McDonalds Protestors Arrested Outside McD's Headquarters.

#1 Posted by Master_Live (15289 posts) -

McDonalds protestors arrested outside company's headquarters

From the article:

Devonte Rice, a McDonalds worker from Charleston, SC. who attended today's protest, said that he was fighting to unionize because he knew that it would "have his back" as he continued to work in food service. He has been working at McDonalds for a few months, and earns $7.25 a hour. Previously, he worked at a Burger King (BKW). Rice told Fortune before the protest that he was "willing to put his life on the line" to help the fast food workers achieve their goals.

Eddie Foreman, a McDonalds maintenance worker in Opelika, Ala. who attended the protest, said he is also seeking higher wages and the right to unionize. He said that even if the company increased wages, it is unlikely to give employees benefits like health insurance without a union. Foreman, who has four kids and earns $7.75 an hour, said that insurance is important in case a worker or someone in their family get sick. When he first started a McDonalds, he recalled being told that "Crew Care," a form of limited health insurance, would be available. But that did not turn out to be the case.

Fells, the protest organizer, said he is confident that moving the campaign to this new level will be successful in swaying public opinion in favor of the workers. He believes that "these workers have successfully captured the hearts and minds" of many Americans.

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Yeah, no. Mr. Rice perhaps you should try Wendy's next to complete the trifecta.

#2 Posted by AutoPilotOn (8565 posts) -

Maybe try a new line of work?

#3 Edited by lamprey263 (24670 posts) -

Why you dislike these people @Master_Live? They deserve to ask for a wage that doesn't keep them in poverty. You're a cold hearted Scrooge.

#4 Posted by Wilfred_Owen (20907 posts) -

Foreman just needs to start wearing a condoms.

#5 Posted by BeardMaster (1580 posts) -
@AutoPilotOn said:

Maybe try a new line of work?

Agreed, lord knows the economy is rife with employment opportunities right now.

#6 Posted by jun_aka_pekto (16809 posts) -

How will health insurance work with McDonald's? Is it through the national HQ or through each individual franchise?

#7 Edited by AutoPilotOn (8565 posts) -

@BeardMaster: excuses. Move to Texas they added half of all jobs in us like a month ago.

Your solution is just pay fast food workers 15 or so that way people who already make 15 will be equal? I got it how about everyone just work where u r told to. Everyone will receive same allotment of food housing clothing. Given same cars and housing too

#8 Edited by BeardMaster (1580 posts) -

@AutoPilotOn said:

@BeardMaster: excuses. Move to Texas they added half of all jobs in us like a month ago.

Your solution is just pay fast food workers 15 or so that way people who already make 15 will be equal? I got it how about everyone just work where u r told to. Everyone will receive same allotment of food housing clothing. Given same cars and housing too

Excuses for what? not pretending to know the individual circumstances of people ive never met? then sure.

And texas is a tax haven within the US. The whole point of being a tax haven is that it only works if everyone else isnt a tax haven. If every other state had similar tax codes and loose regulations... do you have any idea how many businesses would be in texas? the answer is none. They have one of the most poorly educated and unskilled work forces in the nation.

But yes, let them unionize and bargain. Did you support the poor illiterate americans banding together to fight against the more rich and powerful british army during the revolutionary war? or did you sympathize with the crown?

#9 Posted by jasean79 (2375 posts) -

@lamprey263 said:

Why you dislike these people @Master_Live? They deserve to ask for a wage that doesn't keep them in poverty. You're a cold hearted Scrooge.

They can ask for it, but they shouldn't expect to get it. $15/hr working fast food, which might I add, requires ZERO level of educational background, is not worthy of that pay grade. It's a shit job that pays shit. I don't know what these people expect from a "career in fast food", which was designed as a gateway to better opportunities.

#10 Posted by Assassin_87 (2314 posts) -

The base level jobs in food service are not designed as permanent or even long term working positions for adults, but as a stepping stone for the ambitious/an introduction to the working world for teenagers. There is an entire hierarchy within the business where opportunities for lateral moves and outright promotions exist if employees are so inclined as to take those career paths.

I can't really get behind the cause of these protesters, because in my time managing and doing some consulting for restaurants (from the lowliest of fast food establishments to grand scale full service) I've not even met a single individual "stuck" in one of these minimum wage positions that didn't cause their own misfortune by exhibiting a lack of either care or motivation at work.

That, and the fact that the wage they are asking for would put them in equal standing with a lot of skilled trade workers. Flipping a burger or scrubbing a parking lot are not skilled trades.

#12 Posted by jasean79 (2375 posts) -

This is taken from a Crew job description posting for a McD's in my city:

"This is it! It's time you worked for someone who will give you the tools to learn, grow and be what you want to be - both personally and professionally. We're looking for hard working, enthusiastic individuals who want to be a part of a winning team. If you enjoy working with people and love to learn new things, we want to meet you. We offer flexible schedules and the opportunity to advance within our restaurants. Got what it takes? Apply online and see what your future can hold."

The description pretty much screams "we'll train you to move onto better things", not "we'll pay you a great wage to start, so you can continue to have no ambitions in life and work in an entry level restaurant job for the rest of your days".

#13 Edited by ad1x2 (5766 posts) -

I have always looked at fast food as a job to hold you over while in school until you get enough training to get a better job. Asking McDonald's to pay $15 dollars an hour to the burger flippers (which they don't even pay the managers in most places) is ridiculous and those costs will just be pushed on the consumer. Your average person isn't going to pay four dollars for a McDouble or 13 dollars for an Extra Value Meal. I understand people want better wages but they should be looking for a better job, not trying to force the crappy job they have now to more than double their pay because they think it is acceptable to still be working in fast food while trying to feed a family of five.

#14 Edited by Serraph105 (28348 posts) -

@Assassin_87 said:

The base level jobs in food service are not designed as permanent or even long term working positions for adults, but as a stepping stone for the ambitious/an introduction to the working world for teenagers. There is an entire hierarchy within the business where opportunities for lateral moves and outright promotions exist if employees are so inclined as to take those career paths.

I can't really get behind the cause of these protesters, because in my time managing and doing some consulting for restaurants (from the lowliest of fast food establishments to grand scale full service) I've not even met a single individual "stuck" in one of these minimum wage positions that didn't cause their own misfortune by exhibiting a lack of either care or motivation at work.

That, and the fact that the wage they are asking for would put them in equal standing with a lot of skilled trade workers. Flipping a burger or scrubbing a parking lot are not skilled trades.

You see I can't get behind your argument because 40ish years (or however long somebody lives) working in poverty level wages/life is a hell of a long punishment for someone who screwed up in a previously held better position. Or worse they didn't screw up and simply got fucked by the recent recession and became part of the long term unemployed.

We get so into the idea that the people in these positions deserve to be there because they screwed up at some point in a previous position that we don't stop to ask whether the duration of what they are facing is truly appropriate or not. Worse yet the farther down the economic ladder you go the more the odds become stacked against you ever recovering.

#15 Edited by Assassin_87 (2314 posts) -

@Serraph105: I recovered from homelessness, joblessness and general financial and social ruin with not an ounce of financial or government assistance. It required considerable personal mettle and a willingness to deal with very harsh judgments from others around me at times, but ultimately I climbed out of the worst hole you can get into in civilized society. Eating from dumpsters is a humbling experience, but if you're truly dedicated to the idea of getting out and never going back it will happen.

Don't mistake what I'm saying. I don't lack empathy for those in a bad spot for good reason (disability or whatever else) but you can claw painfully from the pit with exhaustive effort.

#16 Posted by MrGeezer (56749 posts) -

@Assassin_87 said:

@Serraph105: I recovered from homelessness, joblessness and general financial and social ruin with not an ounce of financial or government assistance. It required considerable personal mettle and a willingness to deal with very harsh judgments from others around me at times, but ultimately I climbed out of the worst hole you can get into in civilized society. Eating from dumpsters is a humbling experience, but if you're truly dedicated to the idea of getting out and never going back it will happen.

Don't mistake what I'm saying. I don't lack empathy for those in a bad spot for good reason (disability or whatever else) but you can claw painfully from the pit with exhaustive effort.

That obviously can't happen for everyone seeing as how there are only so many managerial positions available and we still need people to flip our burgers and cook our fries.

#17 Posted by Assassin_87 (2314 posts) -

@MrGeezer: As I said I don't lack empathy for everyone in those situations. It is unfortunate that good job opportunities outnumber job seekers, but that's the nature of capitalism. I wouldn't say I had to step on anyone to get to the spot I'm in now, but I did have to be ruthless in the sense that I had to work to outperform those around me in every sense and make a lot of personal sacrifices to reach the spot I'm in.

I'm all in favor of doing something to help end the plight of those in need, but the whole $15/hr thing is not a smart route. That is really what I can't get behind.

#18 Edited by MrGeezer (56749 posts) -

@Assassin_87 said:

@MrGeezer: As I said I don't lack empathy for everyone in those situations. It is unfortunate that good job opportunities outnumber job seekers, but that's the nature of capitalism. I wouldn't say I had to step on anyone to get to the spot I'm in now, but I did have to be ruthless in the sense that I had to work to outperform those around me in every sense and make a lot of personal sacrifices to reach the spot I'm in.

I'm all in favor of doing something to help end the plight of those in need, but the whole $15/hr thing is not a smart route. That is really what I can't get behind.

I agree that $15 an hour is unreasonable, but look at the bigger picture. Most careers require a college degree, and college is getting expensive as shit (in addition to them increasingly being less able to guarantee a job). If you're working at a McJob for $7 an hour, it's pretty goddamn hard to afford a college education in addition to just putting food on the table.

And sure, McDonalds and similar jobs promote and train from within. But there are only so many slots available for managers, which means that by necessity most of the people working for minimum wage CAN'T just move up within the company.

The bottom line is a bunch of people are gonna have to be stuck at the bottom, and dismissing them on the grounds that they didn't work hard enough is missing the point. Even if everyone gave 110%, a bunch of people would still be stuck on the bottom because that's how it has to be. If the conditions at the bottom get bad enough, then those people are going to be very pissed off.

#19 Posted by Assassin_87 (2314 posts) -

@MrGeezer: Like I said, I fully understand what you're trying to say. Maybe there is a solution somewhere, but as we seem to agree on, this is not it.

#20 Posted by Serraph105 (28348 posts) -

Regardless of what happens in years to come we will just automate these jobs, and we won't have to hear as many people working together for better wages.
http://www.clickondetroit.com/money/Robots-will-replace-fast-food-workers/26118050

#21 Posted by lamprey263 (24670 posts) -

This is an interesting read to bring to the discussion - I’m making $21 an hour at McDonald’s. Why aren’t you?

#22 Posted by Makhaidos (1614 posts) -

@lamprey263 said:

Why you dislike these people @Master_Live? They deserve to ask for a wage that doesn't keep them in poverty. You're a cold hearted Scrooge.

Yeah. You're a mean one, Master_Live.

#23 Posted by Aljosa23 (25631 posts) -

@ad1x2 said:

I have always looked at fast food as a job to hold you over while in school until you get enough training to get a better job. Asking McDonald's to pay $15 dollars an hour to the burger flippers (which they don't even pay the managers in most places) is ridiculous and those costs will just be pushed on the consumer. Your average person isn't going to pay four dollars for a McDouble or 13 dollars for an Extra Value Meal. I understand people want better wages but they should be looking for a better job, not trying to force the crappy job they have now to more than double their pay because they think it is acceptable to still be working in fast food while trying to feed a family of five.

Considering McDonald's whole business plan is to move cheap goods efficiently, I doubt they would raise prices all that much. They are a gigantic company and would just absorb the costs and adapt.

Anyway, hope these guys achieve something with the protests, corporations already have too much influence over workers so I'm certainly in favour of the scale tipping more evenly. Republicans fooled everyone into treating "job creators" like they are infallible Gods.

#24 Edited by Serraph105 (28348 posts) -

@Aljosa23 said:

@ad1x2 said:

I have always looked at fast food as a job to hold you over while in school until you get enough training to get a better job. Asking McDonald's to pay $15 dollars an hour to the burger flippers (which they don't even pay the managers in most places) is ridiculous and those costs will just be pushed on the consumer. Your average person isn't going to pay four dollars for a McDouble or 13 dollars for an Extra Value Meal. I understand people want better wages but they should be looking for a better job, not trying to force the crappy job they have now to more than double their pay because they think it is acceptable to still be working in fast food while trying to feed a family of five.

Considering McDonald's whole business plan is to move cheap goods efficiently, I doubt they would raise prices all that much. They are a gigantic company and would just absorb the costs and adapt.

Anyway, hope these guys achieve something with the protests, corporations already have too much influence over workers so I'm certainly in favour of the scale tipping more evenly. Republicans fooled everyone into treating "job creators" like they are infallible Gods.

With wages having been stagnant for the middle class for a few decades I definitely agree that the scales need to be tipped back towards them.

#25 Edited by mattbbpl (10764 posts) -

They're protesting in the wrong location. In a franchise model, the franchisees do the low level hiring. The costs and risks associated with having employees are abstracted out.

#26 Posted by Master_Live (15289 posts) -

@Makhaidos said:

@lamprey263 said:

Why you dislike these people @Master_Live? They deserve to ask for a wage that doesn't keep them in poverty. You're a cold hearted Scrooge.

Yeah. You're a mean one, Master_Live.

Ahhhhh, I saw what you did there ♥♥♥

#27 Posted by SpartanMSU (3440 posts) -

@MrGeezer: The opportunity is there for those who really want it, which is the point.

#28 Edited by MrGeezer (56749 posts) -

@SpartanMSU said:

@MrGeezer: The opportunity is there for those who really want it, which is the point.

And again, even if everyone wanted it, the opportunity isn't there for all of them. So no, the opportunity ISN'T there for all of those who really want it.

#29 Posted by deeliman (2537 posts) -

I agree with geezer

#30 Posted by mattbbpl (10764 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:

Regardless of what happens in years to come we will just automate these jobs, and we won't have to hear as many people working together for better wages.

http://www.clickondetroit.com/money/Robots-will-replace-fast-food-workers/26118050

Absolutely. This is a normal, and even a healthy, thing in the long run provided other aspects of the economy are working correctly - i.e. those jobs are replaced over time with other jobs through new industries or increased demand in existing industries, training is available to transition people to those new jobs, etc. In the meantime, unfortunately, they have nowhere to go while the economy adjusts to accommodate them again.

#31 Edited by LJS9502_basic (151873 posts) -

@lamprey263 said:

Why you dislike these people @Master_Live? They deserve to ask for a wage that doesn't keep them in poverty. You're a cold hearted Scrooge.

It's not a job for a family. Period.

#32 Edited by sargentpsgamer (56 posts) -

I'm sorry, but this argument is entirely stupid. I worked in the food industry, I got hardly any pay, and yes as a college student I was living off less than 400 dollars a month. Yet I'm still against this. Why? Because it's a peon job you have while in school, and above all else its just work experience.

I don't know about other states, but here all you really need is 1 year of restaurant experience to be a manager almost anywhere and that job alone pushes you up to 10 dollars an hour. Have the experience and a competent brain and the job is yours. New food places open ALL the time and need managers ALL the time. Same goes for almost any position really. Get a year of line cook experience and move up the cooking ladder.

Almost all opposing arguments are dumb with no depth to them at all. You say "well the job market sucks, so we can't switch" Yeah right first of all, that level job has all kinds of things to jump into. It doesn't take a degree to be a garbage man, all else fails join the army. Second even if true, why would you want to literally destroy the one market at least supplying jobs? Companies like McDonalds are always going to have greedy CEO's. You get more money, guess what? People lose jobs to make up for the lost revenue, and prices go up so it makes no difference. At this point in time you are telling what jobs are left to supply free health care, more benefits, and higher pay. Where is all this money coming from? (including small business owners barely able to compete as is, don't pretend like they will get some type of "exception" to this because they won't)

Honestly anyone competent enough and willing can and will move up beyond minimum wage. The joke the entire time you are in school is that you "will become a burger flipper if you drop out" or fail. Why? Because it's a peon job, not a career.

Shouldn't people be more angry that our own government is supplying jobs over seas when they promised to our faces that they would bring jobs here? Look at Obama hiring a British company to handle Obamacare applications..... he friggin gave them a billion dollars and thousands of jobs that could have stayed right here in this country!