@seanmcloughlin said:
@foxhound_fox said:
@KHAndAnime said:
I'm very aware. It's the only thing that really differentiates it from Demons Souls. I'm just saying Metroid-esque designed games don't necessarily have to be so maze-like, they usually restrict areas off so you don't waste time.
Those are the best kind of Metroid-esque games. Allowing the player to find their own path at their own pace. Gaming at it's finest. Fully organic.
Exactly, part of the reason Dark Souls is one of my tops games ever. You learn the game through exploring, even the story is told to you that way
Demons Souls has plenty of exploration without wasting anyone's time for no poignant reason :)
Really, attempting to run through an area dozens of times before you realize you just might have to backtrack and check every crevice for the real path (for literally hours on end...it's a big game) isn't as much fun as you chalk it up to be. Sounds masochistic. Metroid games didn't have it this way, Castlevania SOTN didn't have it this way - this is a problem exclusive to Dark Souls' level design.
@seanmcloughlin said:
@KHAndAnime said:
Dark Souls offered multiple ways to go through the game - many of those multiple ways being the blatant wrong way to go. Some ways not so blatantly wrong, but still wrong. I probably ventured into dozens of zones I shouldn't have and wasted time doing things I shouldn't have for this reason alone. It's impossible to do the same thing in Demon's Souls, you can pretty much beat it any way you choose - there isn't necessarily a "wrong way".
Never had to farm in a Souls game before, so I'm not sure what you mean by that. Beat both games by progressing from start to finish, no grinding. You needed to grind to beat them?
Yeah it did offer multiple ways and some were way more than you could handle forcing you the right way, this isn't getting "lost" which you first talked about it's just going the wrong way.
You can beat the games without farming but to get the builds you want or carry the armor and weapons you want you usually have to farm souls to level up your stats. Or farm enemies for certain items. You not doing it doesn't mean the level design wasn't crap for those who DID do it. Dark is still better than Demon's in this regard
There are plenty of times in DS that you can be going the wrong way completely and encounter enemies that aren't too difficult. Dozens of times. I watch Dark Souls quick plays and the majority of people get lost for extended periods of time. Not necessarily a fun - it's just a waste of time. What would be organic is if you could actually traverse these paths to progress. You can't. There's only one (maybe occasionally two) true paths and every thing else is a waste of time unless you read GameFaqs.
@Vatusus said:
@KHAndAnime said:
@AmazonTreeBoa said:
I own Demon's Souls.....It sucks. With no story, I have nothing to motivate me to continue on. Got bored with it after defeating the first two bosses of each level and shut it off and never put the disk in my PS3 again.
You need to be motivated by awfully written video-game stories to play a videogame?
LOL. Christ people, raise your storytelling standards. Read a good book, watch a good TV show, or see a good movie and you won't think twice about coming to a videogame for story again.
This is a flawed argument. A videogame still has to have an interesting story at least. Must it be a oscar worthy story? Off course not, but somethin to keep us going and making us beat a difficult part just to see what happens next (and no, watching it on youtube isnt the same). There are many videogames out there wich managed to tell a great tale just as there are a lot of movies and books wich arent even good to start with. Yes, many games have terrible stories but lets not accept that as a standard when we've been proven many times videogames can tell great stories.
Nobody really thinks videogame's have great stories - if they did, there would be books based off videogame stories that sold well. There haven't been any, has there?
There are plenty of crap movies, crap games, crap books, etc - that's besides the point. The point is that videogames aren't an effective medium for storytelling. People are hung up on videogame stories that are literally only written to serve the action happening on screen. Who cares about a story when the story isn't the point? The point is having fun - do you really need some half-assed story to keep you having fun? Seems counter-productive to enjoying whats in front of you.
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