Microsoft Lacks a "Top Tier" Dev

  • 136 results
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3

This topic is locked from further discussion.

#101 Edited by silversix_ (12543 posts) -

Turd 10 HAHA if that's the best MS has ouch

#102 Edited by iKANNIBAL (14 posts) -

@ConanTheStoner said:

You could say the same about Sony, really. Unless your definition of top tier is a bit lenient.

How so? Microsoft has not produced anything even remotely close to either Shadow of Collosus or Ico. lol @ these noobs. Sony had ips before Uncharted guys.....honestly did some of you start gaming last generation?

As for Sony not having a top tier franchise. Jesus christ do you guys know anything?

GT sold more than all the indivisual Halo & Gears releases. Uncharted 3 as well it outbeat Gears 3. This isn't 2007 anymore.

#103 Edited by killzowned24 (7066 posts) -

@killzowned24 said:

why are you bringing up pc? This is a $200 console ffs! Its last 3 games have a score over 90 at metacritic and each has goty at places. That is consistent.

Crysis 3 on consoles looks better than Naughty Dog's games. It doesn't run as well, but it looks a lot better.

Most people consider Uncharted 3 to be a huge disappointment. I'm not saying they aren't a good studio. They are. They're a great studio. They are not an elite studio yet. They are not Blizzard, Bungie, Rockstar, EPIC, or Nintendo tier yet. Those studios have been putting out games that good for 20 years. Give 'em one more game like The Last of Us or two games as good as Uncharted 2 without another Uncharted 1 or Uncharted 3 in between, and yeah, I'll say they're elite. Not before.

crysis is sub HD and has a crap framerate and still doesn't look as good.

#104 Posted by I_can_haz (5700 posts) -

@killzowned24 said:

why are you bringing up pc? This is a $200 console ffs! Its last 3 games have a score over 90 at metacritic and each has goty at places. That is consistent.

Crysis 3 on consoles looks better than Naughty Dog's games. It doesn't run as well, but it looks a lot better.

Most people consider Uncharted 3 to be a huge disappointment. I'm not saying they aren't a good studio. They are. They're a great studio. They are not an elite studio yet. They are not Blizzard, Bungie, Rockstar, EPIC, or Nintendo tier yet. Those studios have been putting out games that good for 20 years. Give 'em one more game like The Last of Us or two games as good as Uncharted 2 without another Uncharted 1 or Uncharted 3 in between, and yeah, I'll say they're elite. Not before.

Hahahahahaha....no. Crysis 3 on consoles is a blurry piece of choppy sub-HD shit. Please don't insult ND by comparing that turd to their games.

#105 Posted by Stringerboy (6777 posts) -

Who is Turn 10.

#106 Edited by I_can_haz (5700 posts) -

@iKANNIBAL said:

@ConanTheStoner said:

You could say the same about Sony, really. Unless your definition of top tier is a bit lenient.

How so? Microsoft has not produced anything even remotely close to either Shadow of Collosus or Ico. lol @ these noobs. Sony had ips before Uncharted guys.....honestly did some of you start gaming last generation?

As for Sony not having a top tier franchise. Jesus christ do you guys know anything?

GT sold more than all the indivisual Halo & Gears releases. Uncharted 3 as well it outbeat Gears 3. This isn't 2007 anymore.

Lems started gaming in 2007 and stopped gaming then. They say Sony doesn't have high scoring games when Uncharted 2, TLOU, and LBP outscored and got more GOTY awards than anything on 360. Then they say Sony games don't sell as good as Halo and Gears when GT is a bigger franchise than Halo. I really don't know what's up with them. Are they really this dumb and ignorant or are they just trolling?

#107 Posted by Jakandsigz (4512 posts) -

Again, why would they focus on relying on one dev when they have more 2p and Fp devs than everyone else?

#108 Posted by PinkieWinkie (1246 posts) -

@Jakandsigz: Then why were they whooped in number of exclusives last gen?

#109 Edited by nhh18 (6538 posts) -

I still don't think you comprehend how big the last of us is in the younger demographic. It is shocking seeing how many 12-15 year old tweet about how last of us is the best game ever. It is kind of like how some people felt when they played halo when they were young. And how sheep feel when they played super Mario bros 3/64 when they were young. TOo bad sheep have a brain of a bird and have no idea what is going on. The last of us is sony's halo.

#110 Edited by ConanTheStoner (3839 posts) -

@ConanTheStoner said:

You could say the same about Sony, really. Unless your definition of top tier is a bit lenient.

How so? Microsoft has not produced anything even remotely close to either Shadow of Collosus or Ico. lol @ these noobs. Sony had ips before Uncharted guys.....honestly did some of you start gaming last generation?

As for Sony not having a top tier franchise. Jesus christ do you guys know anything?

GT sold more than all the indivisual Halo & Gears releases. Uncharted 3 as well it outbeat Gears 3. This isn't 2007 anymore.

I never said MS did. I love Team Ico games btw. And no, I've been gaming since about 1986.

Not sure why you're bringing up Halo and Gears. I don't give a fuck about those games or MS in general. I highly doubt I'll ever own an Xbone. So please quit jumping to conclusions son.

This has nothing to do with MS and how much they suck. This has everything to do with Sony not having a top tier studio. Sony does have good studios and for brief windows of time, studios like Polyphony and Team Ico where really making the climb. I would say that as far as production values go, Sony does have some of the best in the business right now, so I'll give you that.

You guys really need to figure out what the fuck top tier means though lol.

#111 Posted by kinectthedots (949 posts) -

lemmings have lost it in this thread.

#112 Posted by crimsonman1245 (4253 posts) -

This Naughty Dog damage control is pretty comical.

#113 Posted by Divine_Menace (235 posts) -


In my opinion Sony does have the better first party studios, however the genres are weak and holding them back some. A lot of the sales also are bundled. Microsoft bundles too, but the majority of the exclusive they release are front heavy with big launch numbers.

#114 Edited by ConanTheStoner (3839 posts) -

@ConanTheStoner said:

@Sweenix said:

@ConanTheStoner said:

You could say the same about Sony, really. Unless your definition of top tier is a bit lenient.

I'm talking about Dev not devs, and naughty dog are one of the finest devs out there, so you cant say the same about sony.

When I think top tier, I'm thinking something like top 5 at most. ND has had a couple of flashes in the pan over the years and are certainly poised to become a formidable power-house going forward, but I just don't view them as top tier right now.

If we're only limiting this to the scope of 1st party devs, then sure.

Oh come on now. Your bias is showing. ND is good. No need to pretend otherwise....

Yes, ND is very good, I even said that. Good =/= top tier. And what is my bias? Sony has been my favorite console maker since they entered the business. They have some really good studios under their belt. If anything my bias has me leaning towards Sony.

I'm really not sure why you guys are getting so confused. Do you think ND is one of the very top devs ever or something?

#115 Edited by ConanTheStoner (3839 posts) -

lemmings have lost it in this thread.

I think 1 lemming posted in this thread and his last post was on the first page.

Some people are simply choosing to be realistic in this thread.

We all know that Sony has some good devs. We all know that here and there, some amazing titles have come out of some Sony studios.

OP should have worded it better. Top tier means TOP TIER, not "oh these guys occasionally hit a good note".

#116 Posted by destroyerman455 (112 posts) -

@destroyerman455 said:

Naughty Dog put out TLOU and Uncharted, I really wouldn't put them in Top Tier simply because of a couple of games. They're a good dev team, don't get me wrong, but some people seem to have blasted them out of proportion to others.

Microsoft has Turn 10 which is pretty much the same, but it all comes down to preference and opinion in the end.

Fuking hell mate. Did you just start gaming this gen? Crash Bandicoot and Jak&Daxter are some of the best 3d platformers ever. Probably THE best if we aren't counting Nintendo ones.

I wouldn't call Turn 10 "top tier" due to Forza 5. "Top tier" devs have range. They've only done simulators and one arcadey racer. More like a top dev in their very specific genre. And even then, Polyphony are just as good if not better (GT 6 being on last gen hardware and is regarded as the better racing simulator speaks volumes about the talent they still have).

Fact is, MS do not have a top tier dev. Imo, top tier = devs that can tackle multiple genres, put out GOTY worthy games and have experience.

I've played Crash and the Jak games and they were amazing. Probably one of the biggest highlights of my early gaming years, I'm talking about the Devs in recent years as in last gen (360, PS3, Wii). If we were going that far back then Nintendo's devs would be the best simply due to Zelda and Mario.

#117 Edited by PS4TrumpsXbox1 (1054 posts) -

@foxhound_fox said:

@Vatusus said:

uh? They ARE good games. And critical acclaim MEANS good games. Your own opinion is a whole another matter that isnt called in here and is pretty much worthless in the bigger spectrum of things. I also think Valve games are overrated but I wont say they arent among the best devs out there cause clearly, in many gamers and critics minds, they are

So you are incapable of making and supporting your own opinion. Okay.

I think Naughty Dog get by on a lot of acclaim that is highly unfounded. Most of their games are 6-8's at best, not 9-10's like everyone else claims. People these days are easily impressed with flashy visuals and exciting set pieces. But you know what? Their mechanics are lacking (TLOU notwithstanding as I have not played it). Gears of War puts mechanics first (it still isn't a 9 game though) while the Uncharted games put set-pieces first.

MC ratings of some of the previous ND games:

Crash team racing - 88

Crash Bandicoot 3 - 91

the last of us - 95

uncharted- 88

unchated 2- 96

uncharted 3 - 92

jak and daxter:precursor legacy -90

Jak 2- 87

Jak 3- 84

(note details on crash bandicoot series is a little confusing as ND doesnet own them anymore, also couldnt find Original Crash and its sequel on MC. Crash team racing was the last crash game ND worked before they went to Jak series)

Dont know where you came up with 6-8 rating as nothing on this list is rated below 80's so maybe a more accurate statement would be 8-9 ratings. Just saying....

#118 Posted by hippiesanta (9273 posts) -

No. Microsoft's best studio is 343i, and not even close to Sucker Punch Studio

#119 Posted by delta3074 (17096 posts) -

@Sweenix said:

@ConanTheStoner said:

@Sweenix said:

@ConanTheStoner said:

@Sweenix said:

@ConanTheStoner said:

You could say the same about Sony, really. Unless your definition of top tier is a bit lenient.

I'm talking about Dev not devs, and naughty dog are one of the finest devs out there, so you cant say the same about sony.

When I think top tier, I'm thinking something like top 5 at most. ND has had a couple of flashes in the pan over the years and are certainly poised to become a formidable power-house going forward, but I just don't view them as top tier right now.

If we're only limiting this to the scope of 1st party devs, then sure.

Naughty dog, managed to make a game that completely overshadowed Grand Theft Auto 5, Name a dev who can do that.

Also, Uncharted 2 and 3 were one of the most well received games from this generation, yes naughty dog weren't "Top Tier" at the start of the generation, but now they are, i would even put them above rockstar games, and drawn with nintendo EAD, they are that good.

Mmmm, not really sure what you mean by overshadowed GTA5. Might need to elaborate on that one. I personally enjoyed TLOU more than GTA5 (not much of a GTA fan), but I don't really see were you're coming from.

Uncharted 2 was fantastic. Uncharted 3 was good. I would argue that ND was better before last gen, but that's just me. Still, I can think of quite a few studios with more merit. Sony did wonders with their 1st party last gen and I think the pay off will be big this gen, but I just don't see any of their studios as being at the top of the pile.

By overshadowed i mean within the gaming community, And the last of us managed to receive over 200 game of the year awards, which is more more then grand theft auto 5

Yet more gamers bought GTA 5 including on the Ps3, TLOU WAS the fastest selling title on the Ps3 in 2013 until GTA 5 released, TLOU wins in the 1st party stakes but it didn't even come close to overshadowing GTA 5, even in the gaming community..

#120 Posted by killatwill15 (845 posts) -

They have Rare...........

they have the corpse of rare,

infact to shine on some bits of this article I am going to post,

"the games RARE WERENT ALLOWED TO MAKE"

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=707691

perfect dark core would've been the true "titanfall" xbox exclusive a few years back,

but Microsoft killed that Idea,

saberman and kameo 2 would've convinced me to go back xbox 360

but you know,

Microsoft hates games, but loves money,

hence Kinect, where it wont get both in the future

#121 Posted by killatwill15 (845 posts) -

@killatwill15:

damn looking back at saberman,

I know its just 2 pictures,

but MAN,

fuck Microsoft and fuck Kinect for keeping them from making this,

the art reminds me of disneys "up" with a musket,

fuck Microsoft

#122 Edited by PS4TrumpsXbox1 (1054 posts) -

Out of the last three games that came out of Naughty Dog (Uncharted 2, Uncharted 3 and TLOU), two of those won game of the year awards. Naughty Dog is not a top tier studio! If every game they make isn't critically acclaimed they are crap! LOL

#123 Posted by bforrester420 (683 posts) -

@Sweenix: You can't forget about Sony Santa Monica either. They've kicked out the goodness for a while.

#124 Posted by KungfuKitten (20415 posts) -

Replacing devs with marketing has worked out so far.

#125 Edited by bforrester420 (683 posts) -

@foxhound_fox said:

@Vatusus said:

uh? They ARE good games. And critical acclaim MEANS good games. Your own opinion is a whole another matter that isnt called in here and is pretty much worthless in the bigger spectrum of things. I also think Valve games are overrated but I wont say they arent among the best devs out there cause clearly, in many gamers and critics minds, they are

So you are incapable of making and supporting your own opinion. Okay.

I think Naughty Dog get by on a lot of acclaim that is highly unfounded. Most of their games are 6-8's at best, not 9-10's like everyone else claims. People these days are easily impressed with flashy visuals and exciting set pieces. But you know what? Their mechanics are lacking (TLOU notwithstanding as I have not played it). Gears of War puts mechanics first (it still isn't a 9 game though) while the Uncharted games put set-pieces first.

LMAO... Frankly, your opinion and $.25 could buy me a cup of crappy coffee. Your opinion isn't worth the calories you expended typing that post.

#126 Posted by Shewgenja (6831 posts) -

@Sweenix said:

@ConanTheStoner said:

You could say the same about Sony, really. Unless your definition of top tier is a bit lenient.

I'm talking about Dev not devs, and naughty dog are one of the finest devs out there, so you cant say the same about sony.

When I think top tier, I'm thinking something like top 5 at most. ND has had a couple of flashes in the pan over the years and are certainly poised to become a formidable power-house going forward, but I just don't view them as top tier right now.

If we're only limiting this to the scope of 1st party devs, then sure.

And you would be wrong on each and every one account.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-06-25-the-rise-of-naughty-dog-part-1

Get your learn on.

#127 Edited by shellcase86 (1694 posts) -

I think MSFT has some really quality developers. The problem is they don't really have any interesting titles.

#128 Edited by Shewgenja (6831 posts) -

In all honesty, I would say Turn 10 is a top tier developer. That's not some kind of stretch of the imagination. However, they focus on a single franchise and, more unfortunately, subsequent releases of that franchise have been trending downward on metacritic.

They will likely continue to push the Forza franchise out in the determinable future. For the sake of gamers, I hope that 5 was their lowest point and headed for a rebound afterward.

#129 Edited by sts106mat (17935 posts) -

Turn 10 are a top tier dev, my initial impression of Forza 5 is very good indeed. Driveatars are a great addition.

#130 Edited by shawn30 (3696 posts) -

Turn 10 and Remedy are top developers. Lionhead hasn't sold less than a million on any Fable game and always makes great games. 343 sold 8 million out the gate. Honestly opinions are like assholes and everybody got one. Turn 10, for what they do is as talented as Naughty Dog in my eyes. MS has top tier devs and to say otherwise is a joke, lol.

#131 Edited by bforrester420 (683 posts) -

@shawn30 said:

Turn 10 and Remedy are top developers. Lionhead hasn't sold less than a million on any Fable game and always makes great games. 343 sold 8 million out the gate. Honestly opinions are like assholes and everybody got one. Turn 10, for what they do is as talented as Naughty Dog in my eyes. MS has top tier devs and to say otherwise is a joke, lol.

If Naughty Dogg's entire history consisted of one franchise, I would agree with you. I would equate Turn 10 more with Polyphony, naturally, but they seem to be a notch above at this point. They're beating Poly both in critical acclaim and turnaround at this point. I still cannot understand how Forza 5 scored as high as it has, as it is lacking in content.

#132 Posted by sts106mat (17935 posts) -

@shawn30 said:

Turn 10 and Remedy are top developers. Lionhead hasn't sold less than a million on any Fable game and always makes great games. 343 sold 8 million out the gate. Honestly opinions are like assholes and everybody got one. Turn 10, for what they do is as talented as Naughty Dog in my eyes. MS has top tier devs and to say otherwise is a joke, lol.

If Naughty Dogg's entire history consisted of one franchise, I would agree with you. I would equate Turn 10 more with Polyphony, naturally, but they seem to be a notch above at this point. They're beating Poly both in critical acclaim and turnaround at this point. I still cannot understand how Forza 5 scored as high as it has, as it is lacking in content.

because what contnetnt there is, is excellent

#133 Edited by bforrester420 (683 posts) -

@sts106mat: I'd be more inclined to agree if they had included more tracks. No Nurburgring is unacceptable.

#134 Edited by sts106mat (17935 posts) -

@sts106mat: I'd be more inclined to agree if they had included more tracks. No Nurburgring is unacceptable.

yeah, i was surprised it wasn't there too. it may come as an update (hopefully free) but still, the content it has got is excellent. loving the top gear commentary and the racing itself is great with drivatars really increasing the enjoyment of the SP mode.

#135 Posted by blue_hazy_basic (26705 posts) -

Not really a fan of ND games but they knock out anything MS has and are leagues above most console games. I don't get how anyone can argue that MS has a dev that compares.

#136 Posted by Maddie_Larkin (6040 posts) -

Nah the issue with MS is not the TOP tier devs, they have had plenty over the years, but it seems the internal policies and climate inside MS pretty much kills off all talent it can find, likely due to a rigid structure and unreasonable conditions.

#137 Edited by DarkLink77 (31611 posts) -

@DarkLink77 said:

@killzowned24 said:

why are you bringing up pc? This is a $200 console ffs! Its last 3 games have a score over 90 at metacritic and each has goty at places. That is consistent.

Crysis 3 on consoles looks better than Naughty Dog's games. It doesn't run as well, but it looks a lot better.

Most people consider Uncharted 3 to be a huge disappointment. I'm not saying they aren't a good studio. They are. They're a great studio. They are not an elite studio yet. They are not Blizzard, Bungie, Rockstar, EPIC, or Nintendo tier yet. Those studios have been putting out games that good for 20 years. Give 'em one more game like The Last of Us or two games as good as Uncharted 2 without another Uncharted 1 or Uncharted 3 in between, and yeah, I'll say they're elite. Not before.

crysis is sub HD and has a crap framerate and still doesn't look as good.

It's still more impressive technically and is producing far more effects than Naughty Dog titles do.