Consolites are too young to know it, BUT PC dominated since SNES

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#51 Posted by lundy86_4 (43227 posts) -

Didn't read.

#52 Posted by Heil68 (43996 posts) -

I'm 32, played all those amazing PC games from 90s, and i'm a consolite. What now? Malfunction?

PAL360
Probably time for a full psychological exam.
#53 Posted by StormyJoe (5124 posts) -

[QUOTE="seanmcloughlin"]

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]and still.....the consoles were the top dog back then, considering that was possibly the biggest and most influential console gen pre PS2 i'd say if it wasnt for console games back then some PC games might not have existed in their current forms. But we all know Jhon you are just another hermit trying to justify and preach their platform preference to a board who really frankly dont care.jhonMalcovich

Consoles have always dictated most of this industry.

Consoles couldn´t dictate anything. They were lacking in gaming genres. Consoles didn´t know what 3 dimensions is untill PC showed them.

LOL! For someone who says "consolites are too young to remember", you sure have a selected memory. The Atari 2600 had games like Battlezone, Solaris, Starfighter, 3D Tic-Tac-Toe, and racing games that were all as "3D" as Wolfenstein.

#54 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

[QUOTE="seanmcloughlin"]

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]and still.....the consoles were the top dog back then, considering that was possibly the biggest and most influential console gen pre PS2 i'd say if it wasnt for console games back then some PC games might not have existed in their current forms. But we all know Jhon you are just another hermit trying to justify and preach their platform preference to a board who really frankly dont care.nameless12345

Consoles have always dictated most of this industry. 

 

True, PC gaming was never really "mainstream". (despite some games reaching a rather large audience, i.e. World of Warcraft, The Sims, ect.)

It was always more of a "geek" (sub)culture.

The tech unknowledgable people and those who didn't want to transform their "work tool" into a games' machine and spend a lot of money on it usually never were really interested in PC gaming.

Sony's PlayStation did a great job for those who didn't want to bother with the complexity and expenses of a PC but didn't want a "kiddy" console either. (as consoles used to be called "toys" before the PlayStation appeared)

So it's not surprising it was one of the most successful console systems of all time and spawned a even more successful successor (namely the PS2) as it made video gaming "mainstream" and not just in the domain of "geeks" and "kids".

I don´t know what are you talking about. PC gaming became very popular since 1994. Everybody, in school, in my class, was talking about buying a PC. Yes, PC were expensive, arround 1000$, but nobody cared because it was a matter of the prestige. We, being still 14-year old, were talking about who recently bought the PC. And by 1996 there was many pc gaming saloon, where you had to pay per hour to play on PC. And I remember, me with friends were spending hours after schools in those pc gaming saloons. By 1999, almost everybody in my class had a PC. By 2001, there was a boom of internet cafes and everybody was playing lan parties of Counter Strike there.

Nobody cared about consoles, at least, as I remember. Only my 9-year cousin was playing PS one. Me and my buddies, nobody cared about console gaming back then. Everybody was playing Counter Strike, Unreal  Torment and Star Craft back then.

#55 Posted by StormyJoe (5124 posts) -

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

[QUOTE="MBirdy88"] in Console(S). he refered to one platform. Im betting each WoW expansion over they life spans has been easily 20+ million... EASILY. (and the core game... well god knows)MBirdy88

So, when you are comparing the PC platform vs Consoles as the TC does with his "Consolites" topic, you *can* group all console gamers together; just not when comparing sales? A little biased, are we? Fine. COD:MW3 sold 14 million ON THE XBOX 360 ALONE.

"biased" ... he was refering to games available on systems, not sales, the very fact that sales were brought up was obsurd to begin with as if its some counter to the TC's point. do we have to bring out the "Mc Donalds vs Your favourite Resteraunt" crap again? angry birds sold more than all our games, SO WHAT. Its a little biased to pit 3 fully marketing non-stop systems backed by massive publishers against an open platform aswell isn't it? at least he had the balls to label ONE system when talking to me. Cod averages on 400-500k players at peak at the minute when I log in (on xbox) .... Halo being 2nd or 3rd was 150k. I got 250k on DoTA 2 alone, not factoring in the slew of MMORPGs, league of legends having even more than Dota 2 and heroes of newerth having a steady 180k, People assume console is more popular because the top dog game has more consistant players than any given PC game, but the reality is that this is onyl the case due to the lack of variety/choice available on the console side.

Oh really? There aren't any FPS on the 360? That's why MW3 sold 14 million on it? If you are going to go down the path of "PC vs Consoles", then all console sales are perfectly legitimate. The TC did not say PC vs 360 or PC vs PS3.

#56 Posted by rilpas (8222 posts) -

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

[QUOTE="seanmcloughlin"]

Consoles have always dictated most of this industry.

StormyJoe

Consoles couldn´t dictate anything. They were lacking in gaming genres. Consoles didn´t know what 3 dimensions is untill PC showed them.

LOL! For someone who says "consolites are too young to remember", you sure have a selected memory. The Atari 2600 had games like Battlezone, Solaris, Starfighter, 3D Tic-Tac-Toe, and racing games that were all as "3D" as Wolfenstein.

don't forget Doom, Starfox, Virtua Racing

heck, why are we limiting ourselves to the SNES? The 3DO was already out by 93 and had games like Wing Commander 3, Super Wing Commander and other great 3D games

#57 Posted by seanmcloughlin (38216 posts) -

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

[QUOTE="seanmcloughlin"]

Consoles have always dictated most of this industry. 

jhonMalcovich

 

True, PC gaming was never really "mainstream". (despite some games reaching a rather large audience, i.e. World of Warcraft, The Sims, ect.)

It was always more of a "geek" (sub)culture.

The tech unknowledgable people and those who didn't want to transform their "work tool" into a games' machine and spend a lot of money on it usually never were really interested in PC gaming.

Sony's PlayStation did a great job for those who didn't want to bother with the complexity and expenses of a PC but didn't want a "kiddy" console either. (as consoles used to be called "toys" before the PlayStation appeared)

So it's not surprising it was one of the most successful console systems of all time and spawned a even more successful successor (namely the PS2) as it made video gaming "mainstream" and not just in the domain of "geeks" and "kids".

I don´t know what are you talking about. PC gaming became very popular since 1994. Everybody, in school, in my class, was talking about buying a PC. Yes, PC were expensive, arround 1000$, but nobody cared because it was a matter of the prestige. We, being still 14-year old, were talking about who recently bought the PC. And by 1996 there was many pc gaming saloon, where you had to pay per hour to play on PC. And I remember, me with friends were spending hours after schools in those pc gaming saloon. By 1999, almost everybody in my class had a PC. By 2001, there was a boom of intenet cafes and everybody was playing lan parties of Counter Strike there.

Nobody cared about consoles, at least, as I remember. Only my 9-year cousin was playing PS one. Me and my buddies, nobody cared about consoles gaming back then. Everybody was playing Counter Strike, Unreal  Torment and Star Craft back then.

Think what you want but what he said is true. PC has always been the more powerful platform, but without consoles it would still be considered a geek thing to play games.

Consoles made gaming what it is today, for better or worse, they made it a norm. Sure PC had those rooms to go play in but did you ever hear of Arcades? Those were pretty much consoles too. And just because everyone in your class had a PC it doesn't make it true for everyone. Everyone in my class had a playstation. Now what?

#58 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second. with that said, consoles have always been where the Money and sales are. You can argue quality untill the cows come home, but as a general rule, games tend to sell better on consolesrilpas

Probably this is true. This explains the rise of current gen consoles. But with the growth of digital distribution on PC the tide is changing again. Now consoles are lagging behind again relying on phisical copy sales too much. They didn´t provide a solid digital platform yet.

#59 Posted by rilpas (8222 posts) -

[QUOTE="rilpas"]I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second. with that said, consoles have always been where the Money and sales are. You can argue quality untill the cows come home, but as a general rule, games tend to sell better on consolesjhonMalcovich

Probably this is true. This explains the rise of current gen consoles. But with the groth digital distribution on PC the tide is changing again. Now consoles are lagging behind again relying on phisical copy sales too much. They didn´t provide a solid digital platform yet.

we don't know how well PC games sell on STEAM or how much Money actually goes towards the developers, so I can't comment on way or another
#60 Posted by MBirdy88 (8056 posts) -

[QUOTE="MBirdy88"][QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

So, when you are comparing the PC platform vs Consoles as the TC does with his "Consolites" topic, you *can* group all console gamers together; just not when comparing sales? A little biased, are we? Fine. COD:MW3 sold 14 million ON THE XBOX 360 ALONE.

StormyJoe

"biased" ... he was refering to games available on systems, not sales, the very fact that sales were brought up was obsurd to begin with as if its some counter to the TC's point. do we have to bring out the "Mc Donalds vs Your favourite Resteraunt" crap again? angry birds sold more than all our games, SO WHAT. Its a little biased to pit 3 fully marketing non-stop systems backed by massive publishers against an open platform aswell isn't it? at least he had the balls to label ONE system when talking to me. Cod averages on 400-500k players at peak at the minute when I log in (on xbox) .... Halo being 2nd or 3rd was 150k. I got 250k on DoTA 2 alone, not factoring in the slew of MMORPGs, league of legends having even more than Dota 2 and heroes of newerth having a steady 180k, People assume console is more popular because the top dog game has more consistant players than any given PC game, but the reality is that this is onyl the case due to the lack of variety/choice available on the console side.

Oh really? There aren't any FPS on the 360? That's why MW3 sold 14 million on it? If you are going to go down the path of "PC vs Consoles", then all console sales are perfectly legitimate. The TC did not say PC vs 360 or PC vs PS3.

No, the TC didn't but the guy I was talking to did. keep up.

 

I like how the rest has been ignored, point is, sales clearly mean nothing.

 

3DS sells tons and fails to churn out many games, angry birds destroys everything yet is very small. PC still has most quality game releases yearly despite so called "lesser sales" (totally unproven.)

#61 Posted by Jag85 (4455 posts) -

Nope, you're the one who is way too young to remember the 90s... Because the PC didn't start dominating graphics until the 21st century. Throughout the late 20th century, it was the Arcade that dominated gaming technology, while both consoles and PC's were always just fighting for second place. The first time the Arcade ever lost the lead was probably when Shenmue came along for the Dreamcast in 1999.

As for consoles and PC's, whenever a new console came out, it always had the lead over the PC for a few years (1987-1990 and 1994-1996), but then the PC would overtake it a few years later (1991-1993 and 1996-1997), then a new console would overtake it (1998-2001) before the PC overtakes again (2002-2005), and so on and so forth. Last gen was unique, in that consoles barely even had a year's lead before Crysis came along in 2007.

Anyway, here are a few 3D graphics comparisons between  Arcades, Consoles and PC's in the 90s...

1990

Arcade - Galaxian 3

Foto+Galaxian3.jpg

Console - Star Cruiser

Star%20Cruiser%20(J).png

PC - Archipelagos

683488-archipelagos__4_.gif

1992

Arcade - Virtua Racing

vr1.jpg

Console - Hard Drivin'

hard_5.png

PC - Alone in the Dark

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR3bVqZayfYjzXsQ0UaTWg

1994

Arcade - Virtua Fighter 2

138646-Virtua_Fighter_2_(E)_v1.000-5.jpg

Console - Ridge Racer

ridge_racer_64.jpg

PC - Doom

Doom_(32X)_(Prototype_-_Sep_06,_1994)_(h

1996

Arcade - Virtua Fighter 3

vf3tb3.jpg

Console - Tekken 2

Tekken2_sc003.jpg

PC - Quake

Quake_1_screenshot_320x200_e1m3.png

1998

Arcade - The House of the Dead 2

house_of_the_dead_2-287265-1252903907.jp

Console - Virtua Fighter 3 TB

Virtua%20Fighter%203tb10.jpg

PC - Half-Life

half_life_841705596.jpg

1999

Arcade - Dead or Alive 2

dead_or_alive2_profilelarge.jpg

Console - Shenmue

shenmue3.jpg

PC - System Shock 2

System_Shock_2-s3.jpg


#62 Posted by razgriz_101 (16871 posts) -

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

[QUOTE="MBirdy88"] in Console(S). he refered to one platform. Im betting each WoW expansion over they life spans has been easily 20+ million... EASILY. (and the core game... well god knows)jhonMalcovich

So, when you are comparing the PC platform vs Consoles as the TC does with his "Consolites" topic, you *can* group all console gamers together; just not when comparing sales? A little biased, are we? Fine. COD:MW3 sold 14 million ON THE XBOX 360 ALONE.

Current gen PC sales can be measured because they are mostly digital. And Steam doesn´t reveal its sale numbers, neither other digital distributors. 

From what I now, Steam has 54M active users and Origin, in its short life, already adquired 30M, plus there are many others like greenmangaming, amazon, etc. If we sum up all of them we will have very huge numbers. 

So only god knows how many copies COD:MW3 sold when it was 15 bucks on Amazon and Steam last christmas sale.

Anyway COD is not good example, becasue everybody knows PC gamers moved from COD to Battle Field after it became so consolish.

I like how you say sum it all up to try and beef the numbers, its well known even amongst the rational PC gamers on this board that they have multiple logins as in one for each service.Its not as simple as adding up sure that 54m is impressive and a good hard number but then you've got the DS on the other hand with a solid defined 100m units sold which = 100m potential consumers bang on the dot.

PC gamings big, but its still a part of the larger gaming subculture and not AS mainstream as consoles.But in all honestly the PC will never be the mainstream go-to platform like some of you crave because theres always something bigger and more accessible round the corner a-la the tablet,smartphone and even the next gen of consoles.

Also now hermits using MW3 in a sales arguement? my my hell must have finally frozen over considering how much you lot seem to preach that you loath it so much because its so casual.

#63 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

[QUOTE="rilpas"]I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second. with that said, consoles have always been where the Money and sales are. You can argue quality untill the cows come home, but as a general rule, games tend to sell better on consolesrilpas

Probably this is true. This explains the rise of current gen consoles. But with the groth digital distribution on PC the tide is changing again. Now consoles are lagging behind again relying on phisical copy sales too much. They didn´t provide a solid digital platform yet.

we don't know how well PC games sell on STEAM or how much Money actually goes towards the developers, so I can't comment on way or another

But we know it´s growing and growing fast. It has grown enough to launch its own PC living room box. Isn´t it enough ?

#64 Posted by razgriz_101 (16871 posts) -

[QUOTE="rilpas"][QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

Probably this is true. This explains the rise of current gen consoles. But with the groth digital distribution on PC the tide is changing again. Now consoles are lagging behind again relying on phisical copy sales too much. They didn´t provide a solid digital platform yet.

jhonMalcovich

we don't know how well PC games sell on STEAM or how much Money actually goes towards the developers, so I can't comment on way or another

But we know it´s growing and growing fast. It has grown enough to launch its own PC living room box. Isn´t it enough ?

because something is growing fast doesnt always mean it will be good, look at the .com bubble for further reference.
#65 Posted by nameless12345 (15125 posts) -

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

There are several fatal flaws in your thread. The main one being that you assume innovation in game genres took place on the PC because developers wanted to to do so - that's not true. Nintendo, especially during the NES and SNES days, decided what games were going to be on thier consoles; and they didn't want games like Doom to be on them. Neither did Sega. So, the devs took their titles to the PC where they wouldn't be "restricted". It was a necessity, not a choice.

Proof is in the facts: Nintendo, under fierce pressure to do so, finally allowed Mortal Kombat to be released on the SNES; but they changed the "blood" to "sweat". They also made Rare take out all of the gore from the console release of Killer Instinct.

A lot of games ened up on the PC because of necessity - consoles were too weak, you couldn't save your game, there wasn't enough storage space, etc. Over the past 2 gens, that necessity has wained, not increased.

For the foreseeable future, PC gaming isn't going anywhere - there will be games that require a keyboard/mouse combo, like RTS and simulation games. But this "era of PC gaming dominance" you are suggesting is just not a reality now and is not going to be one in the future.

StormyJoe

 

Doom and Wolfenstein 3D were on SNES and SMD/Genesis. (32X)

Tonned-down versions but anyway.

Killer Instinct on the SNES had blood and killings but the arcade version had the "full" blood and gore.

Nintendo censored MK on SNES because there was no body to regulate violent video games back then and they didn't want to get letters from angry mothers how their kids are playing nasty games on their "toy".

The lack of the features you mentioned also ment that the consoles were much cheaper than an average PC was, at the time.

The console games were designed accordingly to the hardware limitations.

If you wanted more "complex" games, you needed a PC but if you wanted simplistic (yet "fun") games, the consoles had quite a few strong points.

There was no blood in Killer Instinct.

I stand corrected, they were (Doom and Wolfenstein). However, they were not the versions that ID wanted to make - they had to do it on the PC.

 

I'm pretty sure there was blood in KI SNES. (multi-colored blood even)

Of course Wolf3D and Doom were best on PC as only the PC had the power (and control) to run them like id wanted them to.

id Software was largly responsible for the rise of PC gaming in general with the "first-person shooter" as defined by Wolf3D and Doom. (and later Quake)

PC was lacking in "action" games before but the FPS was really thrieving on it.

They even made a term "Doom clone" to describe them.

#66 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

So, when you are comparing the PC platform vs Consoles as the TC does with his "Consolites" topic, you *can* group all console gamers together; just not when comparing sales? A little biased, are we? Fine. COD:MW3 sold 14 million ON THE XBOX 360 ALONE.

razgriz_101

Current gen PC sales can be measured because they are mostly digital. And Steam doesn´t reveal its sale numbers, neither other digital distributors. 

From what I now, Steam has 54M active users and Origin, in its short life, already adquired 30M, plus there are many others like greenmangaming, amazon, etc. If we sum up all of them we will have very huge numbers. 

So only god knows how many copies COD:MW3 sold when it was 15 bucks on Amazon and Steam last christmas sale.

Anyway COD is not good example, becasue everybody knows PC gamers moved from COD to Battle Field after it became so consolish.

I like how you say sum it all up to try and beef the numbers, its well known even amongst the rational PC gamers on this board that they have multiple logins as in one for each service.Its not as simple as adding up sure that 54m is impressive and a good hard number but then you've got the DS on the other hand with a solid defined 100m units sold which = 100m potential consumers bang on the dot.

PC gamings big, but its still a part of the larger gaming subculture and not AS mainstream as consoles.But in all honestly the PC will never be the mainstream go-to platform like some of you crave because theres always something bigger and more accessible round the corner a-la the tablet,smartphone and even the next gen of consoles.

Also now hermits using MW3 in a sales arguement? my my hell must have finally frozen over considering how much you lot seem to preach that you loath it so much because its so casual.

Let´s be honest portable gaming isn´t in direct competion with PC. Besides 3ds can be emulated on PC. And PC shiped 300M brand built units last year. Good knows how many were custom built. PC IS mainstream, because everybody owns, at least, an old one.    

#67 Posted by MBirdy88 (8056 posts) -

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

So, when you are comparing the PC platform vs Consoles as the TC does with his "Consolites" topic, you *can* group all console gamers together; just not when comparing sales? A little biased, are we? Fine. COD:MW3 sold 14 million ON THE XBOX 360 ALONE.

razgriz_101

Current gen PC sales can be measured because they are mostly digital. And Steam doesn´t reveal its sale numbers, neither other digital distributors. 

From what I now, Steam has 54M active users and Origin, in its short life, already adquired 30M, plus there are many others like greenmangaming, amazon, etc. If we sum up all of them we will have very huge numbers. 

So only god knows how many copies COD:MW3 sold when it was 15 bucks on Amazon and Steam last christmas sale.

Anyway COD is not good example, becasue everybody knows PC gamers moved from COD to Battle Field after it became so consolish.

I like how you say sum it all up to try and beef the numbers, its well known even amongst the rational PC gamers on this board that they have multiple logins as in one for each service.Its not as simple as adding up sure that 54m is impressive and a good hard number but then you've got the DS on the other hand with a solid defined 100m units sold which = 100m potential consumers bang on the dot.

PC gamings big, but its still a part of the larger gaming subculture and not AS mainstream as consoles.But in all honestly the PC will never be the mainstream go-to platform like some of you crave because theres always something bigger and more accessible round the corner a-la the tablet,smartphone and even the next gen of consoles.

Also now hermits using MW3 in a sales arguement? my my hell must have finally frozen over considering how much you lot seem to preach that you loath it so much because its so casual.

And console gamers need to understand that the "sales" arguement is largely a cop out. what benefit of pc gamers have "sales" got you. We still get alot of your multiplats, we get alot more exclusives, higher quality in general. Sales is the lowly dogs last growl.
#68 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

[QUOTE="rilpas"] we don't know how well PC games sell on STEAM or how much Money actually goes towards the developers, so I can't comment on way or anotherrazgriz_101

But we know it´s growing and growing fast. It has grown enough to launch its own PC living room box. Isn´t it enough ?

because something is growing fast doesnt always mean it will be good, look at the .com bubble for further reference.

It´s growing fast becuase it´s a good and cheap service. Everybody loves it. So it has good chances it will keep growing. COMON SENSE.

#69 Posted by clyde46 (46027 posts) -

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

Current gen PC sales can be measured because they are mostly digital. And Steam doesn´t reveal its sale numbers, neither other digital distributors. 

From what I now, Steam has 54M active users and Origin, in its short life, already adquired 30M, plus there are many others like greenmangaming, amazon, etc. If we sum up all of them we will have very huge numbers. 

So only god knows how many copies COD:MW3 sold when it was 15 bucks on Amazon and Steam last christmas sale.

Anyway COD is not good example, becasue everybody knows PC gamers moved from COD to Battle Field after it became so consolish.

jhonMalcovich

I like how you say sum it all up to try and beef the numbers, its well known even amongst the rational PC gamers on this board that they have multiple logins as in one for each service.Its not as simple as adding up sure that 54m is impressive and a good hard number but then you've got the DS on the other hand with a solid defined 100m units sold which = 100m potential consumers bang on the dot.

PC gamings big, but its still a part of the larger gaming subculture and not AS mainstream as consoles.But in all honestly the PC will never be the mainstream go-to platform like some of you crave because theres always something bigger and more accessible round the corner a-la the tablet,smartphone and even the next gen of consoles.

Also now hermits using MW3 in a sales arguement? my my hell must have finally frozen over considering how much you lot seem to preach that you loath it so much because its so casual.

Let´s be honest portable gaming isn´t in direct competion with PC. Besides 3ds can be emulated on PC. And PC shiped 300M brand built units last year. Good know how many were custom built. PC IS mainstream, because everybody owns, at least, an old one.    

300M shipped? So we are talking sales from the likes of Dell and HP now?
#70 Posted by MBirdy88 (8056 posts) -
Pretty sure 3DS cannot be emulated properly...
#71 Posted by blue_hazy_basic (27549 posts) -
Only since the SNES? You young 'uns!
#72 Posted by nameless12345 (15125 posts) -

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

[QUOTE="seanmcloughlin"]

Consoles have always dictated most of this industry. 

jhonMalcovich

 

True, PC gaming was never really "mainstream". (despite some games reaching a rather large audience, i.e. World of Warcraft, The Sims, ect.)

It was always more of a "geek" (sub)culture.

The tech unknowledgable people and those who didn't want to transform their "work tool" into a games' machine and spend a lot of money on it usually never were really interested in PC gaming.

Sony's PlayStation did a great job for those who didn't want to bother with the complexity and expenses of a PC but didn't want a "kiddy" console either. (as consoles used to be called "toys" before the PlayStation appeared)

So it's not surprising it was one of the most successful console systems of all time and spawned a even more successful successor (namely the PS2) as it made video gaming "mainstream" and not just in the domain of "geeks" and "kids".

I don´t know what are you talking about. PC gaming became very popular since 1994. Everybody, in school, in my class, was talking about buying a PC. Yes, PC were expensive, arround 1000$, but nobody cared because it was a matter of the prestige. We, being still 14-year old, were talking about who recently bought the PC. And by 1996 there was many pc gaming saloon, where you had to pay per hour to play on PC. And I remember, me with friends were spending hours after schools in those pc gaming saloons. By 1999, almost everybody in my class had a PC. By 2001, there was a boom of internet cafes and everybody was playing lan parties of Counter Strike there.

Nobody cared about consoles, at least, as I remember. Only my 9-year cousin was playing PS one. Me and my buddies, nobody cared about console gaming back then. Everybody was playing Counter Strike, Unreal  Torment and Star Craft back then.

 

That is all true except for the "nobody cared about consoles" part.

Obviously there were people who cared about them given how much some console games sold during that era. (be them 9 year olds or 30 year olds who didn't care about PC gaming)

The PSX alone had several games that sold millions of copies.

On the PC, this was a rare sight as piracy was rather wide-spread. (inb4 consoles had piracy too)

Not all people had a "3D accelerator" either altho at the time most games still ran in "software mode", allowing more people to play them.

#73 Posted by clyde46 (46027 posts) -
Pretty sure 3DS cannot be emulated properly...MBirdy88
The 3D cannot but the rest can.
#74 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

Nope, you're the one who is way too young to remember the 90s... Because the PC didn't start dominating graphics until the 21st century. Throughout the late 20th century, it was the Arcade that dominated gaming technology, while both consoles and PC's were always just fighting for second place. The first time the Arcade ever lost the lead was probably when Shenmue came along for the Dreamcast in 1999.

As for consoles and PC's, whenever a new console came out, it always had the lead over the PC for a few years (1987-1990 and 1994-1996), but then the PC would overtake it a few years later (1991-1993 and 1996-1997), then a new console would overtake it (1998-2001) before the PC overtakes again (2002-2005), and so on and so forth. Last gen was unique, in that consoles barely even had a year's lead before Crysis came along in 2007.

Anyway, here are a few 3D graphics comparisons between  Arcades, Consoles and PC's in the 90s...

1990

Arcade - Galaxian 3

Foto+Galaxian3.jpg

Console - Star Cruiser

Star%20Cruiser%20(J).png

PC - Archipelagos

683488-archipelagos__4_.gif

1992

Arcade - Virtua Racing

vr1.jpg

Console - Hard Drivin'

hard_5.png

PC - Alone in the Dark

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR3bVqZayfYjzXsQ0UaTWg

1994

Arcade - Virtua Fighter 2

138646-Virtua_Fighter_2_(E)_v1.000-5.jpg

Console - Ridge Racer

ridge_racer_64.jpg

PC - Doom

Doom_(32X)_(Prototype_-_Sep_06,_1994)_(h

1996

Arcade - Virtua Fighter 3

vf3tb3.jpg

Console - Tekken 2

Tekken2_sc003.jpg

PC - Quake

Quake_1_screenshot_320x200_e1m3.png

1998

Arcade - The House of the Dead 2

house_of_the_dead_2-287265-1252903907.jp

Console - Virtua Fighter 3 TB

Virtua%20Fighter%203tb10.jpg

PC - Half-Life

half_life_841705596.jpg

1999

Arcade - Dead or Alive 2

dead_or_alive2_profilelarge.jpg

Console - Shenmue

shenmue3.jpg

PC - System Shock 2

System_Shock_2-s3.jpg


Jag85

Sorry but arcade machines are not equal to consoles. They are more close to dedicated PC because of their processing power.

And I don´t claim PC dominated always, but since 1994 to 2006. This is it. And it will dominate agan the next generation when living room PC boxes will replace expensive closed boxes of MS and Sony.

#75 Posted by razgriz_101 (16871 posts) -

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"][QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

But we know it´s growing and growing fast. It has grown enough to launch its own PC living room box. Isn´t it enough ?

jhonMalcovich

because something is growing fast doesnt always mean it will be good, look at the .com bubble for further reference.

It´s growing fast becuase it´s a good and cheap service. Everybody loves it. So it has good chances it will keep growing. COMON SENSE.

as was many ideas in the .com bubble, digital distribution is essentially .com bubble 2.0 but without as much lavish spending but the fact theres the consumer gouging which is more prevelant a-la silly DLC which is not only a console specific problem.
#76 Posted by lowe0 (13692 posts) -

[QUOTE="rilpas"][QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

Probably this is true. This explains the rise of current gen consoles. But with the groth digital distribution on PC the tide is changing again. Now consoles are lagging behind again relying on phisical copy sales too much. They didn´t provide a solid digital platform yet.

jhonMalcovich

we don't know how well PC games sell on STEAM or how much Money actually goes towards the developers, so I can't comment on way or another

But we know it´s growing and growing fast. It has grown enough to launch its own PC living room box. Isn´t it enough ?

"Enough" isn't the standard you set in your thread title and opening post. It's a little late to back down now.
#77 Posted by AmazonTreeBoa (16745 posts) -

Consolites are too young to know it.jhonMalcovich

I stop reading right there because I realized you are clueless and it would be a complete waste of my time to read the rest of your gibberish. Consoles gamers come in all ages just like PC. Stop being such a simpleton.

#78 Posted by Jag85 (4455 posts) -

[QUOTE="Jag85"]

Nope, you're the one who is way too young to remember the 90s... Because the PC didn't start dominating graphics until the 21st century. Throughout the late 20th century, it was the Arcade that dominated gaming technology, while both consoles and PC's were always just fighting for second place. The first time the Arcade ever lost the lead was probably when Shenmue came along for the Dreamcast in 1999.

As for consoles and PC's, whenever a new console came out, it always had the lead over the PC for a few years (1987-1990 and 1994-1996), but then the PC would overtake it a few years later (1991-1993 and 1996-1997), then a new console would overtake it (1998-2001) before the PC overtakes again (2002-2005), and so on and so forth. Last gen was unique, in that consoles barely even had a year's lead before Crysis came along in 2007.

Anyway, here are a few 3D graphics comparisons between  Arcades, Consoles and PC's in the 90s...

1990

Arcade - Galaxian 3

Foto+Galaxian3.jpg

Console - Star Cruiser

Star%20Cruiser%20(J).png

PC - Archipelagos

683488-archipelagos__4_.gif

1992

Arcade - Virtua Racing

vr1.jpg

Console - Hard Drivin'

hard_5.png

PC - Alone in the Dark

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR3bVqZayfYjzXsQ0UaTWg

1994

Arcade - Virtua Fighter 2

138646-Virtua_Fighter_2_(E)_v1.000-5.jpg

Console - Ridge Racer

ridge_racer_64.jpg

PC - Doom

Doom_(32X)_(Prototype_-_Sep_06,_1994)_(h

1996

Arcade - Virtua Fighter 3

vf3tb3.jpg

Console - Tekken 2

Tekken2_sc003.jpg

PC - Quake

Quake_1_screenshot_320x200_e1m3.png

1998

Arcade - The House of the Dead 2

house_of_the_dead_2-287265-1252903907.jp

Console - Virtua Fighter 3 TB

Virtua%20Fighter%203tb10.jpg

PC - Half-Life

half_life_841705596.jpg

1999

Arcade - Dead or Alive 2

dead_or_alive2_profilelarge.jpg

Console - Shenmue

shenmue3.jpg

PC - System Shock 2

System_Shock_2-s3.jpg


jhonMalcovich

Sorry but arcade machines are not equal to consoles. They are more close to dedicated PC because of their processing power.

And I don´t claim PC dominated always, but since 1994 to 2006. This is it. And it will dominate agan the next generation when living room PC boxes will replace expensive closed boxes of MS and Sony.

Like I've already proven above with those screenshots, the PC did not dominate graphics at all in the 90s. Even if we exclude the powerful arcades, consoles had the lead over the PC many times in the 90s, including 1990-1991, 1994-1996, and especially 1998-2001, when the Dreamcast was not only superior to PC's, but even rivaled the arcades. Nothing on PC's even came close to Shenmue (1999) for a good couple of years.
#79 Posted by blue_hazy_basic (27549 posts) -

Guys when you're quoting don't include multiple images please. It makes threads hard to follow.

#80 Posted by HaloPimp978 (7287 posts) -

Ain't Nobody got time to read this dumb thread.

#81 Posted by clyde46 (46027 posts) -

Guys when you're quoting don't include multiple images please. It makes threads hard to follow.

blue_hazy_basic
So it was you when modded me for that.
#82 Posted by nameless12345 (15125 posts) -

Only since the SNES? You young 'uns!blue_hazy_basic

 

Well, in the 80s the PC was quite far behind console due to no dedicated graphics and sound hardware. (altho the CPUs could already handle 3D polygon games allowing for some simulation type games and such)

Amiga was a different story but that was considered an entirely different platform back then. (ask any Amiga fan if he thinks that Amiga is "just a PC")

#83 Posted by lowe0 (13692 posts) -
Now for the second time this week, a thread has made me miss Virtua Racing. I have a Genesis copy and the PS2 remake, and neither is quite the same as the original cabinet with a wheel.
#84 Posted by LordQuorthon (5322 posts) -

ERMAHGERD, GREFERX ERN CERNEMAHTECS!

As someone who spent most of the 1990s playing Civilization 1 and 2, Doom and several other games like that... Well, this thread is just dumb. 

Yes, PC had TEH BETTER GERFX, but back then Japanese developers were simply way, way, WAY ahead of Western developers in terms of controls, gameplay, optimization, soundtracks, the ability to build amazing settings and universes, and just about everything that captures a person's attention and imagination. Again, I was playing all those GRFX INTERNSEV games back then and I still had this urge to touch my pee pee the first time I saw Final Fantasy VI/3/Whateveryouwannacallit because it played, sounded and looked (DESPITE TEH INFHERER GREFX!!!!!!!!!) better than any other attempt at replicating the D&D experience that I had played on the PC (which can pretty much be summed up with one word: Ultima). 

You can pinpoint the exact moment when Western developers matched and arguably surpassed Japanese developers: The release of Baldur's Gate and all those impossibly amazing Infinity Engine games. But before that, even with all the brilliant games like Civilization, Dune 1/2, Warcraft (I'm seeing a pattern here), it was no contest, Japanese developers were miles ahead of everyone else, and most of the games they made were for consoles. Hell, even when they did make games for the PC, it was usually for those weird computers that were released only in Japan, not for DOS or Windows.  

  

#85 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

Like I've already proven above with those screenshots, the PC did not dominate graphics at all in the 90s. Even if we exclude the powerful arcades, consoles had the lead over the PC many times in the 90s, including 1990-1991, 1994-1996, and especially 1998-2001, when the Dreamcast was not only superior to PC's, but even rivaled the arcades. Nothing on PC's even came close to Shenmue (1999) for a good couple of years.Jag85

Excuse me, but what platform dominated over PC in 1994-1996 and 1998-2001? Can you support your claim with some games besides Shenmue.

#86 Posted by ultra641996 (60 posts) -

[QUOTE="blue_hazy_basic"]Only since the SNES? You young 'uns!nameless12345

 

Well, in the 80s the PC was quite far behind console due to no dedicated graphics and sound hardware. (altho the CPUs could already handle 3D polygon games allowing for some simulation type games and such)

Amiga was a different story but that was considered an entirely different platform back then. (ask any Amiga fan if he thinks that Amiga is "just a PC")

bs arcade machines are custom computers they owned everything.
#87 Posted by nameless12345 (15125 posts) -

ERMAHGERD, GREFERX ERN CERNEMAHTECS!

As someone who spent most of the 1990s playing Civilization 1 and 2, Doom and several other games like that... Well, this thread is just dumb. 

Yes, PC had TEH BETTER GERFX, but back then Japanese developers were simply way, way, WAY ahead of Western developers in terms of controls, gameplay, optimization, soundtracks, the ability to build amazing settings and universes, and just about everything that captures a person's attention and imagination. Again, I was playing all those GRFX INTERNSEV games back then and I still had this urge to touch my pee pee the first time I saw Final Fantasy VI/3/Whateveryouwannacallit because it played, sounded and looked (DESPITE TEH INFHERER GREFX!!!!!!!!!) better than any other attempt at replicating the D&D experience that I had played on the PC (which can pretty much be summed up with one word: Ultima). 

You can pinpoint the exact moment when Western developers matched and arguably surpassed Japanese developers: The release of Baldur's Gate and all those impossibly amazing Infinity Engine games. But before that, even with all the brilliant games like Civilization, Dune 1/2, Warcraft (I'm seeing a pattern here), it was no contest, Japanese developers were miles ahead of everyone else, and most of the games they made were for consoles. Hell, even when they did make games for the PC, it was usually for those weird computers that were released only in Japan, not for DOS or Windows.  

  

LordQuorthon

 

I find the Japanese game companies were excelling on the consoles while the Western (read: US and European) companies were excelling on the PC back in those times.

To trully experience gaming to the fullest, one had to had both, a powerful PC as well as a console. (unless you count emulators but those were never 100% reliable and generally "murky waters")

#88 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

ERMAHGERD, GREFERX ERN CERNEMAHTECS!

As someone who spent most of the 1990s playing Civilization 1 and 2, Doom and several other games like that... Well, this thread is just dumb. 

Yes, PC had TEH BETTER GERFX, but back then Japanese developers were simply way, way, WAY ahead of Western developers in terms of controls, gameplay, optimization, soundtracks, the ability to build amazing settings and universes, and just about everything that captures a person's attention and imagination. Again, I was playing all those GRFX INTERNSEV games back then and I still had this urge to touch my pee pee the first time I saw Final Fantasy VI/3/Whateveryouwannacallit because it played, sounded and looked (DESPITE TEH INFHERER GREFX!!!!!!!!!) better than any other attempt at replicating the D&D experience that I had played on the PC (which can pretty much be summed up with one word: Ultima). 

You can pinpoint the exact moment when Western developers matched and arguably surpassed Japanese developers: The release of Baldur's Gate and all those impossibly amazing Infinity Engine games. But before that, even with all the brilliant games like Civilization, Dune 1/2, Warcraft (I'm seeing a pattern here), it was no contest, Japanese developers were miles ahead of everyone else, and most of the games they made were for consoles. Hell, even when they did make games for the PC, it was usually for those weird computers that were released only in Japan, not for DOS or Windows.  

  

LordQuorthon

I am not claiming PC dominated over SNES, but dominated in post-snes era, after 1994, when 2.5d graphics started becoming mainstream.

#89 Posted by nameless12345 (15125 posts) -

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

[QUOTE="blue_hazy_basic"]Only since the SNES? You young 'uns!ultra641996

 

Well, in the 80s the PC was quite far behind console due to no dedicated graphics and sound hardware. (altho the CPUs could already handle 3D polygon games allowing for some simulation type games and such)

Amiga was a different story but that was considered an entirely different platform back then. (ask any Amiga fan if he thinks that Amiga is "just a PC")

bs arcade machines are custom computers they owned everything.

 

Arcade machines are arcade machines.

Hence, not console or PC.

This thread is about "PC domination over consoles since SNES", not "Arcade domination over PC and consoles in the 80s and early 90s".

#90 Posted by clyde46 (46027 posts) -

[QUOTE="LordQuorthon"]

ERMAHGERD, GREFERX ERN CERNEMAHTECS!

As someone who spent most of the 1990s playing Civilization 1 and 2, Doom and several other games like that... Well, this thread is just dumb. 

Yes, PC had TEH BETTER GERFX, but back then Japanese developers were simply way, way, WAY ahead of Western developers in terms of controls, gameplay, optimization, soundtracks, the ability to build amazing settings and universes, and just about everything that captures a person's attention and imagination. Again, I was playing all those GRFX INTERNSEV games back then and I still had this urge to touch my pee pee the first time I saw Final Fantasy VI/3/Whateveryouwannacallit because it played, sounded and looked (DESPITE TEH INFHERER GREFX!!!!!!!!!) better than any other attempt at replicating the D&D experience that I had played on the PC (which can pretty much be summed up with one word: Ultima). 

You can pinpoint the exact moment when Western developers matched and arguably surpassed Japanese developers: The release of Baldur's Gate and all those impossibly amazing Infinity Engine games. But before that, even with all the brilliant games like Civilization, Dune 1/2, Warcraft (I'm seeing a pattern here), it was no contest, Japanese developers were miles ahead of everyone else, and most of the games they made were for consoles. Hell, even when they did make games for the PC, it was usually for those weird computers that were released only in Japan, not for DOS or Windows.  

  

jhonMalcovich

I am not claiming PC dominated over SNES, but dominated in post-snes era, after 1994, when 2.5d graphics started becoming mainstream.

*reads title* "But PC dominated since SNES" Sure buddy.
#91 Posted by seanmcloughlin (38216 posts) -

[QUOTE="blue_hazy_basic"]

Guys when you're quoting don't include multiple images please. It makes threads hard to follow.

clyde46

So it was you when modded me for that.

People should be bloody banned for that crap. I hate when people quote a huge list of pics, happens in the screenshot thread all the time

#92 Posted by jhonMalcovich (4641 posts) -

[QUOTE="jhonMalcovich"]

[QUOTE="LordQuorthon"]

ERMAHGERD, GREFERX ERN CERNEMAHTECS!

As someone who spent most of the 1990s playing Civilization 1 and 2, Doom and several other games like that... Well, this thread is just dumb. 

Yes, PC had TEH BETTER GERFX, but back then Japanese developers were simply way, way, WAY ahead of Western developers in terms of controls, gameplay, optimization, soundtracks, the ability to build amazing settings and universes, and just about everything that captures a person's attention and imagination. Again, I was playing all those GRFX INTERNSEV games back then and I still had this urge to touch my pee pee the first time I saw Final Fantasy VI/3/Whateveryouwannacallit because it played, sounded and looked (DESPITE TEH INFHERER GREFX!!!!!!!!!) better than any other attempt at replicating the D&D experience that I had played on the PC (which can pretty much be summed up with one word: Ultima). 

You can pinpoint the exact moment when Western developers matched and arguably surpassed Japanese developers: The release of Baldur's Gate and all those impossibly amazing Infinity Engine games. But before that, even with all the brilliant games like Civilization, Dune 1/2, Warcraft (I'm seeing a pattern here), it was no contest, Japanese developers were miles ahead of everyone else, and most of the games they made were for consoles. Hell, even when they did make games for the PC, it was usually for those weird computers that were released only in Japan, not for DOS or Windows.  

  

clyde46

I am not claiming PC dominated over SNES, but dominated in post-snes era, after 1994, when 2.5d graphics started becoming mainstream.

*reads title* "But PC dominated since SNES" Sure buddy.

I said also "since 1994"

#93 Posted by LordQuorthon (5322 posts) -

I find the Japanese game companies were excelling on the consoles while the Western (read: US and European) companies were excelling on the PC back in those times.

nameless12345

You should make a thread about that. In fact, make it a poll. That sounds really interesting, like all your thr... Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

 

 

#94 Posted by R4gn4r0k (16459 posts) -

Yeah I was playing Super Mario as a kid.

I still do

#95 Posted by jsmoke03 (12846 posts) -

wow long read.

one thing im going to say about it is, it was a different audience. pc's didn't have every genre covered. you only covered what was good about th pc and downplayed what was good on consoles. for a lot of us who were kids around the nes/genesis/snes era (i was around 10 when snes came out), we had sports games, platformers, fighting games that were CO-OP. i'm sorry, but even when i was playing doom on my pc when i was younger, me and my friends would take turns playing and dying. plus most of the time, my pc was being used by my dad for work.....internet wasn't available to me or was it even that widely known, so pc was mostly a single player experience.

its true that pc games had a lot of good games, but what domination were you talking about? graphics....only idiots would argue that. games? depends on what genre. experience? depends on what experience you were looking for.

#96 Posted by whiskeystrike (12068 posts) -

Consoles and PC offered completely different kind of games in previous gens

There was nothing to dominate as they appealed to different kinds of people, with different kinds of experiences.

They were not competitive like they are now. Think back to Nintendo's statement that they were not in competition with the HD twins, the Wii would be offering completely different experiences.

#97 Posted by nameless12345 (15125 posts) -

[QUOTE="Jag85"]

Like I've already proven above with those screenshots, the PC did not dominate graphics at all in the 90s. Even if we exclude the powerful arcades, consoles had the lead over the PC many times in the 90s, including 1990-1991, 1994-1996, and especially 1998-2001, when the Dreamcast was not only superior to PC's, but even rivaled the arcades. Nothing on PC's even came close to Shenmue (1999) for a good couple of years.jhonMalcovich

Excuse me, but what platform dominated over PC in 1994-1996 and 1998-2001? Can you support your claim with some games besides Shenmue.

 

1994 - 3DO:

505567-the-need-for-speed-3do-screenshot

 

1995 - PSX:

battlearenatoshinden_1.jpg

 

1996/1997 - N64:

pic_1126625047_10.jpg

waverace642.jpg

pilotwings-64-gyrocopter-robin.jpg

diddy_kong_racing_xmas.jpg

goldeneye-03.jpg

 

1998/1999 - Dreamcast:

sonic-adventure-dx-4.jpg

35243-virtua-fighter-3tb-dreamcast-scree

Soul_Calibur_DC.jpg

shenmue_dc-00004111-low.jpg

 

2000/2001 - PS2:

tekken-tag-tournament.1143367.jpg

35863-198775-ssx1jpg-620x.jpg

gt3_screen003.jpg

Metal.jpg

final_fantasy_x3_001.jpg

 

edit: these two deserve a pic too:

roguesquadron_profilelarge.jpg

halo%20111.jpg

 

 

 

#98 Posted by Gue1 (9775 posts) -

PC gaming... Go keep wasting your life with WoW, LoL, the crappy Facebook social games and piracy.    :lol:

#99 Posted by MBirdy88 (8056 posts) -
[QUOTE="MBirdy88"]Pretty sure 3DS cannot be emulated properly...clyde46
The 3D cannot but the rest can.

What perfectly playable?
#100 Posted by MBirdy88 (8056 posts) -

PC gaming... Go keep wasting your life with WoW, LoL, the crappy Facebook social games and piracy.    :lol:

Gue1
Says that, plays DCUO a pathetic excuse for an MMO. typical console gamers and lack of taste.