Why do you like/hate Dark Souls

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#1 Posted by ACP_45 (434 posts) -

Dark Souls = Insane.

Why do you like it or why do you hate it ?

#2 Posted by iamllamapie (211 posts) -

Customization of the character, range of armours, weapons and spells and most of all, the atmosphere & music.

#3 Edited by Byshop (11664 posts) -

Tough but fair difficulty, totally unique approach to multiplayer, a "horror" game that's horror through it's gameplay mechanics rather because it has ghosts or zombies, The game's atmosphere, difficulty and consequence of action make it more "stressful" than most average, crappy "horror" themed games.

I also love that everyone follows the same "rules". Human-sized enemies deal with the same weapons and stats that you do, so you can create a powerhouse character to smash through their guard, an agile dex-based character who can do massive crit damage, etc.

-Byshop

#4 Edited by turtlethetaffer (16793 posts) -

Character customization is really deep, and the game rewards both careful play and memorization. Plus the fact that you're always a few swipes from death keeps things tense and involved at pretty much all times. That and the lore is well thought out and neat, even if most of it is mondo depressing.

Some issues I have is that the structure of the game is inherently repetitive (admit it- playing through the same level over and over can be frustrating). I see why the game is like that, but it can be annoying at times. I also wish it'd explain things like stat scaling a little better; when I first started playing, I had no idea what stat would do what. I understand the trial and error, figure it out for yourself approach but it gives the game a higher barrier to entry than it already has.

Overall a great game.

Also inb4 Lululu starts whining about RPG mechanics and how it's inherently bad and overwhelming the player and... You get it.

#5 Posted by bowchicka07 (1075 posts) -

@turtlethetaffer said:

Also inb4 Lululu starts whining about RPG mechanics and how it's inherently bad and overwhelming the player and... You get it.

#6 Posted by Evil_Saluki (4878 posts) -

I never got into it.

You got to look at it from my perspective. In cause people didn't know i'm like 30 odd now and not to sound dramatic, I grew up alongside the evolution of the games industry and I've had my share of skill games. I can't pin my finger on what I look for in a game these days, there is so many factors, but it has to have some sort of redeeming features.

What i'm saying is I've done skill, I've done graphics, I've done strategy. I'm open to all, but Dark Souls, it didn't grab me.

Maybe it's the ugly looking characters, the way I felt no connection to my character like he/she is just some husk made to battle through some levels. No story as far as I'm aware, faffy inventory, a multiplayer mechanic which is pointless as I just use U-Tube if I need a practical walk-through, being the most grey game ever invented.

Saying that I will still take a look at the follow up. I'm sure they will improve on i.

The main deciding factor i knew the game wasn't what it was cracked up to be was on the first towering hulk of a boss. I heard it's suppose to be a hard game and all so I approached it with caution. It takes a swing at me, I dodge under it's legs only to die one hit even though it's attack had failed to connect to me in any way.

#7 Posted by wiouds (5257 posts) -

I got bored with it and quite.

#8 Posted by Flubbbs (3159 posts) -

the lore of Dark Souls is just amazing. the atmosphere and music really add to the game. combat is good too

#9 Edited by Byshop (11664 posts) -
@Evil_Saluki said:

I never got into it.

You got to look at it from my perspective. In cause people didn't know i'm like 30 odd now and not to sound dramatic, I grew up alongside the evolution of the games industry and I've had my share of skill games. I can't pin my finger on what I look for in a game these days, there is so many factors, but it has to have some sort of redeeming features.

What i'm saying is I've done skill, I've done graphics, I've done strategy. I'm open to all, but Dark Souls, it didn't grab me.

Maybe it's the ugly looking characters, the way I felt no connection to my character like he/she is just some husk made to battle through some levels. No story as far as I'm aware, faffy inventory, a multiplayer mechanic which is pointless as I just use U-Tube if I need a practical walk-through, being the most grey game ever invented.

Saying that I will still take a look at the follow up. I'm sure they will improve on i.

The main deciding factor i knew the game wasn't what it was cracked up to be was on the first towering hulk of a boss. I heard it's suppose to be a hard game and all so I approached it with caution. It takes a swing at me, I dodge under it's legs only to die one hit even though it's attack had failed to connect to me in any way.

I'm 37 old, so I'm pretty sure that age is not the sole determining factor for whether or not someone enjoys this game.

-Byshop

#10 Posted by Archangel3371 (15747 posts) -

A big reason why I like the Demon/Dark Souls games is the atmosphere, it's so forboding and dark. I also really enjoy the bosses and boss fights.

#11 Posted by turtlethetaffer (16793 posts) -

@Evil_Saluki: There actually is a story in every area, as well as an overarching story. and your avatar is a definite character in that story... It's just done minimally so that basically the only way to figure it out is to study the environment and read item descriptions.

#12 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

Dark Souls is liked/hated for exact same reason.... Its Artificial Difficulty.

Easily identified in two Categories, Masochists and Normal People.

#13 Edited by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

@ turtlethetaffer

LOL ! Thats for other RPGs, Dark Souls is different and warrants its own unique bashing.

#14 Posted by Pffrbt (6565 posts) -

@Lulu_Lulu said:

Dark Souls is liked/hated for exact same reason.... Its Artificial Difficulty.

Dark Souls doesn't have artificial difficulty though.

#15 Posted by Pffrbt (6565 posts) -

@Evil_Saluki: "No story as far as I'm aware"

Dark Souls has a ton of lore and a fairly in depth story.

"a multiplayer mechanic which is pointless as I just use U-Tube if I need a practical walk-through"

It's "Youtube" and the messages you find are still helpful (and less spoilerish and more fun) regardless whether they're as in depth as a full walkthrough. There's also the coop and PVP aspects that you're ignoring.

"being the most grey game ever invented."


Wow so grey.

"The main deciding factor i knew the game wasn't what it was cracked up to be was on the first towering hulk of a boss. I heard it's suppose to be a hard game and all so I approached it with caution. It takes a swing at me, I dodge under it's legs only to die one hit even though it's attack had failed to connect to me in any way."


You're either lying or mistaken then, because none of the bosses can kill you in one hit without hitting you. What boss could you possibly even be talking about.

#16 Posted by sukraj (23060 posts) -

Its very challenging but i wouldn't have it any other way.

#17 Posted by Black_Knight_00 (18524 posts) -

I dislike anything that threatens to negate and roll back my progress.

#18 Posted by jdc6305 (3895 posts) -

Dark Souls is not hard it just has a steep learning curve. It throws you into the world and says have at it without explaining anything. Too many games now a days feel like they have to hold your hand. I'm 37 and I've finished some of the hardest games ever made. Today's games for the most part are way to easy. Today's gamer's cry if something is a challenge.

I sucked at dark souls when I first started. After playing it for an hour I went out and bought the guide. It's the first guide I bought in many years. I sat down one night and said I'm going figure this shit out. After about 8 hours it finally clicked and I started to make progress. Dark Souls turned out to be one of the most rewarding experiences I had all generation. I played nothing but Dark Souls for an entire year.

#19 Edited by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

@ Pffrbt

Dark Souls is nothing but Artificial Difficulty ! Its the embodiment of of all things annoying about gaming in the 80's. Bloated Enemy stats, Trial and Error, Cheating (Playable Characters and Baddies opperate by a different set of Rules), etc. I'l know more when I actually play The Game ! :D

#20 Posted by The_Last_Ride (72470 posts) -

Personally there shouldn't be an automatic insanely hard game where only dedicated players manage to go through the game. There should be the regular very easy, easy, etc. If people still want to play on the hardest difficultym then props to them, but making a game hard just for the sake of being hard is stupid imho. It's probably really rewarding for some, but far from everyone

#21 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

@ jdc6305

WAIT ! I'm confused. You're glad the game doesn't hold your hand but you went out and got the strategy guide anyway because ........ You...... Really ....... Want...... It ...... To ....... Hold ......... Your ......... ?

You don't have what it takes to be a true Masochist. Well come back to the world of Tutorials, Auto Aiming, and Regenerating Health ! :D

#22 Posted by ShepardCommandr (2746 posts) -

I hate it because of the frustrating trial and error difficulty

#23 Edited by iamllamapie (211 posts) -

@Lulu_Lulu said:

@ jdc6305

You don't have what it takes to be a true Masochist. Well come back to the world of Tutorials, Auto Aiming, and Regenerating Health ! :D

Doesn't Demon's/Dark Souls have Tutorials and auto aim (Lock on, same thing)?

#24 Posted by Byshop (11664 posts) -

@Black_Knight_00 said:

I dislike anything that threatens to negate and roll back my progress.

I like a game that has actual consequence. Games have gotten far too easy over the years with constant checkpoints.

-Byshop

#25 Posted by Jacanuk (4763 posts) -

@acp_45 said:

Dark Souls = Insane.

Why do you like it or why do you hate it ?

Hate is such a strong word about a game.

But i dont hate or like Dark Souls, its a pretty average game like so many other games.

but i love how some kids think they are more "hardcore" because they have played it :D

#26 Edited by ACP_45 (434 posts) -

@Lulu_Lulu: You are wrong because I love Dark Souls because of it’s Atmosphere.

Terrifying, cruel and cold.

So unique.

#27 Posted by ACP_45 (434 posts) -

@The_Last_Ride: I know what you mean...

But if you look back to the 1990s.

Games were already hard and extremely difficult sometimes.

Today, to make a game easy means that the game could be played by all ages.

Why do you think that you get more kids playing games like let’s say God of War ?

Because they’ve got an easy setting that provides gameplay for people who aren’t very skilled.

Meanwhile you’ve got 9 year olds playing Mature games.

Dark Souls feels like it was aimed at the mature player ( I’m not sure what you call them :/ ) .

You won’t find a 9 year old that often playing it.

I just think games have become way to easy.

#28 Edited by Black_Knight_00 (18524 posts) -

@Byshop said:

@Black_Knight_00 said:

I dislike anything that threatens to negate and roll back my progress.

I like a game that has actual consequence. Games have gotten far too easy over the years with constant checkpoints.

-Byshop

Maybe. I personally don't think wasting the player's time is the answer though. By "progress" in this context I mean the XP/money system in the Souls series: I have zero fun playing a game when I know it can can screw me out of my progress any second, though I know some find that stimulating. To each one his own.

#29 Posted by Renegade_Fury (17223 posts) -

I hate Dark Souls, because it's boring and slow as shit. When I play a hard game, I need an element of speed like that found in Treasure games, for example. Everything about Dark Souls feels like you're moving through mud.

#30 Edited by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

@ ACP_45

Okay..... Weird.

So no oppinion about the gameplay.

#31 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

@ iamllamapie

Was talking about the most popular complaints about games in general. Because I've never played Dark Souls.

#32 Posted by iamllamapie (211 posts) -

@Lulu_Lulu: I don't see how tutorials are worth complaining about. But yes, Dark/Demon's Souls has both tutorials and lock on mechanics

#33 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

Nice !

Now I wanna play it more. Still don't pay for it though.

#34 Edited by Byshop (11664 posts) -

@Black_Knight_00 said:

@Byshop said:

@Black_Knight_00 said:

I dislike anything that threatens to negate and roll back my progress.

I like a game that has actual consequence. Games have gotten far too easy over the years with constant checkpoints.

-Byshop

Maybe. I personally don't think wasting the player's time is the answer though. By "progress" in this context I mean the XP/money system in the Souls series: I have zero fun playing a game when I know it can can screw me out of my progress any second, though I know some find that stimulating. To each one his own.

Well, there's a distinction between difficult and punishing. A game that forces you to replay a 45 minute section due to crappy checkpoints is terrible. The "Souls" games only made you lose currency and humanity, and each of them are replacable. I liked the idea because it gave you pause and forced you to think about your next action. Wandering around in that game is actually -dangerous- because recklessness can actually cost you something.

Although yes, I have lost souls before in Dark/Demon's Souls and I've felt that sting, I never felt like the game was unnecessarily punishing. You always had a chance to get them back, plus nothing you lose is irreplacable. Hell, my PvP Dex build character has like a million souls built up from PvP sessions that I refuse to spend because I don't want to level myself out of getting good PvP matches.

Edit: Actually I -do- have something I hate about the game. I hate the lack of cheat detection in online interaction, especially in the PC version.

-Byshop

#35 Posted by Black_Knight_00 (18524 posts) -

@Byshop: Yes I know, I was talking in terms of personal taste. I personally can't play that game mostly due to that particular game mechanic. I also don't like the control style and the lack of plot, but those are all subjective issues.

#36 Edited by The_Last_Ride (72470 posts) -

@acp_45 said:

@The_Last_Ride: I know what you mean...

But if you look back to the 1990s.

Games were already hard and extremely difficult sometimes.

Today, to make a game easy means that the game could be played by all ages.

Why do you think that you get more kids playing games like let’s say God of War ?

Because they’ve got an easy setting that provides gameplay for people who aren’t very skilled.

Meanwhile you’ve got 9 year olds playing Mature games.

Dark Souls feels like it was aimed at the mature player ( I’m not sure what you call them :/ ) .

You won’t find a 9 year old that often playing it.

I just think games have become way to easy.

True, but that was because the game design was flawed back then. You can make the game easy now. But making it too easy is also an issue. There should be some sort of achievment to finish the game off course. But to make a game hard just because you can is stupid. I grew up with the SNES and gameboy. Those games were hard as balls. I am all for it as long as it's an option

#37 Posted by cyborg100000 (2858 posts) -

I love the feeling of exploration in the game. A lot of games give you an objective and a path to go down so you tend to use the environment as a tool to get from point A to B. In Dark Souls you get a vague objective, multiple paths and exploring becomes an enhanced experience because you aren't ever entirely sure where the path will take you, there's no map.

#38 Edited by Evil_Saluki (4878 posts) -

Dragons Dogma is so much better in every way.

#39 Posted by osan0 (12750 posts) -

i only played demon souls a bit (is it harder or easier than dark souls?). same kind of thing as i understand it.

i'm not a fan of the games philosophy. it seems to like punishing me. its like there is an internal sadistic AI in the game with overall control. it sees you have made some progress and then goes out of its way to knock any sense of accompishment out of the player. wouldnt want him getting any funny ideas. its tough and unfair and sadistic.

contrast that to, say, monster hunter. a tough but fair game. if you make a stupid mistake then MH will make ya pay. it has no problem lobbing half your health off in one hit. but the player learns 2 things

1) dont do that again (breaks the second rule of MH...dont get hit :P).

2) dont do that again because when monster X is doing that thing he is about to smash the crap out of you.

so there is a sense of growth in skill with MH. first time i faced a great jaggi i was nearly wiped out. now, with the same gear, i can flatten him. its a combination of learning the monster behaviour, making better use of my weapon and knowing my own characters behaviour.

demons souls: i learn to use my weapon well, i have learned the enemies behaviour, i am about to win then the sadistic AI says "not having that...one hit super power wonderkill!!! HA! look at the stupid dead player...quit now player your useless!" (im not mad :S). i can see why that would appeal though in fairness...just not for me.

i did like the art direction and atmosphere in demon souls though (performance was a bit erratic however). the character building side of the game also looked very interesting but i never got far enough where i could really explore it.

#40 Posted by Pffrbt (6565 posts) -

@Lulu_Lulu: "Dark Souls is nothing but Artificial Difficulty !"
How if there is none.

"Its the embodiment of of all things annoying about gaming in the 80's. Bloated Enemy stats, Trial and Error, Cheating"

But it has none of those. I despise those things about older games, so if any of it was actually in Dark Souls I wouldn't like it nearly so much. The only part of the game that involves cheating are of some the other players you meet online. If there's one aspect I hate about the series it's the PVP. That shit is a mess and needs to go.

#41 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (13714 posts) -

@ Pffrbt

It most definately has Bloated enemy stats.

The Bonfire saving system is frustrating. You learn by dying, Enemies don't run out of resources like you do, not even stamina, sounds like cheating to me. It uses a surviva version of a positive feed back loop. And a few other stuff I'm forgetting

#42 Posted by blangenakker (2394 posts) -

I like it because it reminds me of the old NES, SNES, Genesis games that were a challenge

I also hate it because it reminds me of the old NES, SNES, Genesis games that were a challenge

Anyone got any tips for actually damaging the giant wolf boss?

#43 Posted by Pffrbt (6565 posts) -

@Lulu_Lulu: "It most definately has Bloated enemy stats."

It doesn't though.

"The Bonfire saving system is frustrating."

How.

"You learn by dying,"

And by not dying.

"Enemies don't run out of resources like you do, not even stamina, sounds like cheating to me."

Sounds like a non-issue to me since enemies are generally much weaker than you if you're properly equiping yourself and taking advantage of the strategies you can use against them.


#44 Edited by gpuFX16 (1296 posts) -

I hate Dark Souls because of the absence of Sticky White Stuff.

...Joking aside, I love the game. Favorite of the past generation. The interconnected world gives me Metroid-ish vibes, and I enjoy any game that gives me freedom in exploration by allowing me to tackle different areas in varying order. The atmosphere is wonderfully oppressive. The story is left up to the player to uncover without too much forced exposition. Teaming up with other people to drop bosses is a thrill (for me at least.)

I don't really have much of a problem with the difficulty. Most of the time, If I failed, I have a pretty good idea of why I failed, and that gets corrected with more experience. Enemies don't run out of resources, yes, but there are easily exploitable weaknesses in enemy attack patterns to make up for that. (And surely, Dark Souls is not the only game where this happens- think of any shooter out there. Enemies never run out of ammo there.) Bosses can be staggered/stun-locked if you deal enough damage or use certain weaponry. Almost every single enemy attack in the game can be either evaded or blocked, and with the right stat investment and strategy, you can turn boss fights into jokes.

I don't agree with the game having bloated stats. If you really want to talk about bloated stats, have a look at Borderlands 2. Now there's a game with some messed up stat numbers. Enemies increase in strength per level faster than the player does, and equipment becomes sub-optimal after only a few levels in the late-game. Past level 61, tougher enemies deal damage that exceed the player's health+shield value by a factor of 2 or greater, and have health pools in the billions- literally.

#45 Edited by IndianaPwns39 (5037 posts) -

I like the challenging but fair difficulty. This is a game where I can rely on skill rather than boosting my stats to win. Playing through the entire game only leveling up a few times was insanely satisfying.

I like the lore, and how the story isn't in your face but you can piece things together if you want to look for it all. Areas, the enemies that exist within them, and the items that you find there seem random and disjointed but actually exist for a purpose. Each area/enemy/item feels like it belongs and was carefully thought out.

I like the character customization through the use of weapons, armor, and spells. Playing as a soul wielding mage feels different than a pyromancer, and using a rapier offers different strategies than a longsword. How your character changes to use these weapons with their intended function, rather than all swords making the same swing animation like in other games, really gives you character a defined combat style.

I like the multiplayer functionality which creates an unpredictability within the core game. Fighting a phantom that uses a completely different fighting style than you makes the PvP very exciting. While I'm sure Dark Souls has community issues like every other game, this is one of the only games I played in which people were civil. It was always nice to see people bow or salute after a good fight, or wave and aid their companions in a cooperative level.

I could continue, but you get the idea.

#46 Posted by IndianaPwns39 (5037 posts) -

@blangenakker said:

Anyone got any tips for actually damaging the giant wolf boss?

Sif has pretty easy attack patterns but his speed can be frustrating, especially the first time you fight him. Don't take on him head on, as he can attack quickly and chain multiple hits, which can drain even high level stamina down to almost nothing.

The best way to fight him is with patience. Keep your distance and watch his patterns. You don't necessarily have to block, even, since it's better to just stay away from his sword. He'll eventually do a vertical attack which is easy to dodge. Run to the side of the sword as he recovers and get under him and just start hacking away at his ankles.

He'll likely jump away and start the entire process again. However, if you deal enough damage to his legs he'll start to limp and when he's in that state it's actually a very, very easy (and incredibly sad, story wise) kill.

#47 Posted by Shielder7 (5152 posts) -

@acp_45 said:

Dark Souls = Insane.

Why do you like it or why do you hate it ?

Because it's a step down from Demon Souls

Poise system is retarded

The took out the thief ring.

#48 Posted by Shmiity (5151 posts) -

@IndianaPwns39: You can kill every boss by just hugging them the entire time.

#49 Edited by ristactionjakso (5742 posts) -

I like some things about it. I like the difficulty, I like exploring and finding new stuff.

But I hate the combat. It's shallow and really clunky. Just not fluid at all. Most deaths are due to the lack of a fluid combat system.

#50 Posted by Shmiity (5151 posts) -

Dark Souls has amazingly weighty gameplay. Fantastic customization. Awesome built-in, seamless side-quests and alternative stories within the game. I love all the little stats, like equipment weight, weapon weight effecting swings... I can't say enough about how good the game is.

My honest opinion is that it is one of the finest rpg/action games ever. End of post.