There have been 74 school shootings since Sandy Hook

well maybe they should start a new again because they clearly messed up.

we are violent, irrational and well armed.

and the people of the world will be doing themselves a service to remember that.

Not really, here in Persia ,I've only seen weapons in the possession of the armed forces , not normal people.

There's so many people,it hasn't affected me one bit. I don't know anyone who's been shot except for my grandad in WW2, I walk the streets worry free and sleep with my windows unlocked.

Part of the issue here is that even the gun laws we have in place aren't always enforced. I do believe you can buy a gun at a gun show and bypass the background check process. We need to be enforcing the laws in the books before we decide to put MORE laws into play. I will say that some changes likely need to be made, but our enforcement of laws needs to be taken care of before anything.

The lack of mental health care here definitely is the biggest issue. There are a lot of social issue going on here in the US that put a lot of pressure on people, especially teens who are not only trying to keep up with school, but are getting pressured into making serious choices for their future and putting a huge workload on themselves, because apparently at some point society thought it made sense to take people who are struggling with their body going through changes and to say "YOU NEED TO DECIDE YOUR LIFE RIGHT NOW!".

Of course people are going to have issues and yet there isn't SHIT for them here. The mental heath institution in the US has been gutted leaving almost no support for people having issues, unless they attempt suicide which then they can at least get a few days in a hospital...

I would be skeptical of how much therapy may have actually done for people like that Calli kid (whose parents DID try to get something done) and the Columbine folks. I do think they may have been beyond saving, but without any means of helping them anyways who is to say.

Even if the 74 figure is BS, it isn't surprising to me if there is a huge uptick in shootings. There were a bunch of copycat crimes after Columbine, and now you have a struggling economy on top of that which is assuredly putting more pressure on people to break.

So because you haven't been effected it isn't a problem? Like I said you are 5 times more likely to be murdered in the USA than the UK, and the UK isn't even considered a safe country.

Fair enough. In Iran's case, I can understand why citizens might want the right to own guns. There's never really been a need for it in Britain for the past half-century or so.

It would be a cool way of self-defense in cases of robbery or harassment or such.You guys in Britain have these problems too, admit it.

Yes, we do have these problems, but I'd have to disagree about arming everyone with guns being the solution. The worst outbreak of rioting and looting we've had in decades was the 2011 England riots, yet the death toll there was quite low, 5 deaths in total, compared to similar American riots where dozens have been killed. If people were armed with guns here in Britain, the death toll in the 2011 England riots could have been a lot worse.

Background checks would rarely stop any of these mass shootings or school shootings. Background checks don't account for mental history as there is no effective way to track somebody's mental history. What if you were diagnosed with ADHD when you were a kid? Some would call that a mental illness. Others wouldn't. What if you suffered from some depression and took some medication for it a few years ago? Does that mean you're prone to depression and are unfit to own a gun?

Mental health is too ambiguous to just put blanket rules over. It's pretty clear those who indiscriminately kill others are not right in the head but "mental illnesses" is just too vague to rule over.

In the past few years I've come to the conclusion that the only reason that people advocate for more background checks is because it's a lot more simple than trying to deal with the root causes of crime and people's want to kill. It's one of those "feel good" things that really don't do anything but add more layers of ineffective red tape onto the system but make it look like people are actively trying to help reduce gun violence.

My stance is pretty simple. Since the right to bear arms is a right that should not be infringed as long as you are a law abiding citizen who has proven their ability to follow the simple rules of our land, people are going to have much more easy access to firearms and ammunition. Therefore the US will always suffer a higher gun crime rate than other nations. However we as a nation can work together to reduce the overall crime rate, which will reduce the number of gun crimes that happen in the US. A safer nation in general is going to benefit us all and is something we can logically work for.

We're actually on the right track (all violent crime is dropping) but since corporate media is profit driven, stories about school shootings or any shootings make great headlines. We also have a few key individuals in this nation (like Michael Bloomberg) who are willing to spend millions to push their own personal agenda for gun-control to keep the debate alive. Gun control has become profitable even if it has no guarantee of effectiveness within the USA.

Key steps the nation needs to take to reduce violence is ending the war on drugs, reducing or eliminating minimum sentencing on victim-less crimes, reducing prison sentences for the majority of crime, work on rehabilitating former criminals instead of just punishing them, and working on reducing or ending poverty through a large variety of methods.

.... that last bit... do you honestly believe what you type?

You make it sound like the countries that the American immigrants came from... didn't go through the same thing over and over and over.

The UK is a fine example of a nation dominated over and over again by new blood.

This thread is misleading anyway... and I know better than to bother... its far too ingrained in American Society... as far as they are concerned "everything except guns are the problem" ... people comparing knives and poison in this thread to an easy pull automatic in the hands of young peopel is somehow the same.... sigh....

"In the hands of the wrong person" ... right..... we get it.

answer me a simple question.

How does guns being any everyones reach (and dont KID yourselves pro gun nuts..... you or your neighbours guns are not always safe....) make you safer? how does their widespread production and availability in the civilian population make you safer? pull a trigger is far easier than stabbing multiple people... I cant believe that is even up for debate.

so you want to strip someone of their rights because of the faults of their child? Isn't that like the whole "sins of the father" but in reverse.

But you've banned automatic weapons. How can they possibly be in the hands of people? The laws people like you have created are supposed to protect us from those evil guns!

People like you just don't get it. If guns did not exist you don't think these people would find a way? IT'S.........NOT....ABOUT.......THE.......GUNS.

But there is no way as effective as guns.

Oh yea? So throwing a few pipe bombs in a classroom won't do anything? How about driving a SUV through a crowd? How about a crockpot?

You still don't get it.....MURDER is ILLEGAL. If someone is willing to kill 20+ children do you really think there is any law on Earth you could write that will stop them from getting the tools to execute their will? You want to punish 80 million people who own guns in this country because of a few nuts. About 10,000 murders are committed using firearms per year....there are 80 million people NOT using firearms to commit murder but rather to protect themselves against the few nuts out there that will. This topic is such a logical one, it should not even have to be debated.

It really comes down to this: There's only so much we can do before we ban firearms outright. I'm not willing to go that far. I'm also not willing to make arbitrary changes that are only being pushed through by people who don't understand firearms(banning guns based on appearance and not function).

At some point people either need to accept these tragedies or advocate for tyranny. There's no middle ground. You require people use smaller magazines and people will just carry MORE magazines. You ban certain physical features and gun companies will make guns without those features. Meanwhile, there will always be people who are going to do monstrous things. Always. That will never stop.

Just as with freedom of speech, I'm willing to accept the consequences of freedom.

This is terrible!

It's a combination of glorification of violence and individualist mentality. The latter dictates that the individual is responsible for everything he/she does and consequently what he/she deserves. Taken to an extreme, it can alienate the person or it can put enormous pressure on someone's shoulders to accomplish something the point that the person don't relate to other people and they finally snap.

I disagree that this is a freedom issue. There are countries much less free than our where violence is much more prevalent. Venezuela for example, ironically a country many socialists in the U.S. admire.

I know this is not your argument airshocker but to soapbox here ..... this is an overblown issue. It is all about politics and ideology rather than fact. The leading cause of death for children is car accidents, not guns. Child deaths represent 5% of all traffic deaths....while they only account for 0.5% of gun deaths, the majority of which are accidental deaths. Even that does not sound like a huge difference until you factor in guns kill 20,000 people per year (50% of those are suicides), whereas traffic accidents kill closer to 50,000. Yet we do not see calls for more driving laws do we? What is the fine for not putting your kid in a car seat? Not strapping them in with a seatbelt? A hundred bucks? lol. Really?

But none of this logic and fact really matters because it never does when it comes to ideological issues. This is not about the children, never has been. It is no different than any other issue of this kind.....you can kill 100,000 people over 2 weeks in a bombing campaign and that is war....kill 50,000 in one day with one bomb and it is all of a sudden worse somehow. Drop a bomb from a manned aircraft and kill 20 insurgents and that is war.....drop a bomb from a drone and kill 1 person and it is all of a sudden an issue. This is no different, just another illogical debate.

first of all i'm not american, got a rifle at home.... not on medication and not crazy .... caffein is my closest drugs consumption ..... and the last thing I've shot is a giant monitor lizard who invade my tortoise pool.... when I was a teen .... which later I felt guilty see it's blood flowing.

But I agree with you .... guns should be use only by the sane people ....

Infact in my state ..... illegal immigrant outnumbered local population due too government corruption making money through producing illegal ID .... my species is only less than a million and I need to defend my kind .... my dogs is my saviour at the moment and I would only kill if I have too as a last resort ....

Bad example

The U.S. has already gone through huge overhaul when it comes to the rules of the road. Up until the 70's, laws on driving infractions were rarely enforced in the US. In recent decades, measures have been put in place to make American roads more safe; enforced speed limits, fines for unsafe practices, harsh penalties for DUI etc. and these measures have worked and made vehicle deaths about 1/3 of what they were in the 60's

I blame murder simulators.

Current psychological screening isn't even effective for adults. Think how many adults have issues and the abuse their use of their firearm. Also when someone is screened they may not have a severe disorder but DEVELOP ONE LATE IN LIFE. Considering all this that's never going to happen.

The American culture is falling apart. Our students are idiots, we're violent, more so than most if not all other first world industrial nations. All we seem to care about is the next game, hockey, baseball, basketball, fighting, football, it's basically year round. .People are stagnating in work ethic but the knowledge and experience required to break into the work force is MUCH higher than it used to be and getting higher. We want to feel more protected but when actions are made for our protection we cry "That's against our privacy" as we then go on the internet and facebook and gossip about what Paula Dean, Mel Gibson, and Donald Sterling said IN THEIR PRIVATE CONVERSATIONS.The media cares little of why our state of mind is so anti-intellectual and pro entertainment, and instead focuses on running stories on who said something "racist" so that they can be fired.

I don't know what laws are going to make things better, but I know that it's society that needs to change more so than our government.

You really should get out more in the world....

I get out plenty, but thanks for the informative reply.

Well your view of other countries is naive at best....ignorant at worst. But hey...enjoy your little bubble.

What do you mean other countries? I'm talking about my country.

No you're comparing countries. Or are you unaware you did that?

On the violence part yes. Statistically I'm probably correct, I haven't checked recently. But aside from that I'm not.

Really? Because sports are huge in other countries as well. In the US people work more days...take less vacation then various other countries. Gossip? Eh....they have sections of their paper talking about celebs. As for violence....it does exist everywhere. Not sure if the trend is still continuing but violent crime has actually been decreasing in the US.

Who cares? I'm not talking about other countries you dingbat. YOUR bringing up other countries, after accusing me of comparing countries. I made my opinion and I think these attributes are bad, I don't care if people in France also like sports and gossip, but I find the American media's obsession with sports, violence, and gossip to be infuriating, and I repeat, I do not care if it is the same in other countries, I care about mine.

Decreasing violent crime is a good thing, but you know what, I still don't feel safe walking around at night, my brother was just mercilessly jumped a few months ago. So sorry, if I'm not patting the country on the back because it's less violent than it used to be, it's still violent.

Stay focused on the topic my friends

Ugh I have to get out of this discussion....stupidity annoys me. Look dude....YOU made a comparison...not me. I just don't agree with what you said because it's clear you did no research before forming your opinion. If you don't care about other countries...why the **** did you bring them up?

As for anecdotal evidence....that is worthless. Yes...some areas are dangerous. Not all however...and to use your brother's case to state the US is in total like this is foolish.

As for gun rights and stuff

It just seems like the people who sell the guns and stuff should be happy that they are getting increased demand from these inert talks

I'm sorry but your just stupid. Your acting like every point I made was in comparison to other countries. I compared, violent crime rate, which you didn't dispute. I didn't bring up other countries except for that one point that you just can't get over, so go ahead and mentally exclude where I said "all other first world industrial nations." for that one point in the original post. Either way the U.S is still violent without the need for comparison. You brought up other countries saying they also liked sports and gossip which was irrelevant to my post.

Again are you really this stupid? That anecdote was just for effect not proof or evidence,or do you really think the U.S. is a safe place to live? More safe than before? Yes, but it is not safe.

And lol at "Ugh I have to get out of this discussion....stupidity annoys me..." Because you're so fucking smart. Get over yourself prick.

And still you continue. Look when you compare things you are in effect talking about all of them. Period. I'm sorry you cannot grasp the simple concept. I tried telling you in a nice way....but you persist in ignorance.

You actually took the US and compared it in several categories to other first world countries. It's in YOUR post. Go back and read it. You are either incredibly ignorant or trolling. Can't decide which.

Is the US safe to live? As I stated above....it depends on WHERE. There are safe areas in the US....just like other countries. But you seem incapable of understanding that as well. I walk around here at night with no worries. It's a relatively safe neighborhood. Not saying crime is absent...but it's not a violent area of the country. Stop making generalizations based on your personal fears and get out in the world some.

Like I look at the drum beat of state away from our guns and then the rush to go out and buy guns and stuff before they are taken away as basically like when wal mart asks if I want to insure my game disks

Okay, I'm gonna try and make this really simple. I said the U.S is violent compared to other industrialized countries. Every other point is not compared to any other country, it's that simple. I re-read what I wrote to see if maybe I didn't express my thought well, but no, only that one point was in comparison. Just one category. If you can't grasp that then there is no hope for this exchange to go anywhere.

I am full aware of understanding that there are safe places to live in the US, but overall I would not say the US is a safe country, now who's making the anecdotal references. But I won't hold it to you as it's a good point. Maybe my definition of "safe" is too undefined, but that is how I feel. I get out plenty, thank you for the concern though.

edit:Here's an answer key for my original post:

for points where I compare US to other countries:

point followed by:"Compared to other countries."

for points where no comparison is made:

point not followed by "Compared to other countries.".

*bullshit* FYI....I bolded something in your post that is incredibly funny and ironic. Enjoy!

Sometimes I'm a hypocrite. Sue me.

You're

@LJS9502_basic:

Also, we can end now. I won. That's the rules, you were the first to abandon the argument for a purely antagonistic response. I have to go to a barbecue pretty soon anyways. Later.

El oh el.....winning. Hahahaha

One more, I just can't help it. I love your use of "......" I guess that's your signature phrase on Gamespot OT. But with over 149k posts, I guess you have to distinguish yourself somehow.

Nah.....any regular to OT knows me. Good or bad opinion...they know me. :P

So it looks like this list was heavily doctored by Everytown for Gun Safety. Politifact has the details. This is a pathetic move by Bloomberg and the left to increase gun control.

"We reviewed news reports for all 74 shootings and did our best to sort them into five categories. Here’s our breakdown. (See individual shootings by category here, with clickable links to news reports on each shooting.)

• Incidents such as Sandy Hook or Columbine in which the shooter intended to commit mass murder: 10 instances

• Incidents related to criminal activity (such as drug dealing or robbery), or personal altercations: 39 instances

• Incidents unconnected to members of school community and/or that took place outside school hours: 16 instances

• Suicides: 6 instances

• Accidental discharges: 3 instances

In all, these 74 incidents resulted in 38 deaths and 53 injuries. The biggest death toll in one incident was a shooting spree that ended at Santa Monica College. Six people died, though not all of them took place on the campus.

While the list includes a lot of gunfire, deaths and injuries, only about 14 percent were shootings that mirrored Columbine and Sandy Hook."