Investors want MS CEO to dump Xbox Brand

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#151 Posted by SEANMCAD (5464 posts) -

@kuu2 said:

@SEANMCAD said:

@kuu2 said:

@hoyalawya said:

I agree that the bolded statement is the vision for the future. However, the vision will not happen in the near future. Content owners and telecom companies have too much invested in their current assets. In the USA, live sports and premium contents (HBO, ShowTime, some cable TV channels) generally cannot be streamed unless you also have subscription to cable. And advertising revenues on TV keep climbing (although slowly) despite declining TV viewership. A live TV ad spot on a popular program/event is worth much more than say a banner on espn.com. TV will not die in the near future. To me, the short-term approach is what the Xbox One is trying to do. Marry the cable box with online contents, games and mobile computing devices (Smartglass - although it sucks now, the potential is there). The key is how to keep people on your system and not switch to other boxes for contents not available on your device. Microsoft has shown its innovation in this area. I wouldn't be surprise if the Amazon, Google and Apple boxes follow the same HDMI-in approach when they release their respective boxes.

And nowhere are games even mentioned. I can do all that with a $100 Rocku box.

Steam Machine will be one of the biggest boondoggles we will see since the 3DO. No one is going to care about these boxes.

The reason I am focusing so much on non-gaming topics here is because that is what the xbox is. The Xbox is not so much a game machine as it is a living room machine because of all the focus on the cable features. The focus on the cable features is a clear tell that Microsoft does NOT know the future in this space.

In all ways known to man from video, music, communication and well..everything..other than games the Steam Machine wins. So....if they do in fact make Linux more viable you can kiss both xbox and ps4 goodbye.

Games are played in the living room though and MSoft was the first console to really consolidate everything. Steam Boxes are going to be a very niche product and I don't think even Valve knows who they are targeted at. If you asked someone on the street what a steambox was you might get slapped in the face.....XD

Alas though we have taken this way off topic but I do love the discussion.

yes I dont want this to turn into a steam vs xbox debate but what I am trying to explain is that Microsoft not seeing that cable TV is NOT the future is a tell that they are not doing a good job on the long haul. They did bother to read and study the known facts.

and when it comes to people interested in games the numbers away from cable is even larger. Did you know that 80% of MLG viewers do not have cable TV?

#152 Posted by nintendoboy16 (26076 posts) -

Well, it's not the first time investors advise stupid ideas.

#153 Posted by SEANMCAD (5464 posts) -

@kuu2 said:

@SEANMCAD said:

@kuu2 said:
@Animal-Mother said:

Yes because Microsoft has had profound vision..... Getting into the games market was Just so much of MS vision that the other companies stole that idea before it was even conceived that MS would go into console gaming. I like podcasting with you more. You sound so mean when you type!

From the beginning this has been more than games for MSoft. It is a battle for the living room, and TV is a part of that no matter what shape that will take in the future. It is the reason that MSoft has games yes, but has partnered with the NFL, has its own video/music store, and integrated Skype interaction. You are correct their vision was never entirely games. In essence I think it started with the collaboration on the Dreamcast just like Sony with the Nintendo CD attachment.

the internet in the living room is a question but to be honest TV in the living room is actually questionable.That is where Microsoft lost focus, didnt do proper research.

Just as a side note, the only reason to have cable TV is for sports and I watched the Super Bowl from the internet with no sign in....times they are a changing

It will be interesting to see in the near future. The problem from detaching from Cable or Satallite is really are not detaching. The companies that own ISPs are the same companies that pump in Cable and Satallite. TV will exist it will just be in a different form. MSoft has already mastered how to control Netflix, Amazon Instant Video, Hulu, and other services with Kinect I would also bet money that whatever interation that comes along next they are already working on how to master it. People forget how bare bones the 36o was when it first launched and where it is now, I have full confidence in MSoft continuing to improve on what they started with The One.

sure the companies still get the money but if I do not have cable service (which I dont by the way) why would I be interested in a device that has features for cable?

#155 Posted by clyde46 (43949 posts) -

That's where you're wrong idiot. PS2 had little competition but wasn't 800 bucks. Sony doesn't get lazy like MS does.

*cough* PS3 *cough*

#156 Posted by chikenfriedrice (9670 posts) -

Not going to happen and shouldn't happen

#157 Edited by musicalmac (22810 posts) -

This is an incredibly compelling bit of information, sadly it's not THAT compelling when you really drill down. I mean, the men with the money have the loudest voices, but to spin off Xbox seems unlikely in the short term, and like a death sentence to the brand in the long term.

To be honest, I would be surprised if any of these next gen consoles enjoy much success. The end may be near for the industry as we know it.

#158 Edited by clyde46 (43949 posts) -

This is an incredibly compelling bit of information, sadly it's not THAT compelling when you really drill down. I mean, the men with the money have the loudest voices, but to spin off Xbox seems unlikely in the short term, and like a death sentence to the brand in the long term.

To be honest, I would be surprised if any of these next gen consoles enjoy much success. The end may be near for the industry as we know it.

I see that too, given these new machines are geared towards home media as opposed to just gaming.

#159 Posted by Sagemode87 (788 posts) -

Where the hell did Sony get complacent with the PS3? The 600 dollar price was worth it at the time. The only thing they were behind on was online. Unlike MS who relied solely on multiplats with 360 and barely released exclusives.

#160 Posted by bforrester420 (1191 posts) -

@lostrib said:

@bforrester420 said:

@lostrib said:

You sound really ignorant

You sound like you don't do well with women and come here to compensate.

Lol, that's just funny

As well as accurate.

#161 Edited by BeardMaster (1580 posts) -

Where the hell did Sony get complacent with the PS3? The 600 dollar price was worth it at the time. The only thing they were behind on was online. Unlike MS who relied solely on multiplats with 360 and barely released exclusives.

So with the cows mooing about MS forcing expensive and unwanted technology onto consumers with limited gaming applications... you cant see the parallels? Sure it was worth if you wanted a blu ray player, similar to how an xbox one is worth it if you want a kinect.

#162 Posted by lostrib (32942 posts) -

@lostrib said:

@bforrester420 said:

@lostrib said:

You sound really ignorant

You sound like you don't do well with women and come here to compensate.

Lol, that's just funny

As well as accurate.

Not really, but still funny

#163 Posted by jsmoke03 (12600 posts) -

I would actually buy a Xbox One is someone other than Micro$oft was in control of it.

almost there.

#164 Posted by Jakandsigz (4512 posts) -

Investors want Nintendo to go into mobile, Investors wanted Sega to go bankrupt instead of fusing with Sammy, Investors though it would be a GOOD idea for the Atari U.S. section to bankrupt themselves so that the french company would no longer have control without planning ahead and now we have 2 Ataris, one of which has only 5 employees and we have no idea what they are doing.

Investors told Sony to kill the Playstation in 2009.

Investors told Mattel that they did not have to advertise the microvision, just price it low and sell it at radioshacks, it will sell of brand name alone. Oops?

Investors said that Vtech was losing market to Nintendo, Vtech sold double the consoles Nintendo sold with the Gamecube and close to double the Gameboy Advance with its portable systems.

Investors said that Sega needed a place holder in the U.S. since there would be a delayed release of their next console there. So they made a stop gap that confused customers. Same Investors minus one who folded and left the table said that to make up for it they should release the new consoles in the U.S. early.

Investors said that releasing Bubsy 3D early would be ideal since it was highly anticipated. Ended up with Test Drive being the better seller.

Investors said that video games were dying and that the drops in revenue f the Genesis and Super Nintendo with Slow 3DO sales marked doom, and Atari having 20 million in cash. The 3DO sales picked up by the end of 1995 (not enough however, still 2 million) world wide the Playstation started selling well and the Saturn had a head start so technically it also sold well.

Investors were saying about 12 months ago that the industry was dropping, games were not making enough money for developers, the Wii u was showing that interest was fading and something needed to be done. Than the Xbox One and PS4 sold over a million in one day, the 360 sold 1.3 million in 2 months, the PS3 picked up to about 700,000k, and portable sales rose (although that had more to do with phones than anything but still.)

#165 Posted by DarkGamer007 (6024 posts) -

Investors are incredibly short sighted. If you went with the will of investors, Nintendo would have sold off it's hardware division and we would be playing a free-to-play Super Mario Bros. on our iPhones, complete with microtransactions, for years now. Instead Nintendo turned the 3DS around and made it one of the best consoles you could purchase right now.

Microsoft selling off the Xbox brand would be moronic at best. Xbox is perhaps their best received product line in the market by consumers. People who will refuse to own a computer with Windows on it have purchased Xbox game consoles. It's become the standard device for entertainment at home between Netflix, Hulu, and Video Games. Xbox Live is incredibly successful and is making a massive profit for the company.

#166 Posted by Sagemode87 (788 posts) -

@ Beardmaster

You can't seriously be serious comparing what was 1000 dollars standalone cutting edge tech to a gaming peripheral...... that is nothing new.

#167 Posted by Master_ShakeXXX (13361 posts) -

I hope they stick around, if only to continue making Sony look good.

#168 Edited by WilliamRLBaker (28331 posts) -

Um.....this was known like 2 years let alone the postings about it 1 years ago, There has always been some investors that wanted them to drop bing, the smart phone stuff, and xbox....

I'm confused why this is treated as NEW news...

#169 Posted by Jakandsigz (4512 posts) -

@kuu2 said:

@hoyalawya said:

@SEANMCAD said:

@charizard1605 said:

@balfe1990 said:

Yeah, I believe it also powers Yahoo searches now. Ever since Mayer took over, they just seem to outsource every facet of their business to those more established.

That whole Windows Phone stat comes with some caveats though; namely it's emerging in obscure markets where the iPhone would never have taken off anyway(also because Apple has essentially abandoned those markets, if they ever really had any intention of becoming a powerhouse there in the first place). It's booming in India and the Philippines though, which is great.

Though it won't be approaching Android numbers or even iOS anytime soon. I wish it would, it's a fantastic platform.

@cainetao11

All good man, I'm prone to the odd fart of the brain myself.

India, Phillipines, Mexico, plus many western European territories as well. In other places, it is (understandably) growing faster than iOS and Android.

Point is, Microsoft's consumer business bets are for the long haul- listening to short sighted investors trying to make a quick buck would be disastrous.

there is the problem

internet use is increase, cable tv viewership is declining.

Is Cable TV future proof? no

Is a gaming device that can not handle VR properly future proof? no

Is a living room device that charges you extra money to access the internet future proof? no

Put a Steam Machine in your living room, pay for the internet only once and watch all your content on the internet and disconnect your cable service....THAT is the future

I agree that the bolded statement is the vision for the future. However, the vision will not happen in the near future. Content owners and telecom companies have too much invested in their current assets. In the USA, live sports and premium contents (HBO, ShowTime, some cable TV channels) generally cannot be streamed unless you also have subscription to cable. And advertising revenues on TV keep climbing (although slowly) despite declining TV viewership. A live TV ad spot on a popular program/event is worth much more than say a banner on espn.com. TV will not die in the near future. To me, the short-term approach is what the Xbox One is trying to do. Marry the cable box with online contents, games and mobile computing devices (Smartglass - although it sucks now, the potential is there). The key is how to keep people on your system and not switch to other boxes for contents not available on your device. Microsoft has shown its innovation in this area. I wouldn't be surprise if the Amazon, Google and Apple boxes follow the same HDMI-in approach when they release their respective boxes.

And nowhere are games even mentioned. I can do all that with a $100 Rocku box.

Steam Machine will be one of the biggest boondoggles we will see since the 3DO. No one is going to care about these boxes.

3DO? So the steam box will sell around 2-5 million? That's quite a few football stadiums filled with Steam Machines.

#170 Posted by Animal-Mother (26301 posts) -

@musicalmac: Everything is gonna be PC/Cloud based gaming in the next 10 years anyways. It'll be Service wars soon not system wars. Hahah

#171 Edited by FireEmblem_Man (8558 posts) -

@_Matt_ said:

I can see why they would want to kill Bing and the Surface, they suck balls;

but why Xbox?

Surface is amazing :|

TL;DR- as much as cows probably want Microsoft to dump Xbox (and Bing and Surface and what not), they won't. All of these are integral parts of a long term strategy, and dropping any of them would be extraordinarily stupid and myopic. Then again, investors are usually both, so I can see why they would float this idea so many times.

I too love the Surface! I own the Surface 2!

Anyhoo, I understand why investors want to sell the brand. It isn't because its all about video games nor about its business culture, its about profits. TBH, despite the 360 making a profit and the Xbone as well, they lost a ton of money than they made with the brand itself. The Original Xbox bled a lot of cash, and don't forget the amount of money MS had to pay for the RRoD fiasco. Wait, there's more! MS spend half-billion on marketing the Kinect, how much profits have returned after Kinect was release?

#172 Edited by SEANMCAD (5464 posts) -

I think I found a buyer for the Xbox.

Amazon.

I think that is a perfect fit.

#173 Posted by NFJSupreme (5111 posts) -

Sony investors say the same thing. None of you should be celebrating this because it's all bad news for consoles.

#174 Posted by Innovazero2000 (3128 posts) -

Any retarded fan boy in here hoping for it to happen is an idiot. You don't want MS or Sony controlling the market...

MS just needs to refocus it's direction. The 360 was a hell of a gaming machine up until about 2010/2011...then Kinect came... (As awesome as the technology is....)

#175 Posted by Nonstop-Madness (9466 posts) -

The Xbox brand will never go away but if Xbox (gaming) isn't consistently profitable, Microsoft will drop Xbox because it honestly does not strengthen their other divisions. They are better off heavily investing in the mobile space with Windows 8/Phone 8 and services like Bing, Skype, Xbox Music etc.

Microsoft is not a hardware company. Microsoft is not an entertainment company. Microsoft is a software company and they should stick to it. Microsoft needs to drop the ****shit and realize Windows 8 and Phone 8 are the platforms they should be focusing their services on and not Xbox.

#176 Posted by wis3boi (31004 posts) -

Ummm this happens all the time. Lots of short term investors want parts of companies sold (esp hedge funds) because it generates quick income. This really isn't news.

shhhhh, dont interrupt the circlejerk

#177 Posted by Tessellation (8795 posts) -

Only a virgin basement dweller would want this.. you know the ones that go moo,

#178 Edited by GrenadeLauncher (3599 posts) -

All hail the investors!

All hail the sainted Stephen Elop!

#179 Posted by Jankarcop (8893 posts) -

They should, M$ is a detriment to gaming.

#180 Posted by istreakforfood (7749 posts) -

Only thing I like about Bing are the Bing rewards. I was able to get free amazon credits cause of them :p.

#181 Edited by k2theswiss (16598 posts) -

360 was making profit since on 09, Sure whole xbox brand took a hit with the original xbox but, they had to complete with sony who had a strong hand on the market and they had to get their name out there.

Also x1 is selling better the wii u in it's time frame even at it's price, Also you be dumb not to known the x1 would sell less with the ps4 selling for cheaper.

#182 Posted by musicalmac (22810 posts) -

@musicalmac: Everything is gonna be PC/Cloud based gaming in the next 10 years anyways. It'll be Service wars soon not system wars. Hahah

lol... Not out of the question.

#183 Edited by Vatusus (4337 posts) -

@_Matt_ said:

I can see why they would want to kill Bing and the Surface, they suck balls;

but why Xbox?

because it svck balls aswell?

anyway, I would laugh if that happens cause after all the Sony doom and gloom threads from lems the xbox brand would be the one to "die" first. The fact MS is very well financially would make it even more funnier :D

#184 Posted by kuu2 (6868 posts) -

@Animal-Mother: It is already going that way. Just look at Live and PSN+ vs. Steam.

#185 Edited by LJS9502_basic (149964 posts) -

360 was making profit since on 09, Sure whole xbox brand took a hit with the original xbox but, they had to complete with sony who had a strong hand on the market and they had to get their name out there.

Also x1 is selling better the wii u in it's time frame even at it's price, Also you be dumb not to known the x1 would sell less with the ps4 selling for cheaper.

How the investors feel really has nothing to do with how well Nintendo is doing. Actually with all the gloom and doom in SW about the state of Nintendo and Sony....I can MS being the one to pull the plug before those two.

I think the X! is unde rperforming to MS' standards for what they wanted to achieve. Depending on the investors....this may just be the last. I can actually see MS making an entertainment system sans gaming in the future.

#186 Posted by SEANMCAD (5464 posts) -

I am throwing a prediction out there although I have to admit its not a sure bet in my mind.

Amazon will buy Xbox

#187 Edited by SEANMCAD (5464 posts) -

this...

and I think the CEO choice was a good one and I think the speculations are wise.

#188 Edited by FoxbatAlpha (6024 posts) -

War! Hoooo, Good God Yaw! What is it good for? Absolutely nothing!

#189 Posted by EnergyAbsorber (4893 posts) -

Microsoft may not make the same kind of profit in their gaming division as they do in all of their other divisions but I dont see them exiting out of the console market. The company has too much pride.

#190 Edited by bforrester420 (1191 posts) -

Microsoft may not make the same kind of profit in their gaming division as they do in all of their other divisions but I dont see them exiting out of the console market. The company has too much pride.

I wouldn't be so sure. Gates may no longer be CEO, but he's still Chairman of the Board and a shrewd businessman. If it's economically advantageous to sell or spin off that business segment, they'll do it. It isn't their core business, after all.

#191 Edited by KungfuKitten (20748 posts) -

That would be best for everyone involved.
Valve, Amazon, Nintendo, Sony.
I think 4 'consoles' will be enough.

#192 Posted by inb4uall (5227 posts) -

ITT: Stromyjoe damage controlling

#193 Posted by Cyberdot (3510 posts) -

No value would be lost.

Xbox is inferior.

#194 Edited by musicalmac (22810 posts) -

I don't think the Xbox brand could live independent of MS' cash reserves, which is actually a pretty good argument for why they should just remove it entirely and save themselves the trouble. It's almost too simple, makes it even more convincing.

#195 Edited by ldustin (48 posts) -

They should dump it. They are in the business of making money and they aren't making money from either games or tablets.

#196 Posted by I_can_haz (6551 posts) -

@Cyberdot said:

No value would be lost.

Xbox is inferior.

#197 Edited by blackace (19996 posts) -

@blackace said:
@Animal-Mother said:

Sauce

"Some investors have suggested that Microsoft spin off its money-losing consumer products and focus solely on the enterprise. Even the Xbox deserves to go, Paul Ghaffari, the wealth manager for Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen, said last year."

Very old news and Microsoft already so "NO, the aren't dumping XBox brand." lol

This thread can be closed by mods now.

Microsoft made $6.5 billion net profit in their entertainment division this last quarter where XBox is at. I don't think investors are unhappy with that at all.

Where the hell are you getting your numbers? The Devices and Consumer Hardware division had gross profit margins of $762 million for Fiscal year 2013... Nowhere NEAR the $6.5 billion you claim, and you claimed that was for a single quarter!

http://www.microsoft.com/Investor/EarningsAndFinancials/Earnings/SegmentResults/S2/FY14/Q2/Performance.aspx

Do you even know the difference between PROFIT and REVENUE? It's a shame you didn't learn how to read financial statements when you were busy acing calculus.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/23/5338162/microsoft-q2-2014-financial-earnings

Look again.

Microsoft has published its Q2 2014 earnings report, and the company has made $6.56 billion in net income on $24.52 billion in revenue. Revenue has increased by 14 percent from the same period last year, and net income increased by 2.8 percent.

Dude, don't talk down to me kid.

#198 Posted by blackace (19996 posts) -

Well, it's not the first time investors advise stupid ideas.

And it won't be the last either. Microsoft's stocks have been going up every year. That's all investors need to worry about. Their money is increasing. XBox 360 and XBox Live is have been making money for them for about 5 years now.

#199 Edited by ldustin (48 posts) -

MS has sank billions into the Xbox brand over the last decade. Whatever profit they made last fall from the division, no doubt much of it from Live payments, it doesn't make up for the losses in the long term.

#200 Edited by Gaming-Planet (13863 posts) -

Give Xbox to Samsung. Have the Xbox all-in-one implemented into Samsung televisions with cloud features. Yes, a terrible idea for hardcore gamers, but that's exactly what MS wanted to do with the Xbox One and just look at the focus it has on gamers. Nothing.