Somewhat computer related, but i have a question

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#1 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
I heard that getting an Uninterruptible Power Supply is important when you want to save your powered stuff from breaking, like computers, and other stuff. I'm looking at this one: http://www.amazon.com/APC-BE450G-Back-UPS-8-Outlet-Uninterrupted/dp/B001BTWQDS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top Will this one work with any PCs out there? A few days ago, my power went out, and at the time my PC was still connected to the power, so i was afraid it might have damaged it.
#2 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
With modern computers, a power outage usually doesn't damage anything. They are made with technologies that prevent that. Power Surges surely DO damage components. Either way, make sure your UPS has a Surge Protector in it as well.
#3 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]With modern computers, a power outage usually doesn't damage anything. They are made with technologies that prevent that. Power Surges surely DO damage components. Either way, make sure your UPS has a Surge Protector in it as well.

I looked up the term power surge on wikipedia, it isn't very easy to understand. Could you explain it?
#4 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="FelipeInside"]With modern computers, a power outage usually doesn't damage anything. They are made with technologies that prevent that. Power Surges surely DO damage components. Either way, make sure your UPS has a Surge Protector in it as well.

I looked up the term power surge on wikipedia, it isn't very easy to understand. Could you explain it?

I'm no electrician but I'll explain it in laymen terms. The electricity that powers ur computer has a current or voltage. This voltage is unstable, but most of the time is pretty steady. Some times, specially when there are electrical storms or power outages, comes a "surge", which means too much voltage is going through the cord. This means too much power goes into ur PC all at once and can damage components. If the PC is roughly new, the Power Supply is equipped to handle these surges, but can "die" in the process. Now I'll explain the difference in devices: Power Surge Board: a power board but that has surge protectors on it. Belkin is the brand I use and in some countries they even cover u for an amount of $$$. UPS without Surge Board: A UPS just basically powers ur PC for a bit longer (a few minutes) if the power goes out so u can shut it down correctly. UPS with Surge Board: same as above but has also an in-built power board.
#5 Posted by roulettethedog (10976 posts) -

I heard that getting an Uninterruptible Power Supply is important when you want to save your powered stuff from breaking, like computers, and other stuff. I'm looking at this one: http://www.amazon.com/APC-BE450G-Back-UPS-8-Outlet-Uninterrupted/dp/B001BTWQDS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top Will this one work with any PCs out there? A few days ago, my power went out, and at the time my PC was still connected to the power, so i was afraid it might have damaged it. Deathscythe777

I had an APC similar to that one. It would give you maybe 3-5 minutes of power to shut down a P.C. I do not really recommend APC cause mine died with in 3 years.

#6 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -

[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"]I heard that getting an Uninterruptible Power Supply is important when you want to save your powered stuff from breaking, like computers, and other stuff. I'm looking at this one: http://www.amazon.com/APC-BE450G-Back-UPS-8-Outlet-Uninterrupted/dp/B001BTWQDS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top Will this one work with any PCs out there? A few days ago, my power went out, and at the time my PC was still connected to the power, so i was afraid it might have damaged it. roulettethedog

I had an APC similar to that one. It would give you maybe 3-5 minutes of power to shut down a P.C. I do not really recommend APC cause mine died with in 3 years.

3 years is good for a smaller cheaper UPS for desktop.
#7 Posted by LordEC911 (9972 posts) -

[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"]I heard that getting an Uninterruptible Power Supply is important when you want to save your powered stuff from breaking, like computers, and other stuff. I'm looking at this one: http://www.amazon.com/APC-BE450G-Back-UPS-8-Outlet-Uninterrupted/dp/B001BTWQDS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top Will this one work with any PCs out there? A few days ago, my power went out, and at the time my PC was still connected to the power, so i was afraid it might have damaged it. roulettethedog

I had an APC similar to that one. It would give you maybe 3-5 minutes of power to shut down a P.C. I do not really recommend APC cause mine died with in 3 years.

LoL... The battery in them is only suppose to last 3-5years... You can usually get a new battery for ~$30-60.

#8 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -

They will help against brownouts and surges. A psu is not designed to handle those things.

They will not help against lightning strikes.


Also most power surges are when the voltage drops too far below 120v, not above.


If power surges/brownouts are common, then get a UPS.




#9 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -

[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"]I heard that getting an Uninterruptible Power Supply is important when you want to save your powered stuff from breaking, like computers, and other stuff. I'm looking at this one: http://www.amazon.com/APC-BE450G-Back-UPS-8-Outlet-Uninterrupted/dp/B001BTWQDS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top Will this one work with any PCs out there? A few days ago, my power went out, and at the time my PC was still connected to the power, so i was afraid it might have damaged it. roulettethedog

I had an APC similar to that one. It would give you maybe 3-5 minutes of power to shut down a P.C. I do not really recommend APC cause mine died with in 3 years.

Mines working fine, and I've had it for longer than 3 years. Just a cheap 350watt apc ups, works nice on my server. Comes with software for autoshutting down your pc, ofc there is no software for linux. You have to use apcupsd which is never fun, but it works fine once configured.

Also if anyone is feeling adventerous...

http://revision3.com/systm/hackedups

I'd recommend marinegel batteries though, assuming the psu doesn't overheat.

#10 Posted by roulettethedog (10976 posts) -

[QUOTE="roulettethedog"]

[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"]I heard that getting an Uninterruptible Power Supply is important when you want to save your powered stuff from breaking, like computers, and other stuff. I'm looking at this one: http://www.amazon.com/APC-BE450G-Back-UPS-8-Outlet-Uninterrupted/dp/B001BTWQDS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top Will this one work with any PCs out there? A few days ago, my power went out, and at the time my PC was still connected to the power, so i was afraid it might have damaged it. LordEC911

I had an APC similar to that one. It would give you maybe 3-5 minutes of power to shut down a P.C. I do not really recommend APC cause mine died with in 3 years.

LoL... The battery in them is only suppose to last 3-5years... You can usually get a new battery for ~$30-60.

Mine cost like $40 brand new ,so why bother.

#11 Posted by spittis (1875 posts) -

Setting a few things straight & elaborating.

First off you always have voltage and current, you can't have one of them. Simplified you can say that current is electrons moving and voltage is the potential difference, hence the water pressure and amount analogy sometimes used.

Second, most modern powersupples do have protection against "surges" or more accurately transients, and this circuit is called the transient filtering stage. You'd have to buy a really crappy PSU today to get one without it. Transients always appear when a circuit with capacitance and inductance is closed or broken, which in reality is just about every circuit. However - this circuit can't handle very large spikes most of the times caused by lightning, so that's when you get a surge protector. The good ones should give you some kind of warranty if something still breaks while being plugged into it. And then you have Uninterruptable Power Supplies which also have some kind of battery so you can save your work before shutting the computer down.

If you rarely have power issues where you live I'd say it's unnecessary to get a UPS, but it doesn't hurt (obviously).

#12 Posted by JohnF111 (14093 posts) -
Chances are you didn't damage anything, an outage won't break anything but might corrupt data depending on whether you were saving an important file or downloading something at the time. A UPS is a tad extreme when dealing with outages unless it's providing a critical service to you, you could get a surge protector for powering your PC to make sure it won't damage your components and some even give you an insurance type service so that if your components do fail then they might compensate you for it to a very strict extent. UPS's are pretty good though if you get lots of storms or have unstable power.
#13 Posted by kraken2109 (13067 posts) -

May as well spend £10 on a surge protector, not much point having a UPS unless you're a business/often working on important stuff. Just save more often.

#14 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -

May as well spend £10 on a surge protector, not much point having a UPS unless you're a business/often working on important stuff. Just save more often.

kraken2109
I do have a surge protector, but does it prevent against problems from a power outage causing my computer to basically turn off, possibly damaging it? What if a surge occurs and it reaches my PC?
#15 Posted by JohnF111 (14093 posts) -
[QUOTE="kraken2109"]

May as well spend £10 on a surge protector, not much point having a UPS unless you're a business/often working on important stuff. Just save more often.

Deathscythe777
I do have a surge protector, but does it prevent against problems from a power outage causing my computer to basically turn off? What if a surge occurs and it reaches my PC?

That's why you have a surge protector, so that the surge won't reach your PC. Granted they aren't fool proof and a lightning strike can make a surge reach your PC through a surge protector but lets face it, if that happens then you will have bigger problems than simply a damaged PC.
#16 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="kraken2109"]

May as well spend £10 on a surge protector, not much point having a UPS unless you're a business/often working on important stuff. Just save more often.

JohnF111
I do have a surge protector, but does it prevent against problems from a power outage causing my computer to basically turn off? What if a surge occurs and it reaches my PC?

That's why you have a surge protector, so that the surge won't reach your PC. Granted they aren't fool proof and a lightning strike can make a surge reach your PC through a surge protector but lets face it, if that happens then you will have bigger problems than simply a damaged PC.

Like i said in my first post, the power in my home just went out for about 20 seconds, but after that i'm not sure what happened. My PC basically was plugged into a surge protector, and i think it basically turned on the moment after the power was back. Will a surge protector prevent against something like that resulting in damaging the PC? Next question, i'm no businessman, just someone who will probably do papers for school...You're saying i don't need a UPS?
#17 Posted by JohnF111 (14093 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="JohnF111"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"] I do have a surge protector, but does it prevent against problems from a power outage causing my computer to basically turn off? What if a surge occurs and it reaches my PC?

That's why you have a surge protector, so that the surge won't reach your PC. Granted they aren't fool proof and a lightning strike can make a surge reach your PC through a surge protector but lets face it, if that happens then you will have bigger problems than simply a damaged PC.

Like i said in my first post, the power in my home just went out for about 20 seconds, but after that i'm not sure what happened. My PC basically was plugged into a surge protector, and i think it basically turned on the moment after the power was back. Will a surge protector prevent against something like that resulting in damaging the PC? Next question, i'm no businessman, just someone who will probably do papers for school...You're saying i don't need a UPS?

Yeah that's exactly it, you don't need a UPS, losing power won't damage your PC, it's just inconvenient.
#18 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="JohnF111"]That's why you have a surge protector, so that the surge won't reach your PC. Granted they aren't fool proof and a lightning strike can make a surge reach your PC through a surge protector but lets face it, if that happens then you will have bigger problems than simply a damaged PC.JohnF111
Like i said in my first post, the power in my home just went out for about 20 seconds, but after that i'm not sure what happened. My PC basically was plugged into a surge protector, and i think it basically turned on the moment after the power was back. Will a surge protector prevent against something like that resulting in damaging the PC? Next question, i'm no businessman, just someone who will probably do papers for school...You're saying i don't need a UPS?

Yeah that's exactly it, you don't need a UPS, losing power won't damage your PC, it's just inconvenient.

But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure.
#19 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="JohnF111"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"] Like i said in my first post, the power in my home just went out for about 20 seconds, but after that i'm not sure what happened. My PC basically was plugged into a surge protector, and i think it basically turned on the moment after the power was back. Will a surge protector prevent against something like that resulting in damaging the PC? Next question, i'm no businessman, just someone who will probably do papers for school...You're saying i don't need a UPS?

Yeah that's exactly it, you don't need a UPS, losing power won't damage your PC, it's just inconvenient.

But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure.

Let me break it down for you since looks like u didn't read my other post: Surge Protector: will protect again surges and brownouts. Now, if a lightning bolt strikes ur house, nothing will protect ur PC. UPS: keeps ur computer going for 2-3 minutes if the power goes out, just enough time to turn it off. If ur not doing important stuff on the PC (like work documents, etc) then a surge protector is all u need.
#20 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="FelipeInside"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="JohnF111"] Yeah that's exactly it, you don't need a UPS, losing power won't damage your PC, it's just inconvenient.

But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure.

Let me break it down for you since looks like u didn't read my other post: Surge Protector: will protect again surges and brownouts. Now, if a lightning bolt strikes ur house, nothing will protect ur PC. UPS: keeps ur computer going for 2-3 minutes if the power goes out, just enough time to turn it off. If ur not doing important stuff on the PC (like work documents, etc) then a surge protector is all u need.

I did read your post, it may have been that i thought a UPS was good to stop a PC from just shutting down if an outage or something else happened, so that nothing breaks. In other words, you are also saying that all that a UPS is good for is saving word documents that were typed up? If that's all it's good for, i'll be fine, i'll probably just keep saving my progress on a USB flash drive while making a word document, so that if something happens to the PC, i could just finish it somewhere else.
#21 Posted by JohnF111 (14093 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="JohnF111"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"] Like i said in my first post, the power in my home just went out for about 20 seconds, but after that i'm not sure what happened. My PC basically was plugged into a surge protector, and i think it basically turned on the moment after the power was back. Will a surge protector prevent against something like that resulting in damaging the PC? Next question, i'm no businessman, just someone who will probably do papers for school...You're saying i don't need a UPS?

Yeah that's exactly it, you don't need a UPS, losing power won't damage your PC, it's just inconvenient.

But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure.

The power coming back on is already regulated through your home circuit breakers so it's not an issue, if there's a surge your circuit breakers stop your electricals taking damage, so a surge protector is just complementing it from smaller surges that can affect more delicate hardware such as a PC or bulbs. Seriously a surge protector is all you need.
#22 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
[QUOTE="FelipeInside"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"] But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure. Deathscythe777
Let me break it down for you since looks like u didn't read my other post: Surge Protector: will protect again surges and brownouts. Now, if a lightning bolt strikes ur house, nothing will protect ur PC. UPS: keeps ur computer going for 2-3 minutes if the power goes out, just enough time to turn it off. If ur not doing important stuff on the PC (like work documents, etc) then a surge protector is all u need.

I did read your post, it may have been that i thought a UPS was good to stop a PC from just shutting down if an outage or something else happened, so that nothing breaks. In other words, you are also saying that all that a UPS is good for is saving word documents that were typed up? If that's all it's good for, i'll be fine, i'll probably just keep saving my progress on a USB flash drive while making a word document, so that if something happens to the PC, i could just finish it somewhere else.

No, ur still confused. A UPS just keeps the power to the PC going for another 2-3 minutes if the power in the house goes out, that's all it does. A Surge Protector stabilizes the current if a surge happens. And ProTip, don't backup on Flash Drives, they aren't for that.
#23 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="FelipeInside"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="FelipeInside"] Let me break it down for you since looks like u didn't read my other post: Surge Protector: will protect again surges and brownouts. Now, if a lightning bolt strikes ur house, nothing will protect ur PC. UPS: keeps ur computer going for 2-3 minutes if the power goes out, just enough time to turn it off. If ur not doing important stuff on the PC (like work documents, etc) then a surge protector is all u need.

I did read your post, it may have been that i thought a UPS was good to stop a PC from just shutting down if an outage or something else happened, so that nothing breaks. In other words, you are also saying that all that a UPS is good for is saving word documents that were typed up? If that's all it's good for, i'll be fine, i'll probably just keep saving my progress on a USB flash drive while making a word document, so that if something happens to the PC, i could just finish it somewhere else.

No, ur still confused. A UPS just keeps the power to the PC going for another 2-3 minutes if the power in the house goes out, that's all it does. A Surge Protector stabilizes the current if a surge happens. And ProTip, don't backup on Flash Drives, they aren't for that.

I'm probably confused, but bear with me. I just assumed that if a computer just turns off due to an outage, that could damage it. So a UPS gives you time to turn the PC off the right way so nothing bad happens. And why shouldn't i use a USB flash drive to save what i typed up so far on a word document?
#24 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
If ur editing a word document for example, and the computer shuts down without proper shutdown, u can corrupt the document. A UPS just gives u that extra time to properly save the document and shut down the PC. When u are editing any document, u should be saving the document on your Hard Drive on the computer, and then backing up ur documents to an external Hard Drive, not a USB Memory Stick since they are made for transfer.
#25 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]If ur editing a word document for example, and the computer shuts down without proper shutdown, u can corrupt the document. A UPS just gives u that extra time to properly save the document and shut down the PC. When u are editing any document, u should be saving the document on your Hard Drive on the computer, and then backing up ur documents to an external Hard Drive, not a USB Memory Stick since they are made for transfer.

So a UPS is the only way to keep a document from being corrupted if the computer shuts down without proper shutdown? I may have to buy one. The second sentence you typed, i'm not sure about. I mean are external hard drives better for saving word documents than USB flash drives? Lastly, what should i buy to get full benefits (i'm talking about the list of stuff you named, that had to do with power boards)
#26 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
[QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="FelipeInside"]If ur editing a word document for example, and the computer shuts down without proper shutdown, u can corrupt the document. A UPS just gives u that extra time to properly save the document and shut down the PC. When u are editing any document, u should be saving the document on your Hard Drive on the computer, and then backing up ur documents to an external Hard Drive, not a USB Memory Stick since they are made for transfer.

So a UPS is the only way to keep a document from being corrupted if the computer shuts down without proper shutdown? I may have to buy one. The second sentence you typed, i'm not sure about. I mean are external hard drives better for saving word documents than USB flash drives? Lastly, what should i buy to get full benefits (i'm talking about the list of stuff you named, that had to do with power boards)

Well, basically yes. Most of the time the document won't get corrupted, but if ur anal about those things then you need can get a UPS. Yes, external hard drives are better than USB Flash Drives. Ext. are meant for backups, Flash Drives are meant for transfer and quick storage, they are a lot more fragile. To buy, u have to decide if u need a UPS or just a power board. If u go UPS, get APC brand, they are good. If u go Power Surge Board, look into Belkin.
#27 Posted by kraken2109 (13067 posts) -

Let me simplify this. A UPS is a big battery. That's it.

#28 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -

Let me simplify this. A UPS is a big battery. That's it.

kraken2109

They are surge protectors, help with brownouts, and clean up the electricity if you have a bunch of incandescent bulbs or laser printers(Or if the electricity coming into your house is just dirty, but that's probably not too likely unless you live in a crap area) Probably does more too, but that's all I can remember on the top of my head.

#29 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -

[QUOTE="kraken2109"]

Let me simplify this. A UPS is a big battery. That's it.

JigglyWiggly_

They are surge protectors, help with brownouts, and clean up the electricity if you have a bunch of incandescent bulbs or laser printers(Or if the electricity coming into your house is just dirty, but that's probably not too likely unless you live in a crap area) Probably does more too, but that's all I can remember on the top of my head.

Ehhhh, ur not supposed to plug in Printers to a UPS.

#30 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -

[QUOTE="JigglyWiggly_"]

[QUOTE="kraken2109"]

Let me simplify this. A UPS is a big battery. That's it.

FelipeInside

They are surge protectors, help with brownouts, and clean up the electricity if you have a bunch of incandescent bulbs or laser printers(Or if the electricity coming into your house is just dirty, but that's probably not too likely unless you live in a crap area) Probably does more too, but that's all I can remember on the top of my head.

Ehhhh, ur not supposed to plug in Printers to a UPS.

That's not what I meant. If you plug in a laser printer to your wall, you may notice your lights dim, the circuit has to compensate for the voltage drop. A UPS will keep your connected devices on the battery side clean and at a constant voltage.

#31 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
^^ I thought that's what you meant, just wanted to clarify mostly for the TC since I can see he doesn't know much about UPS.
#32 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="FelipeInside"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="FelipeInside"]If ur editing a word document for example, and the computer shuts down without proper shutdown, u can corrupt the document. A UPS just gives u that extra time to properly save the document and shut down the PC. When u are editing any document, u should be saving the document on your Hard Drive on the computer, and then backing up ur documents to an external Hard Drive, not a USB Memory Stick since they are made for transfer.

So a UPS is the only way to keep a document from being corrupted if the computer shuts down without proper shutdown? I may have to buy one. The second sentence you typed, i'm not sure about. I mean are external hard drives better for saving word documents than USB flash drives? Lastly, what should i buy to get full benefits (i'm talking about the list of stuff you named, that had to do with power boards)

Well, basically yes. Most of the time the document won't get corrupted, but if ur anal about those things then you need can get a UPS. Yes, external hard drives are better than USB Flash Drives. Ext. are meant for backups, Flash Drives are meant for transfer and quick storage, they are a lot more fragile. To buy, u have to decide if u need a UPS or just a power board. If u go UPS, get APC brand, they are good. If u go Power Surge Board, look into Belkin.

I looked at your post which explained what power boards and other stuff were. Kind of confusing, i'm not savvy with this kind of stuff. Also, i don't think flash drives are that fragile. It's not like i will be in danger of somehow stepping on it or snapping it into 2. I mean the flash drive serves its purpose as saving your important stuff to access later, right?
#33 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"] So a UPS is the only way to keep a document from being corrupted if the computer shuts down without proper shutdown? I may have to buy one. The second sentence you typed, i'm not sure about. I mean are external hard drives better for saving word documents than USB flash drives? Lastly, what should i buy to get full benefits (i'm talking about the list of stuff you named, that had to do with power boards)Deathscythe777
Well, basically yes. Most of the time the document won't get corrupted, but if ur anal about those things then you need can get a UPS. Yes, external hard drives are better than USB Flash Drives. Ext. are meant for backups, Flash Drives are meant for transfer and quick storage, they are a lot more fragile. To buy, u have to decide if u need a UPS or just a power board. If u go UPS, get APC brand, they are good. If u go Power Surge Board, look into Belkin.

I looked at your post which explained what power boards and other stuff were. Kind of confusing, i'm not savvy with this kind of stuff. Also, i don't think flash drives are that fragile. It's not like i will be in danger of somehow stepping on it or snapping it into 2. I mean the flash drive serves its purpose as saving your important stuff to access later, right?

Never save your data to a flash drive. They can just die instantly for no reason w/o physical damage
and the connector can always break off, and unless you can resolder it, it's broken.

Cloud storage is what you should use.

External hard drives can die randomly as well w/o warning, that's what cloud storage is for.
It doesn't really matter who the surge protector is by, just as long as you check the specs and it is rated to handle the amount of watts you're planning to pull and has decent reviews.

It's not like belkin themselves makes the board.

#35 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -
[QUOTE="JohnF111"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"][QUOTE="JohnF111"] Yeah that's exactly it, you don't need a UPS, losing power won't damage your PC, it's just inconvenient.

But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure.

The power coming back on is already regulated through your home circuit breakers so it's not an issue, if there's a surge your circuit breakers stop your electricals taking damage, so a surge protector is just complementing it from smaller surges that can affect more delicate hardware such as a PC or bulbs. Seriously a surge protector is all you need.

wait, so i don't have to worry about the power going out and coming back on damaging my PC, because the circuit breaker takes care of that? In basic terms, you're saying the circuit breaker protects my stuff that uses electricity from really big surges, and the surge protector protects that same stuff from smaller surges? As you might have guessed, i'm not familiar with this stuff.
#36 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
Ok, let me break it down for you even more simpler. First, both Jiggs and I know more about this stuff than you do. Don't take that the wrong way, but I've been in IT for the past 20 years and Jiggs knows his stuff too, so when we say something don't think we are lying or that you know more about the subject than us. POWER - If you want your PC to go for a few more minutes in case the power goes out, get a UPS - If you want your PC to be protected 90% of the time from surges and brownouts, get a good higher priced Belkin Power Surge Protector Board. Don't buy those that say Surge Protector but cost $20. - If you buy a UPS with a Surge Protector Board included then you get the best of both worlds. BACKUP There are 4 ways (generally) to back up: 1- To a USB Flash Drive. Don't do it, simple. I worked in a computer shop for years and if you just could see the amount of people backing up to Flash Drives and their drives failing, leaving them with nothing 2- To an External USB Hard Drive: the most common and easy way to backup. They are more reliable than Flash Drives and you can turn them off (unplug them) so if a super surge destroys ur PC, the external wasn't connected and is safe with ur data. 3- To another INTERNAL Hard Drive: Some people have a second hard drive inside their PC for backups, which is fine but you might loose the data in the case of a super surge. 4- To the cloud (or internet): now there are ways to backup to the internet. Problems here are they are slower than the traditional ways (backup and recovery) and u are also putting ur data out there which some people don't like. I suggest you print a copy of this post for further reference.
#37 Posted by LordEC911 (9972 posts) -

Mine cost like $40 brand new ,so why bother.roulettethedog

I was talking about the highend 800-1000w units, like I have.
If you are only spending $40 on a UPS... well what did you expect?

#38 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -
[QUOTE="JohnF111"][QUOTE="Deathscythe777"] But losing power and having it come back on turned my PC on. What about that issue? What about a surge happening? Will using a surge protector prevent against EVERYTHING bad that could possibly happen? I want to be sure. Deathscythe777
The power coming back on is already regulated through your home circuit breakers so it's not an issue, if there's a surge your circuit breakers stop your electricals taking damage, so a surge protector is just complementing it from smaller surges that can affect more delicate hardware such as a PC or bulbs. Seriously a surge protector is all you need.

wait, so i don't have to worry about the power going out and coming back on damaging my PC, because the circuit breaker takes care of that? In basic terms, you're saying the circuit breaker protects my stuff that uses electricity from really big surges, and the surge protector protects that same stuff from smaller surges? As you might have guessed, i'm not familiar with this stuff.

You should have a surge protector and a circuit breaker. Your surge protector will go off first, preventing you from going up and walking your butt to reset the circuit breaker.
#40 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -

Ok, let me break it down for you even more simpler. First, both Jiggs and I know more about this stuff than you do. Don't take that the wrong way, but I've been in IT for the past 20 years and Jiggs knows his stuff too, so when we say something don't think we are lying or that you know more about the subject than us. POWER - If you want your PC to go for a few more minutes in case the power goes out, get a UPS - If you want your PC to be protected 90% of the time from surges and brownouts, get a good higher priced Belkin Power Surge Protector Board. Don't buy those that say Surge Protector but cost $20. - If you buy a UPS with a Surge Protector Board included then you get the best of both worlds. BACKUP There are 4 ways (generally) to back up: 1- To a USB Flash Drive. Don't do it, simple. I worked in a computer shop for years and if you just could see the amount of people backing up to Flash Drives and their drives failing, leaving them with nothing 2- To an External USB Hard Drive: the most common and easy way to backup. They are more reliable than Flash Drives and you can turn them off (unplug them) so if a super surge destroys ur PC, the external wasn't connected and is safe with ur data. 3- To another INTERNAL Hard Drive: Some people have a second hard drive inside their PC for backups, which is fine but you might loose the data in the case of a super surge. 4- To the cloud (or internet): now there are ways to backup to the internet. Problems here are they are slower than the traditional ways (backup and recovery) and u are also putting ur data out there which some people don't like. I suggest you print a copy of this post for further reference.FelipeInside
I thought that a UPS was also important because anything that causes your PC to just shut off, could damage the PC, so a UPS would be useful for preventing the PC from shutting off like that. I think someone said something like that. Am i wrong? Where can i get a cloud storage? Lastly, i think i am using a surge protector, but i really doubt it was more than $25. What is the difference between a power surge protector board, and a surge protector? The way someone described it to me in this thread makes me believe they're the same...The surge protector i am using has 6 outlets and a switch, as i said before.

#41 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
- Power Surge Protector and Surge Protector are the same thing, problem is that nearly every board says it's a surge protector these days so they can sell....but if it's less than $50 then it's not. - UPS prevents ur PC from shutting off instantly if the power goes out. You have to ask urself though, if it's not a server, how often does the power go out in ur area to see if u really need one. - Cloud Storage there are a few options, I recommend CrashPlan (http://www.crashplan.com/). I've done extensive testing on all of them and CrashPlan is still the best for cloud backup. They are not free but they are the best.
#42 Posted by westom1 (5 posts) -
I thought that a UPS was also important because anything that causes your PC to just shut off, could damage the PC, so a UPS would be useful for preventing the PC from shutting off like that. Deathscythe777
Too many different issues being argued as one. An appliance knows no difference between power off by its switch or power off due to a nuclear reactor shutdown. Power loss causes unsaved data to be lost. Power loss cause no hardware damage. In this anomaly, UPS protects data; not hardware. Power on is another anomaly. If power on is via its front panel switch, then voltage rises sharply. That is potentially more harmful to electronics and ideal for motors. If utility power is restored, voltage rises slower which is better for electronics and harmful to motors. These potentials for damage are so tiny as to be ignored - except when anomalies are hyped by subjective reasoning or advertising. Moving on to another anomaly. When does an appliance see 'dirtiest' power? Well this 120 volt UPS in battery backup mode outputs 200 volt square waves with a spike of up to 270 volts. Are your AC mains that 'dirty'? Of course not. But that 200 volt square wave is also ideal power for all electronics. Because electronics are that robust. That square wave can be harmful to small electric motors and power strip protectors. So UPS manufacturers recommend no protector or motorized appliances (ie some printers) on their UPS. But do not say why. See those numbers? 200 volt square wave with a spike of up to 270 volts. Does not matter if your UPS is cleaner. That is power ideal for any electronics. Because electronics have long been required to be that robust. Protection from that type of 'dirty' power is bogus. Since electronics are already designed to make irrelevant 'dirtiest' power from the 'dirtiest' UPS. Advertising will forget to mention that electronics are so robust. Otherwise sales would be lost. Another anomaly. What happens when voltage drops so low that incandescent bulbs dim to 50% intensity? That is also potentially harmful to small motors. And still ideal perfect voltage for any electronics. How often does your voltage vary that much? Never? That is the point. If your voltage goes that low, then the utility cuts off power to protect your motorized appliances (refrigerator, furnace, etc). But even voltages that low are ideal for electronics. What happens if voltage goes even lower? Electronics power off. No damage. So again, a UPS to protect hardware from low voltages is unnecessary. You don't have enough fingers to count the number of potential anomalies. Each should be discussed separately. This post only discussed four anomalies. Plenty of others also exist. But too much discussion has bundled all as if one. Also some popular urban myths were posted. Limiting to a UPS: it protects unsaved data from a blackout. Temporary and 'dirty' power. Surge protection is a completely different anomaly addressed by other completely different solutions.
#43 Posted by Deathscythe777 (27 posts) -

- Power Surge Protector and Surge Protector are the same thing, problem is that nearly every board says it's a surge protector these days so they can sell....but if it's less than $50 then it's not. - UPS prevents ur PC from shutting off instantly if the power goes out. You have to ask urself though, if it's not a server, how often does the power go out in ur area to see if u really need one. - Cloud Storage there are a few options, I recommend CrashPlan (http://www.crashplan.com/). I've done extensive testing on all of them and CrashPlan is still the best for cloud backup. They are not free but they are the best.FelipeInside


if I were to use Crashplan, just to take care of stuff like voice recorder files, papers and handouts from school, what plan would i use?

I don't think the power goes out much in my area.

Also, this hasn't been answered, but does not having a UPS mean that my computer could get shut down suddenly due to an outage, causing the computer to possibly get damaged? From your previous post, you said, "With modern computers, a power outage usually doesn't damage anything. They are made with technologies that prevent that." But you also said, "Some times, specially when there are electrical storms or power outages, comes a "surge", which means too much voltage is going through the cord. This means too much power goes into ur PC all at once and can damage components. If the PC is roughly new, the Power Supply is equipped to handle these surges, but can "die" in the process." It seems you said outages aren't a real problem, but you later said it could be.

#44 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]- Power Surge Protector and Surge Protector are the same thing, problem is that nearly every board says it's a surge protector these days so they can sell....but if it's less than $50 then it's not. - UPS prevents ur PC from shutting off instantly if the power goes out. You have to ask urself though, if it's not a server, how often does the power go out in ur area to see if u really need one. - Cloud Storage there are a few options, I recommend CrashPlan (http://www.crashplan.com/). I've done extensive testing on all of them and CrashPlan is still the best for cloud backup. They are not free but they are the best.Deathscythe777


if I were to use Crashplan, just to take care of stuff like voice recorder files, papers and handouts from school, what plan would i use?

I don't think the power goes out much in my area.

Also, this hasn't been answered, but does not having a UPS mean that my computer could get shut down suddenly due to an outage, causing the computer to possibly get damaged? From your previous post, you said, "With modern computers, a power outage usually doesn't damage anything. They are made with technologies that prevent that." But you also said, "Some times, specially when there are electrical storms or power outages, comes a "surge", which means too much voltage is going through the cord. This means too much power goes into ur PC all at once and can damage components. If the PC is roughly new, the Power Supply is equipped to handle these surges, but can "die" in the process." It seems you said outages aren't a real problem, but you later said it could be.

There are levels of surges. If it's a minor surge, most of the time nothing will happen to your PC (ur surge protector will stop it). If it's a strong surge maybe ur surge protector will die and protect ur PC. Maybe ur power supply inside the PC will die and protect ur PC. If it's a freaking huge surge (like a lightning strike) then nothing will protect ur PC, or ur fridge, or ur TV. Don't take this the wrong way but I can tell you are very anal about everything, so just go out and buy a good UPS with Surge Protection on it. Spend more than $100. As for CrashPlan, you need to see how much space all ur documents and stuff (the things u want backed up) take up. 1GB, 5GB etc. Then you just choose a plan that can hold all of it.
#45 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -
Crashplan is good for storing big files if it's a lot of documents you edit a lot, use dropbox, skydrive, spideroak, google drive. Though skydrive will ban your account if you have any sort of nudity.
#46 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
[QUOTE="JigglyWiggly_"]Crashplan is good for storing big files if it's a lot of documents you edit a lot, use dropbox, skydrive, spideroak, google drive. Though skydrive will ban your account if you have any sort of nudity.

They are different things Jiggs. DropBox is meant for sync of documents across devices, not backing up. CrashPlan can even back up real time if you tell it too. Also, the dropbox upload/download rate is atrocious.
#47 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -
Dropbox still backs up your data to their server. It also recognizes file changes much quicker than crashplan. I have Dropbox, spideroak, google drive, skydrive and crashplan. I have 150gigs on dropbox, 100 on spideroak, skydrive 25 gigs, and i uploaded 2 terabytes to crashplan. Almost all the data is junk on crashplan though.
#48 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
[QUOTE="JigglyWiggly_"]Dropbox still backs up your data to their server. It also recognizes file changes much quicker than crashplan. I have Dropbox, spideroak, google drive, skydrive and crashplan. I have 150gigs on dropbox, 100 on spideroak, skydrive 25 gigs, and i uploaded 2 terabytes to crashplan. Almost all the data is junk on crashplan though.

CrashPlan detects file changes instantly like I said before, you just need to enable the option, but most people don't need this so they just have it backing up hourly, or every 3 days or weekly. Why do you have so much stuff all over the place? CrashPlan offers unlimited storage, u could have everything on there and just have one client taking up ur CPU Usage.
#49 Posted by JigglyWiggly_ (23602 posts) -

No, dropbox is instant.
If you put a file it's on your other computer in seconds.

Crashplan takes like a minute, I do have it on auto sync.

I also don't trust crashplan as much, and crashplan is for one computer. Reason I don't trust crashplan as much is because the software is not nearly as polished.
I feel like I could accidentally delete all my files and never get them back if I did something I wasn't supposed too. Which I have seen people do on the forums.
I use multiple computers, dropbox is the best.

Dropbox also supports directurls, my sig and avatar are hosted from my dropbox public folder.
Spideroak supports directurls too, but they are in https links, which gamespot doesn't support.



I use spideroak for synching files outside.

Like my quakelive folder is synched across all my machines, all my 500000 demos.

I also used it for synching my save files when I played skyrim. Which was useless since I beat the game in like 8 hours.

It's also a bad game.

No testing was involved, they shipped a broken game, feels floaty, etc.


#50 Posted by FelipeInside (25657 posts) -
You are a bit confused Jiggs. - If you use multiple computers, then DropBox is one of the best. You don't trust CrashPlan but you trust DropBox? Hahahahahha. You do know that DropBox has been hacked twice and once they left their accounts without password for 6 hours right? - Also it seems you don't know that much about CrashPlan, cause if you delete ur files you get them back from the server since you can tell CrashPlan to have copies on the server for any amount of time you designate. - CrashPlan's Software is a lot more stable and polished than DropBox. CrashPlan were around years before DropBox existed. - U say DropBox support DirectURLs, yes, because CrashPlan is a backup program where DropBox isn't. - Like I said before, I tested all these extensively for work, and continual testing them as well. I know what I'm talking about.