Journey is IGN's Game of the Year. Now Gamespot GOTY too! What in the world.....

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CarnageHeart

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#201 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

Proof positive of just how much generic, re-packaged trash came out this year.

syztem

No doubt they feared falling outside wioud's brilliant but narrow definition of what constitutes a true game.

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wiouds

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#203 wiouds
Member since 2004 • 6233 Posts

[QUOTE="dvader654"][QUOTE="wiouds"]

The problem I have is that there is very little deviation you can make within a class. It seems to me that Borderland games have a more control of the character within a class. I would like to have two soldiers be able to play noticeable differently.Instead of an offense power why not get a soldier with a special heavy weapon. Have it where alternative paths that needs out of combat skills to get through.

Imagine having a part of the game that you need to defend a location and you have the time to set up a defense of some type. If you have an engineer with the right skills you can fix up defenses there. You have someone with the right biotic skills then have them move objects around to make cover

I understand that would be hard with staging the shooter parts. After all good staging is the art behind a good shooter. While A WRPG art is from give the player option a ways to deal with task before them.

With that poor made segue, game play elements are art. Game play is what makes something a game. We can have great games with poor visual, audio and story, but with poor game play they game as a game is poor. Until we start thinking of parts of the game that make it a game as art, we will interactive stories claiming to be artistic game while the game part is poor or simple.

I am not saying interactive stories are bad. I am saying trying for force them to be games is wrong. We should remove the burden of trying to be a game from interactive stories like journey, The Walking Dead, and Heavy Rain. They are not games. Just as a novel is not a play. It does not mean that novels are bad.

I think that game of the year should take a look at just the game play as a part of the game.

CarnageHeart

Your ideas are pretty awesome and I agree completely that the gameplay is the art of the video game. Excellent post.

Truly wiouds, you speak wisdom. All these decades and no one knew that adventure games weren't games :P.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

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CarnageHeart

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#204 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

[QUOTE="dvader654"] Your ideas are pretty awesome and I agree completely that the gameplay is the art of the video game. Excellent post.wiouds

Truly wiouds, you speak wisdom. All these decades and no one knew that adventure games weren't games :P.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Try to learn the meaning of terms before you use them. Sometimes that is as simple as reading your own links.
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wiouds

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#205 wiouds
Member since 2004 • 6233 Posts

[QUOTE="wiouds"]

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

Truly wiouds, you speak wisdom. All these decades and no one knew that adventure games weren't games :P.

CarnageHeart

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Try to learn the meaning of terms before you use them. Sometimes that is as simple as reading your own links.

I did read the link and your statement fits it.

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Gemini_Red

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#206 Gemini_Red
Member since 2003 • 3290 Posts

[QUOTE="Grammaton-Cleric"]

It's a pretentious choice by pseudo-intellectuals vying for attention while simultaneously trying to infuse this medium with some semblance of artistic credibility, especially in light of recent events which have once again placed violent media into the spotlight.

That said, it's a good game but I wouldn't even classify it as the best downloadable software, with something like Mark of the Ninja being a far better interactive experience and employing a fantastic art style.

It's not a horrible choice but given how many truly fantastic games hit the shelves this year it is a relatively uninspired and obvious pick by the wannabe art house crowd.

RandoIph

Pretty much this. Yep.

Also agree. After watching the video as to why it won, it did bother me how often they hit home how it was not violent. After hearing that in the video several times, I couldn't help thinking "Please don't tell me this game game won partly because of sociopolitical issues." Not making it sound like a conspiracy, but those repeated statements did bother me. Not to downplay the recent issues in the least as a GOTY award is absolutely trivial by comparison, but recent or current events should never play a part in any award.

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idunnodude

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#207 idunnodude
Member since 2007 • 2287 Posts

i think this is just proof that we live in a hipster dominated society. i think it would be acceptable maybe if it was like a $5, $10 at most game. but $15 is just too much to pay for a 2 hour experience of floating scarfs and sand surfing, especially considering all the other great games you can get for that much like ME1.

i swear it seems like the western world is just getting more and more sensitive always catering to minority. its cool to hate the big budget games. whats wrong with appreciating a big budget game? i think ME3 should have won hands down. i mean you talk about stunning visuals, have you seen the scenery and level design in the mass effect games? i can recall many times just starring off into the citadel or ilium (ME2) and just appreciating the scenery, its gorgeous. id say its one of the best looking games ever.

and talk about emotional connection, no other game has immersed me into it like the ME series. the choices you make and the relationships you develop. top it all off with a great in depth gameplay and addictive and fun multiplayer. it almost seems like an insult that they pick journey over a game like this, or the other nominess like Halo 4.

say what you will about ME3, but even the fact that they released the extended cut ending says a lot about how much the developers care about the fans and listened to their concerns. just cuz its big budget doesn't mean it doesn't have any "soul" or "emotional connection" or whatever the hell everyone keeps raving about for journey.

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#208 thom_maytees
Member since 2010 • 3668 Posts

I am surprised that both IGN and GameSpot chosen the same game as GOTY, but I am quite surprised over the reaction by those who are against it.

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CarnageHeart

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#209 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"][QUOTE="wiouds"]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

wiouds

Try to learn the meaning of terms before you use them. Sometimes that is as simple as reading your own links.

I did read the link and your statement fits it.

Your attempt to exclude the three games you mentioned from the category of games would also eliminate many adventure games (including but not limited to games like Zork). The industry has always recognized that gameplay isn't a narrow thing, it is the interaction one has with a game and can take many, many forms. A text adventure where you play a spy who talks his way into and out of an enemy hideout is just as laid a game as one in which a guy shoots his way in and out of an enemy hideout (except to the adrenaline junkie set).
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MadVybz

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#210 MadVybz
Member since 2009 • 2797 Posts

While I haven't played Journey I have been lurking in this thread and it's quite clear that there's the party that advocates both IGN and Gamespot's choice for it as GOTY and the others that see it a choice affected by recent events that have once again put video games in the limelight.

Given what I've seen I'm gonna have to side with the theory this is an outcome of media pressure. Since I can't pass judgment on Journey I won't say it is a bad game or bad experience, but it is quite clear that there is an agenda with these picks since there has been an ample amount of quality titles that came out this year which hold much more weight in the whole game aspect of this medium, which Journey clearly lacks.

While I whole-heartedly believe that games can be form of art, there's a fine line between being a game and simply being an interactive experience, and Journey definitely fits in the latter.

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GT90

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#211 GT90
Member since 2002 • 6256 Posts

While I haven't played Journey I have been lurking in this thread and it's quite clear that there's the party that advocates both IGN and Gamespot's choice for it as GOTY and the others that see it a choice affected by recent events that have once again put video games in the limelight.

Given what I've seen I'm gonna have to side with the theory this is an outcome of media pressure. Since I can't pass judgment on Journey I won't say it is a bad game or bad experience, but it is quite clear that there is an agenda with these picks since there has been an ample amount of quality titles that came out this year which hold much more weight in the whole [i]game[/i] aspect of this medium, which Journey clearly lacks.

While I whole-heartedly believe that games can be form of art, there's a fine line between being a game and simply being an interactive experience, and Journey definitely fits in the latter.

MadVybz

I disagree that Gamespot and IGN gave into some so called media pressure due to the recent bouts of shootings. Why would they decide a game of the year on something like that?

A game is all about being allowed to have an interactive experience, which Journey is.

All in all, this is a fairly silly argument over peoples opinions on the game they decided was GOTY for them. Whether or not Journey constitutes a game? Who cares, people played loved it enough to say that it was a great game for them. It's no different then when someone rates a game low, yet you might in fact love the game.

This isn't setting any precedent, it's just a group of people saying that, they happen to love a game enough to call it GOTY.

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MadVybz

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#212 MadVybz
Member since 2009 • 2797 Posts

I disagree that Gamespot and IGN gave into some so called media pressure due to the recent bouts of shootings. Why would they decide a game of the year on something like that? GT90

Simply because it gives gaming a better image in times where there are many groups of people trying to point their finger at video games as the cause for such a tradegy. It's basically saying "Look! Video games aren't just gratuitous amounts of violence! They can be artsy too!"

The only reason why I'm leaning towards this as opposed to them genuinely rewarding Journey's merit (which, by the way, is an action that hardly amounts to anything) is because this is it totally out of the blue. Yes, indie games have been given great praise in the past but never so much as GOTY status. Why choose now to have a game like this as GOTY (especially when there are lots of other titles that simply do more as a game?)

While I may sound contradictory, GOTY doesn't matter much to me personally, but I know a fair amount of people that do take the title to heart and their purchases are influenced by it, which is the whole reason why it exists in the first place. Slap GOTY on the box art and more people will buy it.

A game is all about being allowed to have an interactive experience, which Journey is.

GT90

Well, yes. Games are about interactivity, but what you're conveniently ignoring is that games also have to provide some sort of challenge and punishment in accordance to player actions, along with requiring some degree of skill or luck. That's what a game is. Journey, as far as I've seen, has none of these aspects. So it's not so far-fetched to call it an 'experience' as opposed to a game.

All in all, this is a fairly silly argument over peoples opinions on the game they decided was GOTY for them. Whether or not Journey constitutes a game? Who cares, people played loved it enough to say that it was a great game for them.

GT90

How is the significance of this argument dependent on your judgment? I find it quite interesting how something like Journey has all of a sudden become a top dog among two of the most popular gaming sites and the point of this board is to discuss matters like these.

Gaming is a subjective medium; that's a given. But to give GOTY to a 2 - 3 hour experience that hardly constitues as such just rings a bit insincere when you take a look at the more game-y titles that are more fit contenders.

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D3s7rUc71oN

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#213 D3s7rUc71oN
Member since 2004 • 5180 Posts

[QUOTE="MadVybz"]

While I haven't played Journey I have been lurking in this thread and it's quite clear that there's the party that advocates both IGN and Gamespot's choice for it as GOTY and the others that see it a choice affected by recent events that have once again put video games in the limelight.

Given what I've seen I'm gonna have to side with the theory this is an outcome of media pressure. Since I can't pass judgment on Journey I won't say it is a bad game or bad experience, but it is quite clear that there is an agenda with these picks since there has been an ample amount of quality titles that came out this year which hold much more weight in the whole [i]game[/i] aspect of this medium, which Journey clearly lacks.

While I whole-heartedly believe that games can be form of art, there's a fine line between being a game and simply being an interactive experience, and Journey definitely fits in the latter.

GT90

I disagree that Gamespot and IGN gave into some so called media pressure due to the recent bouts of shootings. Why would they decide a game of the year on something like that?

A game is all about being allowed to have an interactive experience, which Journey is.

All in all, this is a fairly silly argument over peoples opinions on the game they decided was GOTY for them. Whether or not Journey constitutes a game? Who cares, people played loved it enough to say that it was a great game for them. It's no different then when someone rates a game low, yet you might in fact love the game.

This isn't setting any precedent, it's just a group of people saying that, they happen to love a game enough to call it GOTY.

I haven't had the chance to play Journey, but hard to justify GOTY when its a 2 hour game compared to other candidates with replay value. I've read that there's a rumour that for a film to be nominated for best picture, a film has to be at least 2 hours long. I've noticed noticed movies have been over 2 hours long lately.

Now for a game like Journey to be GOTY, it has to be one of the best 2 damn hours I've experienced ever in gaming and from what I've seen I doubt it. I'll get to play it soon enough though.

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MirkoS77

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#214 MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 17640 Posts

The only reason why I'm leaning towards this as opposed to them genuinely rewarding Journey's merit (which, by the way, hardly amounts to anything) is because this is it totally out of the blue.

MadVybz

Wait a minute. By your own admission you've yet to play it, yet are making the claim it has no merit? On which basis are you making this aside from others' opinions? Your posts would be a lot more credible after you've played Journey instead of attempting to put forth an opinion on it through somebody else's. I'm not saying you don't have points, but until you play Journey for yourself they have no grounds for support.

Or did I misinterpret?

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MadVybz

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#215 MadVybz
Member since 2009 • 2797 Posts

[QUOTE="MadVybz"]

The only reason why I'm leaning towards this as opposed to them genuinely rewarding Journey's merit (which, by the way, hardly amounts to anything) is because this is it totally out of the blue.

MirkoS77

Wait a minute. By your own admission you've yet to play it, yet are making the claim it has no merit? On which basis are you making this aside from others' opinions? Your posts would be a lot more credible after you've played Journey instead of attempting to put forth an opinion on it through somebody else's. I'm not saying you don't have points, but until you play Journey for yourself they have no grounds for support.

Or did I misinterpret?

I'm not saying it has no merit, I'm saying that rewarding it for its merit hardly amounts to anything. In other words, calling it GOTY doesn't mean much to me, I'm just interested in why it has.

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Saladin__7

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#216 Saladin__7
Member since 2012 • 116 Posts
I haven't played it, yet. I'm going to give it a chance since it received two GOTYs awards.
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LoG-Sacrament

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#217 LoG-Sacrament
Member since 2006 • 20397 Posts
I've read that there's a rumour that for a film to be nominated for best picture, a film has to be at least 2 hours long.D3s7rUc71oN
where'd you hear that? :P the artist won the oscar for best picture last year and it is 100 minutes. the king's speech won it the year before at 118 minutes. that same year, 8 out of the 10 nominees were under 2 hours. you can check out the link here to see all the winners.
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#218 D3s7rUc71oN
Member since 2004 • 5180 Posts

[QUOTE="D3s7rUc71oN"]I've read that there's a rumour that for a film to be nominated for best picture, a film has to be at least 2 hours long.LoG-Sacrament
where'd you hear that? :P the artist won the oscar for best picture last year and it is 100 minutes. the king's speech won it the year before at 118 minutes. that same year, 8 out of the 10 nominees were under 2 hours. you can check out the link here to see all the winners.

TV a few nights ago, don't remember which show .

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LoG-Sacrament

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#219 LoG-Sacrament
Member since 2006 • 20397 Posts

[QUOTE="LoG-Sacrament"][QUOTE="D3s7rUc71oN"]I've read that there's a rumour that for a film to be nominated for best picture, a film has to be at least 2 hours long.D3s7rUc71oN

where'd you hear that? :P the artist won the oscar for best picture last year and it is 100 minutes. the king's speech won it the year before at 118 minutes. that same year, 8 out of the 10 nominees were under 2 hours. you can check out the link here to see all the winners.

TV a few nights ago, don't remember which show .

well, the show was plainly wrong.
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edgewalker16

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#220 edgewalker16
Member since 2005 • 2286 Posts

Since when are video games not an experience? The opposite line of thinking is completely asinine.

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wiouds

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#221 wiouds
Member since 2004 • 6233 Posts

Since when are video games not an experience? The opposite line of thinking is completely asinine.

edgewalker16

Gameplay should be a important part of a game. Having a game of the year only because it is an experience is completely asinine.

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#222 Bigboi500
Member since 2007 • 35550 Posts

[QUOTE="edgewalker16"]

Since when are video games not an experience? The opposite line of thinking is completely asinine.

wiouds

Gameplay should be a important part of a game. Having a game of the year only because it is an experience is completely asinine.

Every game can't be everything to everybody. Sometimes games only do one thing over the other, and there's nothing wrong with that. Gamespot thought Journey was good enough to be GOTY, so who are we to say they're right or wrong?

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#223 Black_Knight_00
Member since 2007 • 77 Posts

[QUOTE="LoG-Sacrament"][QUOTE="D3s7rUc71oN"]I've read that there's a rumour that for a film to be nominated for best picture, a film has to be at least 2 hours long.D3s7rUc71oN

where'd you hear that? :P the artist won the oscar for best picture last year and it is 100 minutes. the king's speech won it the year before at 118 minutes. that same year, 8 out of the 10 nominees were under 2 hours. you can check out the link here to see all the winners.

TV a few nights ago, don't remember which show .

You read something on TV?
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CarnageHeart

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#224 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

While I haven't played Journey I have been lurking in this thread and it's quite clear that there's the party that advocates both IGN and Gamespot's choice for it as GOTY and the others that see it a choice affected by recent events that have once again put video games in the limelight.

Given what I've seen I'm gonna have to side with the theory this is an outcome of media pressure. Since I can't pass judgment on Journey I won't say it is a bad game or bad experience, but it is quite clear that there is an agenda with these picks since there has been an ample amount of quality titles that came out this year which hold much more weight in the whole game aspect of this medium, which Journey clearly lacks.

While I whole-heartedly believe that games can be form of art, there's a fine line between being a game and simply being an interactive experience, and Journey definitely fits in the latter.

MadVybz

Given that reviewers have been excited about Journey since before its launch (Gamespot named it among its most anticipated games back in early 2011) and it got stellar reviews when it finally hit back in March, your theory just doesn't make sense.

http://www.gamespot.com/special_feature/most-anticipated-2011/day-5/index.html?page=6

There reason the line is so fine is that its newly drawn by adrenaline junkies butthurt that a game without a bodycount won GoTY. Adventure games without action go back a long way (roughly 3 decades) so the December 2012 movement to declare that such games aren't games is just a bizarre, ahistorical internet thing.

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MadVybz

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#227 MadVybz
Member since 2009 • 2797 Posts

Given that reviewers have been excited about Journey since before its launch (Gamespot named it among its most anticipated games back in early 2011) and it got stellar reviews when it finally hit back in March, your theory just doesn't make sense.

There reason the line is so fine is that its newly drawn by adrenaline junkies butthurt that a game without a bodycount won GoTY. Adventure games without action go back a long way (roughly 3 decades) so the December 2012 movement to declare that such games aren't games is just a bizarre, ahistorical internet thing.

CarnageHeart

Your assumption that I don't call Journey a game simply because it lacks action is just straight up false; I don't call Journey a game because it lacks conventions that would make it one (challenge, punishment, requirement of skill and/or luck). I've played plenty of adventure games without action but still constitute some elements that make it an actual game.

Also, being excited about a game before its launch doesn't mean anything in regards to this argument. I'm more than positive that reviewers were excited for a number of games before their release, that doesn't atuomatically make any choice for GOTY a given.

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CarnageHeart

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#228 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

Given that reviewers have been excited about Journey since before its launch (Gamespot named it among its most anticipated games back in early 2011) and it got stellar reviews when it finally hit back in March, your theory just doesn't make sense.

There reason the line is so fine is that its newly drawn by adrenaline junkies butthurt that a game without a bodycount won GoTY. Adventure games without action go back a long way (roughly 3 decades) so the December 2012 movement to declare that such games aren't games is just a bizarre, ahistorical internet thing.

MadVybz

Your assumption that I don't call Journey a game simply because it lacks action is just straight up false; I don't call Journey a game because it lacks conventions that would make it one (challenge, punishment, requirement of skill and/or luck). I've played plenty of adventure games without action but still constitute some elements that make it an actual game.

Also, being excited about a game before its launch doesn't mean anything in regards to this argument. I'm more than positive that reviewers were excited for a number of games before their release, that doesn't atuomatically make any choice for GOTY a given.

Did you play Journey since you stated yesterday that you hadn't?

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CarnageHeart

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#229 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

[QUOTE="MadVybz"]

While I haven't played Journey I have been lurking in this thread and it's quite clear that there's the party that advocates both IGN and Gamespot's choice for it as GOTY and the others that see it a choice affected by recent events that have once again put video games in the limelight.

Given what I've seen I'm gonna have to side with the theory this is an outcome of media pressure. Since I can't pass judgment on Journey I won't say it is a bad game or bad experience, but it is quite clear that there is an agenda with these picks since there has been an ample amount of quality titles that came out this year which hold much more weight in the whole game aspect of this medium, which Journey clearly lacks.

While I whole-heartedly believe that games can be form of art, there's a fine line between being a game and simply being an interactive experience, and Journey definitely fits in the latter.

dvader654

Given that reviewers have been excited about Journey since before its launch (Gamespot named it among its most anticipated games back in early 2011) and it got stellar reviews when it finally hit back in March, your theory just doesn't make sense.

http://www.gamespot.com/special_feature/most-anticipated-2011/day-5/index.html?page=6

There reason the line is so fine is that its newly drawn by adrenaline junkies butthurt that a game without a bodycount won GoTY. Adventure games without action go back a long way (roughly 3 decades) so the December 2012 movement to declare that such games aren't games is just a bizarre, ahistorical internet thing.

I do thi I Journey is a game and I understand why it's loved. That said it has nothing to do that it is non violent. If its an adventure game it's a poor adventure game. If its a play former it's a poor platformer. In all gameplay terms it is a poor game. But games have other elements and Journey does most of those exceptionally well.

Well yes, its guilty of being non-traditional, even for an adventure game. Different/innovative and bad aren't the same thing.

I take pride in my eloquence and dislike hiding behind the words of others, but I feel I am repeating myself again and again, so perhaps I am using the wrong words. To mix things up a bit, I am posting a Forbes review of Journey written by someone whose perspective mirrors my own (interestingly, the guy even compares the journey to a pilgrimage, as I did in an early post in the Journey thread).

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2012/12/04/journey-review-making-video-games-beautiful/

But wouldnt all this work just as well as a silent, animated film? After all, in Journey you never fight. You dont score points or compete with anyone. You dont make meaningful choices or venture about an open world. There is no clear set of goals or obstacles to achieve or overcome.

My answer to this question is a flat-out No. The game would not work just as well as a silent, animated film (even if that film would be remarkable itself.) The fact that it has become the most downloaded game on the PlayStation Network surely proves how much its appreciated as a member of this particular type of media.

More importantly, Journey is meant to be experienced rather than observed. This is true of all games, or at least it ought to be true of all games. Certainly we observe a great deal while we play, as video games are a visual and audible artform, but its the actions we take in the game itself that make it so much fun.

Journey tells its story through its gameplay and visuals, including a few brief cutscenes, and never directs us from some out-of-game place. There is no tutorial, no Mash X that pops up on screen, nobody telling you where youre going or why. The storytelling is purely about the game experience itself.

Exploration, Awe, and Danger

But what an odd game it is. None of the puzzles are terribly challenging. Theyre not intended to confound so much as they are to give the landscape its true depth, to provide meat to the exploration. To make it an adventure as well as a pilgrimage.

Lighting up ribbons to create bridges, or ducking behind stones to avoid the gusts of wind, or leaping through the air between floating ribbon jellyfishthese are not terribly complicated maneuvers, and yet theyre incredibly rewarding.

Even just sliding and floating down a huge corridor of flowing sand is a breathtaking experience, and being in control of how you make that descent causes it to be not merely a visual feast or something to observe, but something that is actively fun to do.

The beauty of the earlier levels makes the darker levels all the more terrifying. You are not a warrior in the game. You are prey, not predator, and when the stone dragons come you have no option but to flee or hide. On your first playthrough, this comes as something of a shock. Up to this point, all was peaceful. Your journey was unmarred by enemies. Your obstacles were benign.

But the cave and the subsequent windswept, snow-covered heights are deadly and dangerous, and while these areas are still gorgeous, theyre filled with tension and struggle.

Few games capture struggle the way Journey does. Climbing those last heights, being wounded by the dragons, hiding and clawing your way forward into the buffeting gales with nothing but an increasingly short magical cape to aid youthe sense of struggle is palpable. Even in the way your faceless avatar bends against the wind, or falls to the earth shows just how perilous and difficult this pilgrimage has become.

Which brings us to the other unique aspect of the gameits multiplayer component.

The Loneliest Number

I didnt know anything about Journey going in, and it was surprising when another player appeared. Nameless, this player looked just like mine, but I could tell instantly that it was another person and not some computer AI.

Isnt that remarkable in and of itself, that we can tell simply by how an onscreen avatar moves around the world that its a human and not a pre-programmed part of the game?

Isnt it fascinating that we can sniff out one anothers humanity with no voice chat, no names or handles, no dialogue or form of communication beyond the little musical chirpings that comprise the only thing near to speech we find in the game?

Journey is a game that you begin on your own, and one thatfor a whileyou may continue to play on your own. But at least in my experience, its not a game you will finish alone.

I made it through the entire desert and much of the cave without relying on the aid of a companion. I didnt even realize for a while that proximity with another traveler could refill my capes power. That mechanic I discovered partly out of necessity, and Im still a bit stunned at how brilliant it is. This reliance on one another thats programmed into the game is what makes it so captivating.

As I began to climb the final slopes and the wind and the dragons became more dire and my own situation more desperate, I found myself and this other anonymous person clinging to one another as we moved up the slope.

When I was tossed aside by a dragon, left lying half-broken in the snow, the other traveler ran back for me. We climbed together.

At this point, the idea of climbing alone had vanished from my thoughts entirely even though so often in games the solo route is the one I take.

In a way that no other multiplayer game has done, I felt the necessity of companionship in Journey. In literally no MMO Ive ever played have I felt that need, but in Journey that sense of struggle feeds directly into a sense of camaraderie. Its deeply affecting. The whole game is moving in a way I dont yet fully understand.

Walking slowly into the light at the top of the mountainMount Doom, my wife jokingly referred to it asnext to that other player. I was nearly speechless.

It was so much more profound than walking alone.

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Sushiglutton

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#230 Sushiglutton
Member since 2009 • 9839 Posts
It's a unique game/experience and it def has its qualities. That said I don't think it does anything interestingly mechanically. To me a game should push gameplay more to be GOTY, but I respect that not everyone feel that way :).
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MadVybz

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#231 MadVybz
Member since 2009 • 2797 Posts

Did you play Journey since you stated yesterday that you hadn't?

CarnageHeart
Unfortunately, no. As much as I'd like to, I don't own a PS3 and have no interest in getting one.
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CarnageHeart

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#234 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

That preview you posted carnage shows how the previews stretched the truth as to what Journey is. They say you get to explore a world, to me that sounds like an open world not small individual levels. It says you meet other online but what you do with them is up to you, if you like you can go your own way if you'd like. You can't go your own way there is nowhere to go! The previews made this game sound incredible but the result is very simplistic. What makes me feel so weird is that instead of asking for all these great ideas to be put in the game many are patting thatgamecompany on the back and handing them awards for a game that had far far more potential.dvader654

It was a review, not a preview. Also, did you read it? The line below is from the first paragraph.

You dont make meaningful choices or venture about an open world.

Also, as I pointed out before, there are ability enhancing collectibles explorers can find so yes, there are different ways to play (as I observed in my initial posts in the official thread). Your determination to ignore that incovenient fact (which doesn't fit your narrative) doesn't make it less true.

I find it puzzling that you pour scorn on the multiplayer given that you initially praised it, but I don't doubt you genuinely dislike the game, I just don't think you've found a tangible reason to dislike it (which is fine and good, like is entirely subjective).

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CarnageHeart

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#235 CarnageHeart
Member since 2002 • 18316 Posts

Carnage we are all talking in circles cause in the end we simply have two very opposing viewpoints which won't change. The best we can do is explain out thoughts and you have done so well. For me where that Forbes review talks about the wonder of going through this landscape, I see the inner workings of a game designed in such a way to limit the players action to make sure they experience those things which so many feel happen naturally. They mention the struggle they felt as your character struggles to climb the mountain, yes this game does a good job of making you feel that climb through animation. That said Uncharted 3 did the same thing and I still found it to be very boring then. Large stretches where all you do is hold up as you see your character struggle, not very interesting. An example of that done right is MGS4 where Snake is crawling for his life, you don't simply press up. you must mash the buttons which puts you right in the struggle. Snakes struggle is your struggle, you actually feel it not just watch it because you must keep pushing on even when you are tired. It's still not that interesting but it is far more engaging than holding up and it does a far better job of expressing struggle in this medium than Journey does. The compliments about the coop seem so over exaggerated to the point where it feels like they never play coop games. Do you guys always play coop games where the other player totally ignores you? I never use voice chat and I have silently worked together with many random people on many games and the grand grand majority always help. It is NOT unique to Journey to have someone stop and help you, it happens in all coop games and in others usually far more spectacularly than Journey. It's compliments like those that confuse me so much, what games are you guys playing that makes you say what happens in Journey's coop is that special. Is it well done? absolutely, it's a very well done coop system but not the incredible unique experience so many make it out to be.dvader654

March 2012 dvader654 strongly disagrees :P.

http://www.gamespot.com/forums/topic/29015233/journey-thread-of-quotlivin-in-a-lonely-worldquot?page=5

I played straight through with what I thought was one other person but it turns out it was two people. Both were great companions allowing me to lead and helping each other out when needed. The multiplayer aspect was fantastic and so seemless. Having limited communication and goals that dont feel like you are competing but simply aiding each other creates the perfect formula for co-op.

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S0lidSnake

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#236 S0lidSnake
Member since 2002 • 29001 Posts

Since this thread is still going, I am going to take a stab at something that was said a few pages ago... that Walking Dead and Heavy Rain cant be classified as games. This is the biggest load of BS I've ever heard. Walking Dead and Heavy Rain are adventure games. We've always had adventure games. The point and click adventure games on the PC are GAMES. They are just as worthy of winning GOTYs as your yearly Halo or Call of Duty. Imagine if someone said Treasure Island or the Sam & Max games dont qualify for GOTY because they aren't games. You may not like them but they are very much video games. Heavy Rain is still the most intense game I've ever experienced. It revamped QTEs and turned it into a control scheme. Walking Dead has made QTEs even more exhilirating and 'challenging' by introducing the aiming mechanics. Walking Dead is as deserving of a GOTY as any other game I've played this year, and its exhilirating point and click + QTE gameplay is a huge reason why.

Other than that, I agree with dvader in that Journey tries to do a lot of gamey things but doesn't do anything well. It has platforming, but it's devoid of any challenge. It has exploration, but the levels are too small. It has puzzles, but they are devoid of any challenge. It has coop, but I've had better coop experinces in the phenomenal Uncharted 2 coop on Crushing and Gears 3 horde mode. What it does well is how it makes you 'feel', and I'd disagree that that alone should warrant it a GOTY award. It's a game first and in order for it to win the best game awards, it needs to do gamey things better.

The Uncharted 3 comparison is PERFECT. Some people loved the Village scene from Uncharted 2 where all you do is walk, do a soccer QTE, pet some cows and shake hands with locals. So ND gave us a half a dozen of those segments in Uncharted 3 and they were the most boring segments in a game I've ever played. What's so different here other than the fact that you fly and slide instead of walk? You are still going through the game as if its on rails.

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IndianaJosh

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#237 IndianaJosh
Member since 2003 • 5159 Posts

I think too many people get caught up on the word game. These are not just games, these are video games. We use the term "video game" for a wide range of interative media because it's the name that stuck. Video games are evolving and our definitions of "video games" must evolve and broaden as well.

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Zensword

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#239 Zensword
Member since 2007 • 4510 Posts
It's just the opinion/choice of some people. Thre's no wrong or right in deciding which game to win GOTY award. It's a 2 hour downloadablle game, so what ? It's still a game. You may disagree with GP or IGN but saying it's the "wrong" choice is just silly.
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MirkoS77

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#240 MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 17640 Posts

The compliments about the coop seem so over exaggerated to the point where it feels like they never play coop games. Do you guys always play coop games where the other player totally ignores you? I never use voice chat and I have silently worked together with many random people on many games and the grand grand majority always help. It is NOT unique to Journey to have someone stop and help you, it happens in all coop games and in others usually far more spectacularly than Journey. It's compliments like those that confuse me so much, what games are you guys playing that makes you say what happens in Journey's coop is that special. Is it well done? absolutely, it's a very well done coop system but not the incredible unique experience so many make it out to be.dvader654

You say you never use voice chat and have silently worked together with many random people in other games and that many help. I never do also and I've seen the same as well. The difference with Journey however is that the language system is entirely universal yet at the same time is "spoken". I was a bit taken aback when I received a message in my inbox in Japanese after completing one game, which after a bit of research turned out to be a thank you note. The entire time I just assumed the other player was English speaking. Have you played a multiplayer game where you didn't speak the same language with the other player yet were able to communicate audibly/visually with them at the same time in such an efficient and simplistic manner, yet with each playthrough the language can take different forms? If not, then how is Journey's multiplayer aspect not unique? I'm not saying there's not another game out there that's done this, but I can't think of one off the top of my head. And if there is, I don't remember it being so well implemented that it left such a lasting impression.

In any case, it edified to me the idea that the complexity and nuances of language can be just as much a barrier as it can an aid, and that even though it may be broken down to its most basic level, with a bit of experimentation and patience each player will come to understand what the other is trying to say despite the fact they more than likely couldn't recite each other's alphabet if their lives depended on it. It's that exact experimentation and patience which is the reason I came to feel close to my other half. It took mutual effort, and like in any relationship, that is the foundation that builds intimacy. This is the reason I felt such a powerful connection to the other player by the end....a connection that is entirely absent while playing any other multiplayer game where we both remained silent throughout, regardless if we were helping each other. Because if we were silent we weren't even trying, and if we were speaking, we still weren't trying. That we could "speak", but only using the most rudimentary of means that required cooperation simply to try to interpret each other is what makes the co-op so amazing. It affords just enough, but not quite enough.

So I really don't see how Journey is not unique in this respect and I find the way that it is done elevates it to a far more spectacular level than can be claimed in the far majority of other multiplayer experiences out there. It tore down the barriers that we've always seen as bridges to relations yet manages to maintain that relation to an effective level, and therein lies its brilliance.

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GodModeEnabled

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#243 GodModeEnabled
Member since 2005 • 15314 Posts
All these Gamespots editors top ten lists and journey makes it onto like two lists out of ten. GOTY fo sho guyz 2 hour do nothing game ftw.
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Black_Knight_00

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#244 Black_Knight_00
Member since 2007 • 77 Posts
I'll just leave this here, in case someone needs it:
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homegirl2180

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#245 homegirl2180
Member since 2004 • 7161 Posts
I like the game, but I don't see how people cry during something like this. My favourite reviewer of this site, Kevin VanOrd, says he was brought to tears multiple times while playing the game. It makes no sense to me. I get the game. I understand its subtleties. I've replayed it twice. I never felt near tears. I liked flower better.
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MirkoS77

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#246 MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 17640 Posts

Of course I have played games with people who didn't speak the language. I have played RE games like outbreak with Japanese players and in those games there are universal commands used to communicate. Its no different than Journey.

dvader654

It's completely different, because Journey doesn't use universal commands. That's the entire point. There is no drop down menu, no pre-assigned quick buttons to communicate that both sides can understand to know exactly what they are being told or asked to do. In Journey, that is up to each player to determine and work out between each other. This is NOT a detriment to the experience as you seem to believe it is, nor is it a product of poor design. It's intentional, and it's because of that aspect (limited and minimalist as it may be) that leads to a stronger feeling of connection to the other player. You may see this as a fault, I see it as the game's biggest strength.

I'm sure you've constantly heard of people saying how they felt very attached, even to the point of sadness and regret at the end on having to leave? That (as I mentioned) complete strangers leave thank you notes afterwards? Have you ever asked yourself why many feel this way? I know why I've felt the above and have tried to elaborate on such, but I'd like to hear your thoughts. What is it about Journey that seems to make such feelings of closeness to another that many, if not most, games lack?

Any game without voice chat that has some communication button does this as well, most do it better cause they have multiple ways to communicate and to work together cause most of these games are far more complex than Journey. You are painting this incredible picture of something Journey does that many games have done before and better. That is the kind of thing that is bugging me about all this.

dvader654

I'm not trying to paint an incredible picture, I'm just giving my opinion based on my time with the game. And I'm working on limiting my hyperbole, it's a work in progress. :) Besides, what "many other games have done before and better"? I'd like to hear names, and not games with assigned communication methods, but ones such as Journey where nothing is known or set in stone but still allows communication between the language barrier. Until you can provide some, I don't accept your assertion that it is not unique and it has been done before and better. Especially for the type of game it is.

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lozengez

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#247 lozengez
Member since 2011 • 490 Posts
[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]All these Gamespots editors top ten lists and journey makes it onto like two lists out of ten. GOTY fo sho guyz 2 hour do nothing game ftw.

Yeah, what's that about? Pretty much the same with IGN too.
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00-Riddick-00

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#249 00-Riddick-00
Member since 2009 • 18884 Posts


buncha sony fanboys