Lack of Spy Shooters... Who should be blamed?

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Cloud_imperium

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#1 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

As we all know, Tactical genres such as cRPGs, Turn based Strategy games, Space Sims etc were on death beds for the last ten years. Now we are seeing low budget games (except Star Citizen and may be Divinity: OS since those aren't very low on production values) trying to bring those genres back and things (slowly but surely) are becoming better. However, we still lack Spy Shooters? Why?

We want Kate Archer Back!
We want Kate Archer Back!

Why no one is interested in that genre. 007 Nightfire and No one Lives forever were amazing games and it seems like no one is trying to bring those games back. Ladies and Gentlemen we also know that industry is flooding with Military Shooters with rare gems like Shadow Warrior. Should we blame Military Shooters? Should we blame people who buy annual franchises? Should we blame Mountain Dew gamers?

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Priestwithgun

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#2  Edited By Priestwithgun
Member since 2015 • 132 Posts

Does sniper elite 3 count? It had a lot of stealth and was fun

People have become too complacent anyways. I see them going to any lengths to defend thier purchases. They are more interested in specs than games

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Cloud_imperium

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#3 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@priestwithgun: Sad but true.

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Lulu_Lulu

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#4 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

I don't understand.... whats the difference between stealth game and a spy shooter ? Is the latter even a genre ?

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#5 DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 55899 Posts

@Lulu_Lulu said:

I don't understand.... whats the difference between stealth game and a spy shooter ? Is the latter even a genre ?

Stealth Games are not spy games, they focus on being quiet while sneaking to get were your going, like in Last of Us, that's a stealth game, not a spy shooter. Spy Shooters involve working with the Government Agencies like 007, Splinter Cell, and No One Lives Forever. They follow there objectives, sneaking behind enemies while not being detected, get to your objectives and evacuate.

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#6 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

@davillain-:

So its the Samething Then ?

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#7 DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 55899 Posts

@Lulu_Lulu: I'm only saying that stealth games don't normally follow the Spy Government but if they do, it would be just Spy Game and Stealth games most of the times involves outside fields. Metal Gear Solid is both if you'll want to put it like that.

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#8 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

@davillain-:

I'm sorry, you guys have a case for Strategy Games and cRPGs but this ? Nope.... I just don't see it.

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uninspiredcup

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#9 uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 58646 Posts

The stealth missions in the Arma series can be quite good. In general, they squander it.

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mastermetal777

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#10 mastermetal777
Member since 2009 • 3236 Posts

Try a game called CounterSpy. It's a 2.5D spy game set during the Cold War and it involves infiltration either through force or stealth or a mix of both. Fun game.

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#11 TheShadowLord07
Member since 2006 • 23083 Posts

Well publishers are afraid of making a new ip, so they go with whatever is successful. I was conflicted that Black Tusk's new ip was put on hold when Microsoft got hold of the GeOW license.

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#12 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

@davillain- said:
@Lulu_Lulu said:

I don't understand.... whats the difference between stealth game and a spy shooter ? Is the latter even a genre ?

Stealth Games are not spy games, they focus on being quiet while sneaking to get were your going, like in Last of Us, that's a stealth game, not a spy shooter. Spy Shooters involve working with the Government Agencies like 007, Splinter Cell, and No One Lives Forever. They follow there objectives, sneaking behind enemies while not being detected, get to your objectives and evacuate.

The Last of us is not a stealth game. Its a action game with some stealth elements.

A stealth game is games like Dishonoured, Theif, Splinter Cell.

But the reason why we don't see games like No Lives forever is because it didn't sell enough and today its all about the numbers, and developers wont get the same good will to pursue new ip´s.

So you ask who is to blame and its the gamers who are to blame. Most are stuck in their ways and wont try out new games and not to mention the idea some have that a critic can tell them if a game is good or not.

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#13  Edited By yukushi
Member since 2011 • 2368 Posts

@Cloud_imperium: I blame the spies they keep spying on the developers and now they are nervous and refuse to make any more spy games.

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Cloud_imperium

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#14 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@yukushi said:

@Cloud_imperium: I blame the spies they keep spying on the developers and now they are nervous and refuse to make any more spy games.

Well, that makes sense.

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#15  Edited By Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@Lulu_Lulu said:

@davillain-:

So its the Samething Then ?

It's not same thing. Some Stealth games also feel like Spy shooter but not all Spy shooters are stealth games. @davillain summed it up pretty well. Take No One Lives Forever,,, you don't have to be stealthy. You can kill everyone just like you do in games like Half Life but that's not the only thing that you do in the game.

You have a lot of gadgets that you have to use at the right time to proceed. Stuff like grappling hook to jump from one building to another, perfumes to hide bodies, hacking devices to unlock doors, traps to disarm enemies, Laser watch to destroy locks, different gadget upgrades etc.

These gadgets are as important as guns in these games, while other shooters only rely on killing everyone with guns. Then there is whole story element to these games as well. These games have different look and feel.

You are undercover agent,,, you discover plans/conspiracies, read documents, do chase missions to find hideouts etc . Semi Sci Fi elements can also be found in these games. Military FPS on other hand are different where you are Rambo.

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#16 Black_Knight_00
Member since 2007 • 77 Posts

Cate Archer <3

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#17 Gwynnblade
Member since 2015 • 931 Posts

Everywhere I look, I find the same thing over and over again. The gaming industry has turned into a hive mind and it all began with 2007's Modern Warfare. It was unique back then, people loved it. And so the trends changed.

Now when we see people complaining like the TC, the best counter-argument people present is "People have different tastes, grow up!". Well, how do we develop 'tastes'? is it in my genes that I'm gonna grow up and be a COD pro? or is it the environment?
Most definitely the later. Today's gaming environment is full of rehashed CODs and there is little room for anything else. No developer wants to take any risk. Like a newly wed Indian bride who'll keep cooking the same curry in the peril that her mother-in-law might not find the biryani up to her taste. All its going to take is ONE brave developer to make a game separate from the norm that everyone likes and then the trends will change again. History repeats itself, sometimes, it requires a push to do so. But with Squadron 42 and the recent efforts by Indie developers, I can say for sure the trends are going to change.

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#18 speedfreak48t5p
Member since 2009 • 14411 Posts

Cows obviously.

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#19 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@gwynnblade said:

Everywhere I look, I find the same thing over and over again. The gaming industry has turned into a hive mind and it all began with 2007's Modern Warfare. It was unique back then, people loved it. And so the trends changed.

Now when we see people complaining like the TC, the best counter-argument people present is "People have different tastes, grow up!". Well, how do we develop 'tastes'? is it in my genes that I'm gonna grow up and be a COD pro? or is it the environment?

Most definitely the later. Today's gaming environment is full of rehashed CODs and there is little room for anything else. No developer wants to take any risk. Like a newly wed Indian bride who'll keep cooking the same curry in the peril that her mother-in-law might not find the biryani up to her taste. All its going to take is ONE brave developer to make a game separate from the norm that everyone likes and then the trends will change again. History repeats itself, sometimes, it requires a push to do so. But with Squadron 42 and the recent efforts by Indie developers, I can say for sure the trends are going to change.

Wise words from a wise man.

@Black_Knight_00 said:

Cate Archer <3

Loading Video...

Ain't she awesome? <3

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#20 Black_Knight_00
Member since 2007 • 77 Posts

@Cloud_imperium said:
@Black_Knight_00 said:

Cate Archer <3

Ain't she awesome? <3

She sure is. The sad part is that the games are not available on Steam or anywhere else (like so many Sierra games), so a lot of young players will never experience them, unless someone buys out Sierra :(

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#21 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

@Cloud_imperium:

Theres plenty of games with Gadgets.....

Sorry but I theres no unique defining characteristics the way you're explaining it....

Even BulletStorm had Gadgets.

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#22 Sushiglutton
Member since 2009 • 9839 Posts

Well there was 007 legends, but I never bought it because of horrible reviews (if I recall correctly). Looked kind of interesting though:

Loading Video...

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#23 CleanB
Member since 2013 • 289 Posts

Bro gamers, obviously.

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#24  Edited By GameboyTroy
Member since 2011 • 9723 Posts

Spy shooters need to be made more often.

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#25 Running-Target
Member since 2014 • 413 Posts

Loved No One Lives Forever games back in the days. Cate Archer, one of gaming's best secret agents.NOLF in many ways is reminiscent of IGI-2 Covert Strike in its theme and use of the stealth mechanic in an FPS game. Anyone remember this under-rated spy genre game?

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#26 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@Lulu_Lulu said:

@Cloud_imperium:

Theres plenty of games with Gadgets.....

Sorry but I theres no unique defining characteristics the way you're explaining it....

Even BulletStorm had Gadgets.

WTF are you talking about? BulltetStorm is not a Spy Shooter.

@running-target said:

Loved No One Lives Forever games back in the days. Cate Archer, one of gaming's best secret agents.NOLF in many ways is reminiscent of IGI-2 Covert Strike in its theme and use of the stealth mechanic in an FPS game. Anyone remember this under-rated spy genre game?

Yeah man, I've played both IGI games. First were pretty popular where I live.

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#27  Edited By Toxic-Seahorse
Member since 2012 • 5074 Posts

Wouldn't Alpha Protocol fit into that category? Or is it too RPGish?

and what about Dues Ex? Sure you're not really working for a government but a lot of the other aspects you mentioned are there.

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#28 Cloud_imperium
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@Toxic-Seahorse said:

Wouldn't Alpha Protocol fit into that category? Or is it too RPGish?

and what about Dues Ex? Sure you're not really working for a government but a lot of the other aspects you mentioned are there.

Deus Ex comes close since it's First Person too and it can play like a shooter if your character is more aggressive and less stealthy.

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#29 MARKER_1988
Member since 2015 • 102 Posts

Nothing beats Splinter Cell chaos theory and Blacklist when it comes to spy shooter types. Whilst Chaos theory was totally stealth based, Blacklist missions were a great mix of spy and shooting.

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#30 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

@Cloud_imperium:

By your description of the genre... it is..... guns and gadgets !!! Oooooh and Bioshock as well.... also has Guns and Gadgets. .

.... and Magic....

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#31  Edited By Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@Lulu_Lulu said:

@Cloud_imperium:

By your description of the genre... it is..... guns and gadgets !!! Oooooh and Bioshock as well.... also has Guns and Gadgets. .

.... and Magic....

As usual you are acting dumb and wasting my time. OK, how about this...Everyone is wrong and dumb,,, only you are right... Lulu_lulu for the win. Thank you for opening our eyes man... YOU DA MAN!!!.

Now plz STOP!!!

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#32 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

@Cloud_imperium:

I'm just trying to understand..... don't get mad at me because you didn't explain it properly.....

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#33 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15146 Posts

@Lulu_Lulu said:

@Cloud_imperium:

I'm just trying to understand..... don't get mad at me because you didn't explain it properly.....

Yeah, forgive me for overestimating your intelligence,

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#34 Lulu_Lulu
Member since 2013 • 19564 Posts

@Cloud_imperium:

Theres no need to be hurtful.

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deactivated-57ad0e5285d73

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#35 deactivated-57ad0e5285d73
Member since 2009 • 21398 Posts

The obvious answer is the consumer. I'd rather have more twitch/wave fps games, at least at the moment.

It would have been nice to see the Rainbow Six series take an actual step forward. I've also been playing a lot of Goldeneye and I prefer that design over pure stealth. Goldeneye allows for both which is why it is so fun.

I'd say Arma is stealth, too. Haven't played the 3rd one and ended up getting bored with Arma2 out of performance hiccup frustration.