Are Naughty Dog better Valve

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uninspiredcup

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Edited By uninspiredcup

Poll Are Naughty Dog better Valve (98 votes)

Valve revolutionized gaming, saved pc gaming, populized and saved indie gaming, populized modding, made the greatest single player FPS of all time, made the greatest Free2play title of all time e.t.c.. e.t.c.... 59%
Naughty Dog made two pretty decent third person games 39%

My friends. This is a very heated system wars debate. Many of us feel passionately one way or the other. But, through the use of popularity voting (that is 100% accurate) we will factually, finally have a decision as to who is the best of the best.

 • 
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uninspiredcup

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#51 uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 58647 Posts

Of course I didn't prove anything, it's common knowledge to older gamers. Most people didn't need it explained, only you, the little people.

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I_can_haz

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#52 I_can_haz
Member since 2013 • 6511 Posts

IMO yes. I don't really care for the Half Life games and have always found them boring. I can see why people like them though but they aren't for me. I haven't been bored by a ND game yet.

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DarkLink77

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#53 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

@uninspiredcup said:

Of course I didn't prove anything, it's common knowledge to older gamers. Most people didn't need it explained, only you, the little people.

Nah. I played Half-Life in '98. Didn't need the importance of it explained. No one who played video games in the 90s did. Besides, you didn't explain anything. You linked to Youtube.

And thank you for admitting you didn't prove anything. I think we're done here, unless you'd like to keep moving the goalposts.

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uninspiredcup

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#54  Edited By uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 58647 Posts

@DarkLink77 said:

Nah. I played Half-Life in '98. Didn't need the importance of it explained.

But it just had to be explained to you minutes ago. Such a short memory. :S

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DarkLink77

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#55 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

@uninspiredcup said:

@DarkLink77 said:

Nah. I played Half-Life in '98. Didn't need the importance of it explained.

But it just had to be explained to you.

It didn't. Because we aren't talking about the importance of that game. We're talking about the Valve being better than Naughty Dog. Making one game two decades ago doesn't make them a better studio. It doesn't make up for the fact that they haven't developed an IP internally since then. It doesn't make up for the fact that they haven't released anything on that IP for the better part of a decade. And it certainly doesn't make up for their lack of creativity in the intervening years.

So no, it didn't, but please, keep moving those goalposts.

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Jankarcop

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#56 Jankarcop
Member since 2011 • 11058 Posts

LFD

LFD2

HL1

HL2

TF2

>

UC2 and UC3

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PinkieWinkie

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#57 PinkieWinkie
Member since 2006 • 1454 Posts

ITT: OP gets destroyed by Darklink. Looking at who has done more for the gaming industry Valve obviously wins. When it comes down to strictly developing games ND wins by a mile. Once again TC is a clown

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Krelian-co

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#58  Edited By Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@DarkLink77 said:

@uninspiredcup said:

@DarkLink77 said:

Nah. I played Half-Life in '98. Didn't need the importance of it explained.

But it just had to be explained to you.

It didn't. Because we aren't talking about the importance of that game. We're talking about the Valve being better than Naughty Dog. Making one game two decades ago doesn't make them a better studio. It doesn't make up for the fact that they haven't developed an IP internally since then. It doesn't make up for the fact that they haven't released anything on that IP for the better part of a decade. And it certainly doesn't make up for their lack of creativity in the intervening years.

So no, it didn't, but please, keep moving those goalposts.

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Puckhog04

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#59  Edited By Puckhog04
Member since 2003 • 22814 Posts

There is no comparison. Valve >>>> ND. Left 4 Dead, Half LIfe, Dota 2, Steam, etc. >>> Uncharted.

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uninspiredcup

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#60 uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 58647 Posts

@Puckhog04 said:

There is no comparison. Valve >>>> ND. Left 4 Dead, Half LIfe, Dota 2, Steam, etc. >>> Uncharted.

Excellent point. Probably the best.

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Jankarcop

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#61 Jankarcop
Member since 2011 • 11058 Posts

@uninspiredcup said:

@Puckhog04 said:

There is no comparison. Valve >>>> ND. Left 4 Dead, Half LIfe, Dota 2, Steam, etc. >>> Uncharted.

Excellent point. Probably the best.

agreed

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Masculus

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#62  Edited By Masculus
Member since 2009 • 2878 Posts

Lol, the english is strong with this one.

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Jankarcop

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#63 Jankarcop
Member since 2011 • 11058 Posts

@PinkieWinkie said:

ITT: OP gets destroyed by Darklink. Looking at who has done more for the gaming industry Valve obviously wins. When it comes down to strictly developing games ND wins by a mile. Once again TC is a clown

What?

HL and HL2 alone destroy ND's shitty movie-games.

Add in TF2 and its fucking over.

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uninspiredcup

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#64  Edited By uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 58647 Posts

Bringing Portal into the equitation would simply be abuse. Naughty Dog would need aid from the UN.

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AM-Gamer

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#65  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@FreedomFreeLife: I have played every HL and the original portal and I still picked ND .

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Krelian-co

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#66  Edited By Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@Jankarcop said:

@PinkieWinkie said:

ITT: OP gets destroyed by Darklink. Looking at who has done more for the gaming industry Valve obviously wins. When it comes down to strictly developing games ND wins by a mile. Once again TC is a clown

What?

HL and HL2 alone destroy ND's shitty movie-games.

Add in TF2 and its fucking over.

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SexyJazzCat

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#67 SexyJazzCat
Member since 2013 • 2796 Posts

ND's games can't even come close to the amount of enjoyment that TF2 alone has given me. Whether Valve created the IP or not is completely irrelevant. They are giving the little guys very big opportunities and have given life to projects that would've otherwise never had seen the light of day.

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Jankarcop

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#68  Edited By Jankarcop
Member since 2011 • 11058 Posts

It doesn't matter, it counts as valve. The developer was valve.

"bu bu they aquired teh studio". Studios acquire people all the time, stop your excuses and crying.

5 amazing genre games > 2 amazing but forgettable (rental) games. Lets not get into steam and the such.

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ConanTheStoner

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#69 ConanTheStoner
Member since 2011 • 23706 Posts

Eh.. as far as game development goes, can't say I care too much for either. Both are good devs that seem to get disproportionate amounts of praise.

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#70  Edited By DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

@Jankarcop said:

It doesn't matter, it counts as valve. The developer was valve.

"bu bu they aquired teh studio". Studios acquire people all the time, stop your excuses and crying.

5 amazing genre games > 2 amazing but forgettable (rental) games. Lets not get into steam and the such.

No excuses. Just no respect for anything not named Steam. And the original Half-Life, I suppose. Beyond that, they've done nothing by themselves. They just buy other people's ideas and throw money at them.

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AM-Gamer

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#71  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@Jankarcop: valve couldn't hold ND jock. Try 9 amazing games and 4 amazing franchises vs a now irrelevant fps and a company that's about to lose millions on the suckmachine.

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navyguy21

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#72 navyguy21
Member since 2003 • 17401 Posts

Not even a comparison.

ND has a long way to go to be even be considered in the same league.

ND makes games.

Valve innovates and creates.

Thats not a knock on ND because i love them and the Uncharted series, but come on! Some of you must be really young.

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raging_user

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#73 raging_user
Member since 2013 • 467 Posts

Valve, since players still play their games on a a daily basis and don't wait months are weeks to play it again

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Jankarcop

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#74  Edited By Jankarcop
Member since 2011 • 11058 Posts

@AM-Gamer said:

@Jankarcop: valve couldn't hold ND jock. Try 9 amazing games and 4 amazing franchises vs a now irrelevant fps and a company that's about to lose millions on the suckmachine.

Troll harder.

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Heil68

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#75 Heil68
Member since 2004 • 60681 Posts

Naughty Gods have 2 games in the top 5 of all video game history, Valve does not

Gabe am cry.

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#76 PinkieWinkie
Member since 2006 • 1454 Posts

@Jankarcop: So developing an amazing franchise almost a decade ago is somehow better than consistently pumping out some of the best games every couple of years along with multiple gotys? Sure bud.

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TheTruthIsREAL

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#77 TheTruthIsREAL
Member since 2013 • 813 Posts

I chose Naughty Dog because Half Life is laughable compared to the games now. Portal is a borefest and it's nothing but a 3D puzzle, nothing more. I guess if PC gamers enjoy Bore Life and Portal (lol) well, more power to them. Naughty Dog makes better games.

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#78 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

@mems_1224 said:

Valve barely makes games anymore.

Probably because people spend 3-4 years of their life playing only one of them.

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Jankarcop

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#79  Edited By Jankarcop
Member since 2011 • 11058 Posts

@PinkieWinkie said:

@Jankarcop: So developing an amazing franchise almost a decade ago is somehow better than consistently pumping out some of the best games every couple of years along with multiple gotys? Sure bud.

steam/hl1/hl2/tf2/lf4d/l4d2/portal/portal2 >>>>> uncharted2/3

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blangenakker

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#80  Edited By blangenakker
Member since 2006 • 3240 Posts

In game development Naughty Dog has been better than Valve lately

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#81 PinkieWinkie
Member since 2006 • 1454 Posts

@Jankarcop: For you young PC gamers, I would like to educate you that's ND has developed more games and IPs than Uncharted 2 and Tlous.

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#82 jake44
Member since 2003 • 2085 Posts

@IgGy621985 said:

Nice job with subtle poll options. Also, learn English ffs.

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#83 Sweenix
Member since 2013 • 5957 Posts

Naughty dog destroys valve.

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#84  Edited By cain006
Member since 2008 • 8625 Posts

@DarkLink77 said:

Lol okay, sure. The original Half-Life was super important. It was also made more than 15 years ago, and they've made nothing with an influence that's even remotely comparable since, Steam aside. And even Gabe himself has said that they are more focused on multiplayer games than Half-Life right now, because it makes more money.

They haven't made a new IP since 1998. They haven't released anything Half-Life related in nearly seven years, which is all the more pathetic when you consider that since 2006, Half-Life has been delivered as episodic content. Still no info on Episode 3, though. They're challenging Duke Nukem Forever as vaporware king.

They have been living off of Half-Life's legacy, and other people's ideas. That is the definition of creatively bankrupt.

And really, don't presume to know how old I am, how many games I've played, or how much knowledge about video games I have. You know nothing about me. It makes you look like a fool.

Why does it matter that they make new IPs themselves? Portal 2 is a great game. TF2 is as well. I don't care much for L4D or HL2 but I don't see how not coming up with your own IPs suddenly makes their games bad.

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#85 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

@cain006 said:

@DarkLink77 said:

Lol okay, sure. The original Half-Life was super important. It was also made more than 15 years ago, and they've made nothing with an influence that's even remotely comparable since, Steam aside. And even Gabe himself has said that they are more focused on multiplayer games than Half-Life right now, because it makes more money.

They haven't made a new IP since 1998. They haven't released anything Half-Life related in nearly seven years, which is all the more pathetic when you consider that since 2006, Half-Life has been delivered as episodic content. Still no info on Episode 3, though. They're challenging Duke Nukem Forever as vaporware king.

They have been living off of Half-Life's legacy, and other people's ideas. That is the definition of creatively bankrupt.

And really, don't presume to know how old I am, how many games I've played, or how much knowledge about video games I have. You know nothing about me. It makes you look like a fool.

Why does it matter that they make new IPs themselves? Portal 2 is a great game. TF2 is as well. I don't care much for L4D or HL2 but I don't see how not coming up with your own IPs suddenly makes their games bad.

I never said it made them bad. It makes them creatively bankrupt.

I personally don't like a lot of their games, but I wouldn't call most of them bad.

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#86 zeeshanhaider
Member since 2004 • 5524 Posts

@MBirdy88 said:

@zeeshanhaider said:

Comparing Valve to any other studio like ND is not only an insult to Valve but a crime against humanity. How many studios have taken risks like Valve? Every valve product screams quality and creativity. With every games they brought something new to the table and didn't just churn out sequels yearly or every two years which they could have done easily. Valave impact on the industry is so fucking huge. What the **** did ND do in caparison?

make graphic whore games with little substance beyond movie like visuals and animation.... basically as far as games goe, Crash and Daxter were far better.

But you know... console gamers don't care about graphics... thats graphic whoring pc gamers.

apperently the more like a movie a game is, the best in the industry it is...

makes sense right? ... yea.... totally.

And the funny thing is, none of what ND did was original in any way, shape or form. In the PS2 days they were copying Mario and in the PS3 days ripping off PoP/Tomb Raider with automated press 'X' to win gameplay.

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zeeshanhaider

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#87  Edited By zeeshanhaider
Member since 2004 • 5524 Posts

@uninspiredcup said:

Bringing Portal into the equitation would simply be abuse. Naughty Dog would need aid from the UN.

@DarkLink77 said:

@cain006 said:

@DarkLink77 said:

Lol okay, sure. The original Half-Life was super important. It was also made more than 15 years ago, and they've made nothing with an influence that's even remotely comparable since, Steam aside. And even Gabe himself has said that they are more focused on multiplayer games than Half-Life right now, because it makes more money.

They haven't made a new IP since 1998. They haven't released anything Half-Life related in nearly seven years, which is all the more pathetic when you consider that since 2006, Half-Life has been delivered as episodic content. Still no info on Episode 3, though. They're challenging Duke Nukem Forever as vaporware king.

They have been living off of Half-Life's legacy, and other people's ideas. That is the definition of creatively bankrupt.

And really, don't presume to know how old I am, how many games I've played, or how much knowledge about video games I have. You know nothing about me. It makes you look like a fool.

Why does it matter that they make new IPs themselves? Portal 2 is a great game. TF2 is as well. I don't care much for L4D or HL2 but I don't see how not coming up with your own IPs suddenly makes their games bad.

I never said it made them bad. It makes them creatively bankrupt.

I personally don't like a lot of their games, but I wouldn't call most of them bad.

Please enlighten me what 'creative' thing did ND do? I dare you.

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Bazooka_4ME

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#88 Bazooka_4ME
Member since 2008 • 2540 Posts

If by "games" then ND wins.

But company as a whole, then Valve wins.

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#89 Roler42
Member since 2013 • 1067 Posts

Valve

After CB on the ps1, ND has done NOTHING that catches my eye, and I have yet to ever be given a reason to care about UC or TLOU

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#90  Edited By Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@Heil68 said:

Naughty Gods have 2 games in the top 5 of all video game history, Valve does not

Gabe am cry.

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#91 AtariKidX
Member since 2010 • 7156 Posts

Both they are very good but Naughty Dog is a lot better.

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deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd

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#92  Edited By deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd
Member since 2012 • 12449 Posts

@good_sk8er7 said:

Since Valve doesn't really make games anymore... yes they are better.

I didn't really fancy Half Life either so... yeah.

..... Lef4Dead, Portal and by far their biggest game DoTA .... I guess living under a rock may lead you to believe they don't.

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#93 biggest_loser
Member since 2007 • 24508 Posts

To me Naughty Dog is eclipsing Valve very quickly. I'm far more interested in the types of games they're making. MMOs and F2P don't hold any appeal. The success of Last of Us lays waste to that business about the market just wanting social media games, MMOs etc.

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deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd

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#94  Edited By deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd
Member since 2012 • 12449 Posts

@DarkLink77 said:

@uninspiredcup said:

@DarkLink77 said:

@uninspiredcup said:

@DarkLink77 said:

Valve is a creatively bankrupt studio who hasn't made an original IP since Half-Life.

But what about Left 4 Dead?

That was Turtle Rock's idea. Valve bought them.

B-b-but Portal.

Once again, someone else's idea that they bought.

But Counter Strike and Team Fortress....

Both mods they bought.

DOTA 2....

Is basically intellectual property theft. They stole WarCraft 3's game mechanics and art design. The only reason it's not called Defense of the Ancients 2 is because Blizzard sued them.

They're a shit company with no original ideas. The only thing they really have going for them is Half-Life (a series and fanbase they no longer care about), and Steam.

Naughty Dog has made some great games, but are inconsistent as ****. Gun to my head, I choose Valve, but only for Steam.

Valve has won and Bioshock sucks. Thus, the universe is in alignment.

Forever better than Valve's "games." They'd be irrelevant

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EODbHVySFWM

Being an older gamer with a much wider repertoire of games, I look at history, the big picture. Unlike you young console fellows, loud and stuck in the immediate, I can objectively look at history as a whole. By doing so, we see almost every AAA game (including Bioshock my very very young friend) have taken "inspiration" from the creatively bankrupt Valve. And all those creatively bankrupt people bought up and now part of Valve (due to Valve not being creative).

Son, you need to go back to the drawing board. Reevaluate things.

Lol okay, sure. The original Half-Life was super important. It was also made more than 15 years ago, and they've made nothing with an influence that's even remotely comparable since, Steam aside. And even Gabe himself has said that they are more focused on multiplayer games than Half-Life right now, because it makes more money.

They haven't made a new IP since 1998. They haven't released anything Half-Life related in nearly seven years, which is all the more pathetic when you consider that since 2006, Half-Life has been delivered as episodic content. Still no info on Episode 3, though. They're challenging Duke Nukem Forever as vaporware king.

They have been living off of Half-Life's legacy, and other people's ideas. That is the definition of creatively bankrupt.

And really, don't presume to know how old I am, how many games I've played, or how much knowledge about video games I have. You know nothing about me. It makes you look like a fool.

.... what am I reading? How is Uncharted / Last of us anything comparable to Half-Life of its time? ALL they do is cinematics and graphics better than 99% of companies, what have either game franchises done in the gameplay department? other than not stand out at all... didn't even try to improve on shooting mechanics found in friggin GTA games for gods sake.

Tell me again, why other than making flashy games with little substance how is Naughty dog even comparable to Valve?

And the main crutch of your argument is "Creative bankruptcy due to buying up talent." because no company buys ideas and talent. because every companies idea comes from within? failing to mention VALVE's brilliant community support for modding made Team Fortress, Portal and Left4Dead/Day of defeat possible in the first place. so thye hired the people that made these games? because they have a much better eye for talent than most companies...

its one of the stupidest arguments I have heard so far against valve. They build a community that churns out some of the best mods ever, then instead of letting that idea go undervalued, they take that person/team under their win, provide their excellent production values and make everything they touch a massive winner.

Nothing Influential? well not innovative but definitely influential. DoTA 2 being the fairest "free2play" game on the market in terms of MOBA's, having the community make mods which enter the game (well mostly aesthetic in this case) and they make money off of it.

Not many companies know their market anywhere close to Valve, or have made as many good games regardless of where the ideas come from.

Your telling me Uncharted is an original idea/setting? REALLY? your telling me last of us, which is riding on the drawn out zombie fad .. is innovative because it features aman and an a.i girl? (yea we TOTALLY havnt seen that before) oh creative right... coral zombies.

honestly, no matter what ND and Sony fanboys say... all naughty dog have focused on this gen is 2 linear TPS with ridiculously good graphics, mediocre gameplay and poor MP.

EDIT:

Also are you suggesting that focusing on MP games is bad? I didn;t know we lived in 1995 where SP games are for some reason magically more important... they are not, far from it, people like playing games with eachother or other people.... dare I say, more so than SP games.

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silversix_

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#95 silversix_
Member since 2010 • 26347 Posts

I think they are. I hate Portal, L4D is too simplistic for my taste, don't care about CS and HL2 is the only Valve title that i liked a shittone. Actually i'd say that they're equal for now cuz ND has TLOU which is amazing and Valve has HL2 which is equally as amazing. All their other titles are just 'okay' and nothing to brag about (for me personally)

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Sushiglutton

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#96 Sushiglutton
Member since 2009 • 9839 Posts

@biggest_loser said:

To me Naughty Dog is eclipsing Valve very quickly. I'm far more interested in the types of games they're making. MMOs and F2P don't hold any appeal. The success of Last of Us lays waste to that business about the market just wanting social media games, MMOs etc.

Pretty much how I feel too. Valve is all about pseudo economy systems and other forms of social stuff these day. That's why they won't make HL3. I did enjoy Portal 2 though, but it's not as good as Uncharted/TLOU imo.

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sukraj

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#97 sukraj
Member since 2008 • 27859 Posts

I like Valve

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deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd

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#98 deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd
Member since 2012 • 12449 Posts


As of yesterday's peak alone, there were over 750,000 people playing Valve's apparently "non existent games in years" honestly, who are these people that come into these threads with "valve doesn't make games, not influential" ... and then votes ND ... made 2 tps games with brilliant graphics and presentation. what smore important? I think the 750k people playing games for gameplay is personally, BUT f*CK LOGIC

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Martin_G_N

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#99 Martin_G_N
Member since 2006 • 2124 Posts

@Sushiglutton said:

@biggest_loser said:

To me Naughty Dog is eclipsing Valve very quickly. I'm far more interested in the types of games they're making. MMOs and F2P don't hold any appeal. The success of Last of Us lays waste to that business about the market just wanting social media games, MMOs etc.

Pretty much how I feel too. Valve is all about pseudo economy systems and other forms of social stuff these day. That's why they won't make HL3. I did enjoy Portal 2 though, but it's not as good as Uncharted/TLOU imo.

Agreed. And the skillset required for making games like Uncharted and The Last of us is just higher than what Valve has shown, especially considering it's on the PS3 hardware, which Valve did'nt even want to work on because of the complexity.

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edwardecl

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#100 edwardecl
Member since 2005 • 2240 Posts

As much as I like Naughty Dog Valve is slightly better when you factor in they can do things Naughty Dog can't, they get to work on and do whatever they like good or bad. They are trying to attack Microsoft from a different angle in the PC market while making games, and now they are promoting Linux as a gaming platform. If they pull it off then they would be one of the greatest ever in my opinion.

Then again I don't like Microsoft so factor that in. If it's all about the games and pushing hardware obviously Naughty Dog wins.