I do miss backwards compatability

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#1 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

Sony's PlayStation plan: capture lost Wii owners with PS3 updates

Sony Computer Entertainment head Andrew House says more classic titles will be coming to PS4, for gamers who bought Wii instead of a PS3

Andrew House, head of Sony Computer Entertainment, has told Eurogamer that the company will update and re-release classic PlayStation titles, in an attempt to attract gamers who bought a Wii in the last generation instead of a PS3.

#2 Posted by blue_hazy_basic (27544 posts) -

Yea, if you don't want to get milked for over paying for a previous gen's games, get a PC. Filling in a lack of games by re-releasing your last gen's games with a new coat of paint doesn't cut it. I WANT NEW GAMES!

#3 Edited by silversix_ (14270 posts) -

He's not getting those Wii peeps because they're long gone

#4 Posted by Riverwolf007 (23612 posts) -

i only ever bought one hd remake (ico/sotc) and it was a huge disappointment.

better gfx never made any game better just better looking.

i will probably never buy another after learning my lesson.

#5 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

From a business standpoint I understand, its easy money. I knew it when they dropped BC in the PS3. They were just going to resell games. And they're all guilty of it, but looking at what's been done, Sony is leading the charge no doubt. With MS' restructuring of their Xbox division (people getting fired, entertainment division closed) I bet Gears collection, Alan Wake and American Nightmare, Crackdown collection are at least a thought. Its effin weak imo.

#6 Posted by parkurtommo (26763 posts) -

Nowadays Sony and MS have complete freedom to do whatever the hell they want with their system and the only people who will complain are forumites. Bro gamers are the majority and they don't notice these decisions....

Removing BC is just getting more money, essentially. Costs less to manufacture, you get to resell games, people might have t get an older system just for that game ect.

#7 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (11541 posts) -

Those days are over... Welcome to the days of rereleases and streaming games. All for a price ofcourse...

#8 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

i only ever bought one hd remake (ico/sotc) and it was a huge disappointment.

better gfx never made any game better just better looking.

i will probably never buy another after learning my lesson.

Halo anniversary was the only one I ever bought. I received GoW collection from a girlfriend for birthday, Ico/SotC from her at Christmas. I told my sister in law whose birthday is after mine in Nov, just get me MC Collection. I wont spend my own money on them anymore.

#9 Posted by Blabadon (26150 posts) -

Me too. The less I have to use my PS3 after the PS4, the better

#10 Posted by Gue1 (9764 posts) -

I miss it too and the main reason I still don't have a PS4. And not to mention that the PS4's still missing a shit ton of features that are on PS3 but what hurts me the most, beside BC, is the fact that it doesn't has analog audio output and you have to pay to play online. The freaking thing doesn't even has PS1 BC that could be easily done through software but they dropped Compact Disc support too, so not even through homebrew it will ever be possible.

#11 Posted by SambaLele (5341 posts) -

"Then you're really backwards" - Don Mattrick.

#12 Posted by nini200 (9696 posts) -

I don't miss it since the WiiU has backwards compatibility lol

#13 Posted by Ghost120x (3800 posts) -

Just keep your old console. It's most likely the best way to play older games anyway, with some games being buggy through emulation and such.

#14 Edited by edwardecl (2239 posts) -

There are technical reasons why backwards compatibility is impossible. The only thing they could have realistically done to have backwards compatibility is put a PS3 inside the PS4 like they did the PS3 and the PS2 backwards compatibility. Then everyone would be complaining about the extra $100+ price.

Just buy a fucking PS3 if you want to continue to play PS3 games.

#15 Posted by Demonjoe93 (9553 posts) -

Tell me about it. Backwards compatibility is such an underrated feature in a console.

#16 Posted by Krelian-co (10658 posts) -

Well who would sell their last gen console to get a new one with hardly any games yet, that is not smart.

#17 Posted by AmazonAngry (945 posts) -

I don't

#18 Posted by gago-gago (9445 posts) -

Sony lead the way with taking out BC. Hopefully someone brings at least Arcade games BC over.

#19 Edited by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

There are technical reasons why backwards compatibility is impossible. The only thing they could have realistically done to have backwards compatibility is put a PS3 inside the PS4 like they did the PS3 and the PS2 backwards compatibility. Then everyone would be complaining about the extra $100+ price.

Just buy a fucking PS3 if you want to continue to play PS3 games.

I already own a fucking PS3 thanks guy. I like many here are just expressing a distaste for the future of gaming. Don't like? Don't read.

#20 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

Well who would sell their last gen console to get a new one with hardly any games yet, that is not smart.

Well if they were BC I could just play my old games on the new one. Give me a break with the lack of tech to be able to do this. We have landed robots on mars; have the ability to pin point a missile to a precise target; we have fuckin franks that plump when you cook them!!! We can do anything!!!!!!!!

#21 Posted by handssss (1834 posts) -

ps4 would have been another $599 fiasco if not worse if sony tried to make the machine capable of BC, so people REALLY need to stop blaming them for not including it.

#22 Posted by Krelian-co (10658 posts) -

@Krelian-co said:

Well who would sell their last gen console to get a new one with hardly any games yet, that is not smart.

Well if they were BC I could just play my old games on the new one. Give me a break with the lack of tech to be able to do this. We have landed robots on mars; have the ability to pin point a missile to a precise target; we have fuckin franks that plump when you cook them!!! We can do anything!!!!!!!!

do you really think it's technology related and not price related?

People want a $400 box that makes miracles.

#23 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

@cainetao11 said:

@Krelian-co said:

Well who would sell their last gen console to get a new one with hardly any games yet, that is not smart.

Well if they were BC I could just play my old games on the new one. Give me a break with the lack of tech to be able to do this. We have landed robots on mars; have the ability to pin point a missile to a precise target; we have fuckin franks that plump when you cook them!!! We can do anything!!!!!!!!

do you really think it's technology related and not price related?

People want a $400 box that makes miracles.

I guess I am the only one that has a slight memory of the points others have posted. In other threads I have defended both companies for what others complain about in terms of a lack of power in the consoles. I know it was about money. I'm just having fun here guys. Lighten up.

#24 Edited by Krelian-co (10658 posts) -

@Krelian-co said:

@cainetao11 said:

@Krelian-co said:

Well who would sell their last gen console to get a new one with hardly any games yet, that is not smart.

Well if they were BC I could just play my old games on the new one. Give me a break with the lack of tech to be able to do this. We have landed robots on mars; have the ability to pin point a missile to a precise target; we have fuckin franks that plump when you cook them!!! We can do anything!!!!!!!!

do you really think it's technology related and not price related?

People want a $400 box that makes miracles.

I guess I am the only one that has a slight memory of the points others have posted. In other threads I have defended both companies for what others complain about in terms of a lack of power in the consoles. I know it was about money. I'm just having fun here guys. Lighten up.

suddenly that seems to be the #1 excuse to saying stupid things.

#25 Posted by MBirdy88 (8043 posts) -

most disappointing console generation thus far... its just down hill from here.

Stick with PC, support the dying real-console that is the Wii-U ... ignore the Cow/Lemming graphic whores that don;t seem to care about gameplay in the slightest.

#26 Posted by freedomfreak (39997 posts) -

Nintendo's still chill with that stuff.

#27 Posted by PapaTrop (844 posts) -

Yeah, it sucks.

I figured it would be the trend after Sony dropped b/c on the PS3 slim, and began repackaging old games. There is just too much money to be made doing that.

Though, I don't mind it when it's done right, and in good taste. Things like the Halo MC collection seem great since you get four games, two of which are remastered, and the multiplayer from each game is integrated into one single ultimate multiplayer component. That is worth full price.

If a company is just going to take a game, and give it a resolution boost, then they won't get my money.

#28 Posted by scottpsfan14 (4719 posts) -

I don't

Lets say SONY announced that PS1/PS2 discs were going to be playable on PS4 in 1080p, would you not consider that a major reason to get PS4? And with the option to download games you don't have on PSN? It's a really big thing. Just because you don't miss it, does that mean you would actively object to it?

#29 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

@cainetao11 said:

@Krelian-co said:

@cainetao11 said:

@Krelian-co said:

Well who would sell their last gen console to get a new one with hardly any games yet, that is not smart.

Well if they were BC I could just play my old games on the new one. Give me a break with the lack of tech to be able to do this. We have landed robots on mars; have the ability to pin point a missile to a precise target; we have fuckin franks that plump when you cook them!!! We can do anything!!!!!!!!

do you really think it's technology related and not price related?

People want a $400 box that makes miracles.

I guess I am the only one that has a slight memory of the points others have posted. In other threads I have defended both companies for what others complain about in terms of a lack of power in the consoles. I know it was about money. I'm just having fun here guys. Lighten up.

suddenly that seems to be the #1 excuse to saying stupid things.

Your assessment of stupid things has no bearing on me. I've easily said before I know neither company wanted to sell at massive losses, not my fault you don't remember or that you think I take this place all that seriously.

#30 Posted by mems_1224 (46959 posts) -

Meh, the only PS2 game I ever played on my PS3 was Persona 4. Backwards compatibility is mostly useless now. Old games are only fun to play on PC thanks to modders.

#31 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

Meh, the only PS2 game I ever played on my PS3 was Persona 4. Backwards compatibility is mostly useless now. Old games are only fun to play on PC thanks to modders.

To each his own I guess. I still played Maximo Psychonauts, Oni, SotC, Ico on my BC PS3 sometimes. I always liked the option. But money talks in our world.

#32 Posted by 35cent (898 posts) -

I miss backwards compatibility as well but it would increase the price of the console and people don't like paying €400+ for them so it's generally left on the cutting room floor.

#33 Posted by Netret0120 (2084 posts) -

I miss BC myself so i use my PC to backup my games and play it through an emulator.

Hermits really have it good that BC is never a problem for them. I think it is such a ripoff to have to buy an "HD classic" of a game to play it on my new console.

#34 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

@35cent said:

I miss backwards compatibility as well but it would increase the price of the console and people don't like paying €400+ for them so it's generally left on the cutting room floor.

Agreed. In my second post I said I understand its easy money, but I also understand not wanting to sell the console for a loss.

I miss BC myself so i use my PC to backup my games and play it through an emulator.

Hermits really have it good that BC is never a problem for them. I think it is such a ripoff to have to buy an "HD classic" of a game to play it on my new console.

Just a noob in the PC gaming world. Still so much to learn. It is cool that you can play games from almost any time.

#35 Edited by kinectthedots (1687 posts) -

@cainetao11 said:

From a business standpoint I understand, its easy money. I knew it when they dropped BC in the PS3. They were just going to resell games. And they're all guilty of it, but looking at what's been done, Sony is leading the charge no doubt. With MS' restructuring of their Xbox division (people getting fired, entertainment division closed) I bet Gears collection, Alan Wake and American Nightmare, Crackdown collection are at least a thought. Its effin weak imo.

It's all sony's fault!

Damn Sony for not leaving PS3 $600 while still taking a $200 hit on each system sold, while people complained about the price but still wanting all the features despite Sony's finances going down the drain.

Sony should have included the EE and Cell tech in the PS4 and sold the console at $600 again because everyone appreciated it and that all-in-one "kitchen sink" strategy went over so well for them last gen.

Stupid greedy sony, they should have been saints like MS and installed perfect BC technology in their system and given it away for free/DERP

#36 Edited by LadyBlue (3928 posts) -

He's not getting those Wii peeps because they're long gone

The mobile movement took them.

#37 Edited by HalcyonScarlet (4224 posts) -

A lot of those gamers were super casuals, like the people who only play mobile phone games now. What makes him think they have have a PS4 or are interested in the current gen of gaming.

#38 Edited by Gue1 (9764 posts) -

@kinectthedots said:

@cainetao11 said:

From a business standpoint I understand, its easy money. I knew it when they dropped BC in the PS3. They were just going to resell games. And they're all guilty of it, but looking at what's been done, Sony is leading the charge no doubt. With MS' restructuring of their Xbox division (people getting fired, entertainment division closed) I bet Gears collection, Alan Wake and American Nightmare, Crackdown collection are at least a thought. Its effin weak imo.

It's all sony's fault!

Damn Sony for not leaving PS3 $600 while still taking a $200 hit on each system sold, while people complained about the price but still wanting all the features despite Sony's finances going down the drain.

Sony should have included the EE and Cell tech in the PS4 and sold the console at $600 again because everyone appreciated it and that all-in-one "kitchen sink" strategy went over so well for them last gen.

Stupid greedy sony, they should have been saints like MS and installed perfect BC technology in their system and given it away for free/DERP

PS3 was $600 because of the Cell and blu-ray not because of BC... They removed BC because according to them "no one used it" but then they came up with the digital PS2 classics.

And did you know that each PS2 classic runs on an emulator contrary to what many people believe that the code of the game was customized? If this is not a scam then I don't know what it is.

#39 Posted by cainetao11 (17329 posts) -

@cainetao11 said:

From a business standpoint I understand, its easy money. I knew it when they dropped BC in the PS3. They were just going to resell games. And they're all guilty of it, but looking at what's been done, Sony is leading the charge no doubt. With MS' restructuring of their Xbox division (people getting fired, entertainment division closed) I bet Gears collection, Alan Wake and American Nightmare, Crackdown collection are at least a thought. Its effin weak imo.

It's all sony's fault!

Damn Sony for not leaving PS3 $600 while still taking a $200 hit on each system sold, while people complained about the price but still wanting all the features despite Sony's finances going down the drain.

Sony should have included the EE and Cell tech in the PS4 and sold the console at $600 again because everyone appreciated it and that all-in-one "kitchen sink" strategy went over so well for them last gen.

Stupid greedy sony, they should have been saints like MS and installed perfect BC technology in their system and given it away for free/DERP

May not have been perfect but I was able to play games I owned. So sony doesn't have the most HD or remasters on the market last gen and from the sound of it they aren't cutting back. That all I meant by leading the charge, wipe your butt, its not your fault and its all going to be ok

#40 Edited by kinectthedots (1687 posts) -

@Gue1 said:

@kinectthedots said:

@cainetao11 said:

From a business standpoint I understand, its easy money. I knew it when they dropped BC in the PS3. They were just going to resell games. And they're all guilty of it, but looking at what's been done, Sony is leading the charge no doubt. With MS' restructuring of their Xbox division (people getting fired, entertainment division closed) I bet Gears collection, Alan Wake and American Nightmare, Crackdown collection are at least a thought. Its effin weak imo.

It's all sony's fault!

Damn Sony for not leaving PS3 $600 while still taking a $200 hit on each system sold, while people complained about the price but still wanting all the features despite Sony's finances going down the drain.

Sony should have included the EE and Cell tech in the PS4 and sold the console at $600 again because everyone appreciated it and that all-in-one "kitchen sink" strategy went over so well for them last gen.

Stupid greedy sony, they should have been saints like MS and installed perfect BC technology in their system and given it away for free/DERP

PS3 was $600 because of the Cell and blu-ray not because of BC... They removed BC because according to them "no one used it" but then they came up with the digital PS2 classics.

I know about the history on PS3 bud, telling me "not because of BC" as some kind of reply is an inaccurate statement. Blue-ray was only part of PS3's manufacture price deficit as follows...

How and Why PS2 Compatibility Was Removed

The PS2, released in 2000, used a pair of proprietary Sony-built processors in its chipset. These were the 'Emotion Engine' CPU and the 'Graphics Synthesizer' GPU. These were unique processors with distinct architecture that proved difficult to emulate and expensive to manufacture.

When the PS3 was released in 2006, it contained these two processors specifically for the purpose of running Playstation 2 games; this enabled nearly 100% PS2 compatibility. These were the original CECHA 60gb and CECHB 20gb launch models.

With the system still priced at nearly $600 retail, and production costs over $800 per unit, Sony needed to reduce the cost of manufacture AND reduce the price for consumers. With cheaper and more efficient replacement parts still a few years away, they had to cut costs and remove non-essential parts.

The 'Emotion engine' CPU was subsequently removed, leaving the 'Graphics Synthesizer' GPU combined with software-driven emulation to run PS2 games. Although this reduced production costs, the emulation turned out to be sub-par and resulted in only about 80% of PS2 games being playable. The only models to use this configuration were the CECHE 80gb console and the CECHC 60gb.

Eventually, Sony determined that the sub-par emulation combined with the continued expense of including the PS2 GPU, was not giving them the cost to performance ratio that they needed to achieve. Sony at this point introduced the first non-PS2 compatible PS3. The new 40gb models debuted at $399, a full $200 dollars cheaper than the original 60gb launch models.

Even with all these changes and others to the PS3 Sony was still losing money on every console made. But, with the removal of the backwards compatibility, Sony was able to greatly reduce the cost of the PS3 to the consumer and got much closer to finding the proper performance to cost ratio, that they were looking for.

http://www.semperthree.com/backwards-compatibility.html

#41 Posted by TrappedInABox91 (587 posts) -

Nintendo still rolls with BC.

#42 Edited by kinectthedots (1687 posts) -

@cainetao11 said:

@kinectthedots said:

@cainetao11 said:

From a business standpoint I understand, its easy money. I knew it when they dropped BC in the PS3. They were just going to resell games. And they're all guilty of it, but looking at what's been done, Sony is leading the charge no doubt. With MS' restructuring of their Xbox division (people getting fired, entertainment division closed) I bet Gears collection, Alan Wake and American Nightmare, Crackdown collection are at least a thought. Its effin weak imo.

It's all sony's fault!

Damn Sony for not leaving PS3 $600 while still taking a $200 hit on each system sold, while people complained about the price but still wanting all the features despite Sony's finances going down the drain.

Sony should have included the EE and Cell tech in the PS4 and sold the console at $600 again because everyone appreciated it and that all-in-one "kitchen sink" strategy went over so well for them last gen.

Stupid greedy sony, they should have been saints like MS and installed perfect BC technology in their system and given it away for free/DERP

May not have been perfect but I was able to play games I owned. So sony doesn't have the most HD or remasters on the market last gen and from the sound of it they aren't cutting back. That all I meant by leading the charge, wipe your butt, its not your fault and its all going to be ok

Again, it's all Sony's fault.

I'll post this again and leave this here so your derpness can be enlightened.

How and Why PS2 Compatibility Was Removed

The PS2, released in 2000, used a pair of proprietary Sony-built processors in its chipset. These were the 'Emotion Engine' CPU and the 'Graphics Synthesizer' GPU. These were unique processors with distinct architecture that proved difficult to emulate and expensive to manufacture.

When the PS3 was released in 2006, it contained these two processors specifically for the purpose of running Playstation 2 games; this enabled nearly 100% PS2 compatibility. These were the original CECHA 60gb and CECHB 20gb launch models.

With the system still priced at nearly $600 retail, and production costs over $800 per unit, Sony needed to reduce the cost of manufacture AND reduce the price for consumers. With cheaper and more efficient replacement parts still a few years away, they had to cut costs and remove non-essential parts.

The 'Emotion engine' CPU was subsequently removed, leaving the 'Graphics Synthesizer' GPU combined with software-driven emulation to run PS2 games. Although this reduced production costs, the emulation turned out to be sub-par and resulted in only about 80% of PS2 games being playable. The only models to use this configuration were the CECHE 80gb console and the CECHC 60gb.

Eventually, Sony determined that the sub-par emulation combined with the continued expense of including the PS2 GPU, was not giving them the cost to performance ratio that they needed to achieve. Sony at this point introduced the first non-PS2 compatible PS3. The new 40gb models debuted at $399, a full $200 dollars cheaper than the original 60gb launch models.

Even with all these changes and others to the PS3 Sony was still losing money on every console made. But, with the removal of the backwards compatibility, Sony was able to greatly reduce the cost of the PS3 to the consumer and got much closer to finding the proper performance to cost ratio, that they were looking for.

http://www.semperthree.com/backwards-compatibility.html

Also, it's funny that you say Sony lead the way in removing BC when you neglected to acknowledge the fact or realize that SONY were the ones who lead the way to BC being in successor consoles to begin with. DERP/

#43 Edited by Heil68 (43951 posts) -

I think it's good for people who didn't have a chance to play the original and people seem to buy them so they will be coming out for quite some time.

I kept my PS3/360 so I'm in no rush to get previously played games, but a game like Beyond 2 Souls, which I didn't play on Ps3, I'll get on Ps4.

#44 Posted by Bardock47 (5272 posts) -

Nintendo is rocking it pretty well. The lack of BC is a major reason I haven't gotten an Xbone or PS4 had they come out and said the Xbone is BC I would have gotten one already. Same with the PS4.

#45 Edited by bbkkristian (14946 posts) -

I swear they better be talking about emulation, and not ps now. PSNow is a joke and it's a poison to the audience that wants to play older games on their newer systems.

I miss BC too. Thank god for the Wii u's BC, I can still play Xenoblade, the last story, and smash bros while selling my old Wii. I still have to lug around my PHAT ps3, which is probably on the verge on dying from overheating. Then I'll have to come up with $300 for a replacement.

#46 Posted by PapaTrop (844 posts) -

I swear they better be talking about emulation, and not ps now. PSNow is a joke and it's a poison to the audience that wants to play older games on their newer systems.

I miss BC too. Thank god for the Wii u's BC, I can still play Xenoblade, the last story, and smash bros while selling my old Wii. I still have to lug around my PHAT ps3, which is probably on the verge on dying from overheating. Then I'll have to come up with $300 for a replacement.

I don't think Sony would forgo the money they can get from PS Now subscriptions in favor of emulation.

Even still, the PS3 probably won't be able to be emulated for quite some time just due to the complexity, so you'll still need one of those to play PS3 games at least.

But I agree. PS Now is a terrible sign of the future for console gaming. PS+ was the first step towards rental subscriptions, now PS Now... Without enough competition from Nintendo and Microsoft it could take off, and perhaps become the dominant form of game distribution on future consoles.

Let's hope Nintendo keeps up with what they're doing. Luckily there is also PC though, and PC has been getting a ton of Japanese support lately, so I'm not too worried anymore. Consoles are losing a lot of their appeal to me, at least.

#47 Edited by kinectthedots (1687 posts) -

@papatrop said:

@bbkkristian said:

I swear they better be talking about emulation, and not ps now. PSNow is a joke and it's a poison to the audience that wants to play older games on their newer systems.

I miss BC too. Thank god for the Wii u's BC, I can still play Xenoblade, the last story, and smash bros while selling my old Wii. I still have to lug around my PHAT ps3, which is probably on the verge on dying from overheating. Then I'll have to come up with $300 for a replacement.

I don't think Sony would forgo the money they can get from PS Now subscriptions in favor of emulation.

Even still, the PS3 probably won't be able to be emulated for quite some time just due to the complexity, so you'll still need one of those to play PS3 games at least.

But I agree. PS Now is a terrible sign of the future for console gaming. PS+ was the first step towards rental subscriptions, now PS Now... Without enough competition from Nintendo and Microsoft it could take off, and perhaps become the dominant form of game distribution on future consoles.

Let's hope Nintendo keeps up with what they're doing. Luckily there is also PC though, and PC has been getting a ton of Japanese support lately, so I'm not too worried anymore. Consoles are losing a lot of their appeal to me, at least.

I can agree on that.

Sony did have legitimate financial reasons for cutting the BC tech, but PS NOW in it's current form is TERRIBLE. That service is complete BS and they are clearly being greedy with that set-up since it's completely a software enabled feature.

Can't pull any punches with that and I won't support it. Sony really missed an opportunity to do something great with PS NOW because somewhere along the way they got caught up in the maximizing profit and ripping-off customer BS that MS lead the way with last gen.

#48 Posted by Gaming-Planet (14021 posts) -

That's what my PC is for.

#49 Edited by SolidSnake35 (58096 posts) -

If PS4s could play PS3 discs, I would buy one. But they can't, so I won't. I will stick to this generation, as was my plan, and replace my broken PS3. Lost chances, ey??

#50 Posted by pyro1245 (755 posts) -

Yep. Lack of foresight with the system architecture plus opportunity to milk customers. That's where we're at. Good thing I can emulate PS2 games since mine broke and the only way to play them on PS3/4 is to just buy it again. Suck it, Sony.