"Kingdom of Amalur:Reckogning / Skyrim" hybrid = Best Rpg Ever.

Simple: Take the action combat system of KoA, put it in skyrim. And that's it.

Ok, I'll get right on it.

well it also needs an interesting plot cause both were below average in that department

Two Worlds 2?

Not that ive played it, but it looks like the middle ground in terms of what youre on about.

Add an action RPG to another action RPG and you get a "best RPG ever"?

Do you even know what an RPG is?

Two Worlds 2?

Not that ive played it, but it looks like the middle ground in terms of what youre on about.

D1zzyCriminal

Add an action RPG to another action RPG and you get a "best RPG ever"?

Do you even know what an RPG is?

N30F3N1X

Skyrim is an action rpg now? Why? Because it has combat? Maybe you are the one who is confused?

"Role playing game", is there a better setting to roleplay in than an open world where you can go anywhere and do pretty much anything you wish? It is not a perfect game, but how could it be more rpg than it already is? Please enlighten us as to your definition of a roleplaying game, because I assure you it is YOUR opinion, not a fact. I would argue KOA is an action game with lots of RPG elements, and Skyrim is an RPG with action elements. Either way that is my opinion and my definition. So before being condescending the next time when it comes to such an open discussion think about it some more.

For a great example of a true action rpg I would tos up Dark Messiah. Very action oriented and linear, yet has rpg elements to level up your skills to tailor your gameplay.

Anyway, I think the idea is awesome. KOA's action oriented combat and loot in a huge open world like Skyrim would be awesome. My only complaint with KOA is it is linear to the point you cannot even jump off a small step in some case. No jump arrow, can't jump. I would even take KOAs art design, just make it open world like Skyrim.

*snip*vfibsux

Bleah...Kingdom of Amalur is below Skyrim in every single department...

Combat in Skyrim is way way way more sophisticatedand better and satisfying than KOAR ,add a couple of mods and skyrim combat is miles ahead KOAR...

Bleah...Kingdom of Amalur is below Skyrim in every single department...

Combat in Skyrim is way way way more sophisticatedand better and satisfying than KOAR ,add a couple of mods and skyrim combat is miles ahead KOAR...

rhazzy

Skyrim is an action rpg now? Why? Because it has combat? Maybe you are the one who is confused?

"Role playing game", is there a better setting to roleplay in than an open world where you can go anywhere and do pretty much anything you wish? It is not a perfect game, but how could it be more rpg than it already is? Please enlighten us as to your definition of a roleplaying game, because I assure you it is YOUR opinion, not a fact. I would argue KOA is an action game with lots of RPG elements, and Skyrim is an RPG with action elements. Either way that is my opinion and my definition. So before being condescending the next time when it comes to such an open discussion think about it some more.

For a great example of a true action rpg I would tos up Dark Messiah. Very action oriented and linear, yet has rpg elements to level up your skills to tailor your gameplay.

Anyway, I think the idea is awesome. KOA's action oriented combat and loot in a huge open world like Skyrim would be awesome. My only complaint with KOA is it is linear to the point you cannot even jump off a small step in some case. No jump arrow, can't jump. I would even take KOAs art design, just make it open world like Skyrim.

vfibsux

LMAO. Play Black Isle games if you want to know what an RPG is. Sure, Dark Messiah defines ARPG better, doesn't mean Skyrim is any less of one.

In fact the mere idea of calling Skyrim an RPG is hilarious. And I should be the confused one :lol: It has a levelling system that is less deep than Call of Duty games and the same can be said about the plots (both in the main quest and the sidequests) and the dialogues, and an almost textbook ARPG and completely unbalanced combat that renders any hint of "character build" meaningless because as long as you skill up crafting skills you are factually better at everything than a pure combat type oriented character.

Sure, the exploration, crafting are good and the shouts add extra spice to the combat, but don't for the love of god say it's a good RPG because that's just ludicrous.

Two Worlds 2?

Not that ive played it, but it looks like the middle ground in terms of what youre on about.

D1zzyCriminal

[QUOTE="D1zzyCriminal"]

Two Worlds 2?

Not that ive played it, but it looks like the middle ground in terms of what youre on about.

KABCOOL

Kingdoms of Amalur is a boring game...i played only a couple of h and got really bored of it

[QUOTE="vfibsux"]

Skyrim is an action rpg now? Why? Because it has combat? Maybe you are the one who is confused?

"Role playing game", is there a better setting to roleplay in than an open world where you can go anywhere and do pretty much anything you wish? It is not a perfect game, but how could it be more rpg than it already is? Please enlighten us as to your definition of a roleplaying game, because I assure you it is YOUR opinion, not a fact. I would argue KOA is an action game with lots of RPG elements, and Skyrim is an RPG with action elements. Either way that is my opinion and my definition. So before being condescending the next time when it comes to such an open discussion think about it some more.

For a great example of a true action rpg I would tos up Dark Messiah. Very action oriented and linear, yet has rpg elements to level up your skills to tailor your gameplay.

Anyway, I think the idea is awesome. KOA's action oriented combat and loot in a huge open world like Skyrim would be awesome. My only complaint with KOA is it is linear to the point you cannot even jump off a small step in some case. No jump arrow, can't jump. I would even take KOAs art design, just make it open world like Skyrim.

N30F3N1X

LMAO. Play Black Isle games if you want to know what an RPG is. Sure, Dark Messiah defines ARPG better, doesn't mean Skyrim is any less of one.

In fact the mere idea of calling Skyrim an RPG is hilarious. And I should be the confused one :lol: It has a levelling system that is less deep than Call of Duty games and the same can be said about the plots (both in the main quest and the sidequests) and the dialogues, and an almost textbook ARPG and completely unbalanced combat that renders any hint of "character build" meaningless because as long as you skill up crafting skills you are factually better at everything than a pure combat type oriented character.

Sure, the exploration, crafting are good and the shouts add extra spice to the combat, but don't for the love of god say it's a good RPG because that's just ludicrous.

And I asked you to give me your definition of an rpg in your own words, not point at a general BI title. And funny you assume I did not play them.

[QUOTE="N30F3N1X"]

[QUOTE="vfibsux"]

Skyrim is an action rpg now? Why? Because it has combat? Maybe you are the one who is confused?

"Role playing game", is there a better setting to roleplay in than an open world where you can go anywhere and do pretty much anything you wish? It is not a perfect game, but how could it be more rpg than it already is? Please enlighten us as to your definition of a roleplaying game, because I assure you it is YOUR opinion, not a fact. I would argue KOA is an action game with lots of RPG elements, and Skyrim is an RPG with action elements. Either way that is my opinion and my definition. So before being condescending the next time when it comes to such an open discussion think about it some more.

For a great example of a true action rpg I would tos up Dark Messiah. Very action oriented and linear, yet has rpg elements to level up your skills to tailor your gameplay.

Anyway, I think the idea is awesome. KOA's action oriented combat and loot in a huge open world like Skyrim would be awesome. My only complaint with KOA is it is linear to the point you cannot even jump off a small step in some case. No jump arrow, can't jump. I would even take KOAs art design, just make it open world like Skyrim.

vfibsux

LMAO. Play Black Isle games if you want to know what an RPG is. Sure, Dark Messiah defines ARPG better, doesn't mean Skyrim is any less of one.

In fact the mere idea of calling Skyrim an RPG is hilarious. And I should be the confused one :lol: It has a levelling system that is less deep than Call of Duty games and the same can be said about the plots (both in the main quest and the sidequests) and the dialogues, and an almost textbook ARPG and completely unbalanced combat that renders any hint of "character build" meaningless because as long as you skill up crafting skills you are factually better at everything than a pure combat type oriented character.

Sure, the exploration, crafting are good and the shouts add extra spice to the combat, but don't for the love of god say it's a good RPG because that's just ludicrous.

His point in still bang on. The entire levelling system revolves around being better at combat. The only "real" social skill: Speech revolves around reducing item prices, which leads right back to the improved killing ability. The game does a good job of disguising it but Skyrim is way more Diablo than Torment.

There's nothing that requires RPG's to have many social skills or abilities. Never in the history of CRPG's has every RPG been focused on speech and endless dialog. Many RPG's were more about exploration, tactics, combat, and/or other aspects (yup, just like Skyrim).

"The game does a good job of disguising it but Skyrim is way more Diablo than Torment."

Eh D2 is nothing but killing stuff...Skyrim has many activities outside of killing like including crafting and quests with non-violent alternatives. It's between Planescape and Diablo sure...as far as dialog/story is concerned...but not so far it's not a RPG anymore. Planescape and Diablo are pretty bad examples for Skyrim anyways.

All the people yammering about dialog/story are talking about is there preferences in the types of RPG's they enjoy...they don't own the definition of the genre and their opinions about it run contrary to the history of the genre.

Ok, I'll get right on it.

-Unreal-

Hurry up.

blah blah blah blah blah your opinion sucks mine does not blah blah blah blah.... That's all I heard dude. Learn to express your views minus the condescending attitude and maybe someone will be willing to actually debate with you. Your definition of an RPG is an opinion, and that sir is the only fact in this matter. Good day, I will say no more.

And I asked you to give me your definition of an rpg in your own words, not point at a general BI title. And funny you assume I did not play them.

vfibsux

That's all you heard? Am I to assume you don't want to continue the argument you started because you don't have the means to? I'm not debating, just showing why you are wrong ;)

My definition of RPG is in its broadest term a game where your character's skills matter more than yours. A character development system, a combat that reflects this definition is what makes or breaks an RPG for me.

Exploration, an inventory and a party help aswell, they're not "as crucial" as the former things but they surely do have their place.

Skyrim's combat is marginally dependent on your character's skills and definitely more action oriented and the character development is insultingly bad. Add level scaling to that and "progression" becomes its own antithesis. There are no character relations either, it's just you and the rest of the world. That's really messed up for an RPG. By level 20 you'll meet more Draugr Deathlords than actual Draugrs, what am I levelling up for then?

Exploration in Skyrim is great. Really ****ing great. And so is the inventory and, with proper mods, the crafting too. The main aspects that would make it an RPG however are too broken for it to be considered just an "RPG".

As a game Skyrim is definitely one of the biggest titles one could think of from 2011. It didn't deserve all the GotYes it got in 2011 imo but who cares. It's still a great game. But as an RPG? LMAO. Even Terraria craps on Skyrim as an RPG.

But Skyrim isn't an RPG.

There was a contest held by Obsidian....who can describe in their own words what is a RPG...i cannot find the link...if someone know what iam talking about and didnt forget the link like me, please do post it here to put just a little light to this "RPG debate" :)

This? http://www.vg247.com/2011/12/13/obsidian-dev-unimpressed-with-rpg-advances-which-undermine-the-thrill-of-exploration/

Obsidian dev unimpressed with RPG advances which "undermine" the thrill of exploration Obsidian's Chris Avellone is of the belief some of the mechanics implemented in RPGs over the years have "undermined" the genre, making it more about convenience than "the thrill of victory and discovery."

"I'll say the 'advances' have been more for player convenience, sometimes good, sometimes bad, in my opinion," he told IndustryGamers. "Journals, quest compasses that point directly to the goal and show you the route, auto-maps, etc. are helpful, but, at the same time, I think it undermines the thrill of victory and discovery and a lot of what makes an RPG an RPG (exploration, notably)."

Avellone, who has works on a number of RPGs such as Fallout 2 and Icewind Dale, does seem pleased with advances in "non-interface" elements such as consequence systems and fully voice-acted characters – all which are bleeding over into other areas of gaming. "I enjoy the fact that role-playing game mechanics are bleeding into other genres, and the 'genres' aren't as clear-cut any more," he said. "Developers are seeing the worth in customization, levelling, dialogue, choice and reactivity and other elements that would normally be considered RPG mechanics and introducing them into multiple titles."

Obsidian has various titles in the works at the moment, and was announced recently as the developer behind the South Park RPG.article

Kinda funny how he says exploration is a lot of what makes a RPG a RPG. I don't put a lot of stock into what a single developers thinks, but even here he seems to be saying what others are saying...which is what makes and RPG a RPG isn't one single thing and there's a lot to them (exploration, customization, leveling, dialog, choice, ect). Skyrim has all of those. It does some better than others (exploration, leveling, customization, ect), but that's what people love about the series I think.

I find it quite idiotic to discuss what makes an RPG. I've played many different ones and found most if not all to be enjoyable. Sure, they all had their flaws in some area, but what really matters is that you enjoy it. Everyone has their own taste for things they want to see in a rpg. Their will never be an rpg were everyone thinks it was perfect. Glad to hear what the TC would like to see, but that doesn't mean anyone else will. Just buy the ones you prefer and pass on the rest. End of story!!slabber44

I find it quite idiotic to discuss what makes an RPG. I've played many different ones and found most if not all to be enjoyable. Sure, they all had their flaws in some area, but what really matters is that you enjoy it. Everyone has their own taste for things they want to see in a rpg. Their will never be an rpg were everyone thinks it was perfect. Glad to hear what the TC would like to see, but that doesn't mean anyone else will. Just buy the ones you prefer and pass on the rest. End of story!!slabber44

Well by that relativist logic, it would be sound to speak of Unreal Tournament as an RPG.

[QUOTE="slabber44"]I find it quite idiotic to discuss what makes an RPG. I've played many different ones and found most if not all to be enjoyable. Sure, they all had their flaws in some area, but what really matters is that you enjoy it. Everyone has their own taste for things they want to see in a rpg. Their will never be an rpg were everyone thinks it was perfect. Glad to hear what the TC would like to see, but that doesn't mean anyone else will. Just buy the ones you prefer and pass on the rest. End of story!!Renevent42

Yes, but some of those RPG are better then other RPG's just because they focus on those specific "things" that makes an RPG an RPG...

[QUOTE="Renevent42"][QUOTE="slabber44"]I find it quite idiotic to discuss what makes an RPG. I've played many different ones and found most if not all to be enjoyable. Sure, they all had their flaws in some area, but what really matters is that you enjoy it. Everyone has their own taste for things they want to see in a rpg. Their will never be an rpg were everyone thinks it was perfect. Glad to hear what the TC would like to see, but that doesn't mean anyone else will. Just buy the ones you prefer and pass on the rest. End of story!!rhazzy

Yes, but some of those RPG are better then other RPG's just because they focus on those specific "things" that makes an RPG an RPG...

What's better than others is in the eyes of the beholder. I know many here think BGII is the greatest RPG of all time...not me. I like other series like Ultima, Lands of Lore, and others and enjoyed those more. At any rate, Skyrim clearly checks the boxes for being a RPG. It has exploration, leveling, dialog, choices, stats and skills, quests, and a whole crap ton of stuff that's considered "the stuff RPG's are made from". I don't think there's anything wrong with saying someone enjoys TW2 because it does conversations and C&C better, but pretending Skyrim isn't a RPG is kinda silly.

It has exploration,leveling,dialog, stats and skills, quests

Renevent42

None of these are exclusive to RPGs. The level systems implemented in Tribes or in the plethora of modern tacticool shooter aren't role playing in any sense of the word.

choicesRenevent42

Having meaningful choices and restrictions placed on a player (to the point that class holds rigid framework) and his wordly interactions would constitute Skyrim as an RPG. We both know Skyrim does not fall in such a category.

[QUOTE="Renevent42"]It has exploration,leveling,dialog, stats and skills, quests

Socijalisticka

None of these are exclusive to RPGs. The level systems implemented in Tribes or in the plethora of modern tacticool shooter aren't role playing in any sense of the word.

choicesRenevent42

Having meaningful choices and restrictions placed on a player (to the point that class holds rigid framework) and his wordly interactions would constitute Skyrim as an RPG. We both know Skyrim does not fall in such a category.

Gamespot is full of people who confuse opinion/point of view with fact on a daily basis, which results in the disrespect of opinions and makes for crappy debate. If you are so close minded that someone cannot refer to Skyrim as an "RPG" in any sense of the word I would hate to see how you handle more important topics.

If you want to really get technical let's look at a definition of "roleplay":

to assume the attitudes, actions, or discourse, of another

So in Skyrim when you decide to be a bad guy and train up theivery to go around the world and steal from everyone you can....or a cold blooded assassin killing at will.............if you are not these IN REAL LIFE guess what? You are.......omg......wait for it..........ROLEPLAYING!!! Holy crap. It doesn't get much easier than that. No YOU might not consider that a roleplaying game, but it certainly is not out of the realm of fathoming the possibility as some here would suggest. The only point here is you alone do not say what is and what is not roleplaying for someone else, the mere notion you think you have that power is absurd. THat is what many are doing here. If you want a healthy debate on what makes a RPG, awesome. But belittling other's opinions is not going to entice anyone to have that debate with you.

Gamespot is full of people who confuse opinion/point of view with fact on a daily basis, which results in the disrespect of opinions and makes for crappy debate. If you are so close minded that someone cannot refer to Skyrim as an "RPG" in any sense of the word I would hate to see how you handle more important topics.

If you want to really get technical let's look at a definition of "roleplay":

to assume the attitudes, actions, or discourse, of another

So in Skyrim when you decide to be a bad guy and train up theivery to go around the world and steal from everyone you can....or a cold blooded assassin killing at will.............if you are not these IN REAL LIFE guess what? You are.......omg......wait for it..........ROLEPLAYING!!! Holy crap. It doesn't get much easier than that. No YOU might not consider that a roleplaying game, but it certainly is not out of the realm of fathoming the possibility as some here would suggest. The only point here is you alone do not say what is and what is not roleplaying for someone else, the mere notion you think you have that power is absurd. THat is what many are doing here. If you want a healthy debate on what makes a RPG, awesome. But belittling other's opinions is not going to entice anyone to have that debate with you.

vfibsux

Nice argument you got there. So going by your logic I can say Doom and Quake are RPGs.

HOLD ON FOLKS. This has to be the biggest discovery since Planck's elaboration of quantum mechanics. mind = blown!

There's a lot of crossover in genres, yes, but a game like Tribes only has small pieces of these ingredients. I mean, what does it have? Some basic form of leveling? Which is more like just unlocks? Other than that does it have exploration of a large world with lots of things to discover? Quests to do? NPC's to interact with and do quests for? Choices to make in how to approach said quests? Your argument with Tribes is a failing one and clearly is a huge stretch to even try and make. Pointing out a non-RPG has a tiny sliver of RPG components does not discount Skyrim as an RPG at all. And no, Skyrim absolutely falls into such category.Huge world to explore with tons of quests to do and NPC's to interact with. Leveling system with lots of customization that goes beyond combat and into things like crafting and speech. There are choices to be made whether you guys want to admit it or not. Faction quests you decide, there are yarls you can oust (or work for), you negotiate deals, deadric quests...just some examples.Renevent42

I've stated that these traits are NOT limited to RPGs, that they are NOT determinant factors of what makes an RPG. Tribes is not a cross-over, as it lacks even the "sliver" of RPG components.

When did I say Skyrim lacked any choice? I've only said it lacked meaning as the choices you are granted and the choices you make are not at all restrictive. Joining the Stormclocks or the Legion is only meaningful choice in that the rewards you recieve differ based on which faction you join. Any other change is merely superficial and not of consequence to your character development. A soley ranged or CC-combat player can join the mages guild. Quests are not limited based on role, as even role lacks restriction.

There are restrictions too...people in this thread lie about it. Try killing a Deadric Lord at level 20 having never used destruction magic (skill level 1)...you will literally be there all day and suck up 1000 mana potions because your attacks will be utterly ineffective. Your combat prowess *is* based heavily on your attributes and skills. So are your other non-combat skills. Can you craft ebony armor without the required skills? Can you put two enchantments on an item with the proper skill? Does your crafted items grow in power along with your leveling of said skills? The answers are obvious... Is the C&C as well done as TW2? No, but nobody is making that claim. However, as a whole Skyrim clearly has the workings of a RPG and checks all the boxes. You may like other games that focus on dialog and story more, and that's fine, it doesn't make Skyrim any less of a RPG though.Renevent42

By restrictions I mean in the sense of character development and class structure (we are speaking of RPGs after all). Anybody has the potentional to become capable in the fields of magic, enchantment, and armor crafting. The only restriction is character level, not role.

You may like other games that focus on dialog and story more, and that's fineRenevent42

I would say that dialogue and story-driven games are not necessarily RPGs.

Skyrim fails for me because the 'action style' combat is lame. (go play Dark Souls or Blade of Darkness and see much better duels are)

And the 'story' aspect (writing/characters/dialog) is also terrible.

Either give me good combat (be it tactical like Temple of Elemental Evil, or action like Dark Souls), or give me good 'story'. (like Planescape) OR a decent mix or both, Baldurs Gate, Fallout 1/2.

Skyrim provides none of that. The only thing it has going for it, in my eyes, is exploration. And even that falls flat when the combat is crap and the rpg mechanics and bestiary are so weak.

I'm not even sure what your argument is at this point...you point out games with slivers of RPG in attempt to discount Skyrim is a RPG, and then turn around and say it lacks even the sliver of RPG. So why bring it up Tribes at all?

I mean...that's the point...games are judged and categorized as a whole. As a whole, Skyrim checks so many RPG boxes what's the point of even bringing up Tribes? Skyrim doesn't just have one or two things that are kinda like RPG's...the entire game is built around RPG staples.

And no, there are quests with consequences. An example is the blades quest...killing parantha-bla-whatever-it's-name-is has you kill a major character in the plot, and if you do you also are no longer able to associate yourself with the Grey Beards...which among other things also stops you from getting their "whispers of shout locations" quest lines.

Like I said, Skyrim doesn't do the dialog/C&C as good as TW2, but it has a hefty dose of just about damn near everything else in the RPG genre. In those respects it outdoes TW2 in fact. If you want a RPG with heavy dialog and story choices...go for TW2. If you want a RPG built around exploration, leveling, open world dynamics, questing, and stuff like that,

Skyrim is your game. Skyrim is a RPG. You may or may not like it, which is fine, but it clearly falls into the RPG genre.

Skyrim fails for me because the 'action style' combat is lame. (go play Dark Souls or Blade of Darkness and see much better duels are)

And the 'story' aspect (writing/characters/dialog) is also terrible.

Either give me good combat (be it tactical like Temple of Elemental Evil, or action like Dark Souls), or give me good 'story'. (like Planescape) OR a decent mix or both, Baldurs Gate, Fallout 1/2.

Skyrim provides none of that. The only thing it has going for it, in my eyes, is exploration. And even that falls flat when the combat is crap and the rpg mechanics and bestiary are so weak.

Plus it doesn't do choices and consequences either.

I'm not even sure what your argument is at this point...you point out games with slivers of RPG in attempt to discount Skyrim is a RPG, and then turn around and say it lacks even the sliver of RPG. So why bring it up at all? I mean...that's the point...games are judged and categorized as a whole.

I've stated that none of these characteristics (leveling, stats) are exlusive to RPGs. I've used Tribes in example, stating that it has implemented in it a level/skill-driven system, and yet the game is void of RPG characteristics. Not exclusive, therefore not a determinant factor.

As a whole, Skyrim checks so many RPG boxes what's the point of even bringing up Tribes? Skyrim doesn't just have one or two things that are kinda like RPG's...the entire game is built around RPG staples. And no, there are quests with consequences. An example is the blades quest...killing parantha-bla-whatever-it's-name-is has you kill a major character in the plot, and if you do you also are no longer able to associate yourself with the Grey Beards...which among other things also stops you from getting their "whispers of shout locations" quest lines. Like I said, Skyrim doesn't do the dialog/C&C as good as TW2, but it has a hefty dose of just about damn near everything else in the RPG genre. In those respects it outdoes TW2 in fact. If you want a RPG with heavy dialog and story choices...go for TW2. If you want a RPG built around exploration, leveling, open world dynamics, questing, and stuff like that, Skyrim is your game. Skyrim is a RPG.Renevent42

Are you not capable of understanding what I've been arguing this whole time? I'll say for the last time, all these characterstics (inventory, leveling, exploration, quests etc) are superficial when it comes to determining whether a game belongs in the RPG class or not. By this premise, it is possible to have an RPG without implementing a leveling system. The fundamental of an RPG is role development and with it, role-restriction, and restriction on wordly interactions, hence the term "role-playing".

You know original Blood Omen plot on KOAR engine would have been nice. Big map with dynamic combat add some gore and the results would be fantastic.