Why Final Fantasy VI is the best game in the Final Fantasy series.... (spoilers)

  • 69 results
  • 1
  • 2

This topic is locked from further discussion.

#1 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

I have played nearly every FF game, except for IIj, IIIj, and XII (but I do know its story), so basically I played I, IV, V, VI, VII, VIII, IX, and X(and X2). I am not a old schooler who hates the newer FF's. I am looking towards XIII, especially now because they have a lead female protagonist (lightning), maybe a decent supporting male (snow), and another important female character who could steal the show (vanille). I loved the original FF, thought FFIV was great but slightly overrated (it doesn't have a coherent story, it seems Square made things up along as they went), and liked FFV. I do view FFVII as one of the most overrated, if not the most overrated, game of all time. I did find VIII, IX, and X extremly beautiful and great FF games. I also thought Lost Odyssey was an incredible game, almost matching....FFVI in storytelling and themes.

But Final Fantasy VI is truly amazing, its characters are top notch, the gameplay was great, and its themes transcends video gaming and handles serious human issues with grace and respect. I have not seen anything like what FFVI did until Lost Odyssey. Lets talk about the moments first. This game has incredible direction and has incredible moments due to the direction....the Opera Scene, Phantom Train, the Solitary Island, and the ending truly being standouts. I liked how you have this completely cool level in the Phantom Train, with a cool boss battle, but at the end, they stick one of the most heartbreaking scenes in the game to give the whole stage a meaning. The late 19th century, late 20th century vibe is uncliched and really adds to the game. The best directional move was to have the metaphysics and the lore take a backseat to the characters and to have a simple, but effective storyline.

The characters really shine in ways the other games don't compare. The standouts are the two lead characters, Terra and Celes, who are not typical cliched leads you find now in JRPG's. Terra is not a badass action hero lead, she is different. At the beginning Terra is someone who doesn't know who she is, is freigthened and needs protection, and goes wherever the wind takes her. But she is trying to learn how to be human, especially finding out what the meaning of love is. Later she does, in a motherly role, and becomes the great hero. What an uncliched stunning role for a lead heroine. Celes Chere.....her journey is similar, but different than Terra. She has to learn how to deal with her humanity, which is a difficult and tragic journey, which no other character in the series really takes. Celes is made great by her weaknesses, not her strengths. When Locke finds her, she is branded as a traitor and hopeless, struggling with the lack of humanity brought about by working with the empire. She has to learn to find hope and she does in companionship with Locke and later Terra. But Celes along the way does tragically get defeated by despair, but learns from it, finds hope, and becomes the most vital character in the defeat of Kefka. Basically Terra learns to be independant and Celes learns to be co-dependant. The other cast memmbers are incredible as well, from the Figaro brothers, to Locke, the tragic knight Cyan, and lovable and silly Relm. They have their struggles and weaknesses to overcome as well.

Kefka may be the best villain in the series, he is certainly the most wicked and ruthless. Characters like The Joker and the Riddler, Anton Chigurh (No Country For Old Men), The Judge (Blood Meridian), and Capitan Vidal (Pan's Labyrinth) come to mind. He is a personification of hatred, despair, and death. He doesn't care who he hurts, is freighteningly unperdictable, and untrustworthy. He also works for his great power. In the end (when he rules the World of Ruin), he is so evil, he enjoys watching people suffer and takes pleasure in it, for example the darkly funny line when he poisions Doma's water supply. He is definately the opposite of a Terra or Celes, who represent love and hope.

The themes transcends video games. FFVI was ahead of its time and I think still is. It was willing to explore and bring out issues other games do not address; dealing with tragic loss of a loved one, suicide, teen pregnancy, the value of family, ethics and rules of warfare, and what it means to live. I find that this game has the best non theistic explaination for the value of life (before the final battle when Kefka asks "why do you yearn live when all things must die?"). This game absolutely pulls no punches (at least the uncensored Japanese version) when it comes to death and loss. Dealing with the loss of loved ones is a major theme in the game and nrealy every character has to deal with it. The most notable are Locke (who loses his girlfriend, and never got to say goodbye) and Cyan (whos family was murdered by Kefka). Both have an extremely tough time dealing with their losses, with Cyan going as far as writing letters to the girlfriend of a solider who died, pretending to be him. Through supernatural means, they do eventually learn to cope with their loss, but death is still permanent, for example with Rachel. Celes's suicide attempt may be the most heartwrenching scene in the series. I don't think another suicide like that is done in a game. Most suicides in video games are noble heroic deaths...this attempt is anti-heroic. Celes throws herself off a cliff because she felt alone (thinking all her friends, including Locke were dead), scared, sad, and hopeless after losing the person who cared for her throughout her life, Cid. The SNES version though is butchered with its censored translation (the GBA version is no longer a "leap of faith"), the original Japanese script is far more grim. But Celes, luckily alive after the attempt, learns a valuable lesson to never give up hope when she finds Locke's bandanna on the beach. I think this is not only the most stunning scene in the game, but in the entire series. The meaning of love is also explored more maturely than any other game I have seen (except for Lost Odyssey). Love is found to be caring for someone, fighting to bring someome a better future, and being there fo rthem. This is what Terra poignantly learned at the orphanage in Mobriz and thats why she regained the ability to fight, to protect and give hope to those she loved, the children and her fellow party members (and somehow Celes develops a bond with Terra and in turn worries about her and cares for her in the final attack and ending). And boy does she answer Kefka's big question.

The soundtrack is also a standout....and considered one of the greatest if not the greatest soundtrack in video game history. You can't go wrong with Terra's Theme, Celes Theme (or the opera leitmoif, Aria Di Mezzo Cattare), or the final boss song "Dancing Mad"...sorry One Winged Angel...

While the other Fantasies are good, maybe even among the all time greats, none have the thematic bravery and the power this game has. With strong characters, effective plot, meaningful themes, and strong direction, I think I set the bar way too high for future FFs and that was the big case with VII in 1997. So I am always a little disappointed.

Those who have not played VI before (those who only played VII or later) need to play this game....you may have a new favorite soon!!!!!

#2 Posted by siLVURcross (26106 posts) -
I've finished FF1-10 and I disagree.
#3 Posted by leonklauser (187 posts) -

I like Five better.

#4 Posted by EpiphoneMan2008 (7169 posts) -
FF VII is the BEST!!!!!!!!!!!
#5 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
FF VII is the BEST!!!!!!!!!!!EpiphoneMan2008
VII is extremely overrated, especially its story and characters. Instead of telling a simple human tale, they attempt to tell a confusing scifi metaphysical one. Except for maybe Tifa and Aeris, I didn't care for the characters at all. Cloud is not a very good lead and basing the game around him brought the story down in my opinion. Barrett was basically a character who is basically a stereotype. He had good elements to him, but he was executed poorly. Sephiroth is overrated as a villain, especially after the monster in Kefka, who was also the central character of VI. Complex villians and motivations do equal good villains. The graphics have aged so poorly that IV, V, VI look better than VII. The script and the translation is bad. At least the gameplay is excellent. For V, it is a great underrated game.....job system is excellent and the characters are pretty good.....VI's are better though.
#6 Posted by jasonharris48 (21441 posts) -

I find FF: Tactics, FFVI, FFIX, FFXII to be the best FF titles because of gameplay, story and characters. FFVII is a good game but it is very overrated. The oly reason it is so big is because it came out a thte right time.

#7 Posted by ASK_Story (11455 posts) -
I like FFVI personally myself. But if FFVII was my first FF, than who knows how my opinion would be like. Usually, from what I've seen people who started with FFVII seem like they can't get into the older FFs. But to those who started with the 2D old-school FFs, than FFVI is mostly the choice.
#8 Posted by Got_to_go (2036 posts) -

You're downright obessed with this game aren't you?

It's a good game, but it's not so good that you have to constantly talk about the game as if it were some sort of religion. And on another note, Final Fantasy VII kicked ass. You need to stop comparing all these games to VI and just enjoy them individually.

#9 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
[QUOTE="Got_to_go"]

You're downright obessed with this game aren't you?

It's a good game, but it's not so good that you have to constantly talk about the game as if it were some sort of religion. And on another note, Final Fantasy VII kicked ass. You need to stop comparing all these games to VI and just enjoy them individually.

no this game is that good........whenever I do a topic of what is the best "......" in a video game.....something about FFVI is usually on top, becaus it did almost everything right. And actually, FFVI is not my favorite gameplay experience in the genre, Chrono Trigger and Seiken Densetsu 3 are..............but the narrative in this game is almost unmatched.
#10 Posted by BladesOfAthena (3938 posts) -
Well you're free to believe that FFVI is the superior game, just keep in mind that you guys are in the minority. FFVI may be superior both gameplay and graphics wise (which is debatable and is a matter of opinion), but FFVII is without a doubt superior in terms of influence, marketability, and mass appeal (which is fact).
#11 Posted by StaticPenguin (3250 posts) -

I agree. Final Fantasy VI is amazing.

#12 Posted by _Tobli_ (5733 posts) -

I have played FF 1-12 (except 11), and i do not agree.Then again my favourite is FFIX... Which can't be talked about it the way you talk about VI, but it is still my favourite game of all time.

My favourite among pre FFVII ff's is FFIV.

#13 Posted by SemiMaster (19011 posts) -

I've beaten EVERY Final Fantasy game (including XI up to Rise of the Zilart expansion material, X-2 and most of the spinoffs), and by far I'd say Final Fantasy 7 is my favorite and the best, but rather than try to prove my opinion, I'm going to counter your examples.

You cite female leads who have human flaws. What about Cecil in Final Fantasy 4? I mean he goes out and essentially murders people in the name of the King of Baron (supposedly, but you don't know that at first). He is so dragged down by duty, that he ends up killing the mother of Rydia (who herself overcomes quite some hardships). He eventually mends his ways and finds out his lofty heritage.

How about Faris from FF5. People don't even know she's a female for the most part. She is not comfortable in her own body, but eventually accepts herself as a princess and as a person.

And you might say Cloud is extra cliche, but his story played out through the Final Fantasy 7 trilogy paints him as a character of deep substance, as much as he takes an emo turn near the end.

I think the biggest weakeness though of Final Fantasy 6 is that it has TOO many characters who get lost in a sea of stories and their overall use in a party. From what I understand most primary parties end up as Sabin, Terra, Celes, Edgar and perhaps Shadow or Locke seeing as they tend to have some of the more useful secondary abilities and the fact is EVERYONE can learn ANY spell (which really detracts from their uniqueness of that cast). Hell I probably never even used Gau, Gogo, Mog, Setzer, Relm, Strago or a bunch of those guys once I don't have to. For having so many characters it seems they are ancillary at best.

I just find that many of these flaws detract from the story and gameplay, rather than enhance the overall experience.

But then again they are just opinions.

#14 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
[QUOTE="SemiMaster"]

I've beaten EVERY Final Fantasy game (including XI up to Rise of the Zilart expansion material, X-2 and most of the spinoffs), and by far I'd say Final Fantasy 7 is my favorite and the best, but rather than try to prove my opinion, I'm going to counter your examples.

You cite female leads who have human flaws. What about Cecil in Final Fantasy 4? I mean he goes out and essentially murders people in the name of the King of Baron (supposedly, but you don't know that at first). He is so dragged down by duty, that he ends up killing the mother of Rydia (who herself overcomes quite some hardships). He eventually mends his ways and finds out his lofty heritage.

How about Faris from FF5. People don't even know she's a female for the most part. She is not comfortable in her own body, but eventually accepts herself as a princess and as a person.

And you might say Cloud is extra cliche, but his story played out through the Final Fantasy 7 trilogy paints him as a character of deep substance, as much as he takes an emo turn near the end.

I think the biggest weakeness though of Final Fantasy 6 is that it has TOO many characters who get lost in a sea of stories and their overall use in a party. From what I understand most primary parties end up as Sabin, Terra, Celes, Edgar and perhaps Shadow or Locke seeing as they tend to have some of the more useful secondary abilities and the fact is EVERYONE can learn ANY spell (which really detracts from their uniqueness of that cast). Hell I probably never even used Gau, Gogo, Mog, Setzer, Relm, Strago or a bunch of those guys once I don't have to. For having so many characters it seems they are ancillary at best.

I just find that many of these flaws detract from the story and gameplay, rather than enhance the overall experience.

But then again they are just opinions.

IV and V are excellent, while IV story may be overrated, it does indeed have a great lead character...and Lenna and Faris are excellent characters in V. The problem with V is that they used the crystals plotline too many times. The developers did an excellent job with the large cast of FFVI. There is no bad characters or throwaway characters in the game, except for maybe Gogo and Umaro, who are bonus characters anyway. Even in the sea of stories, there is a common theme....love and hope. This makes the large amount of characters and stories work. While the girls, Terra and Celes, are more developed than the other characters, the others are pretty well developed. Also I use most of my party members...you have to anyway for Kefka's Tower. Relm, for example, is one deadly little girl. She has the best magic in the game, slap a Soul of Thamasa and give her 2 9999 damage ultimas. Gau is excellent if you have the right rages and Strago has some very good Lores. They are very useful. If you use them properly, all characters are great. While VI's characters can all learn spells, which is a flaw.....VII, its worse, there is basically nothing but limit breaks that give each character uniqueness in battle.
#15 Posted by pootbear (1 posts) -
WARNING POST IS FILLED WITH SPOILERS, FROM OLD FINAL FANTASY GAMES. IF ONE WISHES TO PLAY SOME OF THE OLDER GAMES OR IS IN THE MIDDLE OF PLAYING THEM, HE/SHE MUST REFRAIN FROM READING ANY FURTHER. ANYWAYS- Agreed. In my opinion, FF6 is arguably the best final fantasy game in the series. (Though I have yet to play tactics) The story line and characters were memorable. Semi Master stated in his/her post that having too many characters hindered the story. I think it enhanced it. It was great that you could play with so many characters, I mean haven't you ever played a game and thought, "man, i wish i could play so and so they seem like a cool character!" If you didn't want to play as or get all the characters, you could just choose not do the sidequests. (simple fix) SemiMaster: "I think the biggest weakeness though of Final Fantasy 6 is that it has TOO many characters who get lost in a sea of stories and their overall use in a party. From what I understand most primary parties end up as Sabin, Terra, Celes, Edgar and perhaps Shadow or Locke seeing as they tend to have some of the more useful secondary abilities and the fact is EVERYONE can learn ANY spell (which really detracts from their uniqueness of that cast). Hell I probably never even used Gau, Gogo, Mog, Setzer, Relm, Strago or a bunch of those guys once I don't have to. For having so many characters it seems they are ancillary at best." Final fantasy 6 is an rpg game. It's a game you sit down to play- for hours and hours- If you want to rush through a game or if you're not into sidequests or different storylines, then I don't know why you would play an RPG. RPG's have a lot to do with the storyline and it's characters and the roles they play. Sure everyone could use magic, but to me, that's just the icing on top of the cake. (don't forget, everyone in 7 can do magic as well when they equip materia) Characters like Edgar and Celes had some of the best moves in the game so they didn't rely on magic as much. Celes could reflect magic, and Edgar's got his amazing chainsaw and gadgets. Relm and Gogo and Gau (depending on where you released him) could learn to manipulate their enemies. Shadow with Interceptor beats Edge (FF4) any day. It first introduced moogles to the series. Hell Cyan's got the sprite equivalent of the omnislash. Hidden beneath the many different characters, are their sad and troubled tales like Cyan losing his family to the Empire, Terra's being used as a tool for the empire, Gau's father going nuts and abandoning him (and looking him in the face while leaving and Gau's crying) at the veldt after his mom died, and won't even recognize his son and talks trash about him, to the point where Gau has to stop Sabin from beating the crap out of the old guy. Of course these are all sidequests you can choose to do if you want to they aren't necessary to beat the game, but for the player's enjoyment. All in all, everything in FF6 tied in together in some way, and made sense. There was a reason you had to do something, like Celes going around the world (after Kefka kills the emporer and takes over the world for a bit) trying to bring back the resistance. 7 is so overrated it's not even funny. Don't get me wrong tho- when it first came out, the graphics were phenomenal (for it's time) and I really enjoyed the game, it's one of my favorites for the obvious reason- the bishie's. (You guys might laugh now, but watch advent children and tell me Cloud doesn't look like a ****? Honestly, I thought the first disc of FF7 was great, but the second disc lost me, and I don't know why there needed to be a 3rd disc or a fourth... (were there four discs? It's been a while) The mini-games in the arcade were kinda cool, and the fact that Aerith who was a main character and love interest passed away and there was no way to get her back no matter how many pheonix downs you use, was an interesting plot twist in the series, but that was about it really, I mean, when people talk about ff7 that's what they talk about or how good looking the guys are. There was a lot that didn't make sense in the game tho- There was a huge debate on whether or not cloud was zack's clone, and believe me, people are idiots. Tifa flat out tells you you're not a clone in the flash back dream sequence in Nibelhiem (after Tifa and Cloud fall into that lifestream) and people were still like, hmmm I wonder, is Cloud a clone? There's also the rumor circulating that you can bring Aerith back from the dead, tho that is just a fake claim from a douchebag with too much time on his hands. Don't forget, you have to wait on Tifa (who's taking care of Cloud) and Cloud so you're basically just running around town to pass the time. And the weapons? PFFFT- a gigantic waste of time! You only need to kill one or two of them who are essential to the storyline. The materia system was stupid but not as pathetic as FF8's system. (Finalfantasy 3/6 gameplay made more sense, I don't know why Square always has to change the gameplay, but I'd like to say if it ain't broke don't fix it! Though I have heard that the gameplay in Crisiscore was good ) Cloud's omnislash is a rip off of Cyan's number 8 (move) Ofcourse, Cyan is a sprite so it's hard to tell wether or not it's a total rip. Sephiroth was a prettier and more sophisticated version of Kefka who is the ultimate villain. (Really, think about it, the only thing that differentiates Sephy from Kefka was the hair and the lack of clown makeup, tho he is prone to eyeliner and nude lipstick.) If anyone did some snooping, they'd find that Kefka was actually a decent human being until the experiments with Magitek really screwed him over mentally and created the monster that we know now. (Which is a far better story than level headed Sephiroth doing a complete 180 talking about his mom and killing practically everyone in Nibelhiem after finding Jenova) And it never ceases to amaze me that you don't even get an option to use Vincent (If you happen to get him) to tell Sephiroth about Lucretia. FF 4 is pretty awesome, but the storyline was redundant as hell. Idk if it was the times or not, but it seemed like every freakin video game was doing something with crystals, and the hero was a knight, and has to save his girl from the bad guys numerous times. (Legend of Zelda much? ) And is it me or did the game jump the shark when it moved everything out to space and what's up with the whale space ship? Then there's also the cliche- Cecil, I'm your brother bit with the guy who you thought was the bad guy, but it turns out-(GASP!!!) someone else was controlling him all along!!! I don't know what to call it but CLICHE!!!! All in all, I enjoyed all 3 of these games, but as for the whole package? Out of all three? Final fantasy 6 has got the other two beat. Ofcourse Chrono Trigger just kicks the crap out of the entire final fantasy series but hey, that's just my opinion.
#16 Posted by stike22 (3401 posts) -
Well you're free to believe that FFVI is the superior game, just keep in mind that you guys are in the minority. FFVI may be superior both gameplay and graphics wise (which is debatable and is a matter of opinion), but FFVII is without a doubt superior in terms of influence, marketability, and mass appeal (which is fact).BladesOfAthena
Yep...and to be honest most FF fans tend to be quite...how to put it...fanatical, just about every FF is overrated by fans even though most of them are great games. If they believe the FF they enjoyed most is the best they will not budge an inch, as for me its down to FF7 or FF10 which in majority fans would agree that those two were the best, I say FF10 another person says FF7 I don't realy mind they were both excellent games that satisfied a hell of a lot of gamers so they are both superb. And although FF6 is constantly overshadowed by FF7 fans I remember the days when FF6 came out and it was a great game, I think a few fans forgot how much they enjoyed that game. FF4 is also one of my favs...and I forgot to get that for my DS damn...I've got to check the shop see if they still have it in stock...at a reasonable price.
#17 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

Ofcourse Chrono Trigger just kicks the crap out of the entire final fantasy series but hey, that's just my opinion. pootbear

Chrono Trigger kicks the crap out of all the final fantasy games.....................true......except for VI.

VI had a much better story, Chrono Trigger had the better gameplay and innovation.

But Seiken Densetsu 3 is the snes game I have played the most......

#18 Posted by Oilers99 (28843 posts) -

[QUOTE="pootbear"]Ofcourse Chrono Trigger just kicks the crap out of the entire final fantasy series but hey, that's just my opinion. texasgoldrush

Chrono Trigger kicks the crap out of all the final fantasy games.....................true......except for VI.

VI had a much better story, Chrono Trigger had the better gameplay and innovation.

But Seiken Densetsu 3 is the snes game I have played the most......

I'm not sure how Chrono Trigger has gained such a bright reputation. Highly polished, but very shallow gameplay. I'm not quite sure what tactical advantages one ever had by using one's brain. That, sadly, is a problem. Fortunately, it played out at almost an action game's speed, and was a mildly amusing form of entertainment... not unlike hacking in BioShock.
#19 Posted by Oilers99 (28843 posts) -
As for the suggestion of the original topic... yeah, Final Fantasy VI is up there. It's a certainly a better gameplay system than what Final Fantasy VII would offer, and VI sits with VIII and X as among my personal favourites. I'm halfway through Final Fantasy XII, and kinda digging it too, though it's a shame that this game was not as broadly liked as some of the other Final Fantasy games. I think its depth and drama are certainly solid. My reaction is much like my own to IX... I can certainly appreciate the game a lot, though it's not doing anything in particular to stick out as a personal favourite of mine.
#20 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

For me, its VI > IV > VIII = IX > V > X saga > I > XII > VII > III > II.

#21 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
[QUOTE="Oilers99"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]

Ofcourse Chrono Trigger just kicks the crap out of the entire final fantasy series but hey, that's just my opinion. pootbear

Chrono Trigger kicks the crap out of all the final fantasy games.....................true......except for VI.

VI had a much better story, Chrono Trigger had the better gameplay and innovation.

But Seiken Densetsu 3 is the snes game I have played the most......

I'm not sure how Chrono Trigger has gained such a bright reputation. Highly polished, but very shallow gameplay. I'm not quite sure what tactical advantages one ever had by using one's brain. That, sadly, is a problem. Fortunately, it played out at almost an action game's speed, and was a mildly amusing form of entertainment... not unlike hacking in BioShock.

Chrono Trigger had boss battles in where if you attempt to fight regularly, you'd be destroyed, for example Ozzie. Chrono Trigger in my view has the best gameplay for a JRPG and Seiken Densetsu 3 has the best gameplay for an action JRPG.
#22 Posted by Vinolence (128 posts) -
I am completely serious when I say the following: Final Fantasy VI is not that much better than other games in the series. You're just a huge, huge fanboy. The "themes" don't "transcend video games" (???) more than any other game in the series. Sorry to break it to you.
#23 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
I am completely serious when I say the following: Final Fantasy VI is not that much better than other games in the series. You're just a huge, huge fanboy. The "themes" don't "transcend video games" (???) more than any other game in the series. Sorry to break it to you.Vinolence
but it does..... No game in the series takes on the issue of a loss of a loved one like VI........sure Aeris's death in VII, as well as parts of II, IV and XII do, not to the extent of VI. Every major character (except for maybe Celes if you choose to save Cid) has to deal with a loss of a loved one or someone important in the game (or abandonment by someone with regards to Gau and Relm). And the game doesn't bring them back. This game also deals with family issues and the true meaning of love...something other games in the series doesn't really do. The character of Terra at the end transcends video games with her role as a mother.....usually heroines in video games are sexed up ass kickers. Terra also has no hatred in her heart even after the horrible things done to her...something I don't see in other video game characters. Then there is Celes............. Sure there are other games whose themes transcend video games..........Lost Odyssey for example, especially with its "Thousand Years of Dreams". But I do not see other games in the FF series doing it. Western RPG's are doing it better, the Witcher and Mass Effect for example.
#24 Posted by BladesOfAthena (3938 posts) -

[QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]Well you're free to believe that FFVI is the superior game, just keep in mind that you guys are in the minority. FFVI may be superior both gameplay and graphics wise (which is debatable and is a matter of opinion), but FFVII is without a doubt superior in terms of influence, marketability, and mass appeal (which is fact).stike22
Yep...and to be honest most FF fans tend to be quite...how to put it...fanatical, just about every FF is overrated by fans even though most of them are great games. If they believe the FF they enjoyed most is the best they will not budge an inch, as for me its down to FF7 or FF10 which in majority fans would agree that those two were the best, I say FF10 another person says FF7 I don't realy mind they were both excellent games that satisfied a hell of a lot of gamers so they are both superb. And although FF6 is constantly overshadowed by FF7 fans I remember the days when FF6 came out and it was a great game, I think a few fans forgot how much they enjoyed that game. FF4 is also one of my favs...and I forgot to get that for my DS damn...I've got to check the shop see if they still have it in stock...at a reasonable price.

They all are. Its just that FFVI fans in general can't seem to talk about how great VI is without bashing VII. At least with FFVII fans, they don't go around slamming other people's tastes in other FFs, unlike FFVI fans, who seem to have this ongoing crusade to ram their opinions down other people's throats. I don't give a **** how great people think FF VI is, its not going to change my opinion that FFVII means more to me than FFVI ever will.

Sorry, I just felt the need to vent a bit.

#25 Posted by stike22 (3401 posts) -
Haha, no worries I understand. They do tend to bash 7 a lot but at end of the day 7 touched a hell of a lot more people then 6 did, nothing they say can change that. Besides there is no reason to bash 7 it was one of the greatest JRPGs ever made as well as a definite one of the best FFs if 7 was bad, 6 must be worse...and that goes for most of the FFs as well for that matter.
#26 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

[QUOTE="stike22"][QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]Well you're free to believe that FFVI is the superior game, just keep in mind that you guys are in the minority. FFVI may be superior both gameplay and graphics wise (which is debatable and is a matter of opinion), but FFVII is without a doubt superior in terms of influence, marketability, and mass appeal (which is fact).BladesOfAthena

Yep...and to be honest most FF fans tend to be quite...how to put it...fanatical, just about every FF is overrated by fans even though most of them are great games. If they believe the FF they enjoyed most is the best they will not budge an inch, as for me its down to FF7 or FF10 which in majority fans would agree that those two were the best, I say FF10 another person says FF7 I don't realy mind they were both excellent games that satisfied a hell of a lot of gamers so they are both superb. And although FF6 is constantly overshadowed by FF7 fans I remember the days when FF6 came out and it was a great game, I think a few fans forgot how much they enjoyed that game. FF4 is also one of my favs...and I forgot to get that for my DS damn...I've got to check the shop see if they still have it in stock...at a reasonable price.

They all are. Its just that FFVI fans in general can't seem to talk about how great VI is without bashing VII. At least with FFVII fans, they don't go around slamming other people's tastes in other FFs, unlike FFVI fans, who seem to have this ongoing crusade to ram their opinions down other people's throats. I don't give a **** how great people think FF VI is, its not going to change my opinion that FFVII means more to me than FFVI ever will.

Sorry, I just felt the need to vent a bit.

The reason why VII is hammered and rightfully so, is because it is overhyped and it is not as good as people say it is. There is actually things VII does right....art style is pretty good (not my favorite as VIII, X, XII, and especially IX's are better). The corporate and environmental themes are good. The things that VII fails at is its story and characters, except for some (Tifa for example). The only real moment was Aeris's death...if it wasn't for that moment, the game would not be the same. But it isn't the only FF game to kill playable characters....II, IV, V, VI all did as well. The difference was that Aeris's death was cinematic. The story is great from the beginning until you get out of Midgar.....it just falls apart after that. Way too many metaphysical and spiritual concepts.....unlike the more humanistic VI. The later games also have this problem as well.......VIII, IX, X, and Xii's story are pretty much messes, but are saved by its characters. Sadly, VII's character cast is lackluster. Tifa is great as a best friend role and Aeris was good as a romantic interest. Cid's dreams were also convincing and Red XIII was unique. But the other cast members are not as good. Cloud is not a very good protagonist....he isn't bad.....but other FF leads are better...Cecil, Terra, Celes, Squall, Zidane, Yuna, to name a few. He just doesn't carry the game well. Barrett is also terrible, a great idea of a character, poor execution. Sephiroth is the most overrated villain ever. His motives are strange and not very believable, he lacks the threat of say Kefka or Kuja. I just find that the qualities to make Sephiroth more likeable are unconvincing. Is VII a bad game? Absolutely not, it had some greatness to it that does deserve to be praised. Is it the best game ever? NO.....Is it the best Final Fantasy ever? Nope

VII has to be compared to because of its commercial popularity, but it doesn't make it the best critically. And there are many many VII fanboys....much more than VI. Hell, there are too many X fanboys and I can hammer that game as well...maybe not as hard as VII.

A notice in my original post I don't bash VII really except for calling it overrated once, I make the case why VI is the best.......

#27 Posted by topsemag55 (19063 posts) -

I fail to see why there has to be so many topics on "why FF nn is the best". Each person has their own opinion. I happen to prefer FF VIII and FF-X. omg, you overlooked the fact that the publisher sunk $32 million into FF-X.

I have to look at the franchise realistically, however. As much as I have enjoyed them, they have limitations: chief among which is they are too linear. Square cannot make an open-ended RPG. You can't veer off very far and explore: the environment can and often does become a wall.

They need to modernize the franchise - they need to jerk themselves out of the black hole of past games. Open-ended is where RPGs are at. This is why the best RPGs are to be found on other systems. Bioware and Bethesda simply make better RPGs.

And I like FF, ok? But the first two letters mean "Role-Play", and you can't do much of that in FF. But in games like Oblivion, you can totally ignore the Main Quest, and role-play to your heart's content, which is what RPG stands for.

If you want to be an alchemist who simply collects plants, makes potions, then sells them to merchants, you can actually do that in Oblivion.

You sure as heck can't role-play in FF games. Mass Effect 2: You can use Mass Effect 1 saved games, and the story starts off with the choices you made in the first game!!

FF is aging rapidly, and they are doing little to modernize it.

Edit: and when you finish the game, if you ever start a new one, you're immediately in a "been there, done that" environment. Nothing ever changes. Every blasted playthrough is cookie-cutter.

#28 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
[QUOTE="topsemag55"]

I fail to see why there has to be so many topics on "why FF nn is the best". Each person has their own opinion. I happen to prefer FF VIII and FF-X. omg, you overlooked the fact that the publisher sunk $32 million into FF-X.

I have to look at the franchise realistically, however. As much as I have enjoyed them, they have limitations: chief among which is they are too linear. Square cannot make an open-ended RPG. You can't veer off very far and explore: the environment can and often does become a wall.

They need to modernize the franchise - they need to jerk themselves out of the black hole of past games. Open-ended is where RPGs are at. This is why the best RPGs are to be found on other systems. Bioware and Bethesda simply make better RPGs.

And I like FF, ok? But the first two letters mean "Role-Play", and you can't do much of that in FF. But in games like Oblivion, you can totally ignore the Main Quest, and role-play to your heart's content, which is what RPG stands for.

If you want to be an alchemist who simply collects plants, makes potions, then sells them to merchants, you can actually do that in Oblivion.

You sure as heck can't role-play in FF games. Mass Effect 2: You can use Mass Effect 1 saved games, and the story starts off with the choices you made in the first game!!

FF is aging rapidly, and they are doing little to modernize it.

I couldn't agree more that western RPGs are much better than JRPG's now (except for maybe Lost Odyssey and its great story). I think if XIII fails, JRPGs will fade in the US. The problem with open ended gameplay is the story does suffer. Mass Effect struck a balance between linearity and freedom. Its a linear game, but you have so many choices that affect the outcome. Bethesda is kinda too much on the open ended side...but the Fallout series is always open ended. Fallout 3 is actually more linear than Fallout and Fallout 2 though. But FFVI had moments of open endedness in the second half and so did Chrono Trigger. Seiken Densetsu 3 allowed you to play levels in your own order at some parts of the game. Legend of Mana was not linear at all. But Square has been to linear for todays RPG environment and western RPG's are starting to overtake them in US and EU popularity if they already haven't. But the best games balance linearity and freedom.....Mass Effect and the Witcher being prime examples.
#29 Posted by topsemag55 (19063 posts) -

I couldn't agree more that western RPGs are much better than JRPG's now (except for maybe Lost Odyssey and its great story). I think if XIII fails, JRPGs will fade in the US. The problem with open ended gameplay is the story does suffer. Mass Effect struck a balance between linearity and freedom. Its a linear game, but you have so many choices that affect the outcome. Bethesda is kinda too much on the open ended side...but the Fallout series is always open ended. Fallout 3 is actually more linear than Fallout and Fallout 2 though. But FFVI had moments of open endedness in the second half and so did Chrono Trigger. Seiken Densetsu 3 allowed you to play levels in your own order at some parts of the game. Legend of Mana was not linear at all. But Square has been to linear for todays RPG environment and western RPG's are starting to overtake them in US and EU popularity if they already haven't. But the best games balance linearity and freedom.....Mass Effect and the Witcher being prime examples.texasgoldrush
You left out my edit. and when you finish the game, if you ever start a new one, you're immediately in a "been there, done that" environment. Nothing ever changes. Every blasted playthrough is cookie-cutter. There is Zero Replayability -replayability is the hallmark of a true RPG.

#30 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] I couldn't agree more that western RPGs are much better than JRPG's now (except for maybe Lost Odyssey and its great story). I think if XIII fails, JRPGs will fade in the US. The problem with open ended gameplay is the story does suffer. Mass Effect struck a balance between linearity and freedom. Its a linear game, but you have so many choices that affect the outcome. Bethesda is kinda too much on the open ended side...but the Fallout series is always open ended. Fallout 3 is actually more linear than Fallout and Fallout 2 though. But FFVI had moments of open endedness in the second half and so did Chrono Trigger. Seiken Densetsu 3 allowed you to play levels in your own order at some parts of the game. Legend of Mana was not linear at all. But Square has been to linear for todays RPG environment and western RPG's are starting to overtake them in US and EU popularity if they already haven't. But the best games balance linearity and freedom.....Mass Effect and the Witcher being prime examples.topsemag55

You left out my edit. and when you finish the game, if you ever start a new one, you're immediately in a "been there, done that" environment. Nothing ever changes. Every blasted playthrough is cookie-cutter. There is Zero Replayability -replayability is the hallmark of a true RPG.

Not all.............Seiken Densetsu 3 is an example....there is actually three storylines with six characters, three final dungeons and bosses, as well as villain sets. Also you can develop a character in 4 different ways. That game is extremely replayable. I actually didn't get everything the first time through FF VI....I missed things like seeing Gau reunite with his father or bringing Terra to the ancient Castle. Its not as replayable a say Mass Effect...but this is one of the cases where the story is so good, I replay it again. Not immediately, but after a couple years. But non replayabilty is indeed the JRPG weakness........as good as Lost Odyssey was, I won't replay that game again.
#31 Posted by topsemag55 (19063 posts) -

Well I for one would love to see the FF franchise revitalized. They could work wonders, and the entire gaming industry would be stood on its head, if Square announced the first-ever open-ended FF that had the same amount of explorable area as Oblivion.

I've got 70 Mods running in Oblivion. Some of them add extra dimensions you can travel to. One takes you to the astral plane. Another takes you to a dark land not unlike Oblivion itself, yet completely different, and populated with different creatures.

You can have as many as 255 mods in Oblivion, albeit it would be a nightmare to properly load-order them correctly. You have a utility that takes the scripts from Oblivion and extends them so you can implement better systems. I installed just one such mod, and that single mod changed the Stat and Skill progression from 1-100 to 1-200. Instead of having to sleep to level-up, you can now level-up even in the middle of melee combat.

Comparing the two games is like looking at the difference between the Stone Age and interstellar travel.

#33 Posted by calvinsora (7043 posts) -

[QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]

[QUOTE="stike22"] Yep...and to be honest most FF fans tend to be quite...how to put it...fanatical, just about every FF is overrated by fans even though most of them are great games. If they believe the FF they enjoyed most is the best they will not budge an inch, as for me its down to FF7 or FF10 which in majority fans would agree that those two were the best, I say FF10 another person says FF7 I don't realy mind they were both excellent games that satisfied a hell of a lot of gamers so they are both superb. And although FF6 is constantly overshadowed by FF7 fans I remember the days when FF6 came out and it was a great game, I think a few fans forgot how much they enjoyed that game. FF4 is also one of my favs...and I forgot to get that for my DS damn...I've got to check the shop see if they still have it in stock...at a reasonable price.texasgoldrush

They all are. Its just that FFVI fans in general can't seem to talk about how great VI is without bashing VII. At least with FFVII fans, they don't go around slamming other people's tastes in other FFs, unlike FFVI fans, who seem to have this ongoing crusade to ram their opinions down other people's throats. I don't give a **** how great people think FF VI is, its not going to change my opinion that FFVII means more to me than FFVI ever will.

Sorry, I just felt the need to vent a bit.

The reason why VII is hammered and rightfully so, is because it is overhyped and it is not as good as people say it is. There is actually things VII does right....art style is pretty good (not my favorite as VIII, X, XII, and especially IX's are better). The corporate and environmental themes are good. The things that VII fails at is its story and characters, except for some (Tifa for example). The only real moment was Aeris's death...if it wasn't for that moment, the game would not be the same. But it isn't the only FF game to kill playable characters....II, IV, V, VI all did as well. The difference was that Aeris's death was cinematic. The story is great from the beginning until you get out of Midgar.....it just falls apart after that. Way too many metaphysical and spiritual concepts.....unlike the more humanistic VI. The later games also have this problem as well.......VIII, IX, X, and Xii's story are pretty much messes, but are saved by its characters. Sadly, VII's character cast is lackluster. Tifa is great as a best friend role and Aeris was good as a romantic interest. Cid's dreams were also convincing and Red XIII was unique. But the other cast members are not as good. Cloud is not a very good protagonist....he isn't bad.....but other FF leads are better...Cecil, Terra, Celes, Squall, Zidane, Yuna, to name a few. He just doesn't carry the game well. Barrett is also terrible, a great idea of a character, poor execution. Sephiroth is the most overrated villain ever. His motives are strange and not very believable, he lacks the threat of say Kefka or Kuja. I just find that the qualities to make Sephiroth more likeable are unconvincing. Is VII a bad game? Absolutely not, it had some greatness to it that does deserve to be praised. Is it the best game ever? NO.....Is it the best Final Fantasy ever? Nope

VII has to be compared to because of its commercial popularity, but it doesn't make it the best critically. And there are many many VII fanboys....much more than VI. Hell, there are too many X fanboys and I can hammer that game as well...maybe not as hard as VII.

A notice in my original post I don't bash VII really except for calling it overrated once, I make the case why VI is the best.......

If someone enjoys FFVII more than the other FF's, then that is fact for them. You can't say a game is overrated if a person's opinion of a game is truly what they think of it. If someone says it is their favorite game, then it is. Simple as that. You can't say that the game is overrated simply because you don't like it as muchas the other FF's. For instance, I really like FFX's story, and even more FFXII's story. It's well-constructed and political, but the point is, that it is my opinion. In the same way, FFX is my favorite, FFVII is my cousin's favourite and FFVI is your favourite. Bashing other games by saying their are inferior in your opinion is exactly the same thingother "fanboys" do. Also, even though I don't prefer FFVII much, Sephiroth is my favorite villain of all time. By saying Sephiroth is overrated, are you saying I'm wrong in my opinion? It just doesn't work that way. Sorry if I'm coming off rude, I don't mean it that way. Just stating my opinions.

To sum it up, to each his own.

#34 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]

[QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]

They all are. Its just that FFVI fans in general can't seem to talk about how great VI is without bashing VII. At least with FFVII fans, they don't go around slamming other people's tastes in other FFs, unlike FFVI fans, who seem to have this ongoing crusade to ram their opinions down other people's throats. I don't give a **** how great people think FF VI is, its not going to change my opinion that FFVII means more to me than FFVI ever will.

Sorry, I just felt the need to vent a bit.

calvinsora

The reason why VII is hammered and rightfully so, is because it is overhyped and it is not as good as people say it is. There is actually things VII does right....art style is pretty good (not my favorite as VIII, X, XII, and especially IX's are better). The corporate and environmental themes are good. The things that VII fails at is its story and characters, except for some (Tifa for example). The only real moment was Aeris's death...if it wasn't for that moment, the game would not be the same. But it isn't the only FF game to kill playable characters....II, IV, V, VI all did as well. The difference was that Aeris's death was cinematic. The story is great from the beginning until you get out of Midgar.....it just falls apart after that. Way too many metaphysical and spiritual concepts.....unlike the more humanistic VI. The later games also have this problem as well.......VIII, IX, X, and Xii's story are pretty much messes, but are saved by its characters. Sadly, VII's character cast is lackluster. Tifa is great as a best friend role and Aeris was good as a romantic interest. Cid's dreams were also convincing and Red XIII was unique. But the other cast members are not as good. Cloud is not a very good protagonist....he isn't bad.....but other FF leads are better...Cecil, Terra, Celes, Squall, Zidane, Yuna, to name a few. He just doesn't carry the game well. Barrett is also terrible, a great idea of a character, poor execution. Sephiroth is the most overrated villain ever. His motives are strange and not very believable, he lacks the threat of say Kefka or Kuja. I just find that the qualities to make Sephiroth more likeable are unconvincing. Is VII a bad game? Absolutely not, it had some greatness to it that does deserve to be praised. Is it the best game ever? NO.....Is it the best Final Fantasy ever? Nope

VII has to be compared to because of its commercial popularity, but it doesn't make it the best critically. And there are many many VII fanboys....much more than VI. Hell, there are too many X fanboys and I can hammer that game as well...maybe not as hard as VII.

A notice in my original post I don't bash VII really except for calling it overrated once, I make the case why VI is the best.......

If someone enjoys FFVII more than the other FF's, then that is fact for them. You can't say a game is overrated if a person's opinion of a game is truly what they think of it. If someone says it is their favorite game, then it is. Simple as that. You can't say that the game is overrated simply because you don't like it as muchas the other FF's. For instance, I really like FFX's story, and even more FFXII's story. It's well-constructed and political, but the point is, that it is my opinion. In the same way, FFX is my favorite, FFVII is my cousin's favourite and FFVI is your favourite. Bashing other games by saying their are inferior in your opinion is exactly the same thingother "fanboys" do. Also, even though I don't prefer FFVII much, Sephiroth is my favorite villain of all time. By saying Sephiroth is overrated, are you saying I'm wrong in my opinion? It just doesn't work that way. Sorry if I'm coming off rude, I don't mean it that way. Just stating my opinions.

To sum it up, to each his own.

Yes you can say that it is overrated.......and the point of the debate is saying that the other opinions are wrong. With so many people saying it is the best thing ever, there will be backlash, and I happen to be part of the backlash against VII. It is a good game, no doubt, but it isn't best game of all time or the best RPG of all time, or even the best FF of all time. Halo 3 and the GTA series has this backlash too.....because they are overrated. Ocarina of Time and Super Mario 64 do not have backlash, or very much of it, why? Because they are truely worth their praise. But FFVII does have this backlash, so does the Halo series, and even Fallout 3, which I love. But I can see why people think its overrated, and I think it is too a little.

Overrated does not equal suck either.......I think Sephiroth is overrated, but he is better than most video game villains. But against say Kefka, or Kuja....no way.

#35 Posted by blooddog28 (2049 posts) -
not for me I can't figure out how to do blitz!!! I press right, left, right then A and it says I errored!
#36 Posted by stike22 (3401 posts) -
not for me I can't figure out how to do blitz!!! I press right, left, right then A and it says I errored!blooddog28
Oh god yeh forgot about blitz, there are a bunch of different combinations I think you can get them all in an IGN walkthrough.
#37 Posted by ChrisSpartan117 (4519 posts) -

Haha, no worries I understand. They do tend to bash 7 a lot but at end of the day 7 touched a hell of a lot more people then 6 did, nothing they say can change that. Besides there is no reason to bash 7 it was one of the greatest JRPGs ever made as well as a definite one of the best FFs if 7 was bad, 6 must be worse...and that goes for most of the FFs as well for that matter.stike22
Actually, 7's popularity had nothing to do with its content. It had to do with Sony going all out with the advertising. They saw the game and realized it could be used as a weapon against the Nintendo 64, so they did everything they could to hype the game up, and I mean everything.

#38 Posted by ChrisSpartan117 (4519 posts) -

I fail to see why there has to be so many topics on "why FF nn is the best". Each person has their own opinion. I happen to prefer FF VIII and FF-X. omg, you overlooked the fact that the publisher sunk $32 million into FF-X.

I have to look at the franchise realistically, however. As much as I have enjoyed them, they have limitations: chief among which is they are too linear. Square cannot make an open-ended RPG. You can't veer off very far and explore: the environment can and often does become a wall.

They need to modernize the franchise - they need to jerk themselves out of the black hole of past games. Open-ended is where RPGs are at. This is why the best RPGs are to be found on other systems. Bioware and Bethesda simply make better RPGs.

And I like FF, ok? But the first two letters mean "Role-Play", and you can't do much of that in FF. But in games like Oblivion, you can totally ignore the Main Quest, and role-play to your heart's content, which is what RPG stands for.

If you want to be an alchemist who simply collects plants, makes potions, then sells them to merchants, you can actually do that in Oblivion.

You sure as heck can't role-play in FF games. Mass Effect 2: You can use Mass Effect 1 saved games, and the story starts off with the choices you made in the first game!!

FF is aging rapidly, and they are doing little to modernize it.

Edit: and when you finish the game, if you ever start a new one, you're immediately in a "been there, done that" environment. Nothing ever changes. Every blasted playthrough is cookie-cutter.

topsemag55

I can't agree more. If Final Fantasy 13 flops, the JRPG will fall to the WRPG. When you see today's JRPG market, Final Fantasy has now gone from being the trend-starter to the last resort. However, as you might have expected, it's never going to die out completely, because Japan loves those games to death. When you consider consoles fly off shelves there just because a new Monster Hunter or Dragon Quest game got released for those consoles, you can see how much they love their RPGs.

#39 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
not for me I can't figure out how to do blitz!!! I press right, left, right then A and it says I errored!blooddog28
its left right left A......
#40 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -

[QUOTE="topsemag55"]

I fail to see why there has to be so many topics on "why FF nn is the best". Each person has their own opinion. I happen to prefer FF VIII and FF-X. omg, you overlooked the fact that the publisher sunk $32 million into FF-X.

I have to look at the franchise realistically, however. As much as I have enjoyed them, they have limitations: chief among which is they are too linear. Square cannot make an open-ended RPG. You can't veer off very far and explore: the environment can and often does become a wall.

They need to modernize the franchise - they need to jerk themselves out of the black hole of past games. Open-ended is where RPGs are at. This is why the best RPGs are to be found on other systems. Bioware and Bethesda simply make better RPGs.

And I like FF, ok? But the first two letters mean "Role-Play", and you can't do much of that in FF. But in games like Oblivion, you can totally ignore the Main Quest, and role-play to your heart's content, which is what RPG stands for.

If you want to be an alchemist who simply collects plants, makes potions, then sells them to merchants, you can actually do that in Oblivion.

You sure as heck can't role-play in FF games. Mass Effect 2: You can use Mass Effect 1 saved games, and the story starts off with the choices you made in the first game!!

FF is aging rapidly, and they are doing little to modernize it.

Edit: and when you finish the game, if you ever start a new one, you're immediately in a "been there, done that" environment. Nothing ever changes. Every blasted playthrough is cookie-cutter.

ChrisSpartan117

I can't agree more. If Final Fantasy 13 flops, the JRPG will fall to the WRPG. When you see today's JRPG market, Final Fantasy has now gone from being the trend-starter to the last resort. However, as you might have expected, it's never going to die out completely, because Japan loves those games to death. When you consider consoles fly off shelves there just because a new Monster Hunter or Dragon Quest game got released for those consoles, you can see how much they love their RPGs.

From the looks of it..........we could have a Mass Effect 2 vs Final Fantasy XIII battle, with both coming early 2010.........and I would put my money on Mass Effect 2 in the US as the game that sells more.

#41 Posted by PapaSmuffs (70 posts) -

Let me start by admitting that Final Fantasy VI is one of my favorite games of all time. I played VII after I had played VI, and in all honesty I fell in love with VII just as I had done with VI. I feel that both of these FF's strengths lie in the story, the characters, the themes, and the ATMOSPHERE/music. The atmosphere that FF6 provides is totally different from the atmosphere that FF7 provides, yet both are extremely captivating. It's like comparing apples to oranges. I find them equal in their own rights but I do have to say; I found Sephiroth very lacking in cynicism compared to Kefka and was disappointed by how "unevil" he appeared to be (in comparison to Kefka). Kefka was like the Joker; he had no motives. He simply wanted to watch the world burn.

I have to add, I've been playing FF4 for the first time on DS, and it's a bore fest :( . Being from the 16 bit era, I was hoping to have a FF6 esque experience. It just seems so bland in comparison to FF6 and FF7. I just finished storming Golbez's tower in the underworld, and I find myself struggling for motivation to complete the game.

#42 Posted by stike22 (3401 posts) -

[QUOTE="stike22"]Haha, no worries I understand. They do tend to bash 7 a lot but at end of the day 7 touched a hell of a lot more people then 6 did, nothing they say can change that. Besides there is no reason to bash 7 it was one of the greatest JRPGs ever made as well as a definite one of the best FFs if 7 was bad, 6 must be worse...and that goes for most of the FFs as well for that matter.ChrisSpartan117

Actually, 7's popularity had nothing to do with its content. It had to do with Sony going all out with the advertising. They saw the game and realized it could be used as a weapon against the Nintendo 64, so they did everything they could to hype the game up, and I mean everything.

...Erm do me a favour look it up on Wiki it was originally meant to be on N64, whether anyone likes it or not it is ONE of the greatest JRPGs made and I asure you its not my favorite but facts are facts it one of the greats. Nothing anyone says changes that fact.
#43 Posted by i-rock-socks (3262 posts) -

6 is my fav too

only cause of kefka

I LOVE KEFKA

#44 Posted by i-rock-socks (3262 posts) -

[QUOTE="stike22"][QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]Well you're free to believe that FFVI is the superior game, just keep in mind that you guys are in the minority. FFVI may be superior both gameplay and graphics wise (which is debatable and is a matter of opinion), but FFVII is without a doubt superior in terms of influence, marketability, and mass appeal (which is fact).BladesOfAthena

Yep...and to be honest most FF fans tend to be quite...how to put it...fanatical, just about every FF is overrated by fans even though most of them are great games. If they believe the FF they enjoyed most is the best they will not budge an inch, as for me its down to FF7 or FF10 which in majority fans would agree that those two were the best, I say FF10 another person says FF7 I don't realy mind they were both excellent games that satisfied a hell of a lot of gamers so they are both superb. And although FF6 is constantly overshadowed by FF7 fans I remember the days when FF6 came out and it was a great game, I think a few fans forgot how much they enjoyed that game. FF4 is also one of my favs...and I forgot to get that for my DS damn...I've got to check the shop see if they still have it in stock...at a reasonable price.

They all are. Its just that FFVI fans in general can't seem to talk about how great VI is without bashing VII. At least with FFVII fans, they don't go around slamming other people's tastes in other FFs, unlike FFVI fans, who seem to have this ongoing crusade to ram their opinions down other people's throats. I don't give a **** how great people think FF VI is, its not going to change my opinion that FFVII means more to me than FFVI ever will.

Sorry, I just felt the need to vent a bit.

i like how you talk about ff6 and ff7 fans as if they are warring factions

#45 Posted by BladesOfAthena (3938 posts) -

i like how you talk about ff6 and ff7 fans as if they are warring factions

i-rock-socks

They're not?

#46 Posted by i-rock-socks (3262 posts) -

[QUOTE="i-rock-socks"]

i like how you talk about ff6 and ff7 fans as if they are warring factions

BladesOfAthena

They're not?

indeed they arent as a matter a fact FF6 is my fav FF, but i also love FF7 and have nothing but good things to say about it
#47 Posted by BladesOfAthena (3938 posts) -

[QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]

[QUOTE="i-rock-socks"]

i like how you talk about ff6 and ff7 fans as if they are warring factions

i-rock-socks

They're not?

indeed they arent as a matter a fact FF6 is my fav FF, but i also love FF7 and have nothing but good things to say about it

Well not everyone thinks like you. Believe it or not, there have been countless arguments between both sides as to which is the better game. Heck, there are even a few in this thread who have expressed disagreement with the OP.

#48 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
[QUOTE="i-rock-socks"][QUOTE="BladesOfAthena"]

[QUOTE="i-rock-socks"]

i like how you talk about ff6 and ff7 fans as if they are warring factions

They're not?

indeed they arent as a matter a fact FF6 is my fav FF, but i also love FF7 and have nothing but good things to say about it

There is always bad things.........even VI has flaws...Banon disappears from the story, the US translation was hampered by idiotic censorship (Nintendo of America's fault), fighters can learn magic (destroying some uniqueness of the characters), Ultros, while loved, seems out of place, Gau is underdeveloped, and I wished their was more of a relationship between the two main characters, Terra and Celes (its seems Celes cares for Terra alot in the end out of the blue........probably because of seeing her with the children at Mobliz). But VI's flaws are less than the other games in the series. But unlike the other games in the series....the plot holds together. The problem with JRPG's is that there game is way too long for a coherent plot. Every FF from IV on has this problem....except for VI. The best decision is making the plot only linear for half of the game....in the second half instead of linear plot progression, it is the closing of character arcs and stories, with the two heroines closed at the end. The plot never goes off its rails and stays consistant and coherent. The other games, especially from VII on, start great (I think VII indeed has the best beginning of the series), but the plot collapses later in the game, especially with metaphysical elements. VI also is more human than metaphysical, which is also a plus. Chrono Trigger avoids this as well.
#49 Posted by _Tobli_ (5733 posts) -

I have to look at the franchise realistically, however. As much as I have enjoyed them, they have limitations: chief among which is they are too linear. Square cannot make an open-ended RPG. You can't veer off very far and explore: the environment can and often does become a wall.

They need to modernize the franchise - they need to jerk themselves out of the black hole of past games. Open-ended is where RPGs are at. This is why the best RPGs are to be found on other systems. Bioware and Bethesda simply make better RPGs.

topsemag55

I would disagree... The seppuku flaw of every open ended rpg that i have ever played is that the open ended nature detracts greatly from the main story.

Bethesda? Better? :lol:

I like Bioware, but the worlds in Kotor,ME, etc have felt very static.

I think that SE should allow for more open world stuff at some point, but not right now. It would be probably be better to continue to do what they do best until cpu generated terrain tech has progressed a bit further.

Role playing.... Hmm.... It depends what you mean by roleplaying i suppose. I mean even alot of the core of those had alternatives that included pre determined paths..... To me choices usually have a negative impact on immersion.

#50 Posted by texasgoldrush (9396 posts) -
[QUOTE="_Tobli_"]

[QUOTE="topsemag55"]I have to look at the franchise realistically, however. As much as I have enjoyed them, they have limitations: chief among which is they are too linear. Square cannot make an open-ended RPG. You can't veer off very far and explore: the environment can and often does become a wall.

They need to modernize the franchise - they need to jerk themselves out of the black hole of past games. Open-ended is where RPGs are at. This is why the best RPGs are to be found on other systems. Bioware and Bethesda simply make better RPGs.

I would disagree... The seppuku flaw of every open ended rpg that i have ever played is that the open ended nature detracts greatly from the main story.

Bethesda? Better? :lol:

I like Bioware, but the worlds in Kotor,ME, etc have felt very static.

I think that SE should allow for more open world stuff at some point, but not right now. It would be probably be better to continue to do what they do best until cpu generated terrain tech has progressed a bit further.

Role playing.... Hmm.... It depends what you mean by roleplaying i suppose. I mean even alot of the core of those had alternatives that included pre determined paths..... To me choices usually have a negative impact on immersion.

Bethseda does have their last two games win the most amount of GOTY awards in the last three years......I do find Oblivion kinda overrated and Fallout 3 slightly, but they are excellent open world games. In Fallout 3, you choices can destroy whole settlements....Megaton, Tenpenny Tower, Paradise Falls, and now The Citadel. Bioware is basically breaking the JRPG......Mass Effect's world will not be static any longer.........the choices you made in the first game IMPACT THE SEQUEL!!!!!!!!!!!!! They strike a balance between choices and telling a linear story and it works. Choices, if done correctly, have a positive impact on immersion. Take Fable II, the choice I made in childhood, impacts an entire distict of a city!!!! You can even impact a whole region of Oakfield from the choice (OR LACK OF) between the Temple of Light and Shadow. WRPGs are beating the crap out of JRPG's now in the states, because JRPG's have refused to change and stick to cliches. This is what made FFVII bad for the genre. Its popularity caused everyone to copy its formula, with diminishing results. Cliched lead male hero for example......strong anime style, nonsenical stories with heavy use of metaphysical and spiritual themes. The golden age of JRPG's was truly the 16 bit era.....you have FF IV-VI, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana and its sequel, Lufia I and II, the highly underrated 7th Saga, the Soul Blazer trilogy (Soul Blazer, Illusion of Gaia, Terranigma)...these were games of top quality. But now the genre is just about dead in the US....except for FF. Look what happened to the Mana series.