A question about WW2 I been wondering.

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#1 Posted by LegitGamer3212 (1619 posts) -

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

#2 Posted by jim_shorts (7320 posts) -

Nuclear weapons weren't developed until later, during the Manhattan Project.

#3 Posted by Mafiree (3704 posts) -
US didn't have nukes then......
#4 Posted by muller39 (14944 posts) -

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

LegitGamer3212
From what I remember off the top of my head the US placed an embargo on Japan and wouldn't allow them to trade their goods and services with them. This put Japan into distress as being an island nation they needed to import much of their goods to sustain, Japan was desperate and attacked the US when they were unaware.
#5 Posted by brickdoctor (9746 posts) -

They attacked because we embargoed them for the Massacare at Nanking. And no one knew about nukes at the time, they weren't even developed yet. And if the mentality of "They have nukes, we don't, let's not fight" worked, Korea and Vietnam would've been over before they started.

#6 Posted by KC_Hokie (16099 posts) -
Took the entire war to develop the atomic bomb. It was called the Manhattan Project.
#7 Posted by KC_Hokie (16099 posts) -

[QUOTE="LegitGamer3212"]

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

muller39

From what I remember off the top of my head the US placed an embargo on Japan and wouldn't allow them to trade their goods and services with them. This put Japan into distress as being an island nation they needed to import much of their goods to sustain, Japan was desperate and attacked the US when they were unaware.

Yup...and the embargo included oil. Back then the U.S. was the equivalent of OPEC and Japan got 80% of their oil from the U.S.

If OPEC and most other oil producing countries cut us off we would likely go to war as well. FDR picked a fight in order to get into WW2 since he wanted to help the Brits in Europe.

#8 Posted by Cyanide4Suicid3 (733 posts) -
1) When Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, the atom bomb hadnt been invented yet. That didnt take place untill the Manhattan Project, in 1945. 2) The U.S kept it secret, until they were done making the bomb. We warned Japan that if they didnt surrender, we would bomb Hiroshima, but they didnt listen and unfortunately, thousands of innocent civilians paid the price for it.
#9 Posted by lordreaven (7236 posts) -

[QUOTE="muller39"][QUOTE="LegitGamer3212"]

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

KC_Hokie

From what I remember off the top of my head the US placed an embargo on Japan and wouldn't allow them to trade their goods and services with them. This put Japan into distress as being an island nation they needed to import much of their goods to sustain, Japan was desperate and attacked the US when they were unaware.

Yup...and the embargo included oil. Back then the U.S. was the equivalent of OPEC and Japan got 80% of their oil from the U.S.

If OPEC and most other oil producing countries cut us off we would likely go to war as well. FDR picked a fight in order to get into WW2 since he wanted to help the Brits in Europe.

^Pretty much. The Embargo really screwed the Japanese.
#10 Posted by coolbeans90 (21305 posts) -

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

LegitGamer3212

BAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

#11 Posted by coolbeans90 (21305 posts) -

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

[QUOTE="muller39"] From what I remember off the top of my head the US placed an embargo on Japan and wouldn't allow them to trade their goods and services with them. This put Japan into distress as being an island nation they needed to import much of their goods to sustain, Japan was desperate and attacked the US when they were unaware.lordreaven

Yup...and the embargo included oil. Back then the U.S. was the equivalent of OPEC and Japan got 80% of their oil from the U.S.

If OPEC and most other oil producing countries cut us off we would likely go to war as well. FDR picked a fight in order to get into WW2 since he wanted to help the Brits in Europe.

^Pretty much. The Embargo really screwed the Japanese.

They kinda asked for it, though.

#12 Posted by gameofthering (10422 posts) -

I was reading in the paper this morning that many young people don't know much about the wars :(

Do they not talk about them in school much now?

#13 Posted by C2N2 (759 posts) -

US-Japan Relations were like this after 1938:

- Japan had invaded Manchuria, China, Korea.

- US attempting to avoid war in Pacific, focus on Europe (secretly meeting with UK+Canada to discuss plans for defeating Germany, Rainbow 5/ABC-1/Europe First).

- US cut off sale of scrap metal to Japan (vital in maintaining the production of their war machines/navy), cut of sale of petroleum (most of Japan's oil prior to the war came from production on the US West Coast), and put in place economic sanctions to deter further economic ties between the two.

- US just trying to distance itself from Japan, Japan sees it as an economic attack. Trying to establish an autarky (a self sufficient state independent of foreign involvement) (want to unit all of Asia under Japan and separate it from the world to rely on themselves).

- Japan needs oil. Dutch East Indies the answer. What's in the way of the Dutch East Indies? Philippines... Who controls the Philippines during WW2? USA.

- Japan realizes if they want to take the East Indies for oil they need to take the Philippines as well, the December 1941 attack is an attack everywhere... Pearl, other territories, Philippines, East Indies, other EU colonial holdings in the Pacific, all at once. They hope to take all of the territory, knock out the US Pacific Fleet (which is the only thing that could challenge their plans) and move on.

- Unfortunately for Japan they didn't strike a decisive enough blow to the US Pacific Fleet, and it was easily repaired/replaced/upgraded in the aftermath... Not to mention the US had always planned for war with Japan and keels had been laid down in 1938/1939/1940 that were becoming complete in 1942 adding dozens of new ships to the US fleet.

- Then Japan didn't see the war going as it did, many early battles were equally deadly to both the US/Japan with large casualties/material loss on both sides, but Japan couldn't maintain that loss/replace it, while the US not only maintained it, but replaced lost men and materials faster than they were lost.

- This is why battles like Midway destroyed Japan, they simply couldn't afford to lose 3 heavy carriers because they were incapable of replacing them.

- Nukes weren't known about(by Japan that is, the Manhattan project was years in the making by then)/used until 1945. And even then there were only two (the US threatened to use more after Hiroshima/Nagasaki, but didn't have them).

#14 Posted by sherman-tank1 (8185 posts) -

I was reading in the paper this morning that many young people don't know much about the wars :(

Do they not talk about them in school much now?

gameofthering

They are talked about, but most students don't see the point in History anymore.

#15 Posted by lordreaven (7236 posts) -

[QUOTE="lordreaven"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Yup...and the embargo included oil. Back then the U.S. was the equivalent of OPEC and Japan got 80% of their oil from the U.S.

If OPEC and most other oil producing countries cut us off we would likely go to war as well. FDR picked a fight in order to get into WW2 since he wanted to help the Brits in Europe.

coolbeans90

^Pretty much. The Embargo really screwed the Japanese.

They kinda asked for it, though.

That they did.
#16 Posted by wis3boi (31816 posts) -

I was reading in the paper this morning that many young people don't know much about the wars :(

Do they not talk about them in school much now?

gameofthering

very little. They speak broadly, not in detail. I will be honest and say that WW2 video games got me interested in the 30s and 40s and my ww2 knowledge comes from the games and my own research. I went out of my way to take a ww2 history course in college taught from the german perspective (since teaching it from the victor's side is all most courses do) and it was fascinating. Even spoke to some veterans and a holocaust survivor from the Netherlands who took arms as a civilian teenager and rescued some jews

#17 Posted by jun_aka_pekto (16988 posts) -

I was reading in the paper this morning that many young people don't know much about the wars :(

Do they not talk about them in school much now?

gameofthering

That's a shame with kids nowadays. When I was a kid, I already went through many of my dad's history stuff (such as Reminiscenses: MacArthur's memoirs, the Indian Wars, etc) by the 4th grade.

#18 Posted by Pittfan666 (8534 posts) -
Man I thought my knowledge regarding US history was bad...
#19 Posted by Netherscourge (16330 posts) -

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

LegitGamer3212

Nobody had nukes in 1941.

#20 Posted by leviathan91 (7763 posts) -

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

LegitGamer3212

No but both sides were researching extensively into nuclear weaponry. It's just the United States got to there first thanks to the scientists of the Manhatten Project. Also, if Japan knew the United States had nuclear weapons, they wouldn't have attacked.

#21 Posted by leviathan91 (7763 posts) -

[QUOTE="gameofthering"]

I was reading in the paper this morning that many young people don't know much about the wars :(

Do they not talk about them in school much now?

jun_aka_pekto

That's a shame with kids nowadays. When I was a kid, I already went through many of my dad's history stuff (such as Reminiscenses: MacArthur's memoirs, the Indian Wars, etc) by the 4th grade.

History isn't an important subject anymore. It's all about test scores, hoping that your kid will read and get to college to get some degree or something like that.

#22 Posted by Fightingfan (38011 posts) -
Man I thought my knowledge regarding US history was bad...Pittfan666
Most Americans can't even pass the American citizenship test, so not being able to comprehending WW2 isn't obtuse.
#23 Posted by WhiteKnight77 (12018 posts) -

[QUOTE="LegitGamer3212"]

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

leviathan91

No but both sides were researching extensively into nuclear weaponry. It's just the United States got to there first thanks to the scientists of the Manhatten Project. Also, if Japan knew the United States had nuclear weapons, they wouldn't have attacked.

Don't forget that most of those scientists came fled Nazi Germany.

#24 Posted by clyde46 (47228 posts) -

[QUOTE="LegitGamer3212"]

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

leviathan91

No but both sides were researching extensively into nuclear weaponry. It's just the United States got to there first thanks to the scientists of the Manhatten Project. Also, if Japan knew the United States had nuclear weapons, they wouldn't have attacked.

The Japanese were prepared to fight till the last man in the last street in Tokyo. It was only after the US dropped the second bomb that Japan finally saw sense. Japan was always going to attack the US. The US was looking at their advances to China.
#25 Posted by LZ71 (10324 posts) -
[QUOTE="Pittfan666"]Man I thought my knowledge regarding US history was bad...Fightingfan
Most Americans can't even pass the American citizenship test

I'm not sure if that's more of a knock against the knowledge of our students, or a knock against the knowledge the citizenship test requires.
#26 Posted by NiKva (8180 posts) -

I was reading in the paper this morning that many young people don't know much about the wars :(

Do they not talk about them in school much now?

gameofthering
Much of the history in History classes among the US are pretty watered down, mostly explaining what happened but not why.
#27 Posted by Fightingfan (38011 posts) -
[QUOTE="Fightingfan"][QUOTE="Pittfan666"]Man I thought my knowledge regarding US history was bad...LZ71
Most Americans can't even pass the American citizenship test

I'm not sure if that's more of a knock against the knowledge of our students, or a knock against the knowledge the citizenship test requires.

It's a bit of both, but I would say it leans more towards America's education. There's no excuse for an American to not be able to recognize all 50 states(silhouette) and name their capital when Pablo who walked across the Rio Grande has to know to get permanent citizenship.
#28 Posted by LaytonsCat (3652 posts) -

Its worth adding that during the war both the germans and russians were fast at work on nukes as well

#29 Posted by LZ71 (10324 posts) -
[QUOTE="Fightingfan"][QUOTE="LZ71"][QUOTE="Fightingfan"] Most Americans can't even pass the American citizenship test

I'm not sure if that's more of a knock against the knowledge of our students, or a knock against the knowledge the citizenship test requires.

It's a bit of both, but I would say it leans more towards America's education. There's no excuse for an American to not be able to recognize all 50 states(silhouette) and name their capital when Pablo who walked across the Rio Grande has to know to get permanent citizenship.

Oh, I definitely agree. The history education students receive here, unless they take more advanced, is mediocre at best. I was just pointing out that the citizenship test isn't the greatest indicator for how knowledgeable our students are about history, as it's pretty ridiculous (from what I remember).
#30 Posted by Wasdie (50482 posts) -

[QUOTE="Fightingfan"][QUOTE="Pittfan666"]Man I thought my knowledge regarding US history was bad...LZ71
Most Americans can't even pass the American citizenship test

I'm not sure if that's more of a knock against the knowledge of our students, or a knock against the knowledge the citizenship test requires.

The citizen test is kind of a joke. A night of cramming and any competent person could pass it.It's worded in such a way to be tested on. Most citizens with any understanding of our government could pass it fine after a little study to get the wording right.

It's not information that you need for daily living in this country so it's not something that people out of school are going to bother with and could recall on a moments notice.

Anyways, the TC kind of makes me sad. So little known about history in general, I guess people really don't care.

#32 Posted by Verge_6 (20282 posts) -

computer-out-window.jpg

Once again OT, you astound me

#33 Posted by Vuurk (6258 posts) -

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

LegitGamer3212
World War 2 didn't end the Great Depression. Oh wait, what's the topic about?
#34 Posted by FutonSentinal62 (54 posts) -

Yep and the German V-2 rocket was the first long range combat ballistic long range missle. Wernher von Braun designed the rocket. He became one of the founding heads of NASA, where he would work on the saturn rockets.

#35 Posted by Lonelynight (30041 posts) -

[QUOTE="LegitGamer3212"]

I been reading up about world war 2 both online and from books at the library. So my question is why did Japan attack the U.S island of Hawaii when the U.S has nukes while Japan didn't. That's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Did Japan not know the U.S had nukes or something?

coolbeans90

BAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

#36 Posted by Lonelynight (30041 posts) -

computer-out-window.jpg

Once again OT, you astound me

Verge_6
what's wrong with the replies?
#37 Posted by Barbariser (6761 posts) -

The U.S. didn't have nukes in 1942, and even if they did and the Japanese knew it, Imperial Japan was by far the craziest, most bloodthirsty and most trigger-happy belligerent n the war.

#38 Posted by Stesilaus (3473 posts) -

No discussion of the US entry into World War II would be complete without mention that the Pearl Harbor attack was a "stand down operation" ...

Roosevelt wanted the attack, knew it was coming and made sure that it was allowed to happen, even going so far as to withhold relevant intelligence from Major General Walter Short and Admiral Husband Kimmel (who were later scapegoated and disgraced).

At almost 1 hour and 10 minutes in length, the following video is rather long, but it does make for fascinating viewing:

BBC: Sacrifice at Pearl Harbor (1:09:28)

This video provides a brief overview of much of the same information (3 minutes, 20 seconds).