Is Halo 4 the greatest love story in gaming this gen? *spoilers*

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#251 Posted by N30F3N1X (8038 posts) -

:|

:lol:

Basinboy

#252 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

[QUOTE="Master_ShakeXXX"]

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]In gimmick: was a masterpiece. DarkLink77

Well said. Btw I was just playing some Deus Ex HR for the first time and I have two thoughts.

One, the intro level and cinematic was epic. Two, the AI is dumb as hell. When are we going to get a stealth game that delivers believable AI?

>Smart AI >Stealth Game Pick one.

I want a stealth game where the AI is completely ruthless and persistent. I'm talking like flipping over tables and furniture, shooting at sh*t, grabbing innocent civilians and putting a gun to their head while calling you a b*tch and demanding that you show yourself, and if you don't they blow their head off. I'm talking checking each and every room for your ass, every nook and cranny, and never giving up. In most games when enemies spot you ya just gotta run and hide and then the dumbasses just magically forget they saw you. I'm sick of that. I want crazy mother f*ckers who hunt my ass down and beat me within an inch of my life.

#253 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"] >Smart AI >Stealth Game Pick one.DarkLink77

Chaos Theory and Thief exist.

Batman's AI while not necessarily razor sharp is actually interesting in how they react to how you're playing. Slowly picking their ranks apart messes with their pattern, makes them more jumpy, makes them far more wreckless and trigger happy. In that sense it's some pretty well thought out AI.

Plus the AI in MGS 4 wasn't exactly dumb either. Yes they were pattern based as well, but f*cking around with them is the sort of stuff that makes the MGS stealth fun in the first place.

Never played Chaos Theory, so no comment. But agreed on the others. I don't remember Theif all that well, to be honest. The AI in MGS4 isn't exactly smart, though.

As far as AI and stealth games go, MGS is one of the better ones. They're still far from intelligent, but atleast they run some kind of search protocol.

#254 Posted by jg4xchamp (49320 posts) -
It's that the PMCs in MGS 4 were fun as hell to mess with. The robots you deal with in Act 4 and 5? F*cking dull as hell.
#255 Posted by DarkLink77 (31762 posts) -
It's that the PMCs in MGS 4 were fun as hell to mess with. The robots you deal with in Act 4 and 5? F*cking dull as hell. jg4xchamp
Well, Act 4 and 5 are pretty poor by comparison to the first three, which are really good. But messing with MGS enemies has always been fun. It wouldn't be MGS anymore if you couldn't do that.
#256 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

[QUOTE="Master_ShakeXXX"]

One, the intro level and cinematic was epic.

jg4xchamp

This is true. That opening mission just conveys all the games many little nuances beautifully, and teaches the player how to properly play the game. It's brilliantly executed, well paced, and gets to the point effeciently. And the stage it sets for the rest of the game? Absolutely marvelous.

Personally I'm afraid it sets the bar too high for the rest of the game, and thus have not bothered to go back because I would like to preserve my current feeling of that game. Simply Epic.

Lol, you didn't have to agree with me on that one. I was just trying to derail the topic, because it sucks.

#257 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

Is the AI in Dishonored any good? I'm thinking about trading Blops 2 for that.

#258 Posted by jg4xchamp (49320 posts) -
[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]It's that the PMCs in MGS 4 were fun as hell to mess with. The robots you deal with in Act 4 and 5? F*cking dull as hell. DarkLink77
Well, Act 4 and 5 are pretty poor by comparison to the first three, which are really good. But messing with MGS enemies has always been fun. It wouldn't be MGS anymore if you couldn't do that.

Act 4 has Shadow Moses and the Metal Gear Rex stuff. What does Act 3 have? A lame follow the whistle guy sequence, a stupid motorcycle chase sequence that is too busy being cinematic before being fun, and probably the 2nd worst boss fight in that game(mantis takes the cake, vamp doesn't really count). That act sucked balls. Act 4 had homage points. Can't hate on homage points.
#259 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]It's that the PMCs in MGS 4 were fun as hell to mess with. The robots you deal with in Act 4 and 5? F*cking dull as hell. DarkLink77
Well, Act 4 and 5 are pretty poor by comparison to the first three, which are really good. But messing with MGS enemies has always been fun. It wouldn't be MGS anymore if you couldn't do that.

Blasphemy. Act 4 was the highpoint of the game. Except for Otacon crying. that kind of pissed on the awesomeness, but then a batsh*t crazy mech sequence breaks out and totally makes up for it.

#260 Posted by jg4xchamp (49320 posts) -

Is the AI in Dishonored any good? I'm thinking about trading Blops 2 for that.

Master_ShakeXXX
They won't challenge you much on a stealth level no. The game is awesome though.
#261 Posted by DarkLink77 (31762 posts) -
[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]It's that the PMCs in MGS 4 were fun as hell to mess with. The robots you deal with in Act 4 and 5? F*cking dull as hell. jg4xchamp
Well, Act 4 and 5 are pretty poor by comparison to the first three, which are really good. But messing with MGS enemies has always been fun. It wouldn't be MGS anymore if you couldn't do that.

Act 4 has Shadow Moses and the Metal Gear Rex stuff. What does Act 3 have? A lame follow the whistle guy sequence, a stupid motorcycle chase sequence that is too busy being cinematic before being fun, and probably the 2nd worst boss fight in that game(mantis takes the cake, vamp doesn't really count). That act sucked balls. Act 4 had homage points. Can't hate on homage points.

...Damn I totally forgot what you do in Act 3. Guess it must not have been that good. So yes, I revise that statement. Act 4 was good. Act 3 and 5 suck.
#262 Posted by FireSpirit117 (1981 posts) -

I never really stopped being there. I thought those ads were really well done. I don't think you need the EU stuff to believe that the Chief can do anything. That's been made pretty obvious in the games. Well, that wasn't the intention at all. Sorry if came off that way. :(DarkLink77
No, but it made them feel a little more meaningful, for me at least.

Thanks...

#263 Posted by DarkLink77 (31762 posts) -

Thanks...

FireSpirit117

Oh, God. Why the ellipses?

#264 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"][QUOTE="DarkLink77"] Well, Act 4 and 5 are pretty poor by comparison to the first three, which are really good. But messing with MGS enemies has always been fun. It wouldn't be MGS anymore if you couldn't do that.DarkLink77
Act 4 has Shadow Moses and the Metal Gear Rex stuff. What does Act 3 have? A lame follow the whistle guy sequence, a stupid motorcycle chase sequence that is too busy being cinematic before being fun, and probably the 2nd worst boss fight in that game(mantis takes the cake, vamp doesn't really count). That act sucked balls. Act 4 had homage points. Can't hate on homage points.

...Damn I totally forgot what you do in Act 3. Guess it must not have been that good. So yes, I revise that statement. Act 4 was good. Act 3 and 5 suck.

Act 5 wasn't bad. The level opened up a little bit and gave you some more opportunities for doing super stealthy stuff, and ended with a cool boss fight.

In retrospect act 3 is the only one that doesn't hold up well.

#265 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

[QUOTE="Master_ShakeXXX"]

Is the AI in Dishonored any good? I'm thinking about trading Blops 2 for that.

jg4xchamp

They won't challenge you much on a stealth level no. The game is awesome though.

That's... disappointing to hear. My dream of a stealth oriented game with awesome AI continues to just be a dream.

#266 Posted by Ly_the_Fairy (8652 posts) -

There's a love between me, and Halo 4, which is beautiful enough in itself.

#267 Posted by tenaka2 (17040 posts) -

Just going to play through the campaign now and find out, I will post my findings.

#268 Posted by tenaka2 (17040 posts) -

Meh, was ok I guess.

#269 Posted by skrat_01 (33767 posts) -

It was sad but not that sad. Now Dom's death...That was sad.dreman999
I wouldn't say it was sad, it was hilarious. Seriously, the flashback,s Dom's constant 'wah wah my wife, my wife, my wife'; it was like watching space marines partaking in a highschool drama production.

I haven't played Gears 3's campaign, and I've only seen the infamous 'Daaaaaaaad' cutscene, but I've heard good things, and interviews with the writer that I read in Edge were absolutely fantastic - she seemed to get it. The problem with a game like Gears, is that there's only so much you can do with it; the mechanical premise and narrative context are pretty thick boundaries to write a story with characters that reach outside of the predictable lines; or carry emotional gravity.

Personally I liked Gears 1's no nonsense approach to story almost well aware it doesn't matter, but hey, I'll give 3 a go eventually.

I love me some Catherine. jg4xchamp
Ah but how about some Katherine?

So just played the trial version of To the Moon..... and oh boy is the dialogue terrible. It feels like it's written by either a high school wannabe or a college freshman trying to get a sitcom going. I feel like the entire game simply aims to be emotionally manipulative, but if there's any merit, it's playing through the actual premise, which is quite similar to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, though a bit more simple and saccharine. Yeah, I do want to play Catherine, it looks absolutely legit from everything I've seen. Deadly Premonition too. What did you think of Thirty Flights of Loving?FrozenLiquid
Gaaah that's a shame. Maybe it picks up over time? I've found that can be the case often enough, but still that doesn't bode well. Had a feeling it would be like Enternal Sunshine, which is a great premise to tackle; but still I like to think it does something a bit more interesting with those ideas, without straying too deep into basic emotional manipulation. Who knows, it might work like that and be better for it. Interestingly enough I started playing through Gemi Rue again properly, and there's that same stigma; some just cringeworthy writing here and there - and why of all things did they name the protagonist Azriel Odin. But still, it can be overlooked.

Hopefully To the Moon turns out to be the same.

You really should, I think you'll get a kick out of them. Also, if you're interested in a pretty ballsy, unique approach to game narrative, that's full of glorious cheese (like a Saturday morning cartoon), and well aware of it - Driver San Francisco. I still haven't played much of it, but the way it's written in combination with the game mechanics is surprisingly sublime, and interestingly enough it had the writer Tom Jubert onboard who has a pretty excellent blog about this kind of thing. It's more or less a cartoon Life on Mars meets Bullit / X car chase film.

I thought Thirty Flights was pretty good. Didn't quite have the same kick as Gravity Bone, but it was trying to do very different things. Ireally like how it fragmented the story, and added in the jump cuts, but the finale didn't quite add up to Gravity Bone's climax in terms of how the story wrapped up (the whole end bit of Gravity Bone isgodamn sublime). That and I really didn't like the whole 'this is how flight works' thing at the end. I adore Brendan Chung's work and all, and know he's doing it justbecause for a chuckle, but gah, didn't gel.

That and the removal of game mechanics, despite having so much about the action and movement seemed to do more harm then good. I never got an impression of what my characterdid. The other twodid things you didn't. You weren't the guns and mechanical dude, or the sniper who bakes, or even a super sneaky super spy - like in Gravity bone. You just walk; which considering the whole spy premise and all the rushing and action didn't gel to me. Ain't a Dear Esther in that regard.

But otherwise I enjoyed it, quite a bit! Have you given it a burl? What did you think?

#270 Posted by jg4xchamp (49320 posts) -

@Skrat

[spoiler] I thought the game almost made it too obvious she wasn't real or that she was a demon. I mean yeah totally free spirit vs order and balance and stuff was nice, but it kind of cheapens the decision making.

My personal favorite part of the game is how it never explains the morality thing, but you just naturally react to it because blue means good, red means bad right? pfft sike...it has nothing to do with morality what so ever. F*cking brilliant. The questions it asked were goofy, but some of them were really vague, and then out of nowhere the game gets more direct with it. I had my finacee watch some of that stuff, and I had to be careful about what I picked lol [/spoiler]

Game is legit though. Lots of great story stuff, I love its take on relationships, and the puzzles were really good in between some lame ones. Plus the game instantly had me hooked when it opens up with Vince looking at Catherines finger tapping on the table. Was like "Yep, I KNOW THAT FINGER BRO, I know your pain" :lol:

#271 Posted by FrozenLiquid (12819 posts) -

[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="skrat_01"] Still have to play To the Moon, constantly hearing praise about it, still to this day. I've been put off by enough horrible pretentious, angsty anime - as much as I've seen some really excellent stuff, and the same goes for games (though I never cared for Final Fantasy or have tried to touted Persona games), but I'd recommend Catherine. It falls into a few trappings, but it's honestly one of the best games I've played this year. It's Qubert with a theme of infidelity and some excellent writing and really memorable characters; and better yet it's a game that I've seen surprise people who aren't familiar with games, to people who know them back to front. Pretty good stuff. Also, Deadly Premonition. On a mechanical level there's so much wrong with it, and the climax is something else entirely - but that doesn't matter. It's that strong blend of a Japanese interpretation of North America and Twin Peaks, with their own sensibilities coursing right through it. It's great.PannicAtack

So just played the trial version of To the Moon..... and oh boy is the dialogue terrible. It feels like it's written by either a high school wannabe or a college freshman trying to get a sitcom going. I feel like the entire game simply aims to be emotionally manipulative, but if there's any merit, it's playing through the actual premise, which is quite similar to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, though a bit more simple and saccharine.

Well, I take it you didn't like Neil.

Well, that's a bummer.

Yeah, Neil was a dealbreaker. His character reminded me of what I use to write when I first got into screenwriting. I also didn't like the silly "hey I'll die so you can finish the house" idea. Honestly, it feels really inauthentic, and the nigh on intellectually offensive when someone says "You'd rather her live than let her die? You selfish, arrogant, prick!".

There are some cool moments however, like the early banter with the children. It almost feels as if the writer, Kan Gao, needs to live a little bit more to write some great stuff. I'll probably buy it a little later to see where it goes, though.

#272 Posted by Vaasman (11688 posts) -

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]

[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"] So just played the trial version of To the Moon..... and oh boy is the dialogue terrible. It feels like it's written by either a high school wannabe or a college freshman trying to get a sitcom going. I feel like the entire game simply aims to be emotionally manipulative, but if there's any merit, it's playing through the actual premise, which is quite similar to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, though a bit more simple and saccharine.FrozenLiquid

Well, I take it you didn't like Neil.

Well, that's a bummer.

Yeah, Neil was a dealbreaker. His character reminded me of what I use to write when I first got into screenwriting. I also didn't like the silly "hey I'll die so you can finish the house" idea. Honestly, it feels really inauthentic, and the nigh on intellectually offensive when someone says "You'd rather her live than let her die? You selfish, arrogant, prick!".

There are some cool moments however, like the early banter with the children. It almost feels as if the writer, Kan Gao, needs to live a little bit more to write some great stuff. I'll probably buy it a little later to see where it goes, though.

:? If you simply think the idea that they can't pay for a house and a medical operation is forced, I won't argue that, nor will I argue with you about the dialogue. I find the characters likeable and the dialogue largely solid, so to each his own I suppose.

But don't you think you're being a bit hard on the game, to question the motivations of characters 1 hour in? Especially the characters you've barely met by the end of the first hour.

#273 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

Just going to play through the campaign now and find out, I will post my findings.

tenaka2

Meh, was ok I guess.

tenaka2

lmao

#274 Posted by tenaka2 (17040 posts) -

[QUOTE="tenaka2"]

Just going to play through the campaign now and find out, I will post my findings.

Master_ShakeXXX

Meh, was ok I guess.

tenaka2

lmao

Ta :)

#275 Posted by FireSpirit117 (1981 posts) -

[QUOTE="FireSpirit117"]

Thanks...

DarkLink77

Oh, God. Why the ellipses?

Sorry, didn't know what I was thinking that time.

[spoiler] check PM [/spoiler]

#276 Posted by PannicAtack (21040 posts) -
[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]

[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"] So just played the trial version of To the Moon..... and oh boy is the dialogue terrible. It feels like it's written by either a high school wannabe or a college freshman trying to get a sitcom going. I feel like the entire game simply aims to be emotionally manipulative, but if there's any merit, it's playing through the actual premise, which is quite similar to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, though a bit more simple and saccharine.FrozenLiquid

Well, I take it you didn't like Neil.

Well, that's a bummer.

Yeah, Neil was a dealbreaker. His character reminded me of what I use to write when I first got into screenwriting. I also didn't like the silly "hey I'll die so you can finish the house" idea. Honestly, it feels really inauthentic, and the nigh on intellectually offensive when someone says "You'd rather her live than let her die? You selfish, arrogant, prick!".

There are some cool moments however, like the early banter with the children. It almost feels as if the writer, Kan Gao, needs to live a little bit more to write some great stuff. I'll probably buy it a little later to see where it goes, though.

I actually really like Neil, because he actually gets some surprising character development. I also find that the banter helps to relieve the "serious" moments to keep them from getting too overbearing.
#277 Posted by DontGetBigIdeas (233 posts) -
This thread = STOP ENJOYING SOMETHING I DON'T LIKE. STOP. GUYS. STOP!
#278 Posted by dreman999 (10748 posts) -
[QUOTE="DarkLink77"] [QUOTE="dreman999"][QUOTE="DarkLink77"] How was in not corny? We'll forget the the parts where a lot of the emotional heartstring-pulls are just outright wrong (as in cannot happen), but there only difference is that the Chief speaks more in 4 (less boday language characterization), and Cortana is actually full-on Rampant. She's not in Halo 3. She's just being controlled by the Gravemind.

That does not make it corny. MC clearly is a stiff military person. In Halo 4 it made clear. And Cortana is going mad while dying. How else is she going to act? And about Halo 3...That is still not character growth.

She's not. But she doesn't develop as a character while going mad. She's still Cortana. Chief is still Chief. Being sad because your friend is dying is not character development. Never said it was, so no idea where you're getting that from.

1. And they both have little character development before. 2.How is someone dying not character growth or development?
#279 Posted by dreman999 (10748 posts) -
[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="dreman999"][QUOTE="DarkLink77"] It doesn't matter how others treat him. :| Okay, I'm done discussing this with you.

But it does. What make an epic character is how he acts not how other treat him. A character does no become a symbolic because people solute him.

Most epic characters do not change, especially in mythology. Achilles does not change. He's the same in the beginning of Illiad as he is at the beginning. No, characters become symbolic because they jump out of ships with bombs so they can blow up capital ships single-handedly.

Hercules changed. Odysseus changed. Perseus changed. Theseus changed.
#281 Posted by dreman999 (10748 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]

[QUOTE="dreman999"] And what symbol did they make MCDarkLink77

Essentially he was the UNSC's Superman.

Link might not give enough crap to Bungie for sucking(because they suck at a high level), but I understand what he means by how Bungie presented him. He was never presented as some complex character, and I don't think Bungie ever made that his thing. He was gordon freeman like, but more so as this like last remaining Superhero.

The way Bungie presented the series it was like Chief was the last spartan, that last weapon the UNSC pulls out when all else has failed. The UNSC tends to be in awe of his presence, and injured soliders act like a savior has just come to save them. Hell given all the biblical gutter trash bungie throws in their game(bungie), how if I'm not mistaken only Chief gets called Reclaimer, and how the Covenant dubs him The Demon yeah I would say he was more a symbolic hero in this franchise under Bungies reign.

Halo 4s plot just comes off weird. This guy with the way the Halo series goes should have become this all mighty legend among the UNSC(especially spartans), but you get the impression that no one gives a sh1t that Chief is suddenly still alive after 4 years. I mean you have one character out right being a douche to him. Which just comes off contradicting Chief's place and what chief would logically represent in this universe after a 4 year hiatus.

Admittedly it could be proper retconning if 343 is gong in another direction, and I'm not against that. For instance I don't want them to do a Superman film by the book, but at the same time I don't want them to miss the f*cking point of Superman in the first place. And in that regard DarkLink has a point here.

Under Bungie: Masterchief might as well be Superman
Under 343: He's a person, who just happened to have gone through a lot of sh1t.

Thank you.

Finally, someone who was paying attention.

I'm sorry but you can take anyone with the same abilities and trade them with MC and know would know the difference. A symbol is not just epic acts alone. Sorry but how someone treats you don't make you a symbol. Also, it's not the case halo4 that no one gives a crap but it's the case the the Captin of the infinity was an ass and they have spartans to spares. Added, the had not time the throw you a party because you facing an alien invasion.
#282 Posted by PannicAtack (21040 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="dreman999"]But it does. What make an epic character is how he acts not how other treat him. A character does no become a symbolic because people solute him.dreman999
Most epic characters do not change, especially in mythology. Achilles does not change. He's the same in the beginning of Illiad as he is at the beginning. No, characters become symbolic because they jump out of ships with bombs so they can blow up capital ships single-handedly.

Hercules changed. Odysseus changed. Perseus changed. Theseus changed.

Heracles.

/smartass

#283 Posted by cain006 (8625 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="dreman999"]But it does. What make an epic character is how he acts not how other treat him. A character does no become a symbolic because people solute him.dreman999
Most epic characters do not change, especially in mythology. Achilles does not change. He's the same in the beginning of Illiad as he is at the beginning. No, characters become symbolic because they jump out of ships with bombs so they can blow up capital ships single-handedly.

Hercules changed. Odysseus changed. Perseus changed. Theseus changed.

Most Greek myths don't even make sense, they're not really great stories. I mean the heroes are morons sometimes and really smart when they need to be. And tell me how those characters changed, pretty much all the greek heroes are very shallow characters.

#284 Posted by PressXtoJump (1493 posts) -
the story was great, truly amazing, it was so good i played the game over and over again just to notice all the fine details threaded within the story. the characters and the facial maskpressions really added alot of emotion and character
#285 Posted by Chuubby (416 posts) -

Cortana has allways been a really annoying character so it was satisfying to see her die.

#286 Posted by jg4xchamp (49320 posts) -

I'm sorry but you can take anyone with the same abilities and trade them with MC and know would know the difference. A symbol is not just epic acts alone. Sorry but how someone treats you don't make you a symbol. Also, it's not the case halo4 that no one gives a crap but it's the case the the Captin of the infinity was an ass and they have spartans to spares. Added, the had not time the throw you a party because you facing an alien invasion.dreman999
It's a matter of execution.

Bungie's execution might be off, but the idea is there. Chief's never portrayed or even attempted to be mentioned as this dynamic character. In their games he is a glorified weapon. He's superhero status. Bungie just preferred to use him as a mute gordon freeman like character for the player to project their thoughts on him(it's what they do with Rookie in ODST, and noble 6 in Reach, but even more so).

But the idea of a symbol has everything to do with how you get treated. A martyr becomes a martyr based on how everyone reacts to him. Superman and Batman aren't just symbolic in their universes for what they do, but how the people/their enemies look at them. The comics just do a better job portraying those characters significantly better than what Bungie does with Chief. Who in their games is a Brick.

As for the alien invasion. That's all fine and dandy, but the notion that they react so nonchalant is ridiculous. In Halo 2 he was already a major hero for humanity. After what he did in Halo 3 essentially saving the human race, ending the covenant war, and hey lets throw the galaxy in for good measure he should be on a whole different level of legendary level superhero to them.

The fact that no one has seen him in 4 years. He's become this all time great hero for their society. And then suddenly is back, to top it off in a big time moment again? Their reunion should have something more going for it. To put it another way it's like the opening stretch of Reach. Where the Spartans discover the Covenant have found Reach, and the UNSC command almost gives off this reaction like it's not that big of a deal. When really it should have been a holy sh1t moment for them.

Then again 343 had every reason in the world to not shoe horn in the UNSC and The Covenant, and did it anyway. But that's another issue enirely.

#287 Posted by FireSpirit117 (1981 posts) -
^^^They still consider him a hero in Halo 4, but it's just incredibly downplayed. The Spartan 4s seem to look up to him I've noticed, which makes sense.
#288 Posted by jg4xchamp (49320 posts) -
^^^They still consider him a hero in Halo 4, but it's just incredibly downplayed. The Spartan 4s seem to look up to him I've noticed, which makes sense.FireSpirit117
That's just it, it's downplayed. I get that 343 wants to add more layers to chief, and maybe challenge the machine Bungie created(as lame as that dialogue was). But the surrounding characters should at this point be ready to give him a HJ if he asked for it. His reunion lacks any impact what so ever. It's almost completely brushed off. It does no justice to the character, and it really does no justice towards its audience either.
#289 Posted by DarkLink77 (31762 posts) -
[QUOTE="FireSpirit117"]^^^They still consider him a hero in Halo 4, but it's just incredibly downplayed. The Spartan 4s seem to look up to him I've noticed, which makes sense.jg4xchamp
That's just it, it's downplayed. I get that 343 wants to add more layers to chief, and maybe challenge the machine Bungie created(as lame as that dialogue was). But the surrounding characters should at this point be ready to give him a HJ if he asked for it. His reunion lacks any impact what so ever. It's almost completely brushed off. It does no justice to the character, and it really does no justice towards its audience either.

This. You would think the savior of the human race would be met with a little more than, "Sup, bro?" on the part of most everyone, save for Del Rio, who treats him with outright disrespect.
#290 Posted by FireSpirit117 (1981 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"][QUOTE="FireSpirit117"]^^^They still consider him a hero in Halo 4, but it's just incredibly downplayed. The Spartan 4s seem to look up to him I've noticed, which makes sense.DarkLink77
That's just it, it's downplayed. I get that 343 wants to add more layers to chief, and maybe challenge the machine Bungie created(as lame as that dialogue was). But the surrounding characters should at this point be ready to give him a HJ if he asked for it. His reunion lacks any impact what so ever. It's almost completely brushed off. It does no justice to the character, and it really does no justice towards its audience either.

This. You would think the savior of the human race would be met with a little more than, "Sup, bro?" on the part of most everyone, save for Del Rio, who treats him with outright disrespect.

Like I said, it's still there. It's just poorly emphasized.

#291 Posted by locopatho (20438 posts) -

Nah, I don't think of it as a love story, well not romantic love anyway.

She IS a computer program for gosh sake.

[spoiler]

As a story of a partnership that stood the test of time, through thick and thin, and is now breaking apart and there's nothing either of them can do to stop it... it was pretty dam awesome. I loved how both Chief and Cortana had a range of reactions from denial ("I'm fine!" "Just focus") to hope ("We can get back to Halsey, she can fix me!") to acceptance ("I gotta stay behind so you can live") and despair (Chief freaking out and standing staring out the starship in the ending) It wasn't amazing but it was better then most game stories, and much better then Bungies "You are the final hope of Earth!" stuff imo.

[/spoiler]

Btw just looking at some of the ads/trailers you guys linked, they actually are faaaar more epic and emotionally stirring then anything in the Halo games, I wonder why that is? Imagine if Reach was as good as it's "Deliver Hope" trailer for example :shock:

After what he did in Halo 3 essentially saving the human race, ending the covenant war, and hey lets throw the galaxy in for good measure he should be on a whole different level of legendary level superhero to them.

The fact that no one has seen him in 4 years. He's become this all time great hero for their society. And then suddenly is back, to top it off in a big time moment again? Their reunion should have something more going for it. jg4xchamp

Yeah that was a problem I had. It's essentially as if Jesus Christ just strolled into the room and said "Hey guys, I'm back to end some more SIN!" and everyone just sorta said "Cool" and then one guy yelled at him...

#292 Posted by VoodooHak (15989 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="jg4xchamp"] That's just it, it's downplayed. I get that 343 wants to add more layers to chief, and maybe challenge the machine Bungie created(as lame as that dialogue was). But the surrounding characters should at this point be ready to give him a HJ if he asked for it. His reunion lacks any impact what so ever. It's almost completely brushed off. It does no justice to the character, and it really does no justice towards its audience either. FireSpirit117

This. You would think the savior of the human race would be met with a little more than, "Sup, bro?" on the part of most everyone, save for Del Rio, who treats him with outright disrespect.

Like I said, it's still there. It's just poorly emphasized.

Context. Who are these people that are greeting him? I would expect them to be the silent professionals that are typical of their rank. If anything, you could hear the regular marines and even the younger spartans do a double take or make a comment. That seemed fine to me.

I definitely would not expect anyone to hold a parade or swoon in his presence. That would be extremely cheesy. I think Commander Lasky showed an appropriate amount of reserved admiration, realizing that there are more important things to do than act all star-struck.

#293 Posted by DarkLink77 (31762 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="jg4xchamp"] That's just it, it's downplayed. I get that 343 wants to add more layers to chief, and maybe challenge the machine Bungie created(as lame as that dialogue was). But the surrounding characters should at this point be ready to give him a HJ if he asked for it. His reunion lacks any impact what so ever. It's almost completely brushed off. It does no justice to the character, and it really does no justice towards its audience either. FireSpirit117

This. You would think the savior of the human race would be met with a little more than, "Sup, bro?" on the part of most everyone, save for Del Rio, who treats him with outright disrespect.

Like I said, it's still there. It's just poorly emphasized.

Indeed. I just feel like it should have been more overt, and his surviving should have been a little more, "We thought you were dead. Like, we built monuments to you."
#294 Posted by meconate (10476 posts) -
Pfft, no. Portal has the best love story.
#295 Posted by dxmcat (1202 posts) -

I bet the Halo 4 love story is way more intense than the Gears one.

#296 Posted by meconate (10476 posts) -

I bet the Halo 4 love story is way more intense than the Gears one.

dxmcat

Dude, no. Dom and Marcus's love was true, I was expecting their first kiss... but it never did.

#297 Posted by themagicbum9720 (6505 posts) -
No, that would be arbitor and the PS3.Stevo_the_gamer
:lol:
#298 Posted by dreman999 (10748 posts) -

[QUOTE="dreman999"] I'm sorry but you can take anyone with the same abilities and trade them with MC and know would know the difference. A symbol is not just epic acts alone. Sorry but how someone treats you don't make you a symbol. Also, it's not the case halo4 that no one gives a crap but it's the case the the Captin of the infinity was an ass and they have spartans to spares. Added, the had not time the throw you a party because you facing an alien invasion.jg4xchamp

It's a matter of execution.

Bungie's execution might be off, but the idea is there. Chief's never portrayed or even attempted to be mentioned as this dynamic character. In their games he is a glorified weapon. He's superhero status. Bungie just preferred to use him as a mute gordon freeman like character for the player to project their thoughts on him(it's what they do with Rookie in ODST, and noble 6 in Reach, but even more so).

But the idea of a symbol has everything to do with how you get treated. A martyr becomes a martyr based on how everyone reacts to him. Superman and Batman aren't just symbolic in their universes for what they do, but how the people/their enemies look at them. The comics just do a better job portraying those characters significantly better than what Bungie does with Chief. Who in their games is a Brick.

As for the alien invasion. That's all fine and dandy, but the notion that they react so nonchalant is ridiculous. In Halo 2 he was already a major hero for humanity. After what he did in Halo 3 essentially saving the human race, ending the covenant war, and hey lets throw the galaxy in for good measure he should be on a whole different level of legendary level superhero to them.

The fact that no one has seen him in 4 years. He's become this all time great hero for their society. And then suddenly is back, to top it off in a big time moment again? Their reunion should have something more going for it. To put it another way it's like the opening stretch of Reach. Where the Spartans discover the Covenant have found Reach, and the UNSC command almost gives off this reaction like it's not that big of a deal. When really it should have been a holy sh1t moment for them.

Then again 343 had every reason in the world to not shoe horn in the UNSC and The Covenant, and did it anyway. But that's another issue enirely.

With reach it was not a case they did not react. Just a case they just did what they need to do. Just because they did not go to the extreme of the action dos not mean they did not react. You have to not that an alien invation oversteps going out of you way to welcome a hero. And I'm glad you brought up Superman and batman into this. Because you missing the thing here that make the epic heros, what they stand for. Both have strong moral they stand on.It's not just actions alone that make you a symbol. It also character.
#299 Posted by dreman999 (10748 posts) -
[QUOTE="FireSpirit117"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"] This. You would think the savior of the human race would be met with a little more than, "Sup, bro?" on the part of most everyone, save for Del Rio, who treats him with outright disrespect.DarkLink77

Like I said, it's still there. It's just poorly emphasized.

Indeed. I just feel like it should have been more overt, and his surviving should have been a little more, "We thought you were dead. Like, we built monuments to you."

Your telling me that these people should take the time to bow to a hero in the middle of an invasion?
#300 Posted by DarkLink77 (31762 posts) -
[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="FireSpirit117"]Like I said, it's still there. It's just poorly emphasized.dreman999
Indeed. I just feel like it should have been more overt, and his surviving should have been a little more, "We thought you were dead. Like, we built monuments to you."

Your telling me that these people should take the time to bow to a hero in the middle of an invasion?

I'm saying that a little more "Sir, you're not gonna believe this" would have gone a long way.