The MMO genre has died.

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#1 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

    First off I am going to start with a disclaimer. This post is for OG as in original gamers. I'm talking about the guys that brought home Mortal Kombat II and raved about the graphics. ( I'm aware that's not an MMO ) So if you're too young to remember those days then this is not for you. If you care to listen to the ramblings of an OG, continue on, but if you happen to have an opinion on this then kindly STFU and GTFO.

     When was the last time you've been fulfilled by a video game. I mean truely fulfilled. This is especially true for those that are fans of the MMO genre. Gone are the days when hearts and souls were poured into games, and here we're left with the days of cookie cutter nonsense. Remember when developers actually took risks when making games? Remember when a new game would arrive and you didn't know what to expect? Can you really play Rift without thinking of WoW? Can you play any MMO anymore for that matter without thinking of WoW? Why? Because all the game publishers and developers just want to copy what succeeded. How did it succeed? To the OG's, it succeeded killing the genre we loved.

      Now those are harsh words I know. "Killed" The MMO genre is far from dead, this I am aware. However, the MMOs we fell in love with are gone. What's left is a skeleton of what they were, pushed to the masses. I remember when you actually had to work to do something in MMOs. When you actually had to think about walking to the next town over without an escort. What are the penalties for dying in an MMO these days? You're armor depreciates a percentage? You have a death penalty that doesn't last 5 minutes? You have to walk all of 30 seconds to get back to your previous location?

      If you've stuck with me this long I know I've struck that cord that you've pushed far down inside you to cope with what has happened to the genre you love. It means I've weeded out the riff-raff. It also means I can finally reveal the reason this long-winded article of a post took birth. I found my self closing my Guild Wars 2 window out of disgust, not because I died or had problems with a jumping puzzle but because I felt no investment in my toon. Which is why I have 7 of them and not a single one maxed. So then I decided to open my Firefox browser and type in youtube. My first intension was to watch someone stupid get beat up, or go back to those old Kimbo videos from when we all thought he could fight, but then I began to ponder why I felt so unfulfilled. I began to wonder why I have bounced from MMO to MMO without much regard for the time or toons I left behind. Then I remembered....I thought to myself "Asheron's Call."

     Then all the memories began to flood back to me. The giant sandbox that I jumped into upon the recomendation of a friend who happened to work at EB. Yeah that's right, EB not gamestop. Electronics Boutique. Remember that place? Remember the distinct smell of the magazine rack? The piled up peripherals that were like a gold mine of videogame surprises and collectables. That's another subject but back to Asheron's call. When I first dove into that masterpiece of a MMO, I remember how lost I was. I remember feeling like a tiny insignificant blip. I also remember the first gamer that came to assist me. So I decided to look for Asheron's Call ( NOT to be mistaken for Asheron's Call 2 ) on youtube. When I did I had an intense feeling, not of nestalga but of heartache. Why? Because I realized I have not come in 1,000 miles of liking a MMO the way I did Asheron's Call since.

      There were so many things I remembered that have not been in games since! I remembered that running to the next town over took forever and was riddled with danger. I remembered I was not guided to quests it was my job to find them, but they were NOT manditory. I remembered how you could run from one end of the continent to the other. I thought about when you wanted to trade you went to a trade town and TALKED TO PEOPLE. I remembered if you saw someone being chased you would stop to help like it was your lane partner in LoL because you knew AND FELT the consequence of dying. You asked people for tips and talked while you researched spells because Asheron's Call was HARD. That difficulty lead to an enormous sense of accomplishment whenever you managed something out of the ordinary. ( I specifically remember making the giant jump for the Obsidian Dagger ) I started to remember how exciting raid dungeons were, locked in a maze trying to find the end. How about when you ran your crew over to a rivals mansion and fought on their front lawn because there was PLAYER AND GUILD HOUSING. There were so many things that I had not experienced since I left that glorious player base.

      After my flashbacks of glory subsided, I decided to see if any lesser known games had come out to rival the orignals. AC or EQ. SOMETHING. I came up short. As I think back, I now realize the genre has become lazy and geared toward the masses. I fear I may never experience the attachment I had to my toon again. I remember when I closed my account and my heart went out to my little avatar. We had been through so much. Now I erase my little imaginary personalities without a second thought. Half of the time I can't even remember their full name to type in.

#2 Posted by xWoW_Rougex (2767 posts) -

I'd recommend you to try Tibia in this case.


Also, reading articles about the upcoming ArcheAge sounds very promising http://us.gamespot.com/features/a-tale-of-two-worlds-archeage-and-the-elder-scrolls-online-6410289/

(quote from article for example: "Guilds could create caravans in which members do their part to contribute to the process, carrying resources on foot or on a mount. If you are building housing, your residence exists right in the persistent world rather than in its own instance." )


#3 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

I will give it a try...but I'm not sure any new game will embrace the core values of the older gen of MMO's.

#4 Posted by xWoW_Rougex (2767 posts) -

I will give it a try...but I'm not sure any new game will embrace the core values of the older gen of MMO's.

Evan21



ArcheAge does sound like it will have some good open world features though


As for Tibia. Tibia has about 25-30k active players at peak, it has tons of awesome features that I could write a whole essay about (example: years old "mysteries" that many have attempted to solve but failed like translating the bonelord books, how to get in the Serpent Tower or what the mystical binary signs found at some places through out the world are for). If you want older gen mmos, this is sure is old, in fact, it's one of the earliest ever (I think it's the 3rd oldest mmorpg). Most people dismiss it though before they ever get a chance to experience some of the absolutely genius parts of Tibia.




#5 Posted by TheDarkWolf86 (267 posts) -

Good post! Like you said, it's not just MMO that developers tend to "cookie-cut" the experience. Gaming is in a sad era. The same goes for a lot of movies too.

#6 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

Thanks for the support on the issue. I understand that I'm probably the minority of gamers but I really can't figure out any other way to vent my disappointment. Maybe this will serve as a venue where some of the older gamers can remember the good times.

#7 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -
Does anyone still play any of these old school MMO's EQ or AC etc?
#8 Posted by mcrawf21 (6 posts) -

I will give it a try...but I'm not sure any new game will embrace the core values of the older gen of MMO's.

Evan21

The core values of grinding all day and losing all your exp when you die. No thanks. Go back and play P99 on EQEmu and you'll see that Everquest was a bitch. My little brother is like you. He still, to this day, suffers through thousands of lines of code to build the perfect EQ server for himself. Nostalgia is cruel. It keeps us from moving on and enjoying new experiences. I do remember when I got MKII for my Sega Genesis. It was glorious, but so was MKIII, then MKIII Ultimate Edition. MK9 is pretty damn awesome too. I play SWTOR, Rift, Defiance, and DCUO. They are all awesome well thought out games with much kinder gaming environment for their player based. Your standards are too high. When you experienced those games in the past you were a different person. When I was a kid I didn't like green olives and could eat candy all day. Neither of those statements are true now. And to answer the question as to which recent games blew me away, had to be Dark Souls, Arkham Asylum/City, and any Assassin's Creed. I realize all of these are single player, but maybe I'm not into eating candy all day any more anyway.

#9 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

I knew someone would respond this way. I'm wondering what you hoped to accomplish by submitting this post. I'm sure you were not thinking you could sway my opinion with a couple or ridiculous analogies. Its funny, appreciating something because it's hard and challenging appears to be lost on you. Apparently you're happy with the same cookie cut routine everytime you play a MMO. Well I expect more than mediocrity, excuse me. To me you just seem to be someone that failed to grasp the concept of the first paragraph. I don't expect you to grasp the article. Actually if I were to bet, you are a troll that had no chance to experience what the older generation of MMOs offered. Either way what you can do is clearly stated at the very begining of my post.

#10 Posted by MBirdy88 (8330 posts) -

I knew someone would respond this way. I'm wondering what you hoped to accomplish by submitting this post. I'm sure you were not thinking you could sway my opinion with a couple or ridiculous analogies. Its funny, appreciating something because it's hard and challenging appears to be lost on you. Apparently you're happy with the same cookie cut routine everytime you play a MMO. Well I expect more than mediocrity, excuse me. To me you just seem to be someone that failed to grasp the concept of the first paragraph. I don't expect you to grasp the article. Actually if I were to bet, you are a troll that had no chance to experience what the older generation of MMOs offered. Either way what you can do is clearly stated at the very begining of my post.

Evan21
Whoa the hypocrisy here. I played Ultima, SWG and FF11 .... all games that fit your description and I agree with him completely, am I troll because I suffered through your long winded article that USE to be my opinion on the subject? I'm all up for variety, but he is right .... when I Was a sad little 14 year old kid I could tolerate the above games consuming hours ultimately doing nothing.... but not anymore, there is not a big market for these style games. Challenge? yes we all like it, but not every inch of a game needs to have it. modern difficult dungeons/PvP fill those voids. I am all up for sandbox player-centric MMOs.... but not up for all the crap that came with all the older style MMOs. So get off your pathetic high horse.... most of those featuers were deigned to prolong an ultimately boring experiance.
#11 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

     In response to the meat and potatos of your post I would could easily argue that all the garbage forced on MMO players today turns them into a MORE boring experience. It's not long before auction houses absolutely obsolete the need for crafting. Grinding becomes just grinding instead of looking for loot. What are you doing? Killing monsters....Why? For XP. Why? To level. Why? So I can kill more monsters. Why? To level? Why? To get to level 80. Why? So I can actually participate in some end game stuff. Otherwise it's just a scheduled quest after scheduled quest to go from scheduled zone to scheduled zone. The ride used to be filled with all sorts of surprises. What loot might you find or item? Finding dungeons. What spell might you discover? Walking up on strange enemies prowling and area you've never seen before, because you were EXPLORING not moving from designated NPC to NPC. Nice to know everyone experiences the exact same thing. Not to mention there used to be a sense of individualism becacuse you could build any player how ever you wanted. Now it is all point click kill until max level. Skill trees and that's about it. Go to the auction house and upgrade gear every few levels.

     In response to the rest of your post. Once again...the first paragraph of my post is for you. Did anywhere in my post I say, if you disagree please explain to me why? Or, I would love to hear a negative opinion of my opinion. So yes you are a troll because the only point of posting something like your post would be to annoy or get under my skin. Your opinion is no better than mine regardless of how much you like to think so. Also, you used the word hypocrisy and I don't understand how it's applicable where you used it.

#12 Posted by NinthFall (72 posts) -
I'd recommend you to try Tibia in this case.xWoW_Rougex
I wouldn't recommend Tibia. I'm a level 134 elite knight and a level 116 master sorcerer there. Played since 2004 and that game is ruined by botters, cheaters and the most idiotic community in the whole wild world. It's not that the game doesn't have potential, but honestly, it's a dead game. It may be fun at first, but gets very repeatitive and the lack of having a community will eat you alive. It will become ultimately boring.
#13 Posted by Malekoth (26 posts) -

I used to be the type of person who can sink 5 hours a day into an mmo. However, in the last few years, every mmo I try quickly loses its appeal. I think one contributing factor is the bland questing. Honestly, how many times can you repeat the "Kill X number of Y monsters" or "Collect X number of Y"quests? There are a few games I have played until max level, but those are few and far between. I keep searching online for anything new, and have tried a few betas, but nothing has kept me playing. Arch Age does look interesting though. Its as if I have an mmo itch that will never be scratched. Sometimes I think the perfect mmo for me doesn't exist.

#14 Posted by xWoW_Rougex (2767 posts) -

[QUOTE="xWoW_Rougex"]I'd recommend you to try Tibia in this case.NinthFall
I wouldn't recommend Tibia. I'm a level 134 elite knight and a level 116 master sorcerer there. Played since 2004 and that game is ruined by botters, cheaters and the most idiotic community in the whole wild world. It's not that the game doesn't have potential, but honestly, it's a dead game. It may be fun at first, but gets very repeatitive and the lack of having a community will eat you alive. It will become ultimately boring.

 

Sorry can't agree with ya there. From a complete newbies perspective there are tons of things to do and explore. Quests, chests, exploration, building a life and getting a house... It actually makes me think of a half year ago when I tried MapleStory for about two months, everywhere on the forums I read how the bots were absolutely everywhere but I didn't really notice much of it. It makes me optimistic and makes me believe the very new players won't care that much about the bots the first months... Let's face it, is there any game that isn't plagued by cheaters and a bad community? I find the English Chat extremely comforting and on the full server it's always active and filled with nice people, there's also plenty of nice neutral guilds! To me, I feel as if the Tibian players are better than most other mmorpg players. Of course, random people on the street, powerabusers and forum dwellers tend not to be as cool but what I like with Tibia is that it's easy to find the good people. (such as earlier mentioned, I have almost only positive experiences with the english chat).

I will admit that Tibia sure as hell isn't perfect but it has many excellent concepts that I think people should experience. As for the game getting repetitive fast, well, I won't comment much on this because I'm the kind of person that grow bored of just about any game/mmorpg rather fast so I tend to jump around quite a lot.

 

Overall, I really to think Tibia is a worth a try. No mmorpgs are perfect and I can find loads of negative stuff for just about every mmorpg including Tibia but with Tibia I can also name loads of positive things, far more positive things than I could come up with other mmorpgs.

#15 Posted by xWoW_Rougex (2767 posts) -

I used to be the type of person who can sink 5 hours a day into an mmo. However, in the last few years, every mmo I try quickly loses its appeal. I think one contributing factor is the bland questing. Honestly, how many times can you repeat the "Kill X number of Y monsters" or "Collect X number of Y"quests? There are a few games I have played until max level, but those are few and far between. I keep searching online for anything new, and have tried a few betas, but nothing has kept me playing. Arch Age does look interesting though. Its as if I have an mmo itch that will never be scratched. Sometimes I think the perfect mmo for me doesn't exist.

Malekoth

 

My headphones are broken so I'm kinda bored so I will write some Tibia related stuff since you did mentioned bland quests:

There are many quests in Tibia that are different from these kind of grindy quests, there's also many chests with good rewards in them and without spoilers, it'd require a rather intensive search for clues on how to access the chest.  What makes it really cool is that you have to spend lots of cash to hunt properly in Tibia which really makes you appreciate the rare items you find because they'll truly help you a lot.

The excitment with Tibia lies in its mysterious world that really encourages exploring. Tibia doesn't send you off to the next tourist attraction and tells you that HERE IS THE LOST ITEM!!!! Rather, you'd better ask npcs or explore yourself to find that place and look for that lost item yourself.

There's no excitment for example in WoW, exploring. What you gonna find? Nothing!
With Tibia you'd go around and you'd find some cave, is there a chest? When I go down that hole will I encounter a weak troll or a dragon?! Is there a chest down there? Is there any cool notes or clues about stuff down there? Oh snap, a locked door, how do I open it, can I open it, what is beyond that door?!


I'm just trying to get the point across that to me, Tibia has the aboslutely best world that will ever be created in a mmorpg. The mystery of each npc and each cave is so awesome, you can truly never tell whether an item, npc or place has some secrets or if it's completely useless. There's a whole buncha myths that has been unsolved for years (like how to open the Serpentine Tower) and just about everyone would believe that it isn't openable if it weren't for the fact that many quests in Tibia are complex and you almost wonder how people managed to come up with a solution.

Unfortunately, due to Tibia's less positive sides, newcomers tend to end up not realizing all of this.


As two examples, you could read the wiki on how to find the route to the Devil Helmet chest:

http://tibia.wikia.com/wiki/Devil_Helmet_Quest/Spoiler


#17 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

I used to be the type of person who can sink 5 hours a day into an mmo. However, in the last few years, every mmo I try quickly loses its appeal. I think one contributing factor is the bland questing. Honestly, how many times can you repeat the "Kill X number of Y monsters" or "Collect X number of Y"quests? There are a few games I have played until max level, but those are few and far between. I keep searching online for anything new, and have tried a few betas, but nothing has kept me playing. Arch Age does look interesting though. Its as if I have an mmo itch that will never be scratched. Sometimes I think the perfect mmo for me doesn't exist.

Malekoth

I have the SAME itch. However, it's not for something new, it's for the old in a new setting. Maybe your itch is the same. Back in the day you were not guided from place to place to kill a set number of monsters. Quests could be anything from a riddle to find a dungeon to bringing an item to a far location riddled with danger, or killing a queen inside a nest of enemie. Now it's a linar path wrapped in the illusion of a sandbox. Just because a game world is massive DOES NOT make it a sandbox game. The problem is most people in the world have no interest in putting thought into games and they're marketing to the masses.

#18 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -
[QUOTE="xWoW_Rougex"]I'd recommend you to try Tibia in this case.NinthFall
I wouldn't recommend Tibia. I'm a level 134 elite knight and a level 116 master sorcerer there. Played since 2004 and that game is ruined by botters, cheaters and the most idiotic community in the whole wild world. It's not that the game doesn't have potential, but honestly, it's a dead game. It may be fun at first, but gets very repeatitive and the lack of having a community will eat you alive. It will become ultimately boring.

I just started playing the game and as it does pass time I'm not really all that invested in it. I have not run into the problems you speak of much yet but maybe because I'm too new to know the difference. It's certainly not filling the void though.
#19 Posted by Reanemeiko (39 posts) -

Well i think it's not dying but Mobile games are getting more interest to casual gamers.  Does increasing their players 

#20 Posted by xWoW_Rougex (2767 posts) -

[QUOTE="NinthFall"][QUOTE="xWoW_Rougex"]I'd recommend you to try Tibia in this case.Evan21
I wouldn't recommend Tibia. I'm a level 134 elite knight and a level 116 master sorcerer there. Played since 2004 and that game is ruined by botters, cheaters and the most idiotic community in the whole wild world. It's not that the game doesn't have potential, but honestly, it's a dead game. It may be fun at first, but gets very repeatitive and the lack of having a community will eat you alive. It will become ultimately boring.

I just started playing the game and as it does pass time I'm not really all that invested in it. I have not run into the problems you speak of much yet but maybe because I'm too new to know the difference. It's certainly not filling the void though.



You really tried it out? What level are you?

It should be pointed out that you should play on an open pvp server that is as full as possible. Good examples are Antica, which is the oldest server and Aurora/Auorera which are two rather new servers (2x experience). Aurora/Aurera are preview servers, they are pretty much normal servers but much more people in them (more lag also then...) but they get to be guinea pigs for updates before the updates hit the other servers. It should also be pointed out that while the game is free, premium account for like 7 usd a month opens up a lot of the world and much more spells.

For the best gaming experience you'd be get the premium account for a month, become a paladin or sorcerer/druid (knights are easy to play, mostly because they're forced to fight weaker monsters... which means they're boring) and just start "living" there.

#21 Posted by KProxy (1 posts) -
I agree with the OP's post! I have only dabbled in a few MMO's but I have mainly stuck to WoW for the past 7ish years since late vanilla before the first expansion came out. Greed happens to studios or their publishers and then the game starts to expand to "please" everyone, including the casual players. This leaves hardcore or semi hardcore players at a disarray because now things are easy and stuff is handed to casuals who do half the work the more dedicated players do. Then when content is easy people demand more stuff and it's a never ending vicious cycle. Right now I'm waiting on Wildstar which includes some of the original devs from WoW so their focus is for the hardcore/semi hardcore players (think 20/40 man raids and 40 man PvP warplots where you invade other teams warplots) and it appeals to casuals with player housing that you can FULLY decorate inside and out. In fact a lot of the stuff you miss seems to be in WIldstar, but we should still be cautious no matter what until the game is out and people have gotten their hands into the gameplay system. A lot of people think this game is THE game that MMO's are supposed to be all about, but again, don't be too excited yet.
#22 Posted by NinthFall (72 posts) -
Okay guys, if you feel the urge to start Tibia. I might as well help you out. You can find my main characters, Vonome and Vangrael on the server called Titania. But I wouldn't recommend that server for newcomers. It's mainly for players who seek only war, there isn't much of a newbie community there and nobody ever on english chat. However, I recently started Antica, the first server created in Tibia. This is a normal pvp server, but has the best community of all the avalaible PvP servers. I wouldn't recommend Aurora/Aurera for newbies either, those servers will have testing phases for new PvP system and during that time things can get kind of rough, resets may occur, etc. So I'd recommend y'all come to see me on Antica, under the name Theseus. I know pretty much everything about this game, so I can help you out with knowledge. But can't do much about the money problem on Antica as I started there recently myself too. But I have to warn you guys, Tibia is highly addictive. Most people who start it will never quit. This has been said even by WoW players, even in the beginning of WoW some Tibians tried to change their mmo to playing WoW only, but kept coming back to Tibia. I don't know how it feels like to be a newcomer in todays Tibia, but based on my experience, well, here I am after 9 years on/off playing.
#24 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

I agree with the OP's post! I have only dabbled in a few MMO's but I have mainly stuck to WoW for the past 7ish years since late vanilla before the first expansion came out. Greed happens to studios or their publishers and then the game starts to expand to "please" everyone, including the casual players. This leaves hardcore or semi hardcore players at a disarray because now things are easy and stuff is handed to casuals who do half the work the more dedicated players do. Then when content is easy people demand more stuff and it's a never ending vicious cycle. Right now I'm waiting on Wildstar which includes some of the original devs from WoW so their focus is for the hardcore/semi hardcore players (think 20/40 man raids and 40 man PvP warplots where you invade other teams warplots) and it appeals to casuals with player housing that you can FULLY decorate inside and out. In fact a lot of the stuff you miss seems to be in WIldstar, but we should still be cautious no matter what until the game is out and people have gotten their hands into the gameplay system. A lot of people think this game is THE game that MMO's are supposed to be all about, but again, don't be too excited yet. KProxy

To be honest I've never heard of Wildstar but you've peaked my interest. I'm going to look it up right now. It would be nice to get excited about a game that's willing to take a risk and support the model that allowed today's have hearted recreations their birth.

#25 Posted by NegativeCry (5 posts) -
I think mabinogi is a very good game. Complicated caves in wich you have to solve hard puzzles to open doors and that are laberynths. Big world. A lot of fun stuff to do. Mysteries around the world. Quests are not obligatory. Talents instead of classes, like exploring, music, or just warrior and stuff. The thing about marketing too.
#26 Posted by downnice95 (95 posts) -

SAdly I agree. As a former Runescpae player I must agree that the Microtransaction killed of the genre. Gaming in General is becoming corrupt and sadly I feel like in a couple of years I might not have a interest in games and that would be a shame as a avid gaming since 1995 =(

#27 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

SAdly I agree. As a former Runescpae player I must agree that the Microtransaction killed of the genre. Gaming in General is becoming corrupt and sadly I feel like in a couple of years I might not have a interest in games and that would be a shame as a avid gaming since 1995 =(

downnice95

 

I know how you feel. I miss the games of old as my post said. I'm affraid I'm losing interest in gaming as well. It's all focused on the casual player now. Whether you like it or not we can all thank wow for introducing that model.

#28 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

So it seems I may have stumbled upon something people are calling a "hardcore" MMO. And it seems a lot of these new school little girls are complaing about it. Darkfall Unholy Wars. I'm going to give it a try and will update on here whether or not it fits the bill. I've been hearing some good things. Lets see what happens with it.

#29 Posted by chicksieuway (1 posts) -
where the link download
#30 Posted by Evan21 (86 posts) -

where the link downloadchicksieuway

Unfortunately Darkfall is pay to play, it can be purchased on steam for 40 dollars than 15 a month after that. It's not worth it at this point. It KINDA is SORTA like an oldschool MMO but not really. There are specific areas that Mobs spawn. The PVE aspect of the game is just tact on the game so players can earn prowess points to level. The leveling system is non linear which would be awesome if it wasn't for the fact that you will severely gimp your player by not following the general rules of each class. Also if you like the feel of having your own unique chracter don't bother. All the character models are the same model with different skins. Same height, same width. Yea...this was to avoid advantages of smaller players in PvP but really makes you feel like your the same as everyone else. There are good elements but it's just not polished enough yet to warrent the price tag. There are clan cities and player house which is cool. You can build boats etc and seige enemy clans ( My clan is not there yet but working on it through alliances ) You basically have to grind like hell to have a legit shot at leaving the "safe zone" to go to the fully PvP world and the player base is less than steller so they go after noobs hard. It's full loot so that would be cool but there isn't enough rare gear to care too much. It's mostly the same sets at different levels for each class. The combat can be fun if you're with your clan and can have a good go at another one, but many times battles are lopsided. Also the class balance is just not there. Warriors are pretty much owning for the most part in 1 v 1. So my advice is wait until they get the kinks worked out. It's not to the point where it's worth paying to play right now. It does have potential if it gets enough support so we will see.

#32 Posted by vizsla421 (1 posts) -
I know how you feel. But its not just mmos its the gaming industry as a whole, its come down to money money money as fast as we can. Yes all large companies want profit but back in the day games were made by aspiring gamers who loved there industry and loved games, now all it is is "how fast can we get this product out and how much money will we make." A prime example of this is the recent xbox one fiasco, they wanted to cut out used game stores so 100% profit would go to them instead of a percentage going to the middleman I.e. gamestop. I'm not saying gamestop is innocent of anything, far from it, but the sheer dis concern for the gamers over money disgusted me and I felt that major game companies are further and further distancing themselves from the gamers for more profit, EA is a prime example of this strategy, sim city and dead space 3 ring any bells? My last hope for the mmo genre lays in bethesda with the upcoming elder scrolls online. They're one of the few companies that still produces pure games not filled with "stores" and crap dlc (not counting hearthfire) just for profit. Im hoping that ESO will include the randomness and sandboxness lol, of past scrolls games. I want to see a return to the new lasting experiences and community and risk of the old gaming industry, sure there were bombs but the companies took risks (conkers bad fur day), something the companies of today won't do for fear of losing the almighty dollar.
#33 Posted by akymia (1 posts) -
Pretty insulting response towards anyone who tells you grind-to-loose model is bad ^.^ On topic, and I'll try to make it short 1. Old MMOs were only good because we had no knowledge so everything was new and new is cool. Most of their mechanics, ideas, quests, UIs were awesome back in the 90s and are all bad, flawed and dull today. 2. You point out 'mediocrity' as a state below your standards and yet it seems to me like You have never experienced the top level. Play in a top20 PvE guild in WoW or a top50 PvP ratedBG/3v3arena team, push your limits and maybe You will find fullfilment in a proper MMO*. *in my opinion all those old MMOs like eq ac ultima and ever most of the new ones like conan wh swtor rift etc. all have terrible balance issues. Not saying WoW is balanced perfectly 'cause no MMO will ever be but it's the closest one can get nowadays without question. 3. There are still amazing fresh ideas like Firefall so it's just a matter of looking long enough for the right thing to push your skill to it's limit. and an offtopic note - one thing that has gotten a ton better in games is the story told. No game will ever stand up to God of War, Bastion or even Mass Effect Trilogy.
#34 Posted by flexy456 (3 posts) -

I already wrote a *lengthy* post on another forum so I will keep this one short..

It is not correct that the genre itself "has died", because there is a massive difference between a genre becoming old/boring, player fatigue etc. and a game company such as Blizzard actively making a game BAD.

In the case of WoW, this is exactly what happened. The MMORPG genre has not died, in the same way as good RPGs still have an appeal or people still play good FPS shooters even if those genres are already very old.

Blizzard did everything they could to make Wow as bad as even possible by taking out all positive aspects of the game, mainly explorations and adventure, and morph the once good game into a grind-fest where the only thing which remains is repating boring tasks over and over (dailies...)...by forgetting WHAT exactly made the genre so good in the first place. In place of adventure and exploration and felxibility.....they replaced it with "insta gratification" for so called "casual players" to make the game more accessible for people who don't play longer than say 30mins per day.

Short: WoW became so bad NOT because the genre died or people became tired of it, but only and explusively because of Blizzard's decision to change the game to the bad in an attempt to attract more players.

I can guarantee you that if you had ONE game company which would still realize that developing game is about the gamer, AND NOT ABOUT MONEY, it would still be possible to a make a good MMO game which people would like to play. Problem right now is that WoW alternatives are not that great, GW2 might not be perfect and from what I learned Elder Scrolls Online is likely also not becoming a new "uber MMORPG" but rather a "TES game you can play with friends". The GENRE itself is still very alive.

 

#35 Posted by Kane04 (2069 posts) -
To start I still have the MKII disk for PC, functional, I was even playing long before that, I have a working MSIII and even the original Larry. So after "qualifying" to your standards to read your post lets move on to secondly... Secondly, I've stopped read here:

but if you happen to have an opinion on this then kindly STFU and GTFO.

Evan21
Consider it a compliment I've read it that far after the idiotic title. MMOs are hotter than ever, there's never been so many available & in the making as they are right now.
#36 Posted by Kane04 (2069 posts) -
By the way, after coming back and reading the whole thing to see what were you actually all about, I see your problem is that you grown up. Which is ironic because it seems like you haven't as much as you should. So you aren't impressed with anything anymore, who's fault is that? The original Silent Hill took my sleep away, now I look at Saw and yawn, it happens to everyone. And it's interesting to see you saying you haven't maxed your GW2 toons, all 7 of those... So you had to buy 2 slots of characters those are (today) some 26 gold each or 27 more or less. Why throw money at the game like that if you aren't really enjoying it? It there's one thing I hate is things going to waist, but hey, maybe thats because I work hard for my stuff. Before level 80 you can't even fully enjoy the class, not to mention there's lots of room for creativity in the builds and choice of weapons (unlike some traditional MMOs) how often in those you which you had pick some other class because you're sick of a greatsword? And yes, being able to revive yourself in a WP that's right over there takes away tension, and being able to cross the continent as fast as a loading screen allows makes it feel too small and easy, I'll give you that, BUT, I'm afraid there is a but, who has time for 2 hours of walking in a game? I sure don't, ever since GW2 came out 10 or so months ago it's the only game I've been playing and I've only played about 650 hours, now do the math. I'd love to get in Eve, don't have time for that, The Last of Us is sitting on my shelf, only played the intro because..? Don't have time for it, and so on and so forth. Can you really blame companies for making games more accessible? Most people don't have time to sink hours into none sense. Sure having to walk everywhere in GW2 would be cool, it would be even cooler if I had time for it... All and all it all comes down to what I already said, you're just older and unimpressionable which happens to everyone, but still I'm sure somewhere there is a cult maybe obscure game just for you, for most people that can only play 2~3 hours half the days of the week, I'm sorry but games just need to be more immediate.
#37 Posted by afterworld (17 posts) -

I understand where you're coming from about the lack of challenge in games. It's happened to every genre really and if you really want a true challenge, you have to look hard and open your mind to new types of games. I've seen this type of thread appear on many forums regarding the recent beta version for FFXIV A Realm Reborn in particular. I've accepted the fact that these 'hard' games are not coming back any time soon and I've found other games to enjoy in their place. Games like Demon Soul's or Dark Souls, even Fire Emblem, Etrian Odyssey on 3DS or XCOM all are very challenging games which are difficult to master. Even MOBA games like League or Dota 2 take a long time to master. I don't really play MOBAs but I'm willing to try them out. A lot of popular RPGs like FF series, Mass Effect and Dragon Age have all been simplified in game play, even action games with tricky puzzles and exploration like Tomb Raider have become streamlined. There's always private servers or GOG.com for that old skool challenge. 

#38 Posted by Kane04 (2069 posts) -

I understand where you're coming from about the lack of challenge in games.

afterworld
Still speaking of the game he recently quit, what's stopping him to have a rule where he has to go back to a major city and not the nearest WP when he dies forcing himself to walk back? Maybe even delete all the loot in the inventory as a self penalty? What's stopping him to use low tier or even under level gear for harder fights? Just because the game offers easy ways it doesn't mean he has to take them.
#39 Posted by worldalpha (27 posts) -

I truly hope that MMO genre isn't dead.  Been working too hard for that to happen.  There are plenty of MMOs that are still thriving out there.

#40 Posted by DeViLzzz (2144 posts) -

I honestly can't wait to see this new Everquest game.  Graphical improvements are not enough for me though with this genre.  I want mmorpgs to come down in cost in terms of what they charge per month to $9.99 or even lower.  I want questing in these games to require the player base to work together more vs just mowing down everything and leveling up super fast but this won't change if the community doesn't demand it and well players for some reason have had no problem just leveling up in dungeons over and over and over to quickly hit max level and quite frankly that is sad but part of why people do this is the people making these games give into the player base too much.  Seriously Blizzard, Sony and others give more reason for people to play out in the open worlds of the games. Please bring back to life world pvp vs arena based but yes I don't mind having both.  Please make quests harder with the mini bosses at the end of these quest chains actually having a chance to use all the abilities you give them in a battle vs a party and actually make it where people have to group up and have a proper party with healer and other stuff for the battle.  Yes some fights can still be allowed to be done tankless or maybe an enemy reduces a healers ability to really help out but my gosh anything is better than what is in the questing systems now in many mmorpgs.  Much of the time 2 players or even just 1 can take on an end of quest line mini boss.  Stop this.  It ruins the adventure and takes away from the meaning of exploring all these areas you have created.

Oh and Blizzard I asked for years for hardcore servers where things are not nerfed and attunement is left in place.  Why could this not happen ?  Why is it that we have to get these nerfs all the time in your game ?  By the way I am not a great player and still want things to be difficult and so I ask Blizzard and other companies and for crying out the freaking mmorpg communities to realize these games are not as great anymore cuz you have made the experience less fulfilling and less interesting.

Easy is not the way to go and it should not be forced on all players. 

For years I complained in trade chat and on the message boards about this sort of thing with WoW and got little support.  I guess there are no gamers left that want a real adventure and a challenge.