How do you feel about the big Star Wars announcement?

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#1 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

'Star Wars' nukes its entire Expanded Universe

Pretty sad news for those of us who grew up reading the EU books.

This makes me question the cheer I was feeling towards Disney buying the rights to Star Wars. They're seriously going to tell me that crap like The Phantom Menace and The Clone Wars should be canon but the fantastic EU series by Timothy Zahn(Heir to the Empire), the X-Wing series, the Boba Fett Bounty Hunter novels, the Han Solo trilogy, and countless other great stories shouldn't?

Obviously this doesn't mean that the books are going anywhere. They're been a cash cow for Lucasfilm and they'll continue to be for Disney but still...extremely lame. What say you, OT?

#2 Edited by KHAndAnime (13167 posts) -

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. Furthermore, most of the expanded universe's tone fit a lot more with Lucas' prequel universe, which was a huge degradation of the SW universe IMO. Most of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

#3 Edited by airshocker (28327 posts) -

@KHAndAnime said:

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. And a lot of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

I agree that it would be difficult and that's probably the reason they did it: Why read any of the great fiction when we can just make things up from scratch? Fuck those authors that put serious time and thought(most of them, anyway)into what they wrote and how it would fit into the Star Wars universe. As for the Boba Fett stuff, I'll agree that the later stuff(New Jedi Order and Legacy of the Force cameos) was pretty weak but the early stuff in the Han Solo trilogy and the Bounty Hunter Wars trilogy? Those were great.

It's a tough sell trying to say it all sounded like fan fiction. Maybe a good 20% of it was fluff and PR shit, but the rest of it was quality fiction.

#4 Posted by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

It's a good move

#5 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -
#6 Posted by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

The eu is too unwieldy

#7 Edited by KHAndAnime (13167 posts) -
@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. And a lot of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

I agree that it would be difficult and that's probably the reason they did it: Why read any of the great fiction when we can just make things up from scratch? Fuck those authors that put serious time and thought(most of them, anyway)into what they wrote and how it would fit into the Star Wars universe. As for the Boba Fett stuff, I'll agree that the later stuff(New Jedi Order and Legacy of the Force cameos) was pretty weak but the early stuff in the Han Solo trilogy and the Bounty Hunter Wars trilogy? Those were great.

I'll just say I disagree. It's all silly fan fiction to me.

"Though no one in recorded history had ever escaped from the Sarlacc, Fett was able to escape, though not unscathed."

It's completely ridiculous IMO, absolutely not up to stuff with the films and undeserving of being canon. This is stuff I'd write about my favorite characters when I'm 12 years old. It's just redundant lore capitalizing on the Star Wars franchise. I want the new movies to have the creative freedom to do what they want, rather than be choked by stupid SW universe lore that I never knew about nor will ever care to know about. If they were going to include a lot of the silly expanded universe stuff, they wouldn't be able to cherry pick what's canon or not from the expanded universe, so it makes much more sense to ignore them altogether in the context of the movies.

#8 Posted by Master_Live (13639 posts) -

I guess it had to be done, they can still use the good story lines from those books. As long as whatever we get in the movies is great I'm up for it.

#9 Edited by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

Yeah. They can still use the stuff from the books but shouldn't feel beholden to them.

#10 Posted by JangoWuzHere (15930 posts) -

It's not canon, but that doesn't mean it still can't be enjoyed for what it is. It's the right decision and we all saw it coming.

#11 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. And a lot of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

I agree that it would be difficult and that's probably the reason they did it: Why read any of the great fiction when we can just make things up from scratch? Fuck those authors that put serious time and thought(most of them, anyway)into what they wrote and how it would fit into the Star Wars universe. As for the Boba Fett stuff, I'll agree that the later stuff(New Jedi Order and Legacy of the Force cameos) was pretty weak but the early stuff in the Han Solo trilogy and the Bounty Hunter Wars trilogy? Those were great.

I'll just say I disagree. It's all silly fan fiction to me.

"Though no one in recorded history had ever escaped from the Sarlacc, Fett was able to escape, though not unscathed."

It's completely ridiculous IMO, absolutely not up to stuff with the films and undeserving of being canon. This is stuff I'd write about my favorite characters when I'm 12 years old. It's just redundant lore capitalizing on the Star Wars franchise. I want the new movies to have the creative freedom to do what they want, rather than be choked by stupid SW universe lore that I never knew about nor will ever care to know about.

I suggest you stop reading Wookieepedia. It's a good tool to get the broad brush strokes of things that happened but it doesn't reference the books that actually showed how he got out of the Sarlacc. Fett, in the EU lore, was pulled out because he had set up an arrangement with Dengar and another bounty hunter to watch his back. So while I agree that what you quoted sounds ridiculous, it doesn't do what actually happened any justice. The Mandalorian Armor explains it better than I ever could.

How do you know that if you've never even read any of them? If you haven't experienced any of the EU fiction then you are in no place to call any of it stupid.

#12 Posted by lamprey263 (22458 posts) -

There's so much content in the Star Wars universe I think it'd be ludicrous to expect anything new to adhere to already established additions to that universe that have taken place to it over the years. Every comic or book or RPG campaign or video game or spin-off. Does it matter that the Star Wars Christmas Special or Ewok Adventures aren't cannon? Why should this matter?

I mean, what would it take to keep everything cannon? Probably an army of pizza face adult nerd children would have to scrutinize every script, and then they'd start arguing like a bunch of nerds over what happened in this piece of the expanded universe and how it should all fit together and then everything would be stuck in development limbo.

#14 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

hey OT here are some thread ideas for you guys:

Ok so I was watching Last Week Tonight, a new show on hbo, and they talked about American news coverage of the election in India. Or the lack thereoff. The thread idea is to make a thread about the lack of coverage and stuff.

Another idea. Boyhood had a trailer. It's a new film by Richard Linklater and it was filmed over I guess 12 years with this kid. I haven't seen the trailer because I think it's better to go into the movie without seeing it. So you can make a thread talking about trailers in general and if they ruin movie experiences. Which reminds me of Jand and how he got upset when he got exposed to a house of cards spoiler for the new season. Which leads us to a third thread idea

Spoilers. Do they ruin things or is it more about the journey rather than the end?

My feeling is that part of the journey is the unknowing. That's what we would discuss in the thread

4th thread. Speaking of Jand, he has a kid on the way so that prompted me to make a thread about parenting advice on tdh. The thread here will be very much the same

So that's 4 thread ideas. You have my less mission to use any of them.

If you want a thread you make it, jerk.

#15 Edited by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

#16 Posted by SolidSnake35 (57948 posts) -

So you're telling me Dark Vader wasn't Luke's father?

#17 Posted by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

@airshocker: I don't visit here often enough anymore to put my usual quality and attention to a thread

#18 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

But what we're saying now is that Jar Jar Binks is canon! That's absurd and every Star Wars fan boy should take up arms and...do something about it!

#19 Edited by KHAndAnime (13167 posts) -

@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:
@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. And a lot of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

I agree that it would be difficult and that's probably the reason they did it: Why read any of the great fiction when we can just make things up from scratch? Fuck those authors that put serious time and thought(most of them, anyway)into what they wrote and how it would fit into the Star Wars universe. As for the Boba Fett stuff, I'll agree that the later stuff(New Jedi Order and Legacy of the Force cameos) was pretty weak but the early stuff in the Han Solo trilogy and the Bounty Hunter Wars trilogy? Those were great.

I'll just say I disagree. It's all silly fan fiction to me.

"Though no one in recorded history had ever escaped from the Sarlacc, Fett was able to escape, though not unscathed."

It's completely ridiculous IMO, absolutely not up to stuff with the films and undeserving of being canon. This is stuff I'd write about my favorite characters when I'm 12 years old. It's just redundant lore capitalizing on the Star Wars franchise. I want the new movies to have the creative freedom to do what they want, rather than be choked by stupid SW universe lore that I never knew about nor will ever care to know about.

I suggest you stop reading Wookieepedia. It's a good tool to get the broad brush strokes of things that happened but it doesn't reference the books that actually showed how he got out of the Sarlacc. Fett, in the EU lore, was pulled out because he had set up an arrangement with Dengar and another bounty hunter to watch his back. So while I agree that what you quoted sounds ridiculous, it doesn't do what actually happened any justice. The Mandalorian Armor explains it better than I ever could.

How do you know that if you've never even read any of them? If you haven't experienced any of the EU fiction then you are in no place to call any of it stupid.

I've tried reading into it a few times - it doesn't take me long to find things I don't like and stop. What I read seemed more intended for young teenagers. They typically like to stretch the possibilities of the SW universe in ways the movies couldn't do without seeming silly. My point is that in the movie: it's supposed to be his demise. Anything even resembling retcon makes me wince.

#20 Edited by airshocker (28327 posts) -

So you're telling me Dark Vader wasn't Luke's father?

I will not be baited by your ignorance.

#21 Posted by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

Jar jar is a black spot in my heart and memory

#22 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:
@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. And a lot of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

I agree that it would be difficult and that's probably the reason they did it: Why read any of the great fiction when we can just make things up from scratch? Fuck those authors that put serious time and thought(most of them, anyway)into what they wrote and how it would fit into the Star Wars universe. As for the Boba Fett stuff, I'll agree that the later stuff(New Jedi Order and Legacy of the Force cameos) was pretty weak but the early stuff in the Han Solo trilogy and the Bounty Hunter Wars trilogy? Those were great.

I'll just say I disagree. It's all silly fan fiction to me.

"Though no one in recorded history had ever escaped from the Sarlacc, Fett was able to escape, though not unscathed."

It's completely ridiculous IMO, absolutely not up to stuff with the films and undeserving of being canon. This is stuff I'd write about my favorite characters when I'm 12 years old. It's just redundant lore capitalizing on the Star Wars franchise. I want the new movies to have the creative freedom to do what they want, rather than be choked by stupid SW universe lore that I never knew about nor will ever care to know about.

I suggest you stop reading Wookieepedia. It's a good tool to get the broad brush strokes of things that happened but it doesn't reference the books that actually showed how he got out of the Sarlacc. Fett, in the EU lore, was pulled out because he had set up an arrangement with Dengar and another bounty hunter to watch his back. So while I agree that what you quoted sounds ridiculous, it doesn't do what actually happened any justice. The Mandalorian Armor explains it better than I ever could.

How do you know that if you've never even read any of them? If you haven't experienced any of the EU fiction then you are in no place to call any of it stupid.

I've tried reading into it a few times - it doesn't take me long to find things I don't like and stop. What I read seemed more intended for young teenagers. They typically like to stretch the possibilities of the SW universe in ways the movies couldn't do without seeming silly.


Are you talking about the YA fiction specifically? Because there's a lot of that branded under Star Wars and it all blows. If you want my essential list, here it is:

Everything else, before and after, is pretty much shit.

#23 Posted by SolidSnake35 (57948 posts) -

@SolidSnake35 said:

So you're telling me Dark Vader wasn't Luke's father?

I will not be baited by your ignorance.

That's no moon. That's a melon.

#24 Posted by JangoWuzHere (15930 posts) -

@dave123321 said:

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

But what we're saying now is that Jar Jar Binks is canon! That's absurd and every Star Wars fan boy should take up arms and...do something about it!

Jar jar isn't absurd

Midichlorians are absurd

#25 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

@airshocker said:

@dave123321 said:

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

But what we're saying now is that Jar Jar Binks is canon! That's absurd and every Star Wars fan boy should take up arms and...do something about it!

Jar jar isn't absurd

Midichlorians are absurd

Those are absurd too, but Jar Jar is worse.

#26 Posted by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

The thread is in need of a poll

#27 Edited by KHAndAnime (13167 posts) -

@airshocker said:
@KHAndAnime said:

@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:
@airshocker said:

@KHAndAnime said:

Honestly? Good. The amount of content in the expanded universe is probably a thousand times the content in the movies. It would be difficult for them to add more to the Star Wars universe while keeping it consistent with the ridiculous content of the expanded universe. And a lot of it is simply sounds like bad fan fiction. Take a look at Boba Fett's "expanded Universe" character : he's a joke. They take all the tiniest characters from the movie and give them the most ridiculous lore imaginable. Boba Fett's character was a lot better just being the minor character he was in the original trilogy.

I agree that it would be difficult and that's probably the reason they did it: Why read any of the great fiction when we can just make things up from scratch? Fuck those authors that put serious time and thought(most of them, anyway)into what they wrote and how it would fit into the Star Wars universe. As for the Boba Fett stuff, I'll agree that the later stuff(New Jedi Order and Legacy of the Force cameos) was pretty weak but the early stuff in the Han Solo trilogy and the Bounty Hunter Wars trilogy? Those were great.

I'll just say I disagree. It's all silly fan fiction to me.

"Though no one in recorded history had ever escaped from the Sarlacc, Fett was able to escape, though not unscathed."

It's completely ridiculous IMO, absolutely not up to stuff with the films and undeserving of being canon. This is stuff I'd write about my favorite characters when I'm 12 years old. It's just redundant lore capitalizing on the Star Wars franchise. I want the new movies to have the creative freedom to do what they want, rather than be choked by stupid SW universe lore that I never knew about nor will ever care to know about.

I suggest you stop reading Wookieepedia. It's a good tool to get the broad brush strokes of things that happened but it doesn't reference the books that actually showed how he got out of the Sarlacc. Fett, in the EU lore, was pulled out because he had set up an arrangement with Dengar and another bounty hunter to watch his back. So while I agree that what you quoted sounds ridiculous, it doesn't do what actually happened any justice. The Mandalorian Armor explains it better than I ever could.

How do you know that if you've never even read any of them? If you haven't experienced any of the EU fiction then you are in no place to call any of it stupid.

I've tried reading into it a few times - it doesn't take me long to find things I don't like and stop. What I read seemed more intended for young teenagers. They typically like to stretch the possibilities of the SW universe in ways the movies couldn't do without seeming silly.

Are you talking about the YA fiction specifically? Because there's a lot of that branded under Star Wars and it all blows. If you want my essential list, here it is:

Everything else, before and after, is pretty much shit.

No, I'm not talking about anything specific. I'm talking about Star Wars books you'd find in a middle school library. I'm not going to argue that all the EU sucks. I'm sure there is plenty of EU stuff that is fantastic. Unfortunately, there is so much EU of varying quality - that's why I think it's necessary to forget about canon in context of the new SW movies. I mean : if it were up to me, I'd file the prequels under "EU" as well.

#28 Posted by JangoWuzHere (15930 posts) -

@JangoWuzHere said:

@airshocker said:

@dave123321 said:

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

But what we're saying now is that Jar Jar Binks is canon! That's absurd and every Star Wars fan boy should take up arms and...do something about it!

Jar jar isn't absurd

Midichlorians are absurd

Those are absurd too, but Jar Jar is worse.

Jar Jar played a dumb minor character for one movie. Him being canon hardly matters at all.

Midichorians turned the magic and wonder of the force into dumb biology bullshit. The movies and EU have to use midichorians for all future projects.

Midichlorians are far worse.

#29 Edited by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

Air join the side of good

#30 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

@airshocker said:

@JangoWuzHere said:

@airshocker said:

@dave123321 said:

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

But what we're saying now is that Jar Jar Binks is canon! That's absurd and every Star Wars fan boy should take up arms and...do something about it!

Jar jar isn't absurd

Midichlorians are absurd

Those are absurd too, but Jar Jar is worse.

Jar Jar played a dumb minor character for one movie. Him being canon hardly matters at all.

Midichorians turned the magic and wonder of the force into dumb biology bullshit. The movies and EU have to use midichorians for all future projects.

Midichlorians are far worse.

Two movies, actually.

It is science fiction. There was eventually going to come a point where the Force had to be described.

#31 Edited by KHAndAnime (13167 posts) -

@airshocker said:

Two movies, actually.

It is science fiction. There was eventually going to come a point where the Force had to be described.

Star Wars isn't considered traditional sci-fi. It is more akin to a fantasy (in space). Nothing was described in Star Wars movies up til that point - most of the details are all from the EU.

#32 Edited by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

I don't think there ever had to a point where it had to be described. I'm willing to stake my life on that belief

#33 Posted by airshocker (28327 posts) -

Air join the side of good

I am on the side of good...just not too good. Which is why I use a yellow lightsaber crystal.

#34 Posted by JangoWuzHere (15930 posts) -

@JangoWuzHere said:

@airshocker said:

@JangoWuzHere said:

@airshocker said:

@dave123321 said:

As I said, the eu is too expansive and unwieldy to be beholden to. For creativitys sake, let the new films soar

But what we're saying now is that Jar Jar Binks is canon! That's absurd and every Star Wars fan boy should take up arms and...do something about it!

Jar jar isn't absurd

Midichlorians are absurd

Those are absurd too, but Jar Jar is worse.

Jar Jar played a dumb minor character for one movie. Him being canon hardly matters at all.

Midichorians turned the magic and wonder of the force into dumb biology bullshit. The movies and EU have to use midichorians for all future projects.

Midichlorians are far worse.

Two movies, actually.

It is science fiction. There was eventually going to come a point where the Force had to be described.

He's only on screen for like one minute in episode 2, and he isn't annoying like in the first film.

Star Wars is science fantasy. The force was cooler when it was a mystery to everyone.

#35 Posted by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

Describing stuff is the first step to ruin

#36 Edited by dave123321 (33379 posts) -

Oh jj gave some talk about a mystery box.

Someone be a dear and post an embed of it

#37 Edited by FelipeInside (25049 posts) -

The problem is that the expanded universe has become so big, so complex that it would be crazy to try to tie everything to it.

#38 Edited by Korvus (2450 posts) -

It seems like the obvious move, to be honest. I thought everybody would be expecting this to be the case?

#39 Posted by sukraj (21641 posts) -
#40 Edited by airshocker (28327 posts) -
#41 Posted by Crypt_mx (3943 posts) -

Honestly, as a huge Star Wars fan I am glad they are doing it this way. I agree with the above posters, the EU is too hit and miss to be crafted into a truly epic movie. It also encompasses too much overall, and would be impossible to properly cover. By making the movies adaptations of the books they take too many risks, they have to pack in so much information and please so many hardcore fans of the novels, all while JJ tries to put his creative spin on it. It would be a complete and total mess, I for one am happy the EU is being re-written to give everyone more freedom.

#43 Posted by Serraph105 (27580 posts) -

Sorry to hear that. Don't get me wrong I'm not well read on the expanded universe of Star Wars, but I could imagine how pissed I would be if say the Silmarillion (aka the bible of LOTRs) was suddenly declared have no bearing on the trilogy.

The good news is fans can decide that the movies Disney comes out with are only relevant in some alternative universe, but then again that makes them all the more difficult to look forward to.

#44 Posted by thegerg (14414 posts) -

I don't care.

#45 Posted by speedfreak48t5p (6215 posts) -
#46 Edited by Boddicker (2279 posts) -

The eu is too unwieldy

Agreed.

It had become bloated beyond belief. It would only confuse the average movie goer.

#47 Edited by MrGeezer (55942 posts) -

Sorry to hear that. Don't get me wrong I'm not well read on the expanded universe of Star Wars, but I could imagine how pissed I would be if say the Silmarillion (aka the bible of LOTRs) was suddenly declared have no bearing on the trilogy.

The good news is fans can decide that the movies Disney comes out with are only relevant in some alternative universe, but then again that makes them all the more difficult to look forward to.

I don't think that's a good comparison. The Silmarillion was written by one guy, who was also the same author of the trilogy. By contrast the Star Wars EU was written by a shitload of different writers and Star Wars isn't their creation.

One is like the "bible" of the universe laid out by the original creator. The other is essentially fan fiction written by whoever wants to take a stab at it.

#48 Edited by AmazonTreeBoa (16480 posts) -

I couldn't care less. Never got into Star Wars other than watching the movies. I always liked Star Trek more.

#49 Edited by foxhound_fox (86960 posts) -

Pre-prequel EU I can understand, that was hit-and-miss... but the X-Wing series and the Yuuzhan Vong War? You can't be fucking kidding me. Instead of putting in the effort to maintain the established continuity, they just throw it out and start "fresh". Yeah, good way to keep fans around. Now I'm legitimately thinking of not seeing the new Star Wars films. The EU has been a part of my life ever since I first got into Star Wars in 1997/1998... I couldn't imagine the feeling of betrayal people who have been with it for 35 years are feeling right now.

#50 Posted by Behardy24 (2374 posts) -

Never read much of the EU. But since this news, I have been intrigued to read some graphic novels of the EU.