Is it Prejudice or Racism when you refuse to serve to two Israeli woman coffee?

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_R34LiTY_

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#1 _R34LiTY_
Member since 2008 • 3331 Posts

I know some people see them both as the same, which is fine, but to be techinical, isn't this being prejudice?

Israel's ambassador to New Zealand has called on the Government to take action after an Invercargill cafe owner refused to serve two Israeli women because of their nationality.

Australian-based ambassador Yuval Rotem said he wanted the government to ensure nothing similar happened again.

"This anti-Israeli and anti-Jewish sentiment needs to be stopped.

"At this moment you don't need to bring the Middle East into New Zealand ... you need to take the spirit of New Zealand into the Middle East," he said.

.....

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4820655a6009.html

I doubt that the two citizens were the ones bombing Gaza.

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-Sun_Tzu-

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#2 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts
That's pretty ridiculous. You'd think people would be able to differentiate the actions of one's government from one's own actions.
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Theokhoth

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#3 Theokhoth
Member since 2008 • 36799 Posts
Of course it's prejudiced.
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ferrari2001

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#4 ferrari2001
Member since 2008 • 17772 Posts
People are dumb, a war breaks out, one side cries everyone starts being jerks.. Oh well I hope the government shuts that dudes business down, that would be great..
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_R34LiTY_

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#5 _R34LiTY_
Member since 2008 • 3331 Posts

Of course it's prejudiced. Theokhoth

I thought so. I was just wondering because there was a thread about this little incident that turned into stupid debate on some other forum site about whether this was racism or being prejudice.

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Ice-Hot_MoFo

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#6 Ice-Hot_MoFo
Member since 2008 • 511 Posts
Dont people have the right to refuse anyone service? If they do, then can they be sued for it?
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Killer_Cam3lz

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#7 Killer_Cam3lz
Member since 2009 • 25 Posts
That ain't right. If the two women were being rude or inconsiderate, then sure, but not because of nationality.
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Vandalvideo

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#8 Vandalvideo
Member since 2003 • 39655 Posts
Dont people have the right to refuse anyone service? If they do, then can they be sued for it?Ice-Hot_MoFo
Only if it is a privately ran club of some sort. If it is a public business they can't refuse service. Atleast in the United States. Who knows what kinda crazy laws those New Zealanders have.
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More_Dakka

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#9 More_Dakka
Member since 2007 • 1625 Posts

[quote=" "]

Australian-based ambassador Yuval Rotem said he wanted the government to ensure nothing similar happened again. _R34LiTY_

I stopped reading right there... "Wants the government to make sure nothing similar happened again"...

Excuse me- but HOW?!? In all seriousness- that statement's a waste of breath. And if it isn't- then we're all going to be ****ed very soon...

Anyway, back on topic... Since the article said that the guy didn't serve those two women due to their nationality- the wording leads us to believe it may be purely prejudice- since nationality isn't the same as race.

But, I could easily see it being both at the same time. If the article is to be taken word-for-word however, then it's just prejudice.

Whatever the case- it's utterly pathetic.

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Dark-Sithious

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#10 Dark-Sithious
Member since 2008 • 3914 Posts

How did he know they were from Israel?

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GabuEx

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#11 GabuEx
Member since 2006 • 36552 Posts

It's not racism unless there's a race. :P

But yeah, this is pretty stupid. It's kinda like all the crap Americans got because foreigners didn't like their president. Really quite disgusting.

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Funky_Llama

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#12 Funky_Llama
Member since 2006 • 18428 Posts
Xenophobia would be a more accurate term than racism. But yeah, it's also prejudiced.
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freshgman

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#13 freshgman
Member since 2005 • 12241 Posts
yeah yeah it happens
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Big_player

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#14 Big_player
Member since 2004 • 6187 Posts
Call it whatever you want, but the owner has every right to deny them service. It's sad that the owner is punishing them for something clearly out of there control though.
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mayforcebeyou

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#15 mayforcebeyou
Member since 2007 • 2703 Posts
that's ridiculous how do they know the worker refused the cofee for other reasons
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ffaf666

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#16 ffaf666
Member since 2006 • 377 Posts
hehe, the israeli ambassador is trying to blur the line between zionism and judaism.
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btaylor2404

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#17 btaylor2404
Member since 2003 • 11353 Posts
Yes to me it is. Coffee? That's nuts.
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MattUD1

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#18 MattUD1
Member since 2004 • 20715 Posts
Certainly ignorant.
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_R34LiTY_

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#19 _R34LiTY_
Member since 2008 • 3331 Posts

Yes to me it is. Coffee? That's nuts.btaylor2404

Yes it is what to you?

just asking for clarification...racism/prejudice

i guess it really doesn't matter, it was a stupid move

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Paladin_King

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#20 Paladin_King
Member since 2008 • 11832 Posts
[QUOTE="Ice-Hot_MoFo"]Dont people have the right to refuse anyone service? If they do, then can they be sued for it?Vandalvideo
Only if it is a privately ran club of some sort. If it is a public business they can't refuse service. Atleast in the United States. Who knows what kinda crazy laws those New Zealanders have.

Hmm, I know here in Canada you can refuse people service. That said, if you clearly make it an issue of raise, you're cruising for a bruising on the non-discrimination front, which ends up invalidating the freedom of refusal. The freedom of refusal is more or less reserved for customers who are being abusive or unreasonable. Anyway, isn't racism just a form of prejudice?
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Mudcake_Mad

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#21 Mudcake_Mad
Member since 2008 • 505 Posts
Well, yes its tupid for what they did, blaming the two woman, which is racist and prejudiced. However, isnt that what we all do, blame the whole race? Dont all tell me it isnt, because that would be llying
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#22 Zenkuso
Member since 2006 • 4090 Posts
Dont people have the right to refuse anyone service? If they do, then can they be sued for it?Ice-Hot_MoFo
You use to in new zealand but the last government changed many things.
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#23 Paladin_King
Member since 2008 • 11832 Posts
Well, yes its tupid for what they did, blaming the two woman, which is racist and prejudiced. However, isnt that what we all do, blame the whole race? Dont all tell me it isnt, because that would be llyingMudcake_Mad
Um....? I'm afraid that no, i don't blame whole races for the crimes of the few......and no i'm not lying. the belief in "universal racism" has never been a good one.
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SOTE

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#24 SOTE
Member since 2004 • 3398 Posts
yes?
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#25 hiphops_savior
Member since 2007 • 8535 Posts
It depends, if they are being rude, then they're just playing the race card. If they are being denied service just because of where they're from, then it's xenophobia.
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Mudcake_Mad

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#26 Mudcake_Mad
Member since 2008 • 505 Posts
[QUOTE="Mudcake_Mad"]Well, yes its tupid for what they did, blaming the two woman, which is racist and prejudiced. However, isnt that what we all do, blame the whole race? Dont all tell me it isnt, because that would be llyingPaladin_King
Um....? I'm afraid that no, i don't blame whole races for the crimes of the few......and no i'm not lying. the belief in "universal racism" has never been a good one.

well, i afraid that's how it is everywhere all the time
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Paladin_King

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#27 Paladin_King
Member since 2008 • 11832 Posts
[QUOTE="Paladin_King"][QUOTE="Mudcake_Mad"]Well, yes its tupid for what they did, blaming the two woman, which is racist and prejudiced. However, isnt that what we all do, blame the whole race? Dont all tell me it isnt, because that would be llyingMudcake_Mad
Um....? I'm afraid that no, i don't blame whole races for the crimes of the few......and no i'm not lying. the belief in "universal racism" has never been a good one.

well, i afraid that's how it is everywhere all the time

"Everywhere" "all the time." Right. Do you have the empirical proof to back that up? Remember, you said everywhere and all the time. The belief in universal racism is nothing more than an excuse that continuing racism that stops improvement. It's also untrue.
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Morning_Revival

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#28 Morning_Revival
Member since 2008 • 3475 Posts
Add in Rudeness and youre correct.
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GabuEx

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#29 GabuEx
Member since 2006 • 36552 Posts

well, i afraid that's how it is everywhere all the timeMudcake_Mad

I don't think that every cafe on the planet would refuse to serve Israelis because of the actions of their government.

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ThePlothole

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#30 ThePlothole
Member since 2007 • 11515 Posts

It's not racism unless there's a race. :P

GabuEx

The term "racism" is a misnomer however it's used. I mean technically these is just one race: humans.

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halfirishhomer

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#31 halfirishhomer
Member since 2007 • 550 Posts
I don't see why he would refuse to serve them, its not like Israel started this. Hamas shot over 3,000 rockets at Israel last year, they need to be taught a lesson.
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#32 btaylor2404
Member since 2003 • 11353 Posts

[QUOTE="btaylor2404"]Yes to me it is. Coffee? That's nuts._R34LiTY_

Yes it is what to you?

just asking for clarification...racism/prejudice

i guess it really doesn't matter, it was a stupid move

That would be both. Racism & prejudice.
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G-T-A---M-A-D

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#33 G-T-A---M-A-D
Member since 2007 • 331 Posts
wow.....who cares? Arabs arent allowed to be pilots in america now but i dont see a stupid, useless article about that...
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#34 -Sun_Tzu-
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wow.....who cares? Arabs arent allowed to be pilots in america now but i dont see a stupid, useless article about that...G-T-A---M-A-D
You don't see an article about it because you just made that BS up.
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deactivated-5d0e4d67d0988

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#35 deactivated-5d0e4d67d0988
Member since 2008 • 5396 Posts
[QUOTE="Ice-Hot_MoFo"]Dont people have the right to refuse anyone service? If they do, then can they be sued for it?Zenkuso
You use to in new zealand but the last government changed many things.

I still think any business has the right to refuse service however this was done on the basis of race/religion which is a breach of Human rights and possibly the New zealand bill of rights Act, so therefore it is not legal.
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G-T-A---M-A-D

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#36 G-T-A---M-A-D
Member since 2007 • 331 Posts
[QUOTE="G-T-A---M-A-D"]wow.....who cares? Arabs arent allowed to be pilots in america now but i dont see a stupid, useless article about that...-Sun_Tzu-
You don't see an article about it because you just made that BS up.

Nope its true if you are an Arab American citizen and want to become a commercial airline pilot, you will NEVER get the job, this is because of 911, so you can say this is racism and prejudice as well Also those 2 israeli women should know better than to order cofees at an Arab cafe, i think it is atleast.
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-Sun_Tzu-

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#37 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts
[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"][QUOTE="G-T-A---M-A-D"]wow.....who cares? Arabs arent allowed to be pilots in america now but i dont see a stupid, useless article about that...G-T-A---M-A-D
You don't see an article about it because you just made that BS up.

Nope its true if you are an Arab American citizen and want to become a commercial airline pilot, you will NEVER get the job, this is because of 911, so you can say this is racism and prejudice as well

Prove it.
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XilePrincess

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#38 XilePrincess
Member since 2008 • 13130 Posts
you can refuse somebody service for things like the no shirt no shoes no service rule, but that isn't anything like that, that's just racism.
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Sora529

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#39 Sora529
Member since 2006 • 3755 Posts
I believe that would be predjudice. Nationality and race are two different things so discriminating against a race is racism as discriminating against a nationality is predjudice.
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ffaf666

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#40 ffaf666
Member since 2006 • 377 Posts
I don't see why he would refuse to serve them, its not like Israel started this. Hamas shot over 3,000 rockets at Israel last year, they need to be taught a lesson.halfirishhomer
its not that simple, the media hides half the stuff. i doubt you even know how this bitter conflicted started. If you were dispaced from you country and made to live as refugees for something you didnt do, resist?
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II_Seraphim_II

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#41 II_Seraphim_II
Member since 2007 • 20534 Posts
Of course it's prejudiced. Theokhoth
^what (s)he said.
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II_Seraphim_II

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#42 II_Seraphim_II
Member since 2007 • 20534 Posts
[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Ice-Hot_MoFo"]Dont people have the right to refuse anyone service? If they do, then can they be sued for it?Paladin_King
Only if it is a privately ran club of some sort. If it is a public business they can't refuse service. Atleast in the United States. Who knows what kinda crazy laws those New Zealanders have.

Hmm, I know here in Canada you can refuse people service. That said, if you clearly make it an issue of raise, you're cruising for a bruising on the non-discrimination front, which ends up invalidating the freedom of refusal. The freedom of refusal is more or less reserved for customers who are being abusive or unreasonable. Anyway, isn't racism just a form of prejudice?

Canada is similar to the US. You cannot refuse service in a public venue, but in a private one, you are allowed to do as you please.
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Joker_268

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#43 Joker_268
Member since 2004 • 997 Posts

wow.....who cares? Arabs arent allowed to be pilots in america now but i dont see a stupid, useless article about that...G-T-A---M-A-D

^ Thats racist.