Hatred is on Steam

http://store.steampowered.com/app/341940/

For the first time ever Steam has decided to sell an AO rated game. While there currently is no option to preorder on steam itself, the fact that it has a store page and that if you preordered on the devs site you will have already been given a key suggests that it is pretty likely there to stay.

So is this a good thing or not? Personally I'm glad, while I think Steam really needs better quality control, I don't see how a game being too adult is a bad thing. There are quite a few good games that are unfortunately hard to get hold of due to many stores not wanting to stock them because of their content.

On the other hand is this just more proof that steams quality control has declined even more? Now steams not only contains unfinished pieces of crap like The Slaughtering Grounds, but also now stocks what is arguably gore porn.

This also raises the question on pornographic games. Steam really need to release an official statement on the image they want for their store and exactly what is allowed and what isn't.

I don't have an issue with this. I think Steam should do a better job curating and vetting incompetent Early Access developers than outright banning a developer with an AO rated game.

I also don't feel like steam really needs to provide a statement on pornographic games. The game is rated AO, but it also clearly has no nudity or any other content typically associated with pornographic games.

Well I don't have a problem with AO rated games being on Steam per se but I think this "game" is pure trash so I certainly have no interest in it.

But they don't have a rule forbidding pornographic games. Until now they didn't allow any AO game which included all pornographic games. But now that they allow AO games I see no reason they shouldn't allow pornographic games as well.

This. I don't fault Steam for carrying but I also wouldn't fault them for not carrying it. It's up to them to decide what they do and don't carry because it's their service and any claim about "censorship" or "free speech" would be based on a lack of understanding of what either of those concepts are.

But yeah, I think the game is trash. There are a ton of counterarguments to people like Jack Thompson who claim that GTA is a "murder simulator" but then crap like this comes out and takes a giant step backwards for gaming.

-Byshop

Will likely buy to support the freedom of the medium.

I have no issues with this for the sheer sake that If I dislike an aspect of a game then I simply won't buy it, but my dislike for something shouldn't be grounds to prevent others to enjoy something I dislike.
And for those that say that this will mean pornographic games are going to enter Steam I just have to say two things. You don't know that, and So?

graphics in this game look like shit. All greys and browns, reminds me of more poopy version of gears of war.

Maybe this game will be moddable and people will fix the graphics, who knows? As it is, it looks like trash.

Steam US store is selling a AO rated game.

Steam Rest of the World is not selling a AO rated game since we do not go by the US ratings board and US is not the world.

So no it does not raise a question of pornographic games or other AO rated games. But is it a good thing? well Steam is a global platform and the game was greenlit so people clearly want it. And Yes its a good thing that the choice is there and no liberal minded moron got it taken down. Which is a oxymoron in itself.

Never saw a problem with this game. For **** sakes people have been doing exactly what this game is about in 100's of other games for years. It just wasn't the main focus.

Your first point makes no sense. Steam don't sell those games that were rated AO even in the countries where they were rated lower. They don't moderate out of obligation but made a wilful decision to not sell any game to anyone if it were rated AO by the ESRB.

And how does it not raise a question? They've thrown out the last concrete standard they had (other than stolen content and viruses) So why won't they start selling porn games? I doubt they will but seeing how they sell Hatred why not? Like I said they really need to give an official statement.

Now... will they PLEASE sell Manhunt 2?

Good. Very good. My respect and admiration for Valve and Newell increases.

If Steam chose not to carry the product you would call that oppression?

That's Steam's decision as a retailer. Would be a dumb decision, considering the amount of revenue this game will generate due to the controversy, but their own.

I'm still trying to figure out where people seem to have gotten early copies of the game, given that they are already saying that the game is 'trash'.

Hatred is everywhere, especially on the internet.

Porn games have neglectable sales, and that would be doubly true on a platform (Steam) where you can see what your friends own and how much they are playing it, and the meager earnings those games would bring in are not worth the can of worms of bad press Valve would open as soon as conservative media found out they were selling porn games.

The same can be said for extremely violent games.

Not even close to the same. A nipple generates a bigger shitstorm than a hundred exploding heads. Humans are stupid like that.

That's more of an American thing.

The first is pretty straight forward. i know Valve is a US based company but its only the american rating that is AO. So until its actually being released in the Us they don't have AO rated game on steam.

And it does not raise a question because clearly there are politics involved in the rating it got. And not to mention that porn is a whole different ballgame and has no place whatsoever on steam.

This isn't complicated. Until now if a game were rated AO steam wouldn't sell it, even in countries that don't use the ESRB.

How are porn games different? Both have the same age restriction put on them. If anything porn is more suitable than violence as sex is inherently a good thing while violence is not.

I guess Steam just doesn't deem porn games as suitable. I think you have to remember that Steam is a privately owned company and they are under no obligation to publish their criteria for accepting games. Steam sells tons of NR (not rated) games where as a console system never would. Hatred could've easily been an NR game and it would hardly have matter. Suddenly labeling it as AO is a huge deal? I don't think it is. Steam does what Steam wants because its fine for them to be completely arbitrary about who they choose. You may not like that as a consumer, and thats fine. But i think in this instance, it really hardly matters and it isn't worth getting worked up or even concerned about.

Where did I say they were obligated? If you read my posts you'd see I said the exact opposite. Before steam willingly decided to not sell a game if it were rated AO, now they abandoned that rule. That opens quite a few possibilities in games they may release in the future.

I'm not saying they will start selling porn games, but the way I see it it's better to have porn games than something like Hatred.

I did not say that you feel they are obligated. However, you do feel as if Steam has some sort of rule about AO games and that they've now "abandoned" it. Says who? They are not obligated to even *consider* other AO games.

You do realise that you can set up rules for yourself? Like I said it was a self made rule that they now no longer follow.

A person on a diet usually has a rule of no junk food, that doesn't mean they are obligated to not eat junk food. Obligation and rules are not interchangeable.

Not really. Pretty much every culture has a bigger taboo for sex than it has for violence.

Over here we have topless models in our newspapers so I'm not so sure about that.

Where's "overe here", and define "newspaper"

Also, Valve is an american corporation, so...

UK, The Sun which is the second highest selling newspaper contains topless models on page 3.

The idea that sex is worse than violence is mostly an American thing (at least in western countries) Most places see violence as worse. That doesn't mean the attitude towards sex is great, but it's better than the attitude towards violence.

The Sun is a tabloid, (in)famous for that page 3. That's not really something that's widely embedded in the culture, mate, I'm sorry. We too have some TV guides with tits here (italy). They are literally just TV guides sold over the counter, with softcore pictures of naked chicks, but that's not a symptom of anything: my point is that if you were seen reading one of those on a park bench, you'd be looked down upon far more than the guy sitting next to you reading an issue of, say, horror film magazine Fangoria with on the cover Jason Vorhees slicing up some happy campers. That's just how it goes. If your mum came to visit and walked in on you unannounced, what would shock her more: seeing you playing Gears of War or seeing you watching a porno? Why do people remember politicians more for their sex scandals than for the missile strikes they ordered?

The point being that violence and sex are on completely different levels when it comes to their taboo level.

You're assuming that I'm basing my entire argument on that. that was just one humorous example.

The fact is that films and games get higher age restrictions when they contain violence than if they contain sex. For example Mass Effect is rated 12 the BBFC but M by ESRB. I've seen a few films that contain nudity that are only rated pg or 12. While violent films tend to get higher age restrictions than they do in America.

Like I said sex is still a bit of a taboo, but not as much as a taboo as violence is.

The BBFC no longer rates games in the UK since 2012: Mass Effect now holds an 18+ PEGI rating in all of Europe, UK included.

They still rate games, just not all of them, now they only do ones that are refused classification by PEGI. However what I said about things with violence usually getting lower rating in the US than else where while things with sex getting rated higher still holds true.

@Archangel3371: You haven't even played it yet.

You don't need to play something to make an opinion on it. You look at it and make the opinion of either you like it and are interested in playing it or you don't and are not interested in playing it.

This game looks like shit but so what?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Board_of_Film_Classification#Video_Games

"The BBFC has also rated some video games. Normally these are exempt from classification, unless they depict human sexual activity, human genital organs or gross acts of violence, in which case the publishers should submit the game for classification. Publishers may opt to submit a game for classication even if they are not obliged to.

Under the Digital Economy Act 2010, the responsibility for rating video games in the United Kingdom has passed from the BBFC to the Video Standards Council.^[25] A game is only submitted to the BBFC if it contains strong pornographic material or if it includes video material that is not directly accessible through the game itself (e.g. a documentary)."

I think that's quite eloquent: sexual activity and genitalia were previously put on the same level as "gross acts of violence" in the category of content that requires rating.This was until 2010. Today violence is not even contemplated by the BBFC, only strong sexual content is. Aside from that, since 2012 it's also all under the PEGI umbrella.

So many times have the media and controversy about games proven to be just wrong when you actually get to feel the game yourself.

I'm not calling it trash because of how it might play on a technical level, I'm calling it trash because I don't care for the concept of it. I see no entertainment value in it for me.

You are right this is not complicated. Hatred´s developers made a huge error in sending in it to get the ESRB rating. But its still only a american rating.

And porn games are different because they are porn games and porno doesnt make for a good image for Steam not to mention that such games about nothing but self gratification has no place on any platform where there are kids under 18. Hatred might be a somewhat controversial game, but its still well within the line and the only reason that it got that AO rating and got some out of their chair is because they get their panties in a twist over anything not abiding their narrow minded world view.

No you dont have to play something to form a opinion, but any intelligent person would expand their horisont before forming their opinion.

Its so easy to "hate" something when you are blind to what it might be.

Yes perhaps if we were talking about forming an opinion on something that was actually important. We're talking about likes and dislikes of a video game which all we know of it is what we've seen which by all accounts is going to be indicitive of the final product. Hardly makes my opinion less intelligent then ayone else's on the game or blind to what it might be. If it turns out to be something more then I'll do whatever readjustment of my opinion as of now though my opinion is what it is and I stand by it regardless of what others might think.

You seemed to have formed your "intelligent" opinion quite clearly by calling this game pure trash with your first post.

We can do without mass killing simulators thanks.

I think it's super fucking lame.

Steam is going to allow a game like this on Steam, but other adult only games will not. It's beyond stupidity that Steam thinks a game that condones genocide is A okay, but graphic depictions of sex won't even get a chance.

I'd rather have both or none at all. Saying that other games go too far is ludicrous if they allow this to be on Steam.

@hxce: Yes I did. So what? Everything that I've seen from the game looks repulsive to me hence the term trash and once again I stand by it whether other people like it or not. Classifying it as intelligent or not is kind of silly. Is my opinion less intelligent simply because I don't like the game?

This game is nothing new. Postal 2 let you shoot up a town and pee on people's dead bodies, back in 2003