Reselling concert tickets for profit: is it immoral?

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#1 Posted by bloodling (5822 posts) -

I'm talking about legal ticket resale. Some people think that it's highly immoral, others think that it's not immoral at all. What's your opinion on this?

#2 Posted by chessmaster1989 (29108 posts) -
I don't see any reason why it's immoral.
#3 Posted by mingmao3046 (2482 posts) -

I'm talking about legal ticket resale. I've heard some people say that it's highly immoral, and others who say that it's not immoral at all. What's your opinion on this?

bloodling
umm....no? is this seriously a question? if you are willing to wait in line or whatever to get the ticket then you should be able to sell it and make a profit
#4 Posted by bloodling (5822 posts) -

[QUOTE="bloodling"]

I'm talking about legal ticket resale. I've heard some people say that it's highly immoral, and others who say that it's not immoral at all. What's your opinion on this?

mingmao3046

umm....no? is this seriously a question? if you are willing to wait in line or whatever to get the ticket then you should be able to sell it and make a profit

As I stated, a lot of people consider it extremely immoral, so yes this is a real question.

#5 Posted by harashawn (27599 posts) -
It is in the sense that when you buy a ticket you are agreeing to not resell it.
#6 Posted by jim_shorts (7320 posts) -

I don't think so. Opportunist isn't necessarily immoral.

#7 Posted by leviathan91 (7763 posts) -

In my opinion yes but extremely beneficial to both parties: One person makes a profit and the other person doesn't have to wait in line.

The whole thing has been done before not just with tickets but also phones and gaming systems so I don't see the big deal in all of it.

#8 Posted by mayceV (4599 posts) -
why? Its normal commerce. You bought something so you should be able to sell it for a profit if a person is willing to pay.
#9 Posted by Zeviander (9503 posts) -
>Tickets sold on first-come-first-served basis >Scalper buys more tickets than they want >Person who really really really wants to go to that entertainment of choice, found out there are no tickets left >Person goes to entertainment of choice hoping someone has ticket for them >Scalper offers ticket at 300-500% profit >Person begrudgingly *chooses* to spend money despite the ticket only saying regular amount >Scalper walks away richer than when he started It's smart business, what exactly is immoral about it? If you really wanted the tickets, you would have bought them back when they first went on sale like the scalper did. "Waaaahhhhh life's not fair!", says the ticket buyer. "Indeed", responded Zeviander.
#10 Posted by harashawn (27599 posts) -
why? Its normal commerce. You bought something so you should be able to sell it for a profit if a person is willing to pay.mayceV
Read the back of the ticket. Technically, you are not allowed to resell it for a profit. You agree to this condition by purchasing it.
#11 Posted by LJS9502_basic (150365 posts) -

>Tickets sold on first-come-first-served basis >Scalper buys more tickets than they want >Person who really really really wants to go to that entertainment of choice, found out there are no tickets left >Person goes to entertainment of choice hoping someone has ticket for them >Scalper offers ticket at 300-500% profit >Person begrudgingly *chooses* to spend money despite the ticket only saying regular amount >Scalper walks away richer than when he started It's smart business, what exactly is immoral about it? If you really wanted the tickets, you would have bought them back when they first went on sale like the scalper did. "Waaaahhhhh life's not fair!", says the ticket buyer. "Indeed", responded Zeviander.Zeviander
Except the scalpers somehow can get the better tickets....which means something is broke with the system.

#12 Posted by Zeviander (9503 posts) -
Read the back of the ticket. Technically, you are not allowed to resell it for a profit. You agree to this condition by purchasing it.harashawn
Video game publishers are trying to implement that same thing with physical copy video games. First sale doctrine.
#13 Posted by Jacobistheman (3975 posts) -

I'm talking about legal ticket resale. Some people think that it's highly immoral, others think that it's not immoral at all. What's your opinion on this?

bloodling
It is illegal to sell tickets for higher than face value unless somehow the appropriate taxes are paid on the higher value (which they aren't). That is why people see it as immoral.
#14 Posted by harashawn (27599 posts) -
First sale doctrine.Zeviander
Not when you contractually agreed not to resell it for profit , which you did when you bought the ticket. It's silly, but that's how it works.
#15 Posted by Gen007 (10955 posts) -

immoral yeah i guess so. Like mentioned already you aren't supposed to buy tickets just to sell them again and the concert industry is trying to combat it at every turn so clearly there's something wrong there. Its a real dick move quite frankly.

#16 Posted by jim_shorts (7320 posts) -
[QUOTE="bloodling"]

I'm talking about legal ticket resale. Some people think that it's highly immoral, others think that it's not immoral at all. What's your opinion on this?

Jacobistheman
It is illegal to sell tickets for higher than face value unless somehow the appropriate taxes are paid on the higher value (which they aren't). That is why people see it as immoral.

I would argue that something isn't necessarily immoral if it's illegal. Lots of things used to be illegal that aren't immoral.
#17 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

>Tickets sold on first-come-first-served basis >Scalper buys more tickets than they want >Person who really really really wants to go to that entertainment of choice, found out there are no tickets left >Person goes to entertainment of choice hoping someone has ticket for them >Scalper offers ticket at 300-500% profit >Person begrudgingly *chooses* to spend money despite the ticket only saying regular amount >Scalper walks away richer than when he started It's smart business, what exactly is immoral about it? If you really wanted the tickets, you would have bought them back when they first went on sale like the scalper did. "Waaaahhhhh life's not fair!", says the ticket buyer. "Indeed", responded Zeviander.Zeviander

Except that scalpers often clog the ticketing systems thus making it difficult, if not next to impossible, for ordainary fans to even access the systems to purchase tickets.

#18 Posted by Zeviander (9503 posts) -
Except the scalpers somehow can the better tickets....which means something is broke with the system.LJS9502_basic
I'll assume a "get" was supposed to be in there. The system isn't broken, those providing the tickets need to 1) limit ticket sales to individuals so more people have a chance to buy, 2) accept the fact they got their money and small-time scalpers might be taking away potential profits (see: #1, but they won't do that because sales will drop if everyone has to go get their own tickets) or 3) gauge demand as accurately as possible and just charge more/less based on how much profit they want to make. When the Winnipeg Jets came back, the 12,000 (?) season tickets sold, were gone within minutes of the buying period opening online, and buyers were limited to two tickets per order (so if you wanted more, you needed multiple accounts, which decreased your chances of getting them). Then the reselling started, and True North Sports (the team owners) cracked down on those doing it (they had to register a legal address and name, and signed contracts, so they knew by seat number who it was) and only allowed reselling through a sanctioned website which they charged a nominal fee for using it. It's all business. And those who complain shouldn't be in business.
#19 Posted by LJS9502_basic (150365 posts) -
[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Except the scalpers somehow can the better tickets....which means something is broke with the system.Zeviander
I'll assume a "get" was supposed to be in there. The system isn't broken, those providing the tickets need to 1) limit ticket sales to individuals so more people have a chance to buy, 2) accept the fact they got their money and small-time scalpers might be taking away potential profits (see: #1, but they won't do that because sales will drop if everyone has to go get their own tickets) or 3) gauge demand as accurately as possible and just charge more/less based on how much profit they want to make. When the Winnipeg Jets came back, the 12,000 (?) season tickets sold, were gone within minutes of the buying period opening online, and buyers were limited to two tickets per order (so if you wanted more, you needed multiple accounts, which decreased your chances of getting them). Then the reselling started, and True North Sports (the team owners) cracked down on those doing it (they had to register a legal address and name, and signed contracts, so they knew by seat number who it was) and only allowed reselling through a sanctioned website which they charged a nominal fee for using it. It's all business. And those who complain shouldn't be in business.

Get is in there. I edited. Yes the system is broken when ticket sales are limited and on a first come first serve basis and buying the tickets the first minute of a pre sale gets you up in the rafters on the opposite side of the stage.
#20 Posted by Jackc8 (8500 posts) -

Can't really see how anyone could think that was any more immoral than what the outfit who sold them in the first place did.

#21 Posted by Laihendi (5810 posts) -

[QUOTE="Zeviander"]>Tickets sold on first-come-first-served basis >Scalper buys more tickets than they want >Person who really really really wants to go to that entertainment of choice, found out there are no tickets left >Person goes to entertainment of choice hoping someone has ticket for them >Scalper offers ticket at 300-500% profit >Person begrudgingly *chooses* to spend money despite the ticket only saying regular amount >Scalper walks away richer than when he started It's smart business, what exactly is immoral about it? If you really wanted the tickets, you would have bought them back when they first went on sale like the scalper did. "Waaaahhhhh life's not fair!", says the ticket buyer. "Indeed", responded Zeviander.worlock77

Except that scalpers often clog the ticketing systems thus making it difficult, if not next to impossible, for ordainary fans to even access the systems to purchase tickets.

If there is still enough demand to sell all of the tickets for more than the original price, then that just means they were being sold too cheaply originally.
#22 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -
"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,
#23 Posted by ShadowsDemon (10127 posts) -
If people want to buy them then I don't see why not.
#24 Posted by N30F3N1X (7982 posts) -

"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,Rhazakna

We evolved out of that mentality when we first built houses and created societies. You can go back to live in the jungle if you feel like you don't have enough freedom, mr armchair general.

#25 Posted by johnd13 (7994 posts) -

If people want to buy them then I don't see why not.ShadowsDemon

This. As long as you don' t offer it at an unreasonably high price then all people involved are gonna gain sth.

#26 Posted by Laihendi (5810 posts) -
"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,Rhazakna
Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.
#27 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"]"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,Laihendi
Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

#28 Posted by ShadowsDemon (10127 posts) -

[QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="Rhazakna"]"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,worlock77

Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

I think he was being sarcastic? :|
#29 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"]"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,N30F3N1X

We evolved out of that mentality when we first built houses and created societies. You can go back to live in the jungle if you feel like you don't have enough freedom, mr armchair general.

Looks like someone needs to brush up on nihilism as a philosophy. I know you won't, though. It's much easier to just dismiss things.
#30 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -
[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="Laihendi"] Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.ShadowsDemon

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

I think he was being sarcastic? :|

Nope, I'm a nihilist.
#31 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -

[QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="Rhazakna"]"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,worlock77

Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side.
#32 Posted by Laihendi (5810 posts) -
[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="Laihendi"] Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.Rhazakna

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side.

If authoritarianism isn't immoral, why do you dislike it so much?
#33 Posted by supa_badman (16626 posts) -

Not really immoral.

Supply and demand, baby

#34 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

[QUOTE="ShadowsDemon"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Rhazakna

I think he was being sarcastic? :|

Nope, I'm a nihilist.

"Nihilists? F*ck me. I mean say what you will about the tenants of National Socialism, at least it's an ethos."

#35 Posted by N30F3N1X (7982 posts) -

Looks like someone needs to brush up on nihilism as a philosophy. I know you won't, though. It's much easier to just dismiss things.Rhazakna

Odd that you say that considering I believe in existential nihilism.

Perhaps you're the one who should take your head out of your ass and start looking for a bit of insight regarding how our minds work, instead of trying to use some asshat conjecture to talk about things you know nothing of.

#36 Posted by supa_badman (16626 posts) -

[QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="Rhazakna"]"Immorality" is an authoritarian concept to control individuals. Live without limits and without regrets,worlock77

Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Stealing and murdering is better to justify when you just feel like it?
#37 Posted by N30F3N1X (7982 posts) -

Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side. Rhazakna

Lack of morality would have been even worse. Herp derp.

"Oh, and you know the thing about chaos? It's fair!"

#38 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Laihendi

Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side.

If authoritarianism isn't immoral, why do you dislike it so much?

it crushes freedom, squashes liberties and favors the few at the expense of all else.

#39 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -
[QUOTE="Rhazakna"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Laihendi
Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side.

If authoritarianism isn't immoral, why do you dislike it so much?

Because it's opposed to my values (which are completely subjective). I don't think authoritarianism is "wrong" or that people "ought" not to be authoritarian. Authoritarianism makes sense if you hold certain values, like complete societal cohesion.
#40 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="Laihendi"] Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.supa_badman

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

Stealing and murdering is better to justify when you just feel like it?

What?

#41 Posted by N30F3N1X (7982 posts) -

it crushes freedom, squashes liberties and favors the few at the expense of all else.

worlock77

Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins.

And people who work harder towards a field or discipline should be favored over those that invest less or nothing into it.

#42 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"]Looks like someone needs to brush up on nihilism as a philosophy. I know you won't, though. It's much easier to just dismiss things.N30F3N1X

Odd that you say that considering I believe in existential nihilism.

Perhaps you're the one who should take your head out of your ass and start looking for a bit of insight regarding how our minds work, instead of trying to use some asshat conjecture to talk about things you know nothing of.

You're a nihilist, but you believe there are ways people "ought" to act? I never made any claim about people's minds, so that's a non-sequitor. What we understand as "morality" may be inherent to some degree, but that doesn't mean those ideas should control our actions on an individual level.
#43 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

it crushes freedom, squashes liberties and favors the few at the expense of all else.

N30F3N1X

Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins.

And people who work harder towards a field or discipline should be favored over those that invest less or nothing into it.

Neither of those have anything to do with my point.

#44 Posted by Rhazakna (11022 posts) -

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"]Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side. N30F3N1X

Lack of morality would have been even worse. Herp derp.

"Oh, and you know the thing about chaos? It's fair!"

Based on what? How do you get people to fight and die for things that have nothing to do with them? You tell them they have a moral duty to serve something "greater". All wars, all genocides, all violent collectivism has been justified with some view of morality. How would it be worse, and by what standard if people could see through that bullsh*t?
#45 Posted by supa_badman (16626 posts) -

[QUOTE="supa_badman"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

Lots of people have stolen and murdered and found ways to "morally" justify it.

worlock77

Stealing and murdering is better to justify when you just feel like it?

What?

I just feel like your answer is a sh!tty answer, I want you to expand. What would be better?
#46 Posted by Zeviander (9503 posts) -
We evolved out of that mentality when we first built houses and created societies. You can go back to live in the jungle if you feel like you don't have enough freedom, mr armchair general.N30F3N1X
You are so ignorant of his point it isn't even funny. But I will laugh for you benefit. :lol:
Steal and murder at will. Live without limits and without regrets.Laihendi
Such a binary view of morality is dangerous.
#47 Posted by N30F3N1X (7982 posts) -

You're a nihilist, but you believe there are ways people "ought" to act? I never made any claim about people's minds, so that's a non-sequitor. What we understand as "morality" may be inherent to some degree, but that doesn't mean those ideas should control our actions on an individual level.Rhazakna

I said I believe in existential nihilism. Life itself means nothing to me.

What do you mean you never made any claim about people's minds?

"Immorality" is an authoritarian conceptYou

Herp derp?

Then try to live a day using lack of integrity, dishonesty and unfairness as your principles. Tell me how well that works out for you.

#48 Posted by N30F3N1X (7982 posts) -

Neither of those have anything to do with my point.

worlock77

Of course they do. You're saying how bad authoritarianism is and why you'd like to get rid of it, and I'm saying why it is here.

#49 Posted by worlock77 (22547 posts) -

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="supa_badman"] Stealing and murdering is better to justify when you just feel like it?supa_badman

What?

I just feel like your answer is a sh!tty answer, I want you to expand. What would be better?

You'll have to explain how it's a sh*tty answer first.

#50 Posted by supa_badman (16626 posts) -
[QUOTE="N30F3N1X"]

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"]Morality has been an excuse for genocide, murder, and every other brutality you can name. No one is more authoritarian than someone who believes they have "morality" on their side. Rhazakna

Lack of morality would have been even worse. Herp derp.

"Oh, and you know the thing about chaos? It's fair!"

Based on what? How do you get people to fight and die for things that have nothing to do with them? You tell them they have a moral duty to serve something "greater". All wars, all genocides, all violent collectivism has been justified with some view of morality. How would it be worse, and by what standard if people could see through that bullsh*t?

Oh nooooooo, war is bad? What? World leaders are corrupt too? Nooooooooo Morality isn't just used in war, its a foundation for a society, granted, its a foundation that's subject to change as the times and culture changes, but it's there for a reason nonetheless. Saying morality is a bad thing and just doing what you want is; first off, useless and selfish (although, that may be what a sh!tty human being wants) and second off, wouldn't living by your own code be another form of morality?