Is MS insecure about the XBOX ONE?

This topic is locked from further discussion.

#1 Posted by ShoTTyMcNaDeS (1687 posts) -

I was wondering if you all think that with all of the constant talking that MS is doing in regards to all things Xbone if there is a layer of insecurity going into launch? I mean to me it seems like there is a lot of "well we were doing this, but now this is what we are really doing". With all of the CPU and GPU upgrades, the news that your Kinect info doesn't leave the XBOX ONE and on and on. It just seems to be a lot of talk as if they don't have true confidence in their product.

#2 Posted by silversix_ (12542 posts) -
With this kind of weak specs expecting the system to last 10 years you better be insecure.
#3 Posted by muffin200 (733 posts) -

 

I'm no Lem but I belive it's called advertising.

#4 Posted by John_Matherson (2031 posts) -
"Does this overpriced black box make my buns look big?"
#5 Posted by LA-Nighthawk (5 posts) -
If anyone Sony are the insecure ones with how humble they are and how they go out of their way to not step on anyone's toes. Grow a pair.
#6 Posted by ZoomZoom2490 (3905 posts) -

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

#7 Posted by timbers_WSU (5753 posts) -

Insecure?
It is $100 more than a PS4. If anything they are over-confident. 

#8 Posted by ZoomZoom2490 (3905 posts) -
If anyone Sony are the insecure ones with how humble they are and how they go out of their way to not step on anyone's toes. Grow a pair. LA-Nighthawk
sony shrunk ms's balls when they announced a GPU with 50% more shaders than X1 and GDDR5 that farts on 10 year old DDR3 all day long.
#9 Posted by mprince131 (194 posts) -

They're launching a flagship product in less than two months. Why would they not be talking about it? They need to inform people about the console as well as clear up any confusion people may still have. If you confuse their marketing efforts for insecurity it explains why you don't run a multi-billion dollar corporation. 

#10 Posted by LA-Nighthawk (5 posts) -
[QUOTE="LA-Nighthawk"]If anyone Sony are the insecure ones with how humble they are and how they go out of their way to not step on anyone's toes. Grow a pair. ZoomZoom2490
sony shrunk ms's balls when they announced a GPU with 50% more shaders than X1 and GDDR5 that farts on 10 year old DDR3 all day long.

And Titanfall still has more awards than all PS4 games. Almost like gameplay trounces graphics now and forever.
#11 Posted by shawn30 (3696 posts) -

 

I'm no Lem but I belive it's called advertising.

muffin200
This. There are three things going for MS that make me beleive they aren't insecure, but they are monitoring closely. 1. Having made there changes months before launch, they know going forward the system will be in peoples hands and that the games and services is what it will be judged by. I just don't think they care that the PS4 will have a more powerful system. I think their argument is that in actual finished games the difference won't be nearly as great as some think. 2. Its a long-term game, this console war. Surviving a tough couple of years to get your footing, a price drop, and a strong game line-up like the PS3 did is the gameplay. For MS is in a even better position as it hasn't conceded a full year off the shelf. So they are content to make this a multi-year fight irregardless of if they aren't in the top spot right away. 3. Their business model is that they will be profitable on every unti day one, while PS4 isn't. But if things went terribly south, like out of control free-fall they are rich enough to easily cut the price and eat the difference for a few years until it catches on. This is a 270 billion dollar company, and while restructuring, they aren't going anywhere.One way or another the Xbox One will be profitable for MS and that's more importasnt than the bragging rights of who is number one. Its liek Coke and Pepsi. Neither boasts of being the worlds number one soft drink because both are operating in the black. That's all that matters to the stock brokers.
#12 Posted by XBOunity (2981 posts) -

Insecure?
It is $100 more than a PS4. If anything they are over-confident. 

timbers_WSU

#13 Posted by Krelian-co (9087 posts) -

I was wondering if you all think that with all of the constant talking that MS is doing in regards to all things Xbone if there is a layer of insecurity going into launch? I mean to me it seems like there is a lot of "well we were doing this, but now this is what we are really doing". With all of the CPU and GPU upgrades, the news that your Kinect info doesn't leave the XBOX ONE and on and on. It just seems to be a lot of talk as if they don't have true confidence in their product.

ShoTTyMcNaDeS

stop.jpg

#14 Posted by stayhigh1 (723 posts) -

I was wondering if you all think that with all of the constant talking that MS is doing in regards to all things Xbone if there is a layer of insecurity going into launch? I mean to me it seems like there is a lot of "well we were doing this, but now this is what we are really doing". With all of the CPU and GPU upgrades, the news that your Kinect info doesn't leave the XBOX ONE and on and on. It just seems to be a lot of talk as if they don't have true confidence in their product.

ShoTTyMcNaDeS
no doubt they insecure and scared right now..They really fuked up a lot of 360 fanboys switched side already..All the 190s M$ is pulling only show negativity on their side..
#15 Posted by mrintro (1354 posts) -

yep, ever since that E3 debacle, they've done a huge PR push

#16 Posted by Scipio8 (461 posts) -

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

ZoomZoom2490

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

#17 Posted by Guy_Brohski (213 posts) -

They should feel insecure. Even the US favors Sony next gen, partly because they are releasing weaker hardware at $100 more than the competition. I'd say the Xbox brand doesn't have half the appeal that it used to.

#18 Posted by Chutebox (35683 posts) -

No, but since e3 they have been in full DC mode  and they need to be. 

#19 Posted by rjdofu (9164 posts) -
Can't be as insecure as you are.
#20 Posted by MonsieurX (26946 posts) -
No,but you seem to be :|
#21 Posted by xboxiphoneps3 (2209 posts) -

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"]

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

Scipio8

 

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

you have no idea what you are talking about, stop implying the Jaguar CPU in both consoles can even use anything close to 60 gb/s in a cycle...

 

when did Sony say 4 extra CU's are garbage ? :lol: 

 

Microsoft has stated and DF has stated that their is diminishing returns on adding CU's around 12-14 CU's, adding more CU's doesnt scale linearly anymore, okay, so Sony is RECOMMENDING, not FORCING, that developers use the 14:4 model, doesnt mean they have to use that CU setup at all.

 

so no, the 4 extra CU's arent useless, because those 4 CU's will be applied to GCN compute, over 400+ gigaflops for awesome physics and everything else while the Xbox One will still be stuck using 12 CU's, 2 LESS then PS4's 14 CU's for graphical rendering and stuck with absolutely no compute from the GCN GPU LOL 

 

so wow PS4 having 2 more CU's for graphical rendering and over 400+ gigaflops dedicated to physics,raytracing audio, compute, everything.

 

sorry to say but either the Xbox One tries to match the PS4 in compute by dedicating CU's to compute, 8:4 if trying to replicate the 14:4 model of the PS4 or its games will suffer HARD when compared to ps4 games and have sucky physics and everything else.

 

oh and BTW, Xbox One CU count isnt in the diminishing returns terroritory of adding CU's to a GCN card, so if it were to even try to match 14:4, you will see even more of a drop per CU because from 1-12 CU's it does scale linearly, meaning a bigger dip in graphical quality, etc

#22 Posted by realguitarhero5 (3898 posts) -

Microsoft seems very confident to me, they are convinced that the Kinect has something to add for everyone whether it be motion games like we've seen on the 360 or voice controls or the fact that you automatically sign in when you pick up the controller.  Plus, the XB1 is launching with Forza 5, which is huge, and getting a new Halo sometime soon.

#23 Posted by OhSnapitz (17616 posts) -

...maybe if Nintendo took a page from M$'s book..  the Wii-U would've sold more. :|

#24 Posted by ReadingRainbow4 (11035 posts) -

I'd say the near constant DC coming out of ms lately is a good sign that shrinkage has occurred.

#25 Posted by tenaka2 (17010 posts) -

I would hope so, the xbone is an awful product. Its the next Zune.

#26 Posted by jer_1 (7245 posts) -
Pretty obvious they are with the daily propaganda they drop about this and that trying to save their image. They've yet to do much right when it comes to the xbone.
#27 Posted by thrillh0 (334 posts) -

[QUOTE="ShoTTyMcNaDeS"]

I was wondering if you all think that with all of the constant talking that MS is doing in regards to all things Xbone if there is a layer of insecurity going into launch? I mean to me it seems like there is a lot of "well we were doing this, but now this is what we are really doing". With all of the CPU and GPU upgrades, the news that your Kinect info doesn't leave the XBOX ONE and on and on. It just seems to be a lot of talk as if they don't have true confidence in their product.

Krelian-co

stop.jpg

#29 Posted by Zophar87 (4324 posts) -

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"][QUOTE="LA-Nighthawk"]If anyone Sony are the insecure ones with how humble they are and how they go out of their way to not step on anyone's toes. Grow a pair. LA-Nighthawk
sony shrunk ms's balls when they announced a GPU with 50% more shaders than X1 and GDDR5 that farts on 10 year old DDR3 all day long.

And Titanfall still has more awards than all PS4 games. Almost like gameplay trounces graphics now and forever.

TitanFall isn't exclusive to Xbone either.

#30 Posted by MoneySha (5 posts) -

I was wondering if you all think that with all of the constant talking that MS is doing in regards to all things Xbone if there is a layer of insecurity going into launch? I mean to me it seems like there is a lot of "well we were doing this, but now this is what we are really doing". With all of the CPU and GPU upgrades, the news that your Kinect info doesn't leave the XBOX ONE and on and on. It just seems to be a lot of talk as if they don't have true confidence in their product.

ShoTTyMcNaDeS

 

It just seems to me, Microsoft is always saying and doing stuff to damage controll... Every time I see a Microsoft or Xbox One artical, they're always mentioning "Sony", "What Sony is doing with PS4", "GDDR5 vs DDR3", "Their games vs PS4 games", "Their system is balanced... blah, blah, blah!" 

So far, Microsoft has proven to be unprofessional, damage controlling, and really, really, childish, ever since the reveal about Xbox One. If Microsoft was so sure about X1, they'd shut up and let the games and the hardware do the talking; instead, they're constantly in gaming forums and on Neogaf, damage controlling... I think that says a lot about their insecurities...

 

For a company that has said before that, "it's not about the hardware, it's about the games", they sure can't seem to shut up about it... This company has spent hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars (enough money to feed a small starving country) on a "gaming console" because they thought they could secure a #1 spot in gaming while, the competition probably hasn't even spent half that.

 

They're feeling scared going into this next gen and it's making them feel "sick"; It's understandable... The pressure and all!!!

#31 Posted by ronvalencia (15065 posts) -

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

ZoomZoom2490
LOL.. X1 has 256bit DDR3 i.e. 68GB/s > Xbox 360's GDDR3 @ 22.4GB/s GDDR3 is based on DDR2. GDDR5 is based on DDR3.
#32 Posted by ronvalencia (15065 posts) -

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"]

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

Scipio8

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

Retail 7850 with 16 CUs @ 860 Mhz > prototype 7850 with 12 CUs @ 860 Mhz.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/768-shader-pitcairn-review,3196-5.html

0702%20Crysis2%20DX11.png

PS4's GCN with 18 CUs @800Mhz with 176 GB/s memory is slightly faster than retail 7850 with 16 CUs @ 860 Mhz with 153.6 GB/s memory.

#33 Posted by TheTruthIsREAL (622 posts) -

Well. The Xbox team is unsure about what they want their product to be. We have seen this since the announcement with all the 180s. So yeah, I think they are insecure about their product.

#34 Posted by ronvalencia (15065 posts) -

[QUOTE="Scipio8"]

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"]

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

xboxiphoneps3

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

you have no idea what you are talking about, stop implying the Jaguar CPU in both consoles can even use anything close to 60 gb/s in a cycle...

when did Sony say 4 extra CU's are garbage ? :lol:

Microsoft has stated and DF has stated that their is diminishing returns on adding CU's around 12-14 CU's, adding more CU's doesnt scale linearly anymore, okay, so Sony is RECOMMENDING, not FORCING, that developers use the 14:4 model, doesnt mean they have to use that CU setup at all.

so no, the 4 extra CU's arent useless, because those 4 CU's will be applied to GCN compute, over 400+ gigaflops for awesome physics and everything else while the Xbox One will still be stuck using 12 CU's, 2 LESS then PS4's 14 CU's for graphical rendering and stuck with absolutely no compute from the GCN GPU LOL

so wow PS4 having 2 more CU's for graphical rendering and over 400+ gigaflops dedicated to physics,raytracing audio, compute, everything.

sorry to say but either the Xbox One tries to match the PS4 in compute by dedicating CU's to compute, 8:4 if trying to replicate the 14:4 model of the PS4 or its games will suffer HARD when compared to ps4 games and have sucky physics and everything else.

oh and BTW, Xbox One CU count isnt in the diminishing returns terroritory of adding CU's to a GCN card, so if it were to even try to match 14:4, you will see even more of a drop per CU because from 1-12 CU's it does scale linearly, meaning a bigger dip in graphical quality, etc

On certain segment, CUs can scale...

I'll post another 768 stream processor GCN, but with lower memory specs i.e. AMD FirePro W5000 SKU.

FirePro_W5000_GPUZ.jpg

FirePro W5000's 102 GB/s video memory bandwidth and has four links to L2 cache pools.

Some gaming benchmarks for AMD FirePro W5000.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/workstation-graphics-card-gaming,review-32643-9.html

7850 = 45.

W5000 = 33.

Crysis2DX11-1080p.png

FirePro W5000's 12 CUs (825 Mhz) scales down from Radeon HD 7850's 16 CUs (860 Mhz).

7850's 45.3 fps / 16 CUs (860Mhz) = 2.831 x 8 CUs = 22.65 fps which roughly matches 7750's 21.5 fps result. 7750 is clocked at 800Mhz.

My scale down theory vs actual results works.

If we use the 7850 and 7750 as the two points for the "line of best fit", FirePro W5000 falls into the expected slot for scaled 12 CUs @ ~800 Mhz i.e. 2.831 x 12 CU = 33.97 fps.

#35 Posted by StrongBlackVine (7790 posts) -

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"]

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

Scipio8

 

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

So you think the X1 is stronger/faster than the PS4? :lol:

#36 Posted by StrongBlackVine (7790 posts) -

Microsoft seems very confident to me, they are convinced that the Kinect has something to add for everyone whether it be motion games like we've seen on the 360 or voice controls or the fact that you automatically sign in when you pick up the controller.  Plus, the XB1 is launching with Forza 5, which is huge, and getting a new Halo sometime soon.

realguitarhero5

Forza is not a system seller like Grand Turismo. Killzone SF will sell more than Forza.

#37 Posted by ronvalencia (15065 posts) -

[QUOTE="Scipio8"]

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"]

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

StrongBlackVine

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

So you think the X1 is stronger/faster than the PS4? :lol:

X1's GPU has superior GPU memory write speeds and triangle rate.

PS4's GPU has superior GPU memory read speeds and CU(ALU/TMUs) count.

#38 Posted by realguitarhero5 (3898 posts) -

[QUOTE="realguitarhero5"]

Microsoft seems very confident to me, they are convinced that the Kinect has something to add for everyone whether it be motion games like we've seen on the 360 or voice controls or the fact that you automatically sign in when you pick up the controller.  Plus, the XB1 is launching with Forza 5, which is huge, and getting a new Halo sometime soon.

StrongBlackVine

Forza is not a system seller like Grand Turismo. Killzone SF will sell more than Forza.

Since when was GT a system seller? Forza trumps Gran Turismo in almost every way. Forza is one of Microsoft's big exclusives and certainly would help sway me if I planned on stooping as low as buying a console. But new Halo and Gears of War games will help the Xbox One, and so will Titanfall.
#39 Posted by timbers_WSU (5753 posts) -

I would hope so, the xbone is an awful product. Its the next Zune.

tenaka2
Laugh worthy post.
#40 Posted by stereointegrity (10529 posts) -

[QUOTE="ZoomZoom2490"]

i dont consider X1 as next-gen console, mostly because it still operates around the same old 128-bit memory interface of DDR3.

Scipio8

lol GDDR5 and DDR3 from the same family, the XB1 actually has higher bandwidth to the CPU than the PS4. ESRAM pi*** on the GDDR5 where it matters. And before you talk about the 18 CUs, the 4 cu's are worth sh** Sony already admited it. That leaves just 2 CU more than XB1. Guess what? the higher clocked GPU will pi** on the extra 2 CU. Sony pulled a fast one and cows fell for it just as last gen.

You really have no clue Wtf you are talking about
#41 Posted by R3FURBISHED (9443 posts) -

It just seems to be a lot of talk as if they don't have true confidence in their product.

ShoTTyMcNaDeS

So a lack of confidence means you talk often about the subject you are insecure about and having confidence means you don't talk about the subject you are so sure of?

come on TC

#42 Posted by Netherscourge (16271 posts) -

Lemmings are insecure about it, that much is certain.

#43 Posted by Shewgenja (6823 posts) -
If anyone Sony are the insecure ones with how humble they are and how they go out of their way to not step on anyone's toes. Grow a pair. LA-Nighthawk
Pfft! Sony had a "Stand and Deliver" moment at E3. You couldn't be more off.
#44 Posted by timbers_WSU (5753 posts) -

Lemmings are insecure about it, that much is certain.

Netherscourge
If people were worried about it they would not buy it right now. Why would you spend $500 if you thought the company were insecure? Dumb people making stupid comments over and over and over....
#45 Posted by campzor (34932 posts) -
so just like lems.
#46 Posted by Caseytappy (2095 posts) -

With this kind of weak specs expecting the system to last 10 years you better be insecure.silversix_

 

That doesn't make sense at all, I would call them over confident .

#47 Posted by HalcyonScarlet (3197 posts) -

They found room to bump up clock speeds on both the CPU and GPU, how is that insecure? If they were that insecure, they would have made major changes as soon as they found out what Sony were doing in February.

#48 Posted by Caseytappy (2095 posts) -

Talking more about the other console and games then the one you want to buy yourself, now that is considered insecure !