GameSpot GamePlay Episode 43: Slow Boat to Ireland

Giant Bomb's Matt Rorie gives us all he's got--and more!--on this week's pro-consumer, pro-panda podcast.

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 43: Slow Boat to Ireland

Host Kevin VanOrd welcomes Giant Bomb's own Matt Rorie, who tells us what he thinks about the Xbox One's used game policy between exhausted yawns. They're joined by Danny O'Dwyer, Tom Mc Shea, and Carolyn Petit, who analyze the joys of abysmal voice acting, interpret the Elder Scrolls, and discuss the true meaning of onomtapea. Er, aunomottopeea. Oops, it's ottomanohpeia.

Oh, forget it.

You can access all previous episodes on GameSpot here.

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 42: Put Some Pants On

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 41: A Boy Named Xbox

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 40: Happy Happyism

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 39: GameSpot GamePlay - The Movie: The Game

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 38: Sexual Dismemberment

GameSpot GamePlay Episode 37: Mascara Galaxy

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GameSpot senior editor Kevin VanOrd has a cat named Ollie who refuses to play Rock Band because he always gets stuck pla

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84 comments
Rizer
Rizer

25.44 In response to Kevin VanOrd question: I tend to replay rpgs more than anything else. Mass Effect, Dragon's Dogma, Persona, Disgaea, Skyrim, ect. Usually games that have large worlds, interactive stories or a great deal of customized experiences. I can replay them without getting bored or having the exact same experience every time. Graphics matter less to me then writing. I don't replay shooters like metro, or fighters like injustice, or racers as much because those games tend to feel linear and not very personal to me. 

th1zdwk
th1zdwk

Miller rocks his shades even in the hospital. And all the doctors and nurses know it. Do not touch the patient's sunglasses. It's vital.

slikjohnson
slikjohnson

In response to the what game do you always go back to?\

For me it is older rpg's I recently finally forked over 75 bucks to buy a copy of Suikoden 2 which I love and have beaten countless times yet I bought the game less than two week ago.

So my point is people don't need beautiful graphics to compel them to come back to play, it is more of the memories or experience that brings them back.

MuggyTadpole
MuggyTadpole

"Im gunna poop in yer ear"... best line..ever. haha

ejpaine
ejpaine

I kept going back to GTA 4 just to constantly explore and make up new games with my friends. Traded that game with my friend for BF3 and now I keep going back to that. Payed $60, got hundreds of hours of entertainment. Other games I keep playing: Minecraft, FIFA, rarely COD(but I had to put it). Also I have now purchased The Warriors by Rockstar on 3 different platforms. It wasn't cutting edge when it first came out on PS2, so take that for what its worth. 

Lhomity
Lhomity

Don't get me wrong, I'm in no way a supporter of this anti-used game thing, but I think calling it anti-consumer is a bit rich. I heard somebody ask the question: "Would you buy a system that doesn't let you sell used games?" ... Too late. Its called a PC. =/

Potential consumer issues aside, my biggest concern is the demise of the mom-and-pop video game retailers; those small boutique gaming stores. The average Joe selling his old games on eBay is also going to suffer as a result. I'm going to miss them. I'm not going to miss GameStop/EBGames. 

As much as I love boxed games, and the walk-in store experience in general, I'm at the point now where I would welcome a complete switch to a predominantly, if not entirely, digital distribution. Yes, it would alienate anybody who doesn't have an internet connection, but in the long-run, I think a Steam-like distribution system would be a great thing for consoles, and potentially create an environment where Sony and Microsoft compete with Valve and other similar services.

I blame GameStop for making the used game a mass retail item. Why should publishers have to compete with the very retailers they depend on? Every time GameStop sell a used recent-release game for their own benefit, that's 1 new copy they don't sell. GameStop (who also own EBGames) have over 6600 stores around the world. GameTrailers, GAME, and other retail chains, operate on a similar model. That's shipments that publishers do not sell, so those retailers can push more used games. 

'Exploitative' is the nicest word I can think of to describe their business model. GameStop exploit publishers, while they also exploit consumers with their awful $5 trade-in deals for games they resell at $50-55.

haze_blaze
haze_blaze

I could not disagree more with Tom or the rest of your staff... 

Granted, I rarely buy games used... so it does not affect me as much. But even if I could not buy a few used games p/ year, I would buy the system who's exclusives I enjoy the most. You all are crazy. I'm a gamer. I'm going to enjoy high quality gaming, period. "The AAA side of the industry can die"???? You can die. I want my high quality games. Obviously most gamers do as well... hence the tepid reception of the Wii U. 

Who asked for gmaes with multi-million dollar budgets? Gamers did. Every time a new graphics king comes out on pc, ps3, or 360... it's the most talked about thing on these very forums. Would series like Uncharted, Gears, Crysis, Metal Gear be so popular if they weren't also the cutting edge in terms of visuals??? Metal Gear's gameplay is perhaps the only one that stands out regardless of the visuals. 

More importantly... we can't buy used games on Steam. We can't buy used games on Android or iOS. We can't buy used music or movies on iTunes or Google Play. You all are arguing like a generation that has grown too old... And this coming from a 32 yr old gamer. The PS4 is my console of choice. And sure, I do hope they are more lenient with their used game policy so that I can buy games that I might not own otherwise... but I'm sure as hell not going to 'protest' the PS4 if they institute some used-game standard. Not being able to enjoy inFamous: Second Son, Killzone, more Uncharted or Lastest of Us, etc is punishing myself more so than Sony.

AntiH3ro97
AntiH3ro97

Very entertaining, thanks for the entertainment.

bernstein1986
bernstein1986

Hey @Kevin-V. Just want to say I started listening to your podcasts about a month back and they are great. I really enjoy the dynamic conversations that come out between you, Tom, and Caro. I usually listen to music while I'm working, but I've started listening to some of the older podcasts instead. There are a few other podcasts I tune in for, but the ones that you moderate here on gamespot are the only ones I listen to in their entirety. If I can't get through one during my workday I end up throwing it on when I get home. Please keep them going! 

Lexicar
Lexicar

"Another highly anticipated game that's going into a Paid Beta phase"? What the hell? It's now perfectly acceptable practice to pay to test unfinished products? Jesus, employers are doing it all wrong if we should be paying them for machinery and other infrastructure to produce their product. :P 

snova9308
snova9308

the only way they are taking away the used games from me and expect me to take it, is if they implement a system like steam sales on to their online purchase.

seriously, they charge full price for downloadable games, and they never drop the prices for even the really old games, and they wonder why the downloadable games don't sell? are they joking? if I can't get a physical copy, I expect some kind of a compensation for it, either a price drop, or some other incentive.

the reason steam is all digital, and yet people love it, is because they don't force the digital copy at us, they lure us with dirt cheap games, something microsoft, sony, ubisoft etc etc just don't seem to get.

Ducez_III
Ducez_III

I just replayed GTA San Andreas. That game looks like crap, but it's still awesome :P

sg_hobbes
sg_hobbes

The game I go back to all the time is Mirrors Edge. I own 3 copies of it on two platforms 2 on PS3 and 1 on pc. I just like running around parkor style. now if you excuse me i'm going to rant abit 


the whole used game market isn't an issue for me. I'm more worried about trying games before you buy them, lending games to friends, and actually owning the product that i just shelled out $50 to $60 for. When was the last time you played a demo that gave you a good representation of what the game actually was HELL WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU PLAYED A DEMO!!!(that wasn't for a xbla or psn game). It is getting harder and harder to try out a game before you buy it. With the excption of playstation+ which lets you play downloadable titles for an hour before you buy, it is getting harder and harder to test a game.

      On the testing games front I DON'T HAVE MONEY TO BUY EVERY SINGLE GAME. I have three gamer friends, besides COD (util last year at lest), we would buy one copy of a game and it would just make its way around. This worked well because COD and Halo were the only games that we were playing competivative multiplayer for that need multipul consoles to play togeather. Single player games we would just pass around and one person (me most of the time) actually owned the game (for example I own the first and third uncharted and my friend owns the second). This worked great because we all had our own collections and we could trade to try out different stuff. We are all different and fell that different stuff deserved to be in our respective collections.

     My last point is I WANT TO OWN THE STUFF THAT I BUY. If I buy a game I wan't to be able to play it for as long is i own the hardware and it can be connected to a display. I don't have that much of a problem with steam DRM beacause you can back up the games and if you really have to it is prety easy to find and use a crack if there is no other way to play a game on a pc anymore. With the XONE and PS3 being so connected I am genuanly worried that ounce the life of the system ends I won't be able to play the games that i paid for because the server that it's using to authencate it went down years ago. Its like buying an MMO and then the server goes away. all the money and time you put in is just gone.


wow this was longer than I expected i guess i should make a form post

DarthEnderX
DarthEnderX

I find it ironic that he said "If they're going to be anticonsumer and not let us do used games etc.  then we don't need that AAA industry to survive." and "We'll still have PC games and ios games etc."  when those are all game markets that ALREADY don't have used games...

FreedomPrime
FreedomPrime

I'm just gonna stick with steam and my PC. Indie games everywhere. hell, my favorite game right now is Dota 2 and that game is ugly. also counter strike GO is amazing.

FreedomPrime
FreedomPrime

Not every used game store discounts their games by $5. some are $10 to $15 off from the new price. compared to games spot that is a significant discount. what ween need is more mom and pop shops and less gamestops.

vgsak2005
vgsak2005

sorry if this ends up being a double post (don't think my last one posted). but to sum up: Get over the used game issue. You can't expect companies to allow people to install the same game on multiple hardrives for free. No one has an issue with not being able to share their Steam games or Xbox or PSN games. This is just an extension of that to games that you can opt to install from a physical disc. Second, it remains to be seen exactly how they want to work the used games market so no reason to get worked up until they actually bring details to the table

NovahJCMP
NovahJCMP

Gaming to me is not about finding what is the best. It's about finding what I like most and what I find most appealing. Yes PC gamers have sometimes made it crystal clear that PC's are superior and consoles suck. I still love consoles and I always will no matter what. I also love AAA games and the less expensive ones and I hope they continue to make both. It's not just about finding what gives you the most hours of gameplay but also about having a diverse and entertaining experience. Different games have different great aspects and i think its good to allow diversity into gaming. There are different outlets that serve these purposes and i think that all these outlets are needed. This comment could be redundant but oh well.

NovahJCMP
NovahJCMP

I keep going back to Skyrim, Assassins creed 2, gta 4, rdr, dishonored. Amazing interesting games which I love, which are AAA and which I keep going back to. Oops almost forgot MGS4. Far cry 3. Arkham City and definately Infamous 2. Sure I'm missing a few.

jayd02
jayd02

Paused at 25:49 to answer question.

I keep going back to MGS4.  For me it is a great game with a good replay value.  Some people would disagree but I love to get random weapons and run through people.  I like to give myself new challenges throughout the game by only using one weapon throughout the game.  It is a triple A game but it is old come on.  

I like to go back to The Godfather on the Wii.  For me the motion controls were simple yet fun.  For me I liked burning down shops.  I also liked to get into gang fights when trying to take over shops.  I have beaten that game so many times over it is ridiculous.

Borderlands 1 or 2.  I am currently going through 2 and it is just like one in some regards.  I like it though because it is fun to run and gun some guys with a friend.  To hear someone cry for their midget is still pretty funny to me.  I still get excited to find that next chest to see what I will get inside.

A game that I can't play now but wish I could is Tales of Symphonia for the GC.  I loved the story and the combat system.  The twists and turns in the story were a huge shock on my first time through.  Using different characters and having the ability to play with friends was a huge bonus.

Something I don't really understand is the lack of split screen in games today.  We do get a few but not as many as I feel we should.  Certain games that give you a team or a squad but then you can't split screen is crazy.  I am going to get Fuse just because it allows split screen.  They give use four controller ports developers, why do you only use one?  This is not to say that every game should but only when it would make sense.

jayd02
jayd02

Think about this, the amount of money that you have spent on gold over the years, you could have bought at least one or two more 360's with that money.

Lord_Python1049
Lord_Python1049

I can't help but be happy when someone says they like GTAIV :) 

And I agree that the Morrowind theme is THE BEST arrangement, it makes me a little teary hearing it. All the other arrangements seem way too convoluted,

WhiteStormy
WhiteStormy

I get that people are angry about the used games situation and the Xbox and I hear so many people say "vote with you wallet", but the problem is that sooooo many people have this "bend over and take it in the rear" attitude and say stuff like "I don't like what they're doing, but I'll probably still buy an Xbox anyways".  

I was listening to another video game themed podcast the other day (I won't name it), and the host and guest were both very critical of Microsoft and not happy about the direction they're going, but both still said they were planning on buying it.  WTF

MasterTazo
MasterTazo

In Brazil games are super expensive. They can cost from 80 to 120 dolars. The only reason that Xbox sold here was because it was easy to pirate.

DarkFrankhs
DarkFrankhs

The game(s) I always return to are the Pokemon series (which have terrible graphics) 

bosconator22
bosconator22

The game I keep going back to is The Binding of Isaac. I have slowly accumulated over 100 hours in that game over the last year+. I recently purchased Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen but haven't found time to give that a proper go.

max-hit
max-hit

Dark Souls is the most recent game that I always go back to. And from the old ones I always play Warcraft III campaigns from time to time.

max-hit
max-hit

I consider this to be so immature to play a game on easy and then judge it based on that play-through. It's almost like you play it because you have to, and as a result you miss everything that is significant about that game.

Kevin-V
Kevin-V moderator staff

@haze_blaze All good points. But you mention the tepid reception of the Wii U. I am curious, then, what you think of the Wii, which did not feature cutting-edge visuals, yet outsold the competition. If gamers only want cutting-edge visual games, why do you believe that the least technically proficient machines--The Wii and the DS--outsell the others?

You also say, "I want my high quality games." Does that mean you think high-quality games are only those that look like Uncharted and Crysis? Also, as we mentioned, Call of Duty is perennial the best selling game on the market, but notably, it does not feature the best-looking visuals in that space. If what "gamers" are asking for is cutting-edge visuals, then why are the best-selling games not the best-looking games available? Sure, many of those games you mention sell extraordinarily well. But what of the lesser-looking games that sell even better--and what of the gorgeous-looking games that sell poorly? What of Lost Planet 2 or Lair? If all people want are gorgeous games, are these just aberrations? What about games like Skylanders or Rock Band, which sell well despite not looking like God of War 3? I would highly disagree that the market only wants technically stunning visuals. That might be part of it, but there are other considerations. These "gamers" you speak of want all sorts of things, and what you read in forums is a minute representation of the audience. 

I responded to someone further down about Steam and mobile games. If Microsoft offered affordable digital downloads, we might feel very differently. But when Gears of War 1 still costs $30 to digitally purchase, there is a big problem. If Microsoft want to alleviate concerns, they need to prove that they are willing to do what Steam does: have sales and provide access to affordable downloads. That's a big part of the argument you are overlooking. 

You do have important things to say, obviously, and I am not trying to be contentious--only to show that this circumstance isn't black or white, and I have no ill will for people falling on either side of the fence, or, like most of us, somewhere in between. 

And obviously we only speak for ourselves based on the experiences we want. That's how it works. We don't even agree amongst our own group--we certainly can't pretend to speak for the masses! But we think it's important that this particular point of view be heard. 

haze_blaze
haze_blaze

And for the record, I already enjoy PC gaming... I have a high end Alienware rig and will upgrade again in a year or two. And I'm still not willing to 'settle' for just pc and mobile games (I'm not satisfied with mobile gaming any way... it doesn't come close to the pc or console experience for anyone but the most casual of gamers)... There are experiences that are only served on the console market. Just as there are experiences that are only served on the pc market. If you choose to limit your experiences, you speak for yourself, not the rest of us.

Kevin-V
Kevin-V moderator staff

@DarthEnderX I do get your point, but price is a big difference here. It's a couple of dollars to get Angry Birds. I can get long-lasting games on the PC for much less than a console equivalent--and Steam has constant sales that allow us to purchase great games at affordable prices, often large fractions of their console counterparts. As we pointed out, Gears of War 1 on the Xbox 360 still sells at a premium digital price. If Microsoft was balancing their used-game policy with more affordable digital pricing that showed a commitment to consumers, I suspect we would feel differently. 

brainiac1988
brainiac1988

@DarthEnderX  I can sell you my disc of Shogun 2: Total War, along with the CD key and you will be able to play it dude.. No extra fee needed!

If you bought the physical disc its no problem.  Thats why I dont purchase digital copies...like on Steam, Origin etc.

brainiac1988
brainiac1988

@vgsak2005  Im not getting over the used games issue.  Its just wrong.  

When I buy a game disc, it is my property.  If I sell it to my friend, then its his.

They have no right to ask my friend any more money for it because they have already recieved payment for the disc when I went to the store to buy it. 

There are other ways to deal with this... This is greed in its purest form.

MuggyTadpole
MuggyTadpole

Hang on, can't you install your steam games on two (or more than two) pcs at the same time, using your own account? If you can, that nullifies your premise: "You can't expect companies to allow people to install the same game on multiple hardrives for free"

Kevin-V
Kevin-V moderator staff

@WhiteStormy We discussed that, though. If you want to play certain games, you have to own the console that plays them. It's not an easy decision, to buy hardware you don't necessarily support so that you can enjoy the experiences it offers. I wouldn't judge anyone on either side of the argument, because there's a sacrifice either way, albeit a "first-world" kind of sacrifice. 

TomMcShea
TomMcShea moderator

@max-hit Are you talking about my playthrough of Infinite? What did I miss by toning down the difficulty? The combat is cheap, never-ending, and tedious. That would only become worse when the enemies are tougher. I played the first half on medium and then gave up. It felt like Bioshock without any thought put into it.

Rizer
Rizer

@Kevin-V But didn't our direction until recently did ask for big budget games? We bought the snes which had better graphics than the nes, We bought the PS because it could do more than the snes. We bought the PS2 over sticking with the PS. We bought the PS3 and XBox360 because it was higher end than PS2. We paid for these things. We voted with our dollars to add new graphics and larger experiences to our gameplay immersion.

However, they may be going off of older data while the new consoles where in development, better consoles no longer mean a broader experience because it tech now outmatches game dev budgets. It's up to devs to make entertaining games, but the deadlines and demand allow less time to include everything the systems can offer. So the devs have to make choices; do they spend more time and money to get everything to AAA standard and make full use of the system or do they focus on the gameplay and graphics just enough to produce faster and more economic experience? Don't both have their positives and negatives?

I don't have as much inside knowledge of the industry but it seems to me that if they stick to the triple AAA route they: A) justify the system's existence making producers happy, B) get more attention and hype to C) get a jump on sales; people buy what's "in". However, this method seems like a high risk= high reward type of gamble. If the game looks great and is great enough, it justifies big budget experience with ridiculous sales figures. If it fails, math is not on it's side and the whole dev company shudders to the point of someone possibly being shut down nowadays. 

And if they stick to the more indie route?  They might: A) take up little space and can sell the game to pretty much anyone, but don't make powerful systems a necessity. B) have a more manageable budget and C) smoother easier deadlines, but generally exert less hype in grabbing attention without word of mouth. This method is a bit less predictable it seems to me, because not only do they have trouble getting themselves to the forefront on my attention without someone telling directly me to look for them and unless the gameplay is ground breaking I might not be interested enough to bother looking into it over other indie competition. On the bright side, indie games seem to spring back and make more money from merely decent sales than AAA devs.

My guess where the consumers start heading to is where the devs will go to develop. Tech might have to wait till wallets can catch up.

push88
push88

@Kevin-V @DarthEnderX Kevin I am soooo glad you brought up this point!  I have been screaming about this for a bit and don't understand how more people haven't come to the same logical conclusion.  Are consumers in general just, well, stupid?  And is that what Sony and Microsoft are banking on?

vgsak2005
vgsak2005

@brainiac1988 @vgsak2005 make that argument in court. Silicon Knights tried to use their "property" in their games and the company was sunk as a result.

vgsak2005
vgsak2005

@brainiac1988 @vgsak2005  Games are getting to be big business. There is a lot of money to be made, otherwise companies like Microsoft would not be distracted with Xbox. (and they are distracted as some point out). I want good games to play. And I see a lot of good developers go under. You think the margins are huge but they aren't. I want all developers to stay in business and make good games for me to play. This is not greed. This is business.

vgsak2005
vgsak2005

@brainiac1988 @vgsak2005 Where is the outcry with Windows and only having a license to install on a limited # of machines? Why is it when I go back as far as I have had a computer (90's) this is the way software has always worked? I'm playing devil's advocate a little here but I think games are catching up and its rubbing people the wrong way. And then the world keeps on turning. :)

Kevin-V
Kevin-V moderator staff

@MuggyTadpole You sure can. Furthermore, you can do the same on the Xbox 360, the PlayStation 3,  and (I believe) on the Xbox One, because the game is tied to your gamertag/PSN ID, not to the hard drive.  You can, as of right now, provide your password to other people who can access those games for free. 

As for "get over" the issue, well, no. Other industries have found mature ways of dealing with the issue; I think games can do that too.

Arkhalipso
Arkhalipso

@TomMcShea @max-hit I've heard a lot of people say that the combat was boring and it could be much better or that most of the powers you have are useless, and I think that's because they played the game on easy or normal. I finished the game on 1999 a week ago and let me tell you that it's a completely different game in terms of gameplay. You'll find yourself changing equipment for each situation (like all the skyline related equipment), using vigors you never even bothered to try, different weapons, different tactics for each enemy, etc... I mean every element the game offers you is essesial and you end up enjoying it much much more. I had the same impression as you about the combat on my first go, and then it completely changed my mind.

brainiac1988
brainiac1988

@vgsak2005 you dont get it. when I uninstall windows and give you my CD + key, you can install it. No extra fee needed. Same goes with physical copies of Windows games.

Thats how it should work with consoles too. If I uninstall the game and you buy it from me, you should be able to install it and play without having to pay extra costs.

vgsak2005
vgsak2005

@Kevin-V @MuggyTadpole  Well... I don't like sharing my login information with anyone. Maybe that is just me. As far as being the "mature" approach.. I don't get it, I think they are doing the only thing they can possibly do with this stuff as we head away from physical media more and more. What's your solution?

In the end my biggest fear is not having access to my aging game libraries. Sure, the NES game carts do stop working or stop saving your games. When the servers are shut off, what happens next? at least in the old days you had a cartridge you could jam into your old system and maybe it would still work 20 years later.

Arkhalipso
Arkhalipso

@TomMcShea @Arkhalipso @max-hit That's a shame really, because the game has a lot of replay value in details related to the story that you wouldn't notice or wouldn't understand the first time you play it. Besides, it's one of the best games from this year, you should definetely give it another try.

TomMcShea
TomMcShea moderator

@Arkhalipso @TomMcShea @max-hit I certainly understand the appeal of difficult games (Dark Souls is my all-time favorite), but there wasn't any element of the combat interesting enough on medium or easy that makes me want to go back. In fact, it's the excruciating combat that's keeping me from replaying the game at all. Some of those fights are so drawn out that I'm likely never to return to that game. Such a disappointment.