PS4 vs High end PC, what you guys don't know

It surprises me how little most hermits on this board know about PC hardware. Not all of you, some of you are great and know what you're talking about. But most of you are really ridiculous. 

Here are a few points I have not really seen even mentioned here before and it's pretty surprising. 

1. Apples to Oranges - Some of you are comparing the PS4 components against a PC as if they were both gaming PCs. You guys are forgetting that the PS4 is a dedicated gaming box. This means it doesn't have to worry about running any other software and there is not big bloated OS to worry about either. 

Imagine comparing a Cadillac Escalade with 300hp vs a Porsche Cayman with 300hp. They may have the same amount of horsepower but the Cayman was built for speed. It's much lighter, more aerodynamic and will run much faster than the Escalade. Of course the Escalade is much more comfortable, fits more people, more luggage and has more luxury features. But if you're only comparing speed, the Cayman is a lot faster. 

Of course an Escalade can be faster than a Cayman, but not if they have the same amount of horsepower. Maybe if the Escalade had 600hp then it may be able to beat the Cayman in a straight line. 

Anyway, you get the point. You can't compare the '7860' in the PS3 directly to a PC with a 7850/7870 GPU. It doesn't make a good direct comparison.

2. $$$Uber GPU$$$ - You love to talk about how super powerful PC GPUs are. The GTX 680 or the Titan are monsters. Ok but what you are forgetting is that 99% of the NEW GAMES these GPUs run, also run on the 360 and PS3. The only thing they are currently doing is higher res, more detailed textures, higher fps, higher AA and better lighting and shadow details. 

But the games are built for the 360 and PS3. Why do you think it's more relevant to compare the PS4 hardware to high end PC hardware(THAT IS NEVER TRULY UTILIZED) than to compare it to 360 and PS3 hardware that 99% of games are BUILT TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF?

Compare the PS4's GPU to the 360 or PS3 GPUs. Then you will notice A HUGE JUMP! Compare the CPUs, again another big gap. The RAM, the PS3 has 16X the amount and 8X the speed, HUUUUUGE DIFFERENCE!!! 

Those of us who are comparing the PS4 to current gen are the ones who are impressed. I know there are PCs out there that cost in the thousands of dollars that are more powerful but no one wants a super high priced console. 

3. LET'S MISINFORM!!! - I love that thread recently where some Hermit claimed PCs were getting DDR5 RAM this year so that makes the PS4's 8GB of DDR5 no longer impressive. However, that wasn't really true. 

What is great about DDR5 memory is the BANDWIDTH. In other words, the SPEED of the memory. The average PC today, even a gaming PC uses DDR3 RAM. DDR3 RAM with a typical speed of 1600Mhz has a memory bandwidth of around 25/Gbs. That's roughly equal to the Xbox 360 and PS3!!! You got that, HIGH END PCS today use system RAM that is as SLOW as 360 and PS3 memory. 

If you guys clicked the link in that thread it explained that the DDR5 memory that is coming to PCs this year will give us a bandwidth of around 50/Gbs which is double what we have now. But nowhere near the 176/Gbs that will be in the PS4. 

The truth is that DDR5 is only coming at that speed in certain limited configurations. The real jump will be next year when ALL PCs move to DDR4 memory. But then the memory WILL NOT be running at 176/Gbs. 

It will take YEARS for PCs to use system ram that run as fast as the PS4's 8GB DDR5 Memory. Maybe by the time the PS5 is out, PCs will reach that point. 

Conclusion - It's a give and take when you are developing a console. You can't have a super powerful system AND make it cheap AND have it run cool with low power consumption. Something's got to give. If it's uber powerful, it won't be cheap or run cool. If it's cheap, it won't be powerful but can be power effecient. What the PS4 is accomplishing is a HUGE JUMP over current gen, while keeping a low price and a very elegant, power effecient design that will run very cool. 

Why wouldn't we be happy about consoles that are a massive leap ahead of what we have now but also will not overheat and be cheap? Because some Uninformed hermits are damage controlling and spreading misinformation? No, i'm excited for the PS4! Day one!!!

Discuss

So high end PC's are able to do better textures, higher resolutions, AA, AF, 60fps+, but that's not really important, even though that's one of the biggest selling points for the new consoles is that they will be able to do higher resolutions, better textures/graphics, and better frames than the current consoles. 

.

Mad cow disease is an epidemic on system wars right now. 

dude, everyone here already knows that ps4 will crush pc, be a supercomputer, bring harmony to the cosmos and solve erectile dysfunction.

dat shyt is obvious.

I am excited. 

PS4 will be powerful. 

I don't think you'd need an entirely magic PC to best the PS4 in the early stages of it's life. I think a 7850 is likely to produce visuals that are on par, and a 7950 would probably exceed it. Later into it's life I think this will change. Like the 360 with it's ability to play CODBLOPS2, I suspect later in PS4's life it may even equal or surpass a 7950. That's my prediction, and I've been wrong before. Some have said I'm optimistic, others, pessimistic. 

It's almost entirely irrelevent if someone with 2x 7970's (or whatever) can't 100% utilise the card due to restrictions imposed by cross-platform development ensuring a comfortable experience on the PS360 version of a game. More advanced games will come which will better utilise these high end cards. Like you said, PS4's release will likely precipitate the release of such games. 

I don't get it. Why do people keep saying that the PS4 is using DDR5? It's using GDDR5 (and last I checked, that was based off of DDR3). DDR5 doesn't exist yet IIRC. Hell, PC is just moving to DDR4. And GDDR5 is not impressive as graphics cards in PCs have been using it for quite a while. So unless Sony somehow found a way to just skip DDR4, they can't be using DDR5.

I am excited. 

PS4 will be powerful. 

I don't think you'd need an entirely magic PC to best the PS4 in the early stages of it's life. I think a 7850 is likely to produce visuals that are on par, and a 7950 would probably exceed it. Later into it's life I think this will change. Like the 360 with it's ability to play CODBLOPS2, I suspect later in PS4's life it may even equal or surpass a 7950. That's my prediction, and I've been wrong before. Some have said I'm optimistic, others, pessimistic. 

It's almost entirely irrelevent if someone with 2x 7970's (or whatever) can't 100% utilise the card due to restrictions imposed by cross-platform development ensuring a comfortable experience on the PS360 version of a game. More advanced games will come which will better utilise these high end cards. Like you said, PS4's release will likely precipitate the release of such games. 

psymon100

My PC is better. clyde46

.

lundy86_4

I don't get it. Why do people keep saying that the PS4 is using DDR5? It's using GDDR5 (and last I checked, that was based off of DDR3). DDR5 doesn't exist yet IIRC. Hell, PC is just moving to DDR4. And GDDR5 is not impressive as graphics cards in PCs have been using it for quite a while. So unless Sony somehow found a way to just skip DDR4, they can't be using DDR5.

OneLazyAsian

^ this.  It' GDDR5, the G is for graphics, hence it's use in GPUs.  And current GPUs have higher bandwith than 176gb/s

2. $$$Uber GPU$$$ - You love to talk about how super powerful PC GPUs are. The GTX 680 or the Titan are monsters. Ok but what you are forgetting is that 99% of the NEW GAMES these GPUs run, also run on the 360 and PS3. The only thing they are currently doing is higher res, more detailed textures, higher fps, higher AA and better lighting and shadow details. 

Xplode_games

Lol...the ONLY thing....what else is there to do?

dude, everyone here already knows that ps4 will crush pc, be a supercomputer, bring harmony to the cosmos and solve erectile dysfunction.

dat shyt is obvious.

Riverwolf007

OMG THANK GOD, my eh... aquintance will be delighted to hear this...

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

dude, everyone here already knows that ps4 will crush pc, be a supercomputer, bring harmony to the cosmos and solve erectile dysfunction.

dat shyt is obvious.

Snugenz

OMG THANK GOD, my eh... aquintance will be delighted to hear this...

dude, everyone here already knows that ps4 will crush pc, be a supercomputer, bring harmony to the cosmos and solve erectile dysfunction.

dat shyt is obvious.

Riverwolf007

so thoughtful. sony knows exactly what their fanbase needs. 

[QUOTE="Snugenz"]

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

dude, everyone here already knows that ps4 will crush pc, be a supercomputer, bring harmony to the cosmos and solve erectile dysfunction.

dat shyt is obvious.

Riverwolf007

OMG THANK GOD, my eh... aquintance will be delighted to hear this...

GDDR5inch RAM awww yeah :P

Yes the PS4 is impressive as a console, yes it is a great jump from current consoles, and yes it is going to be sweet, and I will be buying one pretty quickly most likely.

But please get your facts completely straight. GDDR5 is not some kind of god amongst men; video cards have been using GDDR5 since 2010. It's great that the whole system can take advantage of some unified memory, and that the communication between memory, CPU and GPU will be rapid, and the system as a whole will be nice for developers. 

But having said that, it really is only the GPU that needs that speed of memory. You made a big thing out of computers having only 1600MHz main memory, yet in actual fact, RAM in computers these days is very rarely a bottleneck at all.

the PS4 is a dedicated gaming boxXplode_games

[QUOTE="Xplode_games"]

the PS4 is a dedicated gaming boxredskins26rocs

Yeah they should correctly call it something like a dedicated media center

[QUOTE="redskins26rocs"][QUOTE="Xplode_games"]

the PS4 is a dedicated gaming boxlostrib

Yeah they should correctly call it something like a dedicated media center

All people who have the brains instead of hamsters in their heads know that high end pcs will destroy PS4. But still it doesn´t matter to me, what matters are games. We already know what will come for pc this year and the next; PC has a huge list of exclusives coming. And PS4 only has rumors and promises. 

On one hand we have

cheap games,

50 exclusives coming,

backward compatiblity,

mods support,

genres that will never be available for consoles

On another hand we have an oudated PC closed box from a company closed to bankruptcy who desperatly tries to sell us air.

I don´t care if I have to spend 300$ more for a new PC, money well spent in face of an abysmal difference between superb PC gaming and casual consoles´.

PC GAMING FTW

inb4 tormentos talking out of his rusty bullet hole

Stop comparing Consoles to PC's. They use there resources much different and Console games are optimized to one set of hardware.

Most people don't understand this or choose to not beleive this, which is fact.

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

dude, everyone here already knows that ps4 will crush pc, be a supercomputer, bring harmony to the cosmos and solve erectile dysfunction.

dat shyt is obvious.

KarateeeChop

so thoughtful. sony knows exactly what their fanbase needs. 

Stop comparing Consoles to PC's. They use there resources much different and Console games are optimized to one set of hardware.

Most people don't understand this or choose to not beleive this, which is fact.

Mrmedia01

This is system wars, it's how it works

[QUOTE="Mrmedia01"]

Stop comparing Consoles to PC's. They use there resources much different and Console games are optimized to one set of hardware.

Most people don't understand this or choose to not beleive this, which is fact.

lostrib

This is system wars, it's how it works

Ok then,

PS4 can use less overall power to acheive a higher graphical point than a PC because games are optimized on that one piece of hardware. So a PC would need higher specs because that one game is not optimized for 1 peice of hardware. Hint, Hint, Crysis was very optimized horribly that's why for a while there you needed a monster PC to defeat it on Max setting 60FPS.

Hermits will grasp at straws for the next 3 years with a couple of games that looks a little bit better but they will hype these meh games as the best things ever. I remember when i got a new pc in 07 i ran to the store to buy crysis only to be really disappointed with that biggy boring mess of a game. when i first booted up the game the menu did not even work right.

Hermits will grasp at straws for the next 3 years with a couple of games that looks a little bit better but they will hype these meh games as the best things ever. I remember when i got a new pc in 07 i ran to the store to buy crysis only to be really disappointed with that biggy boring mess of a game. when i first booted up the game the menu did not even work right.

osirisx3

Okay, and some of us liked crysis, so what?  Since you can see into the future, what will be the winning california lotter numbers next week?

Hermits will grasp at straws for the next 3 years with a couple of games that looks a little bit better but they will hype these meh games as the best things ever. I remember when i got a new pc in 07 i ran to the store to buy crysis only to be really disappointed with that biggy boring mess of a game. when i first booted up the game the menu did not even work right.

osirisx3

Crysis Game is overall Horrible series. Graphics are amazing (Yes the best), but the games are mediocre at best. Much better FPS's out there.

Lol. "High end PC." Those systems will become obsolete in 3 months when Intel launches new CPU. Even that will become obsolete when DDR4 comes out later. :lol: :lol::lol:

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

[QUOTE="Mrmedia01"]

Stop comparing Consoles to PC's. They use there resources much different and Console games are optimized to one set of hardware.

Most people don't understand this or choose to not beleive this, which is fact.

Mrmedia01

This is system wars, it's how it works

Ok then,

PS4 can use less overall power to acheive a higher graphical point than a PC because games are optimized on that one piece of hardware. So a PC would need higher specs because that one game is not optimized for 1 peice of hardware. Hint, Hint, Crysis was very optimized horribly that's why for a while there you needed a monster PC to defeat it on Max setting 60FPS.

Okay, and there already is PC higher spec hardware that is more powerful than the PS4 (based in rumors).  So even with optimization, PC can have better hardware to out distance it, especially since PS4 can't be upgraded.

[QUOTE="osirisx3"]

Hermits will grasp at straws for the next 3 years with a couple of games that looks a little bit better but they will hype these meh games as the best things ever. I remember when i got a new pc in 07 i ran to the store to buy crysis only to be really disappointed with that biggy boring mess of a game. when i first booted up the game the menu did not even work right.

Mrmedia01

Crysis Game is overall Horrible series. Graphics are amazing (Yes the best), but the games are mediocre at best. Much better FPS's out there.

Thanks consolization!

Hermits will grasp at straws for the next 3 years with a couple of games that looks a little bit better but they will hype these meh games as the best things ever. I remember when i got a new pc in 07 i ran to the store to buy crysis only to be really disappointed with that biggy boring mess of a game. when i first booted up the game the menu did not even work right.

osirisx3

Keep up the butthurt, bro.

[QUOTE="Xplode_games"]

2. $$$Uber GPU$$$ - You love to talk about how super powerful PC GPUs are. The GTX 680 or the Titan are monsters. Ok but what you are forgetting is that 99% of the NEW GAMES these GPUs run, also run on the 360 and PS3. The only thing they are currently doing is higher res, more detailed textures, higher fps, higher AA and better lighting and shadow details. 

Omnisystem

Lol...the ONLY thing....what else is there to do?

I agree with some points. This is the best Sony can do with the price and power consumption they are aiming at, and it will, like previous consoles have done, push gaming forward. The PS4 is powerfull enough to give developers new possibilities, that only could have been done on a powerfull PC this gen. And let's face it, most developers develops games on consoles since that is where the money is. Had the PS4 been more powerfull, PC's would have taken a serious hit in game sales, just like at the start of last gen.

Yes the PS4 is impressive as a console, yes it is a great jump from current consoles, and yes it is going to be sweet, and I will be buying one pretty quickly most likely.

But please get your facts completely straight. GDDR5 is not some kind of god amongst men; video cards have been using GDDR5 since 2010. It's great that the whole system can take advantage of some unified memory, and that the communication between memory, CPU and GPU will be rapid, and the system as a whole will be nice for developers. 

But having said that, it really is only the GPU that needs that speed of memory. You made a big thing out of computers having only 1600MHz main memory, yet in actual fact, RAM in computers these days is very rarely a bottleneck at all.

_Matt_

Which GPU current or announced has 8 GB GDDR5 RAM?

[QUOTE="Omnisystem"]

[QUOTE="Xplode_games"]

2. $$$Uber GPU$$$ - You love to talk about how super powerful PC GPUs are. The GTX 680 or the Titan are monsters. Ok but what you are forgetting is that 99% of the NEW GAMES these GPUs run, also run on the 360 and PS3. The only thing they are currently doing is higher res, more detailed textures, higher fps, higher AA and better lighting and shadow details. 

Xplode_games

Lol...the ONLY thing....what else is there to do?

Uh no duh, they games are like 4 years apart and made on completely different platforms.  And GTA4 has been modded on PC to look photorealistic.  

[QUOTE="_Matt_"]

Yes the PS4 is impressive as a console, yes it is a great jump from current consoles, and yes it is going to be sweet, and I will be buying one pretty quickly most likely.

But please get your facts completely straight. GDDR5 is not some kind of god amongst men; video cards have been using GDDR5 since 2010. It's great that the whole system can take advantage of some unified memory, and that the communication between memory, CPU and GPU will be rapid, and the system as a whole will be nice for developers. 

But having said that, it really is only the GPU that needs that speed of memory. You made a big thing out of computers having only 1600MHz main memory, yet in actual fact, RAM in computers these days is very rarely a bottleneck at all.

Xplode_games

Which GPU current or announced has 8 GB GDDR5 RAM?

None do, duh. Neither will the PS4 GPU

So high end PC's are able to do better textures, higher resolutions, AA, AF, 60fps+, but that's not really important, even though that's one of the biggest selling points for the new consoles is that they will be able to do higher resolutions, better textures/graphics, and better frames than the current consoles. 

lostrib

TC owned by the third post. /thread

[QUOTE="_Matt_"]

Yes the PS4 is impressive as a console, yes it is a great jump from current consoles, and yes it is going to be sweet, and I will be buying one pretty quickly most likely.

But please get your facts completely straight. GDDR5 is not some kind of god amongst men; video cards have been using GDDR5 since 2010. It's great that the whole system can take advantage of some unified memory, and that the communication between memory, CPU and GPU will be rapid, and the system as a whole will be nice for developers. 

But having said that, it really is only the GPU that needs that speed of memory. You made a big thing out of computers having only 1600MHz main memory, yet in actual fact, RAM in computers these days is very rarely a bottleneck at all.

Xplode_games

Which GPU current or announced has 8 GB GDDR5 RAM?

You really think all that ram will be used for gaming?  Mad cow is a terrible affliction smh...

[QUOTE="Xplode_games"]

[QUOTE="_Matt_"]

Yes the PS4 is impressive as a console, yes it is a great jump from current consoles, and yes it is going to be sweet, and I will be buying one pretty quickly most likely.

But please get your facts completely straight. GDDR5 is not some kind of god amongst men; video cards have been using GDDR5 since 2010. It's great that the whole system can take advantage of some unified memory, and that the communication between memory, CPU and GPU will be rapid, and the system as a whole will be nice for developers. 

But having said that, it really is only the GPU that needs that speed of memory. You made a big thing out of computers having only 1600MHz main memory, yet in actual fact, RAM in computers these days is very rarely a bottleneck at all.

NFJSupreme

Which GPU current or announced has 8 GB GDDR5 RAM?

You really think all that ram will be used for gaming?  Mad cow is a terrible affliction smh...

[QUOTE="NFJSupreme"]

[QUOTE="Xplode_games"]

Which GPU current or announced has 8 GB GDDR5 RAM?

GioVela2010

You really think all that ram will be used for gaming?  Mad cow is a terrible affliction smh...

dat GDDR5! numbers!

[QUOTE="Mrmedia01"]

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

This is system wars, it's how it works

lostrib

Ok then,

PS4 can use less overall power to acheive a higher graphical point than a PC because games are optimized on that one piece of hardware. So a PC would need higher specs because that one game is not optimized for 1 peice of hardware. Hint, Hint, Crysis was very optimized horribly that's why for a while there you needed a monster PC to defeat it on Max setting 60FPS.

Okay, and there already is PC higher spec hardware that is more powerful than the PS4 (based in rumors).  So even with optimization, PC can have better hardware to out distance it, especially since PS4 can't be upgraded.

True but......

PS4 can achieve better graphics, per better optimized games. Some Gaming PC's are more powerful, no doubt about it. Problem is you always need crazy high specs to run alot of high graphic games at Max settings PC because the game it self is not optimized on one set of hardware, so it needs even more power to run correctly. If that same game was built from the ground up and Optimized for PS4 it would run much better in most cases, unless the game required even more resources than the PS4 could provide.

On PS4 everything will be set and well Optimized for, so either solid 60FPS or 30FPS at native 1080P or 720P, PS4 will be able to achieve more with less resources because of Optimization. Graphically (Not counting frame rates) we will see some amazing stuff with PS4 that will rival PC for a while, untill PC hardware greatly exceeds it to where its in a league of its own again.

Think about how great Heavy Rain and Uncharted 3 character models and graphics were considering they  only had 256MB of ram and a old 8 year old GPU to work with.

Now with 8GB DDR5 much easier hardware to devlop on and Optimize for. We will see some drop dead gorgeous graphics on PS4, no doubt. Especially from exclusive games.