How Gamespot degenerated over the years

I've been a reader of Gamespot since 2004. It was at one point my favorite website. But I've seen it decline so much over the past few years. The site made lots of mistakes which degenerated the community and solidified it as a site full of nasty trolls rather than decent people with intelligent opinions.

By the way, I really like Kevin VanOrd and he's been doing good things for the site. He even answered one of my emails to him about the objectivity of game reviews. He gave me a really long insightful reply and I am kicking myself for accidentally deleting it. That letter was pure gold!! But the point is that GS's greater administrative decisions outweigh all the good Kevin has done. I also like Cam's reality check, by the way.

But there are big mistakes the site made which ruined it for me.

Mistake 1 - Firing Jeff Gerstmann

It hurt the reputation of the site and it lost some of its best reviewers.

Mistake 2 - Allowing rudeness in System Wars

Mods decided to go along with the nastiness rather than stop it, so the good people left and the trolls remain.

Mistake 3 - Feedbackula

This series not only encouraged nasty degenerative comments, but it brought the GS staff down to that level.

Mistake 4 - Deceptive News Titles

Often times the news articles here are very good and well laid out. But far too often, sensationalist titles and clickbait represent the site and drag down the quality of the Gamespot brand. We don't need any more news titles calling Valve "the Half Life 3 developer".

Mistake 5 - Firing the Writers

The process of dumbing down this site into a clickbait archive rather than having digestible intellectual ideas has finally been complete. But it wasn't without the help of all of the above.

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Oh, how the mighty have fallen.

I came here prepared to debate your points...I am now leaving disappointed XD

Yeah pretty much. Many left disgusted and formed new homes to shelter from this cesspool.

Gamespot is now clickbaitspot. They still better than IGN though.

The ravages of time I guess

I think the rise of Reddit kind of killed Gamespot. Originally, a lot off the gaming community who wasn't into 4chan's sadistic sense of humor came to Gamespot or Gamefaqs but now that since the popularity of Reddit increased the gaming community can just go there without having to deal with as much censorship and unfair moderators.

I will say that I've been here (2009 I think) I noticed a steady decline; it used to be on OT that if you go, post in a thread and refresh the page two seconds later, there'd be either a new thread or a new post to read. Same with SW (and SW also used to be more than just graphics threads). Ever since the remodel, dozens of users have left and the once active forums have become forums you go to every once in a while just to read something amusing. I mean, that's what SW was before, but at least on there you could carry a back and forth argument because there were actually people that responded pretty quickly. Not only that, but they've taken User Reviews (something I still participate in) and made them EVEN HARDER to access and view. It used to be that they had the two most recent user reviews for a game in the actual official review and now they don't even have that. It discourages community participation and I hate it. I guess I keep returning to this site because I hold out hope that it'll resurge some day.

I usually stick to the forums. They degenerated with the loss of the ToU. Now the place is a barren wasteland. I come in here and there but by no means spend time here as I did in the past.

TC forgot to mention changing the site and getting rid of unions. >_>

LOL no union invites is a good thing....

Yeah, but we lost a LOT of quality members because of that disaster.

Poor unioners

Anything is better than IGN.

ToU and the redesign seemed to have the biggest effect imo.

May I rule over this barren kingdom?

Indeed, my child.

As far as the forums go, there are some parts you did not include.

A few years ago, a vocal minority group who represented banned users on GameSpot coerced forum users about the former Terms of Use and debated with site moderators as well as staff. Eventually, their arguments became relevant enough to prompt a vote that affected all of GameSpot via Terms of Use, yet most of the participants usually were on Off-Topic if any part of this site. The voting results were in favor of a more relaxed ToU, banned user accounts were reinstated, and things degenerated. Finally, when former GS reviewer Carolyn Petit made a review for Grand Theft Auto V, many users insulted the gender and sexuality status of that individual. Also, they sent that Carolyn Petit death threats and called for a dismissal from GameSpot. The GameSpot staff recognized the damage that decision had caused, though perhaps in a way which was not holistic and the Code of Conduct and Terms of Use were made stricter. While not nearly as strict as before, the Code of Conduct is far stricter than previously so.

All that said, we have plans to make GameSpot a great place again. Check this thread to give your input and maybe you will be part of the reason this site is great again. We know GS has better times. A unified voice requesting improvements could do wonders. Consider Twitter campaigns such as the #NoDRMPS4 one.

I'd say the major cause was the administration staff's complete lack of effort with regards to facilitating a sense of community by updating the code to a working state.

Excuse me, which users that asked for a more relaxed ToU sent that GS reviewer death threats? If you have any proof of that, you need to post it. Because I have a very hard time believing that anybody that actually belongs to this community, and not just a troll that goes through many forums, would do such a thing. If you have no proof then you have nothing to back up your argument that because of the ToU relaxation that is why what happened to Carolyn did indeed happen. In fact, if you have no proof then you need to moderate your own post. Because that's a truly offensive thing to say. I was one of the people that asked for and still want a far relaxed ToU and I've never sent a death threat to Carolyn Petit or asked for her to be fired because she's transgendered. I do think she deserved to be fired because she wasn't a good reviewer, but that's besides the point.

Nothing you guys are able to do can make GS a better place again because your priorities are mixed up. You moderate users who aren't trolls over people who are. You guys get moderators who know nothing about the boards they're supposed to moderate. You guys get moderators with the lowest post counts.

You have a staff that doesn't care about the community as a whole(if they did they'd actually post here).

If you want to community police, you're going about it the wrong way. If you want to make this community better, then maybe you should actually take actions when we make suggestions.

Bran was this tdh because tdh hated the new tou and most left as a result of the change it brought

Bran you seem very much lost about the forum you are supposed to keep in line and the idea that what people wanted was a more human tou and enforcement and not the destruction of the tou

@airshocker: I too was one who desired a relaxed ToU and never sent Carolyn Petit a death threat. While I disagreed with her opinion of the game, I respected her right to have it. Most people who did that probably were the same people Gamespot staff preferred having on the site anyways (i.e. news article comment traffic) and turned their noses up to the people who have been the major foundation of this site for a decade or more (the forum goers).

I don't know, the new TOU don't seem to have helped places like SW. We just see trolls making the same disruptive posts over and over

I'm reading brans death threat example as a consequence of these mysterious people getting their way and not as the mysterious people making the death threats. Two separate groups of peeps with perhaps some bleedover

QFMFT. When is this new ToU going to actually do something?

I agree, I think they've forgotten that the community they allowed to foster is what made this site great. Now it seems like they're doing everything in their power to destroy it.

I hope you misunderstood me. I did not say that exactly. The people who did that were in the comments sections and the forums as well, but I was not referring to the same group of users who initially called for the ToU change and banned user forgiveness. I know you dislike me for some reason. I would appreciate you not making a mountain out a of a mole hill especially when related to what I say because you seem disingenuous at best right now and slanderous at worst.

Nothing you guys are able to do can make GS a better place again because your priorities are mixed up. You moderate users who aren't trolls over people who are. You guys get moderators who know nothing about the boards they're supposed to moderate. You guys get moderators with the lowest post counts.

I must tell you that quality matters much more than quantity which is a reiteration of what AppleFan1991 told you.

You have a staff that doesn't care about the community as a whole(if they did they'd actually post here).

Despite what you believe, the staff actually does care. They post in the Bug & Feedback Forum, comments sections, and chat rooms. They are busy people, yet they find time to communicate with users about current events which are fun times.

If you want to community police, you're going about it the wrong way. If you want to make this community better, then maybe you should actually take actions when we make suggestions.

I do not know what that first statement means because it is grammatically incorrect. There are two nouns one after another. If you meant something else, the word "to" should not be there. Anyway, allow me to inform you about what the moderation team does and does not do because you seem to misunderstand the role of my team on this site.

We Do:

• The best we can to maintain a positive and vibrant community
• Delete comments in breach of the Code of Conduct
• Move Threads
• Purge Threads
• Lock Threads
• Issue Strikes including bans

We Do Not:

• Alter site code (read: site changes)
• Work at a GameSpot office
• Get paid for our position
• Conspire against any particular group

Bran please understand that the powers that be fucked up the tou because of general incompetence and let the monsters shine

Dave, you misconstrue my words as well. At no point did I say "the destruction of the Terms of Use." If you have proof that I did say so or anything similar to that, please actually quote me. Also, you are entitled to your opinion. I do not hate you for it.

@foxhound_fox: See previous post of mine

@lostrib: It is fair to say that there is a part of GameSpot who would like stricter rules. If you are one of those users then the Bug & Feedback Forum is the perfect place to talk about it.

I disagree. I believe it was due to other reasons.

Then what exactly are you trying to say? If there's a misunderstanding then it's because you aren't being clear, not me being disingenuous which I have to add is so far beyond the truth it's not even funny. This is actually the most genuine I've been in quite a long time. I don't like you because you're a hypocrite. That, however, didn't have anything to do with me trying to figure out what it is that you're getting at.

@applefan1991 can say whatever he wants. My point about post counts isn't to say that quantity is better than quality but to say that how can you be a part of a community when you have such a low post count? It would be just like hiring a police officer and throwing them on the streets without giving them any training.

The staff doesn't care. That is evident because they don't post in the community they're paid to represent. Or is that an incorrect description of their job?

Since you aren't a cop I shouldn't have assumed you knew what community policing is: Community policing is a philosophy that promotes organizational strategies, which support the systematic use of partnerships and problem-solving techniques, to proactively address the immediate conditions that give rise to public safety issues such as crime, social disorder, and fear of crime. Here's a neat little PDF you can read. How can this be applied to moderating a website forum? Well I'm glad you asked! 1. You can work with users to identify problem users, and other issues. 2. You can be leaders instead of enforcers. 3. You can control the climate(the vibe, so to speak) of the forums. 4. You can be more transparent. You are doing none of these things. You are acting like despots. If you were actually a decent moderator you wouldn't have tried to patronize me about grammar. Instead, you would have asked what I meant. Also another reason why I don't like you.

Bran who wanted the new tou?

I think the site degenerated because the gaming industry in general just degenerated. I don't game like I used to. There maybe more gamers then there were 10 years ago but many of them are casuals who don't come to sites like these. At least not in the forums. The hardcore crowd just isn't gaming as much these days.

I used to use this YEARS ago. This new site really really sucks. It is so clunky and stupid. The great Diablo112688 also no longer posts.

@airshocker: I further explained what I meant in the post you quoted. How I am a hypocrite is something I would like to know. As long as we are on the subject of mistakes by GameSpot and its representatives, I welcome legitimate criticisms and proactive suggestions on can be done better.

Another thing I will tell you, though, is that the comparison to police officers really does not work for moderators because we are not primarily rule enforcers; That is not our main responsibility whereas police officers are primarily law enforcement.

Everyone who voted for it

That said, if you are asking who I was referring to earlier then I was referencing representatives of banned users who also have an account on a website called The Daily Happening which I must say is the worst site I have ever been a user of. A bit more of this tangent, I still remember all the users who called me the n-word there or simply said what was transpiring there was deserved while others still sided with them. Some of those same users remain active now on GameSpot including in this very thread. Others were former moderators on GS, though they were not who I commented on. I do not mean to give a mental image of something that did not occur. Since that did and it is relevant to a certain extent in many ways, it is worth mentioning in order to avoid any further nasty situations.

Moving on, the staff did make the administrative decision for the rule changes. However, the systematic plan for that change was incurred by the group I have mentioned repeatedly. Without them, the rule changes would not have occurred as they did.

I don't necessarily want stricter enforcement. Just commenting that during the site redesign there was a lot of talk about the stricter TOU and then we didn't really see much come from that. I do think that the reporting system is flawed, and there is a lack of consistency in enforcement of the rules/lack of communication of what constitutes a violation.

I mean in the TOU under Acceptable Use it pretty much covers everything under the sun. But there doesn't seem to be a consistent message of what actually is a moderatable/reportable offense.

Heck even the GS staff doesn't follow the rules

No, you really didn't. We've already discussed why you're a hypocrite. My opinions from that past, private conversation haven't changed. I've also just made suggestions. Time will tell if you guys actually take us up on our suggestions.

That is a cop-out, no pun intended. A moderator is an arbitrator or mediator. While moderator evokes a more peaceful image than say, enforcer, it's the same exact thing.

When they made the terms of use less strict, that was the beginning of the end.

Guys where can I read the tou and code of conduct??? Ever since the redesign I've been unable to find those two....

If the d bags in charge of this POS had any bullocks they'd swallow their pride and relauch the old site...

This is, apparently, the ToU. Even though it doesn't really go into any type of details on what is or isn't allowed on the forums. Or if it does I just can't find it. We used to have a post on the forums that outlined the entire ToU that applied to the forums but now it's broken down into two posts and seems to just be cobbled up from...anything. Also, the mods frequently make stealth edits(rule changes) for whatever suits them.

What's actually funny is that moderators keep trying to tell us that the staff actually care about this website. This thread has been stickied for damn near a year and not a single staff member ever took the time out of their busy schedules to answer our questions. Then it was locked. Lol. Yeah, it sure seems like the staff members care about the forums.

@airshocker: Sorry to say, and I don't mean to be offensive, but you're just talking out of your ass in regards to what moderators and staff do or don't do...people sit here throwing solutions around, knowing nothing of how things work behind the curtain and then getting pissed when things don't change even though they have no real clue how to make real changes...which is mostly the kind of suggestions I read in these forums. Everybody thinks they have the solutions to all of GS's problems, then you hear ridiculous suggestions like "If you made a min post count before being allowed to create a thread we wouldn't have spambots".

Yes, GS has problems, yes, GS has a few useless mods but probably not the ones you'd think, since those actually show up and do the best they can; the real problem are the dozens that I've never even seen...

And yes, getting an answer from the mods is a bitch, because it takes a month to get an answer from admins, who have to wait 3 weeks for an answer from the higher ups....it's a huge shitball that always ends up on the mods and users, while everybody else washes their hands clean. With all of that, I think it's extremely unfair to put the blame on mods.

And particularly to you, airshocker, mods are NOT primarily enforcers...they are specifically instructed to be as unobtrusive as possible and to mainly facilitate conversations; taking action is the last think they are told to do (obviously this doesn't apply to bots threads, or threads in the wrong section, etc). One of the reasons I quit being a moderator is because the feking TOU is a bloody appease-the-idiots mess and I was actually told to let users in SW acting like the retarded fucks that they are (I'm referring specifically to the troublemakers, not everyone), while at the same time having to deal with over 3000 reports a day that I took care of on my lunch hour and when I got home after a 10 hour job, sometimes staying up until 3am (to go back to work 4 hours later) waiting for a US timezone mod to log in so I wouldn't leave everybody drowning in idiocy. And you know what 90% of the reports were? Insulting assholes who would provoke people to insulting them so that they could report them. On top of this I couldn't fart without consulting the staff, who were stuck on pointless meetings, and then I had the users telling me my post count was too low to be a mod (even though they were perfectly happy to have me solve their problems) and others asking me why I stopped being as active in the community.

Now I know being on this side makes it difficult to imagine how things are at the other side...I honestly had no idea until I got asked to be a mod but come on guys, give the mods a break. For a free "job", everybody seems to have a hell of a lot of rocks to throw at mods...

If I'm being unclear as to where my anger lies, let me clean that mess up right now. I understand the shitty job mods have to put up with. Believe me, if it was ever offered to me I'd do it as penance for the asshole I can sometimes be. I was worse years ago, trust me. I don't blame the mod team. My criticisms are almost entirely with the GS staff and a particular moderator.

With that said, that doesn't excuse how the community has been treated over the past year. Some of us actually used to pay every month for an ad free and "enhanced" GameSpot experience. I can say with certainty that I feel robbed. I feel cheated. I've repeatedly asked questions and have gotten no responses except from unpaid moderators who SHOULDN'T have to put up with that.

I do appreciate what you did as a mod. We all do. Things need to change, however. And as the adage goes, the squeaky wheel gets the grease.

@airshocker: Yeah, most of my post was not directed at you, sorry if it sounded like I was lashing out...it was just a "might as well do it here". Aimed at you was mostly the "mods are not primarily enforcers" part...believe me, I wanted to do more, and be harsher with some of the users who ruin it for most of us. Even the people who used to help others on a regular basis turned bitter, some people are just angry all the time nowadays, hell, I'm a lot bigger an asshole nowadays as well.

And it's so incredibly frustrating to be "up there" and "seeing the big picture" (hard not to when you see so many complaints day in and day out aimed at the same users...or terrible reported PM's from users who act like saints on the forums) and being told by the staff (who gets told by their higher-ups) to just slap them on the wrist...It's teeth grinding bad...

Locking threads is fine (that's why it's the go-to solution for a lot of mods) but actually acting against a user (since mods are users themselves, not really working for GS)...it's like trying to get a law approved...lots of people voice out, most of them get no vote, and then an agonising wait, sometimes for weeks, while users insult us for doing nothing.

I can only assume that no staff member is paid to improve the forums.

The golden age of the forums was during the lithium days. It was a lot more fun, and more adult oriented. You could get way with a lot of things. Would You Hit It threads galore. Threads normally didn't get locked unless they became totally disruptive or someone started spamming. People didn't cry to the moderators all the time. Then they tried clamping down on all that to appeal to 12 year olds and parents by getting strict. But that was a long time ago. Good times, nonetheless.

As far as the site in general goes, there's just nothing interesting to read or watch anymore. Gamespot used to be the place to go to for all things gaming (again, I'm talking a really long time ago). And then whatever was left (the old layout), they got rid of too and this new layout sucks. They were trying to make it mobile friendly but I find it's even worse on smartphones/tablets. They need to go back to making this a gamer's website and enough with the dumb gimmicks/click bait. Right now it's more like CNET - Games section than it is its own site. Also, get some personalities and more diversity in personnel. Gamers come in all shapes, sizes, and colors.

My two cents.

You mean content-wise or behaviour-wise? In either case the answer is "yeah, they are".

Feature-wise. Things are broken... things are missing. People stated what these things were when the site launched, and they have been ignored. Just last month, in the feedback forum, a list of improvements was made. It took that long, (a year?), to make a list. Has anything been done about it? No, I don't think so. I'd be more annoyed, but I do believe the staff have other things to do. If these forums are their work, their sole responsibility, for which they are paid, then... really... WTH

@SolidSnake35: Yeah...we have at least 3 people who are responsible for the website (and forums) coding, features and improvements, but during my time as a mod the only feedback I ever got was "It's on the to-do list", which is a shitty feedback to have a mod return to the user...even worse was the "we're not planning on fixing it because that entire system will be scrapped eventually"...which meant that, until then, it was up to mods to swim in shit trying to go around it =/