOTE="ronvalencia"] LOL, to make it simple 80 ALU per CU = AMD Radeon HD 6600 i.e. 6 CU x 80 ALU = 480 stream processors. 64 ALU per CU = AMD GCNclyde46

From recent guidance statement by Rory Read (AMD CEO )

"Our semi-custom APUs already have a number of confidential high-volume design wins in place".

The statement "design wins" indicates more than one. We know Wii U doesn't use AMD's APUs (CPU+GPU combo). So, it's MS and Sony.

fr3ddiemercury is not mature enough for similar topic discussion like in http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2277807

[QUOTE="clyde46"][QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"] WTF?! Proved my point againfr3ddiemercury

He is a real person and he acts with integrity.

I've seen him say great things about Intel products, and supported the Nvidia 8800GT for being a good value card - he's just going by science.

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

fr3ddiemercury

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

PS3FanMan4Life

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

PS3FanMan4Life

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"][QUOTE="clyde46"] You do know that AMD is working with MS on the new Xbox right?psymon100

He is a real person and he acts with integrity.

I've seen him say great things about Intel products, and supported the Nvidia 8800GT for being a good value card - he's just going by science.

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

PS3FanMan4Life

CELL's SPU is an in-order dual instruction issue per cycle design with kitbashed PowerPC instruction set. It's no better than PowerPC G1 design with 128bit SIMD unit and 3.2Ghz clock speed..

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

PS3FanMan4Life

[QUOTE="psymon100"]

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"] Yes. I am talking about the amd bot spamming every thread.fr3ddiemercury

He is a real person and he acts with integrity.

I've seen him say great things about Intel products, and supported the Nvidia 8800GT for being a good value card - he's just going by science.

The problem is you since you missed "Radeon 6600". My post's purpose to reduce GPU candidates.

[QUOTE="psymon100"]

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"] Yes. I am talking about the amd bot spamming every thread.fr3ddiemercury

He is a real person and he acts with integrity.

I've seen him say great things about Intel products, and supported the Nvidia 8800GT for being a good value card - he's just going by science.

[QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"][QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

ronvalencia

[QUOTE="clyde46"][QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"] Yes and for 2006 that was quite impressive! Wait till you see what they bring this year in 2013/Early 2014. It'll blow you away and will compete with the latest computers used for physics predictive models.PS3FanMan4Life

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"][QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"] Yes and for 2006 that was quite impressive! Wait till you see what they bring this year in 2013/Early 2014. It'll blow you away and will compete with the latest computers used for physics predictive models.PS3FanMan4Life

AMD GCN negates the need for SPUs.

You have haven't negated Rory Read's "Our semi-custom APUs already have a number of confidential high-volume design wins in place" statement.

[QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"][QUOTE="ronvalencia"] CELL wasn't impressive from math processor array POV. From recent guidance statement by Rory Read (AMD CEO) "Our semi-custom APUs already have a number of confidential high-volume design wins in place". The statement "design wins" indicates more than one. We know Wii U doesn't use AMD's APUs (CPU+GPU combo). So, it's MS and Sony. Rory Read > some fanboy rumors.ronvalencia

AMD GCN negates the need for SPUs. AMD GCN supports C++ on hardware and X86-64 pointers.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"] PS4 will be using the Cell 2 processor, as well as an AMD powered dedicated GPU with over 1GB ram. The graphics processing power will be shared with the Cell 2 in order to boost dashboard load times, as well as all other non-ingame processes. It's complicated, but unfortunately i'm not allowed to say a whole lot more. PS3FanMan4Life

AMD GCN negates the need for SPUs. AMD GCN supports C++ on hardware and X86-64 pointers.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"] PS4 will be using the Cell 2 processor, as well as an AMD powered dedicated GPU with over 1GB ram. The graphics processing power will be shared with the Cell 2 in order to boost dashboard load times, as well as all other non-ingame processes. It's complicated, but unfortunately i'm not allowed to say a whole lot more. PS3FanMan4Life

AMD GCN negates the need for SPUs. AMD GCN supports C++ on hardware and X86-64 pointers.

"Sheer power of the Cell" gets destroyed by ATI Radeon X1900.

Games that directly use NVIDIA RSX's instruction set (via LibGCM) would be another problem for BC.

Again, you have haven't negated Rory Read's "Our semi-custom APUs already have a number of confidential high-volume design wins in place" statement.

----------------------------

On transistors packing skills

At 28nm process tech, 32 core CELL would have a chip size about 284 mm^2 and it only delivers 4 times over existing CELL.

~230 GFLOPs x 4 = 920 GFLOPS.

Based on CELL's 115 mm^2 @ 45 nm process tech, 28 nm version of CELL would have a chip size of 71 mm^2. Density of ~3.34 million transistors per mm^2.

With 45 nm process tech, IBM Power 7, has a chip size of 567 mm^2 (packing 1.2 billion transistors). Density of ~2.12 million transistors per mm^2

With 28 nm process tech, IBM Power 7, has a chip size of ~352.8 mm^2 (packing 1.2 billion transistors). Density of ~3.40 million transistors per mm^2

IBM is consistent with inferior transistors per mm^2 skills.

For comparisons

With 28nm process tech, AMD Radeon HD 7870 has a chip size of 212 mm^2 (packing 2.8 billion transistors) and delivers 2560 GFLOPS. Density of 13.2 billion transistors per mm^2.

With 28nm process tech, AMD Radeon HD 7970 GE has a chip size of 352 mm^2 (packing 4.313 billion transistors) and delivers 4300 GFLOPS. Density of 12.25 billion transistors per mm^2. Notice AMD improves transistors per mm^2 within the same generation. Radeon HD 78x0 carries the revised AMD GCN design. The next flagchip Radeon HD 8970 would carry the design improvements from Radeon HD 7870.

With 28nm process tech, NVIDIA Geforce GTX 680 has a chip size of 294 mm^2 (packing 3.54 billion transistors) and delivers 3090 GFLOPS. Density of 12.04 billion transistors per mm^2. NVIDIA plans release it's own flagchip Geforce GTX 780.

With 22nm process tech, Intel Ivybridge has a chip size of 160mm^2 (packing 1.4 billion transistors) . Density of 8.75 billion transistors per mm^2.

There's reason why IBM CELL based add-on card was blasted from the PC market.

Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

fr3ddiemercury

Why should anyone be jealous? If Microsoft finally makes a console for core gamers, I will be happy to buy it. Sadly, kinectbox sounds much more likely.

edit: I mean - we dont bash 360 because its MS, but because it sucks. It has no games except shooters and kinect shovelware, kills fun andinnovation and promotes mediocrity, which is exactly what this industry does not need. Next gen doesnt look very bright, Wii U shall once again be great for Ninty games but is not getting much 3rd party support probably, we have no idea what Sony comes out with but given their financial situation it most likely wont be anything special and everything points out that MS will pull off another kinectbox with the few money-printing mediocre shooter franchises. If I will be proven wrong and MS creates core-gamer's powerhouse that devs could jump on and develop interesting and amazing games like Valkyria Chronicles, Demons Souls, Heavy Rain, etc. I will be first to order it.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

fr3ddiemercury

Why are you posting links that are a year old?

>Rumor

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

BlbecekBobecek

Why should anyone be jealous? If Microsoft finally makes a console for core gamers, I will be happy to buy it. Sadly, kinectbox sounds much more likely.

[QUOTE="BlbecekBobecek"]

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

fr3ddiemercury

Why should anyone be jealous? If Microsoft finally makes a console for core gamers, I will be happy to buy it. Sadly, kinectbox sounds much more likely.

There is no money in core, MS are targetting casuals, the 720 will be a kinect box and focus on being a media centre, core games will be few and far between.

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"][QUOTE="BlbecekBobecek"]

Why should anyone be jealous? If Microsoft finally makes a console for core gamers, I will be happy to buy it. Sadly, kinectbox sounds much more likely.

tenaka2

There is no money in core, MS are targetting casuals, the 720 will be a kinect box and focus on being a media centre, core games will be few and far between.

[QUOTE="tenaka2"]

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"] Why does everyone forget Microsoft was the core leader for 4 years. They ave only focused on kinect for 2 years, :/ 720 will mark the return of hardcore focusfr3ddiemercury

There is no money in core, MS are targetting casuals, the 720 will be a kinect box and focus on being a media centre, core games will be few and far between.

Well as you most certainly lack balls, you can temporally borrow mine.

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"][QUOTE="tenaka2"]

There is no money in core, MS are targetting casuals, the 720 will be a kinect box and focus on being a media centre, core games will be few and far between.

tenaka2

Well as you most certainly lack balls, you can temporally borrow mine.

16 threads not cores lol

it is 4 cores, and each core have 4 threads (hyper threading):o

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

fr3ddiemercury

16 threads not cores lol

it is 4 cores, and each core have 4 threads (hyper threading):o

MK-Professor

[QUOTE="PS3FanMan4Life"][QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

AMD GCN negates the need for SPUs. AMD GCN supports C++ on hardware and X86-64 pointers.

ronvalencia

"Sheer power of the Cell" gets destroyed by ATI Radeon X1900.

Games that directly use NVIDIA RSX's instruction set (via LibGCM) would be another problem for BC.

Again, you have haven't negated Rory Read's "Our semi-custom APUs already have a number of confidential high-volume design wins in place" statement.

----------------------------

On transistors packing skills

At 28nm process tech, 32 core CELL would have a chip size about 284 mm^2 and it only delivers 4 times over existing CELL.

~230 GFLOPs x 4 = 920 GFLOPS.

Based on CELL's 115 mm^2 @ 45 nm process tech, 28 nm version of CELL would have a chip size of 71 mm^2. Density of ~3.34 million transistors per mm^2.

With 45 nm process tech, IBM Power 7, has a chip size of 567 mm^2 (packing 1.2 billion transistors). Density of ~2.12 million transistors per mm^2

With 28 nm process tech, IBM Power 7, has a chip size of ~352.8 mm^2 (packing 1.2 billion transistors). Density of ~3.40 million transistors per mm^2

IBM is consistent with inferior transistors per mm^2 skills.

For comparisons

With 28nm process tech, AMD Radeon HD 7870 has a chip size of 212 mm^2 (packing 2.8 billion transistors) and delivers 2560 GFLOPS. Density of 13.2 billion transistors per mm^2.

With 28nm process tech, AMD Radeon HD 7970 GE has a chip size of 352 mm^2 (packing 4.313 billion transistors) and delivers 4300 GFLOPS. Density of 12.25 billion transistors per mm^2. Notice AMD improves transistors per mm^2 within the same generation. Radeon HD 78x0 carries the revised AMD GCN design. The next flagchip Radeon HD 8970 would carry the design improvements from Radeon HD 7870.

With 28nm process tech, NVIDIA Geforce GTX 680 has a chip size of 294 mm^2 (packing 3.54 billion transistors) and delivers 3090 GFLOPS. Density of 12.04 billion transistors per mm^2. NVIDIA plans release it's own flagchip Geforce GTX 780.

With 22nm process tech, Intel Ivybridge has a chip size of 160mm^2 (packing 1.4 billion transistors) . Density of 8.75 billion transistors per mm^2.

There's reason why IBM CELL based add-on card was blasted from the PC market.

[QUOTE="fr3ddiemercury"]

Seeing as other pathetic cows want to cherry pick rumors about the cpu being pathetically weak...

Ignore them. Microsoft is going to have a powerhouse cpu.

.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Xbox-720-16-Core-CPU-xbox-next-microsoft,15285.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-57413857-1/xbox-720-to-ship-with-16-core-cpu/

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/xbox-720-to-be-a-16-core-powerhouse-1075933

.

There. Now cows can stfu and let the jealousy commence.

ronvalencia

Semi-custom 16 core AMD Jaguar would have a die size of ~83.2 mm^2 i.e. 16 x (3.1 mm^2 for CPU core + 2.1 mm^2 for 512KB L2 cache).

1st gen (Xenon/Zephyr) Xbox 360's PPE X3 has die size of 176 mm^2

2nd gen (Falcon/Opus) Xbox 360's PPE X3 has die size of 136 mm^2

With 16 core AMD Jaguar (~64 watts**) + AMD Radeon HD 7950M (50 watts, 1280 stream processors @ 700Mhz) is possible and it's total die size is smaller than 1st gen Xbox 360.

**Based on 4 watts for dual core AMD Bobcat. AMD Z-60 APU's dual core Bobcat @1Ghz has ~2 watts. Each AMD Jaguar core has 128bit SIMD unit and "double pumped" for 256bit wide Intel AVX SIMD.

AMD can recycle 16 core AMD Jaguar SKU for high density/low TDP servers.